SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Someone recommended this website from Reddit and said everyone here is supportive, so here I am :)

Like all marriages, ours isn’t perfect. We met in 2010, got engaged in 2011, married in 2012, kids in 2013 and 2016. In 2017, my wife’s boss left to move to the Southeast to take a C level job. He asked my wife to move to be his assistant, etc. I didn’t think he was serious but he invited us down in 3rd qtr 2017 to see the city and gave her an offer. We’re both from our home midwestern city, born and raised, I worked at a family business, never thought we’d leave.

We went, liked it, and thought we’d take the leap. I’ll spare you the details, but there was a lot of back and forth, including her saying she didn’t want to go days before we were to leave. We went and things were rough. I got an offer a month after we moved, but she said to decline it, it wasn’t enough money. I had second thoughts but did decline and keep looking.

Our house finally sold in May of 2018, and we bought a much more expensive house than I wanted to buy. I didn’t have a job and was worried, rightfully so. Her job was going well, she was working a ton, I was job searching 3 days a week and had our kids 2 days a week. Right after we moved, I injured my back, and had to have surgery for a ruptured disc. Meanwhile, I got convinced to try financial advising. I made no money but was promised future riches. Studied for the tests, all that, finally linked back up with the company I got the offer from right after we moved here. They still needed me, I accepted and started in Jan of 2019.

Going back to her starting her job, she met a guy, VP level, that started the same day. I had coffee with him to network, he even brought me in to interview in the summer of 2018 for three different positions. I wasn’t a fan of him but my wife and him became work friends. He promised me an offer, then recanted the offer, and she was pissed at him. He’s married, two kids, house, the whole deal. I questioned their relationship but never in a million years would I thought she would cheat.

Fast forward to this summer. We had a bunch of issues, she said she wanted a divorce. I said fine. The next day we talked it over and promised to work on our relationship. Thing have been improving since July. Sex has increased, I’ve tried hard, sent her flowers, taken her on dates, etc. She’s still working a ton, traveling. She hasn’t seemed fully engaged but she was preparing for a huge conference she had. She gets home from the conference exhausted, as expected. She didn’t text much while there, but I knew she was busy.

Fast forward to this weekend. I was gone Friday and Saturday, running an event in NY. We get up, go to the gym together, her FIL is in town, he watches the kids. We get back and I promised my son (6) we could go see Addams Family at the movie theater. I take a shower and look at her phone to get pics of the kids downloaded to my phone from their couple days together and see her “hidden” folder has a bunch of files. I check it out and it’s screenshots of her texts with the guy at work. Talking about how gorgeous she is, how they’re gonna make out in the hideout, etc. I start feeling ill but go to the movie and dinner with her, our kids, and my father in law. I’m quiet and they asking what’s going on, etc. I say I’m feeling sick and I was BC of what I saw.

And most recent update...

I don't even know where to start, but I guess the best place is the day after I found out. I found screenshots of texts between my wife and her co-worker on Sunday, Oct 20th. I met with a lawyer on Monday over lunch and discussed my options and laws in my state. She mentioned I could wait and gather more dirt via a PI, but I had everything I need.

I confronted her on that Monday evening. She didn't deny it and I asked her to tell me everything. According to her, she's always been attracted to him since they started on the same day, Jan 2018. The first week of October (1 month ago) she went to Vegas for a conference she planned. On the Saturday evening after everything was over, they all went to a nightclub and she said they kissed for the first time. She said she felt terrible afterwards and came home the next day (as planned). She said she realized it was wrong, but they started texting again and meeting at work to kiss, later in the week. It continued the next week, meeting in a vacant conference room at work to kiss, either during work or from 5-515 (time when she said a meeting ran late etc). I found out on a Sunday, and didn't confront her until Monday night. Well, I asked her if anything happened today (the day I confronted her), and she said they went to lunch and kissed in the car.

I'll spare you the details, but the whole evening was one of the worst of my life. Her father was still in town and upstairs. After she told me she went to lunch with him that day, I lost it. I went for a walk and then marched upstairs and told her father. He was shocked. My wife and I started arguing again and it lasted well into the night.

We've spoke and hashed out details almost every night since then, hence why I'm exhausted. She had a work trip the next weekend to TX. She asked if she should cancel, and I asked if he would be there, and she didn't think so. I said go ahead, it's for work and I don't want to interrupt your job. I asked her on that Thursday night to not talk to or see him, unless it's strictly for work. I also asked her to promise me that regardless of what happens with us, that she not have any further emotional or physical affair until we're separated. Anything else might destroy me completely.

While in Texas, she texted me often and I finally asked if he was there...yes. When she got back on Sunday, I asked if anything happened. Her response, no. The week as tough again but we talked and she said she was in a terrible spot in our marriage and isn't sure she wants to try to fix it. She's not sure she can get back to being happy with me and us. Keep in mind, we've struggled for a long time. We almost got separated in July, but said we'd try again and put forth effort.

Well, on Saturday (just 5 days ago), I snooped through her iPad and found more texts. Basically, he claims he's in love with her, or falling. He wants to be with her, near here, etc. Turns out they met in Dallas for coffee and talked. After begging her to tell me what else happened, she swears nothing else happened. She claims she's trying to push him away and he's really into her. We even went out to dinner to talk (I got a babysitter), and tried to relax.

In summary, I have no idea what to do or where to go. I love my wife, I care about her, I care about our family and know what affect it will have on our children. I was willing to change things about me, change our relationship, etc. I'm willing to put in the work, she's not sure if we can ever get there again. I booked a couples therapy appt for this coming Tuesday. We're hoping to become friends, work on communication, and have decided to stay together through the holidays. I thought about texting him, to tell him (in a way that won't affect me legally down the line) to stop contacting my wife, etc. I'm 100% going to tell his wife, which he hasn't done yet. I'm just waiting because I know it's going to destroy her and change their family forever, and I don't know if I can emotionally handle that right now. He's out nothing right now. He destroyed my family (along with my wife) and continues to want to be with her, etc. He needs a wake up call, which will happen. As of right now, I don't think my wife realizes the pain and hurt she's caused me and this family. I think if we were to get separated, she might have that moment when she comes into an empty house or apt with no husband and no kids, and might change her mind.

I know I'm hanging on to something that might be a lost cause. BUT, I'm willing to do whatever it takes to try to save this. If she's not on board, or if I can't get past this, then it won't work. But I want to tell my kids when they're older that mom and dad tried everything to save this marriage. I can't imagine not seeing my kids every day, hugging them, and telling them I love them. I guess I'm taking one step at a time. I'm hoping counseling will answer some questions for me, and give me clarity. I go back and forth every day, but in the end I'm the kind of person that claws for every last inch until there is nothing there. If it isn't, I'll know I gave it my best effort.

Thank you for all you can offer. B

I'm so so sorry.

First, do the 180. Follow it. Talk to a lawyer. Is the guy married? Expose him to his wife. If he's married, I bet he dumps your wife in a heartbeat.

She will be angry with you. Keep doing the 180. Don't do the pick me dance and let her triangulate you.

Keep well. Take care of yourself.

Is this an EA? I'm betting it's PA. She's been seeing this guy since before 'there was trouble' with you two. In fact, if you look hard enough, she's changed the narrative of your relationship to justify her adulterous actions. They always do.

If she wants this guy to back off, she would have said so in those texts. She's encouraging him.

She's also lying. Kissing in the car and just kissing? They are adults. You know this - adult men kissing in a car will also use their hands. And she's letting him. And reciprocating. This has gone further.

She wants out of the marriage or at least a separations so she can fool around with this guy. He's a VP. She thinks she's landed the golden goose.

Any man willing to screw another man's wife is a scumball.

Hugs.

Sorry you find yourself here.

The three things you can expect from a wayward are:

1) Lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies.

2) Lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies, lies,

3) More lies.

I don't want to come across as harsh, but the chance she is being honest about the extent of the affair is virtually zero. Adults don't meet up just to kiss and nothing more.

In general, people who take a firm approach up front have a better outcome. Doing what we call the "pick me" dance never works.

Start taking a harder line because she is lying to you. Exposure, especially to POSOMs wife, can blow up the fantasy that is part of an affair. It's never a bad idea to inform the other BS (betrayed spouse).

[This message edited by Limboaz at 1:51 PM, November 7th (Thursday)]

Expose him to his wife, but say nothing to your will before you do.

She will warn him. Get screen shots of the texts, store them in a file your wife cannot access. The OBS might need to see them.

Never reveal your sources.

When communicating with your wife, keep your phone’s video going, to record the conversations. Again, don’t tell her.

Go get a Sexually Transmitted Diseases screening done at your doctor’s office. Tell your doctor why.

It’s important you eat, drink lots of water, get some exercise, and be good to yourself through this.

This is something fucked up in the wife, not you.

I have advice. You don't have to do it. But this is what I do if I could do it all over again:

1. This isn't an EA. It's a full blown PA. And it's not cheating, straying, wayward or any of that other euphemistic nonsense. It's adultery. It's a willful, deliberate shattering of the marital vows, a sacred covenant.

1a. Once deep kissing has occurred, once bodies have made contact, that's a physical affair. You say October 1 - based on my own experience and the experience of others here, it's probably been going on longer. After all, she confessed to being attracted to him for a year.

1b. I hate to say this, but sex has probably already been on offer and more than likely has happened. Once the deep kissing barrier has been breached, adults have sex. That's what adults do. They don't fumble around like junior high school students for weeks and weeks. Women like sex as much as men. Reading between the lines of what you've said, she did what only a woman wanting sex with another man will do - she put herself in a situation, timing, proximity, and certain setting to guarantee sex would happen. Women will never do this unless they want sex, because they have been geared by other women (their mothers) to be aware of their surroundings and proximity to men to avoid predatory, dangerous situations. Let that sink in.

2. She needs to quit her job if she wants to stay with you. That needs to happen right now. If she's not willing to do that, that is the first and only line in the sand. She should also be willing to report the inappropriate behavior between both of them to HR before she quits.

3. You need access to her devices. She must hand them over willingly and you will use retrieval software to download everything. Again, this is non-negotiable. Not up for debate. She either does it or you walk. Don't screw around with this or get in an involved circular discussion with her. "Hand the phone over right now or we're done."

3a. Go visit a divorce attorney right now so you know your options and so that you have a plan of action to implement if you need to separate immediately (if she won't comply with your reasonable non-negotiables I've outlined here).

4. You are doing a version of the pick me dance. Stop it. Implement the 180 to the best of your ability right now.

5. Give her a package of non-negotiables. This is an all or nothing package. It's a take it or leave proposition. Be ready to walk and mean it with a fervor down to your gonads. Tell her you have too much self-respect to wait around while she dilly dallies on a decision like Scarlett O'Hara. She either does these things or you walk:

A. Immediate IC for both of you, preferably with therapists who specialize in betrayal trauma. You are the victim of betrayal trauma now, but that doesn't mean you need to stay a victim.

B. No MC - it's destructive and useless in the wake of adultery. Later MC might be good, but much later. Most marital counselors will disregard your pain and try to rug sweep.

C. Full STD panel for her and for you. This must happen. She's claiming no sex, I get it. Tell her this is what you want and it's not up for debate. If she can't do this minimal thing for your peace of mind, then you need to be quits with her.

D. Written timeline of the entire affair. Detailed, WRITTEN, narrative timeline. In this case, give her a week to finish it and hand it over. She had plenty of time to screw around texting a co-worker, she's got plenty of time to detail her affair in writing for you.

E. Polygraph exam for her tested against the timeline for veracity and truthfulness. Polys are cheap in the long run, about $500. Better accuracy with one single question, like "did you have sex" but you can ask additional questions for the same price (the accuracy goes down a little bit with each added question, however). Polys are accurate. The FBI, U.S. Senate, intelligence community and military all use them for a reason. The poly is also a tool to exert tremendous psychic pressure on her to come clean. You'll read a lot here about the proverbial parking lot confession. It's not cruel, it's rational and smart. You need to be rational, cold and smart right now.

F. Moving forward, post nuptial agreement for you to protect you from divorce rape in the event of future infidelity. She's demonstrated a worldview capable of adultery. Cheaters don't always repeat, but post nups are recommended for a reason.

G. As I already said, she quits her job and reports the infidelity to HR. It sounds like they were screwing around on the job, so this is a MUST.

H. She must read and implement How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair. No balking, no weaseling, no delays. Then she provides a written plan for how she will implement the book immediately.

Lastly, VAR her. VAR the shit out of her (excuse my French). Trust but verify is a cliche for a reason. You need intel, and she's not a trustworthy person. She's a shifty bullshitter. She might gain empathy and remorse later and become a safe life partner.

But not now. Right now she's an adulterous woman. Read Proverbs 30:20 and let that sink in (the proverb could as easily apply to an adulterous man).

You can only make a decision about staying if it's an INFORMED decision. VARs are absolutely vital right now.

[This message edited by Thumos at 5:45 PM, November 7th (Thursday)]

And I forgot to add two steps that are absolutes and obligatory:

- She must deliver a NC text, letter and email to him and show it to you proving it has been sent.

- You must inform the OBS if there is one. She must provide the names and contact information. If you don't do this, she and the AP will concoct a narrative and practice their stories (which they may have already done) - the OBS deserves to know. It is also part of the shock and awe experience for your wife. He'll drop your wife immediately like a hot rock while he's dealing with the fallout from his spouse.

- You already outed the affair to her father. Go ahead and out the whole damn thing to the rest of her immediate family (siblings, mom, etc) They need to know.

Blood is thicker than water, and they will eventually line up behind her against you (some of them might immediately circle the wagons around her, so just be ready for that).

But for the time being, it buys you some psychic space and drops a shock and awe bunker buster on her. Along with everything else, it will disorient her and give you the space to insist on the other things that have been outlined here.

This isn't an EA. It's a full blown PA. And it's not cheating, straying, wayward or any of that other euphemistic nonsense. It's adultery. It's a willful, deliberate shattering of the marital vows, a sacred covenant.

Sorry man but Thumos is correct. If they are together out of town complete with hotel rooms it's probably a PA.

All cheaters have one thing in common. They lie a lot.

Most betrayed spouses want so badly to believe they go into a comforting state of denial. Wanting to believe it's only an EA is common.

Your only good course of action would be to inform her other mans wife (without informing your wife or she will warn and conspire against you) Don't worry about pushing your wife away. She's already gone. Affairs only thrive in secrecy and the dark.

The worst thing you can do is nothing and helping hide this will probably enable it further.

She asked if she should cancel, and I asked if he would be there, and she didn't think so.

While in Texas, she texted me often and I finally asked if he was there...yes

Probably planned.

Please do yourself a favor, wake up and stop being so naive.

[This message edited by Marz at 2:15 PM, November 7th (Thursday)]

Masters2020,

Please consider putting yourself in the shoes of the other man for a minute.

You meet a woman at work.

You start texting.

Then you go out (even if it is with a group).

Then you start kissing.

You are now sneaking around with her in vacant offices and conference rooms at work to kiss.

You are in a vehicle with her and kissing.

Question, as a man, wouldn't you want more? MUCH MORE? to continue this?

And if you are really not into being only teased wouldn't you move on?

But he continued because it is very possible he was no longer just being teased.

I greatly appreciate the posts. If she had a physical affair beyond kissing, it's over, period. I think that's why she hasn't been truthful with me. Maybe she has, I don't know what to believe anymore.

I'm trying to get a hold of his wife today. I've emailed her and sent her a connect message on LinkedIn to call me. Haven't heard anything yet.

I think I'm blind to this situation and still in shock. I still feel like this is a nightmare and I'm gonna wake up any second.

I claimed he wants sex, and she was taken aback by the fact that someone wants sex. I don't know if she's playing coy, or if she's just that blind. I said of course he wants sex, he's a guy!

Thanks again for the replies.

[This message edited by Masters2020 at 2:22 PM, November 7th (Thursday)]

Do not offer her R upfront, do not jump into marriage counciling, take time and think this through.

Infidelity is a lifelong gift. Could you live with it forever?

Get out of denial. That will not help you.

Not telling the OBS now is just going to let the affair continue and make it worse for you. You need to do it now it the pain will be (significantly) more later.

Of course, just don’t let your wife know that you are doing this.

After begging her to tell me what else happened, she swears nothing else happened. She claims she's trying to push him away and he's really into her. We even went out to dinner to talk (I got a babysitter), and tried to relax.

Begging will put you in an even worse position. She is not going to tell you the truth. She'll only admit to what you know.

Wake up. If they work together the affair continues.

I'm sorry you're here, if they work together, the A will continue, OM is a VP, report him to HR with your proof and tell them if he's not fired that you will pursue legal action for sexual harassment, he will most likely get fired/asked to resign after the investigation.

If there's a chance to R successfully one of them needs to quit the job, and there should be NC FOREVER, if you get him fired then your WW can stay working there, otherwise she would have to find another job, also inform OBS (Other Betrayed Spouse) TODAY, the OM will most likely dump your WW like a ton of bricks in an effort to try to save his own M and job, consult a D attorney and file for D, have her served at work, and EXPOSE her A with all family and close friends, if shock and awe don't bring her get her head out of her ass, then nothing will, if so just let D run its course and get out of infidelity, she would need to show true remorse and offer 100% transparency/access to her phone and all her electronic devices and passwords and commit to IC to find out her "whys", also demand she gets tested for STDs (you should too).

You need to act NOW, those who act decisively have much better results, we've seen this play out THOUSANDS of times, the collective wisdom of SI can help you through this difficult situation, keep posting frequently.

Get strong quick and stay there. No matter what you will come out better no matter which way this goes.

Also quit putting the onus on her AP.

Look, this guy is the douchiest of douche bags, he's a moral reprobate and he's not a real man. No real man worth his salt would screw around on his own wife AND compound that by doing it with another married woman with children.

So you have every right to be angry with him, and you should let that anger help drive you to tell his wife EVERYTHING.

BUT. Put the real focus where it belongs.

Your wife is not some innocent naif. She's a grown ass damn adult capable of making rational decisions. She decided she liked this, wanted it, did a cost-benefits analysis and went for it. Do not buy into this bullshit narrative about him chasing her. Every single WW says that. They love the victim pity party narrative.

She decided this dumb ass worthless fantasy relationship with the VP was worth more than your beautiful family, a loyal hardworking husband, your very own physical health and safety and sanity, and being a full-time and fully present mother to the babies she carried in her womb. She decided all of that was worth LESS than the feelz and tingles she was getting from this guy.

So make sure in your blind rage, pain, sorrow and grief not to forget that. He didn't make vows to you in front of an altar before a true and living God. She did.

P.S. If the OBS won't answer a LinkedIn message, that's not trying hard enough on your part. I haven't looked at my LinkedIn page in ages. Show up on her doorstep. Find out where she works. Try anything to get in touch with her.

OM is a VP, report him to HR with your proof and tell them if he's not fired that you will pursue legal action for sexual harassment, he will most likely get fired/asked to resign after the investigation

This a thousand times. You're in the fight of your life. You may or may not be in the fight of your life for your wife. She may in fact not be worth it, frankly, and she may need the real filing of real divorce papers to even start working on becoming the wife you deserve.

But you are most definitely in the fight of your life for your inner integrity, sanity, well being and spiritual health. No time to delay. Do this one ASAP.

Masters2020:

Sorry you find yourself here, but you will receive good support. Welcome to the club you never wanted to be part of. Your WW is actively cheating on you and deceiving you violating every wedding vow she made. First off understand that you are not to blame for her cheating. Nada, nil, zilch. Millions of people feel disconnected, ignored, unloved or at odds in their M and never cheat. Your WW cheated because she was attracted to the AP and because she wanted to. Period. She needs to be in IC. Couples counseling is a waste of time. You don’t have a marital problem, your WW has a cheating problem.

You are making one huge mistake that we all do, so don’t feel bad. You are trying desperately to save your M, and in doing so you appear, well, desperate. And to your WW, it makes you appear weak and pathetic, especially as compared to the AP. It’s called the pick me dance, and it never, ever works. You can’t nice her back and you can’t change her. What you can do is always value yourself. You are the prize. Act like it. Read and implement the 180 described here and in the healing library. Get tested for STD’s.

You, unfortunately, have a cheating WW. You decide if the M continues. You are in control.. Take your time. You will be on an emotional roller coaster. Get into IC for you. If your WW wants any chance with you, you need complete honesty and transparency. She needs to prove that she is worthy to try and rebuild your trust and be a true partner, rather than some other guys cheap side piece.

Expose the AP immediately to his W, the OBS. Do not inform your WW beforehand. She will warn him and make you out to be crazy. His W deserves to know she is living a lie just as you do. It’s the right and decent thing to do. Be there for your kids. Be the stable parent. See an attorney to learn your rights.

Good luck.

[This message edited by fareast at 2:33 PM, November 7th (Thursday)]

^^^^^ correct the other man is part of this but your wife picked him over you.

Does LinkedIn show she works outside the home? You may have to show up at her work with the proof (copies of messages, etc) and tell her there. Hopefully she contacts you before that. Ask to meet so you can verify it’s really her.