SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Question, though not sure where to post this to get the most responses (will prob cross-post in other forums too).

Does the 180 have different effects on a husband vs a wife? Put it another way, does the 180 affect WWs differently than WHs?

First, please don't cross post; you other threads will get shut down.

Second, you are misunderstanding the 180; it's not done to affect your WS regardless of his/her gender. It's to make you stronger so that you can think straight and determine your best course of action.

Thanks for the heads up, won't cross-post :)

I understand that the primary purpose of the 180 is more for the BS than the WS. I guess I'm coming at it from Dobson's pov in "Love Must Be Tough", where he asserts that doing the "Pick Me" dance is going to push the WS (any spouse for that matter) away, while going your own way (the 180) tends to be the best approach if reconciliation is desired.

So, I was just curious if there is any idea of whether there are differences in how the 180 affects WWs vs WHs. Put it another way, even though the 180 is mainly for the BS, it will most definitely have an effect on the WS as a result of initiating it (ie. feeling loss of control, feeling their BS moving on without them, etc.). And I'm curious to know if there are any common ways that WWs react to the 180 that differ from the way that WHs react to it.

[This message edited by throwawayabay at 10:29 PM, July 18th (Tuesday)]

It's incredibly affective at getting you where you need to be, which is healing and wholeness. I did it years ago, without knowing it on my ex. I was constantly working on the marriage, reading books, begging for attention etc. One day I realized he held all the power because I cared more about the marriage then he did so I stopped chasing him.

He notice in two days.

But

What really happened was I realized I was doing all the work and begging for crumbs. It helps you get back your self respect among other things which is what you need about now.

smoke,

I understand all of that for sure. So you're saying he picked up on your change in approach almost immediately. Did his behavior change as a result? Did he get angry or frustrated? Did he "lean in" towards you instead of pull away?

You're still not getting it.

Your WS's response is irrelevant. You do the 180 for you, and for you alone.

If R is possible, the 180 is absolutely not for you - R needs lots of communication, the 180 minimizes communication.

The 180 is a last resort for detaching from an unremorseful WS.

D - Don't

E - Even

T - Think

A - About

C - Changing

H - Him/Her.

You're still not getting it.

Your WS's response is irrelevant. You do the 180 for you, and for you alone.

If R is possible, the 180 is absolutely not for you - R needs lots of communication, the 180 minimizes communication.

The 180 is a last resort for detaching from an unremorseful WS.

I agree with Sisoon completely on this. I think part of the confusion over the 180 comes from the fact that many members recommend it to almost every newcomer, regardless of circumstances.

I think it should ONLY be recommended to the select group of BS where they seem to be in that "pick me" stage and just can't see life at all without their cheating spouse back in their lives, back the way it was before the A.

The 180 helps those in that situation to see that there is more to life than their cheating spouse and life will go on with or without him (or her).

Sometimes this new stronger more self-assured person is very attractive to a WS and it may seem to have an effect, but just as often it will have no effect (IMO it makes no difference whether it is a man or woman; all people have their own reactions to things). The point is that you have to be okay with your life with or without the WS. The only person you can EVER hope to control is yourself.

I've heard people using the 180 as a last ditch attempt to lure their WS back. Usually the unremorseful type. Like maybe if you shut down communication/emotions with them, it will make them miss you more and want you more. Unfortunately, its a last ditch attempt because it rarely works. If you are hoping for this desired effect, I think you will be sorely disappointed. If they are unremorseful, you would be better served with serving up some divorce papers, then you might get some effect one way or another.

The 180 is something you do for yourself and really until you are no longer in their presence its incredibly hard to make much progress with it at all. No contact means no more hurt, the 180 means fake it till you make it. The only 180 that worked for me is avoiding contact as much as possible. If I'm not around then, I don't have to fake not caring. I kind of question the idea of the 180 unless you plan on divorcing. There is no path forward in reconciliation without communication. And there is no way to turn off your emotions by pretending to not care.

[This message edited by Randy1133 at 2:00 PM, July 19th (Wednesday)]

Agree with pretty much everything you guys are saying.

But the most helpful post here is by Bobbi_sue, because only that post addressed my primary question.

I DO get it. I understand that regardless of the WS's response, the BS needs to go 180 for themselves. I understand and agree that the purpose of the 180 is for the BS and that it doesn't matter how the WS responds. I also understand that the 180 only really makes sense when R is not probably/possible and when the relationship is headed towards divorce.

I understand and agree with all of this.

All I'm curious about is people's experiences with the WS's response. All I want to know (wish I could make a poll on SI) is how the WS responded ... indifference, anger, leaning in, leaning away, change in behavior and/or desire for the relationship, etc. Sure, their response isn't the point of going 180, but surely WS's DO respond to it, and that's all I'm getting at ... what response is most common? Do WWs typically respond differently than WHs?

I'm just wondering people's experiences, that's all.

Why do you wonder, though?

I think its a complicated question. A lot of it has to do with the mindset of the cheater and WHY they had the affair. Yes the 180 is for you. I have seen stories where there was divorce and there are stories of reconciliation. The 180 didn't really cause the action of either result, but took the pressure off the people involved so the truth of the matter could be allowed to come to the surface. Absence doesn't always make the heart grow fonder. Hearts know no gender. Love knows no gender.

All I'm curious about is people's experiences with the WS's response.

My XWW was indifferent, but she was dead set on divorce. I wasn't very good with the 180 though, if I seen even a glimmer of hope, I would drop it in hopes we might reconcile. I found the 180 incredibly difficult. Once we separated, I detached really fast.

[This message edited by Randy1133 at 3:49 PM, July 19th (Wednesday)]

I think I wonder because relationship dynamics are interesting to me, especially going through everything this past year. I think also, after reading Dobson's "Love Must Be Tough", he pretty much outlines the 180, or at least a variation of it. His experience (counseling thousands and thousands of couples) was that doing the "Pick Me" is self-degrading, and does not make a spouse want to pick you. His main premise (for anyone who hasn't read his book) is that the BS needs to tell WS they are welcome to leave if they want, but things as they stand will not be tolerated and that BS will move on alone if needed. In his experience, BSs taking this approach had the highest likelihood (not guaranteed of course) of reconciliation and restoration of the marriage, mainly due to this inherent desire in all of us to want what we cannot have.

Again, I know this is not always the case, and going 180 is not win back a spouse. Like I said, I would really like to make a poll just to tally the results of people's experiences with this to see if people's experiences coincide with Dobson's. I've chosen the 180 regardless of WW's response to it, period.

standingonmarble,

I agree, it is complicated and probably very much depends on the WS's "why". Thanks for the solid input, and I agree, absence does not always make the heart grow fonder.

Thanks for your input Randy1133.

How are you doing now? How is your relationship with XW and coparenting? Did she move on with her AP? A new relationship? Have you?

Hope you're well.

I didn't really do the 180. I just had enough and detached emotionally from my ex to gather my strength for separation, being there for the kids, etc. Sure, my ex noticed and expressed sadness, but he wasn't sad enough for him to make any changes, nor did it give him any instant remorse.

I don't believe gender will make a difference tbh.

I didn't 180, at least not on purpose. I did detach somewhat after DDay though. I was like a zombie, or at least felt like it.

When I didn't respond to WH right away, whether text or email, phone or whatever, he began to panic. He panicked and tried to take his life twice.

For him, my detachment was what he saw as the end of our relationship, which he saw as life shattering and no reason to live.

Too bad he didn't think of that before right? He had many years to consider what he was doing but I guess he was certain he wouldn't get caught.

He is personality disordered so the love bombing started and the gas lighting ramped up. When he felt secure, it was the same old all over again.

Hi throwawayabay just my hunch the 180 will affect the spouse depending less on gender and more on factors like their personality, how much they want to stay married, their emotional state at any given time, the power dynamic between the couple before during and after the affair, etc.

My husband was a gaslighting demon and the 180 was the starting point of clarity and sanity for me. I had been begging for the truth with no concern for my personal dignity and he lied and denied despite the evidence to the contrary. Within a short few days of going cold and distant from him I received an unsolicited partial confession. My violently emotional response to that put an end to any further details. I then had to work my way back to mastering the 180 but I had lost my footing and he sensed that so he reverted to gaslighting.

We are 10 months out from DDay now and I owe my current state of calm and self confidence to the 180. I am also firmly resolved upon divorce and it is something I am looking forward to. He can see that and is trying to unsettle me in ways I won't get into here. So in other words after the initial confession he has adapted his response which suggests the impact of detaching has had diminishing returns in terms of his behaviour with the biggest reaction being early on. However for myself the returns are cumulative and ever increasing. He is a narcissist which coarsely speaking most cheaters are and the 180 denies them their oxygen supply. A BS grovelling for honesty or doing the pick me dance suits them just fine. Positive or negative any attention is good in their books.

I'm not sure why you are asking this but I can promise you that irrespective of your WW's response you will find the 180 such a simple but effective strategy to navigating the ugly hell that is infidelity. Just be patient and consistent. I wish you well in your endeavours.

Thanks for the responses.

RoadtoPerdition, I think your first paragraph hits the nail on the head for sure. Thanks for sharing a little of your experience too. As I mentioned, I am going 180 (have been slowly for awhile now) and I'm not going to steer off this path unless all of my needs/requirements are met going forward. For instance, last Friday we texted regarding the filing process and when forms are ready, etc. ... business. Three days later on Monday, she sent me a screenshot of a song she was listening to and she wrote the name of a country we visited a few years back together before DDay. She was reminiscing. I waited about 5 hrs to reply (almost didn't at all), and made it clear to her that I would not engage in any casual communication or reminiscing because it isn't healthy or good for me. She didn't respond until a day later, with more business about filing.

So I do feel that I am in a healthier place than in months previously and am able to shut down her attempts to pull me back in. She does a lot of push-pull and it's caused us to be in this marital limbo for the past 8 months or so. It isn't healthy and I won't continue to do that anymore. Either meet my requirements/needs, commit to the marriage and let's roll up our sleeves to do the work, or don't. But no more middle ground. She's supposed to have signed her papers today, but I haven't heard from her yet, so we'll see.

Thanks for the well wishes. I wish the same to you and everyone else here. I see you are 10 mos out and you say you are looking forward to divorce. How are you going about it? Have you filed papers? Glad to see you have a state of calm and that the 180 has helped you out.

Good to see that you are reaping the rewards of going 180 and are in a healthier place. You sound like you are very clear about your expectations from her and are refusing to settle for the crumbs she is throwing your way. At least one of you is making progress.

As for my personal situation it's so complicated it would be a serious t/j to discuss it here. Very briefly he has been cheating me financially for ten years and I have been forgiving him. This cheating is a deal breaker for me. He was supposed to help iron out the financial wrangles to simplify the divorce. He hasn't done that. Shock! Horror! While he carries on spinning lies I am tying up loose ends. I have invested in a small rental property and have my fingers crossed for a part time position which will cover the shortfall from the rent that has just started coming in for my expenses. I kicked him out in February but he moved back in a few months ago saying he couldn't afford to live out until the mortgage payments stop. I'm nearly there to taking care of that one way or another. I have a lot of new found faith in myself but I will also gratefully accept your good wishes. Every little helps.