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hikingout posted 9/24/2019 12:17 PM

I think humans are wired for companionship. It will be interesting to see if your viewpoint changes over the next year on what you are saying. Your husband has still been there, when he's gone the void that you have been trying to fill with other things will be felt differently. And, that will lead to a new relationship, and you will likely say "oh I want to make time for this now". But, it's the new that makes one feel that way, not really the lack of a quality of a spouse or a relationship.

But, we all learn these things through our own journey, rather than taking someone else's word for it. I felt dead in that arena too prior to the A, during the A, and after. I felt the whole "I love him but I am not in love with him", I am pretty sure most of the people in the wayward forum has been at that point. It does take more work to restore it with the one you are with, but once you do the beauty of it is greater, there is a deeper appreciation of it. I look at those times now and think I wasted a lot of time with things that wasn't important. I can't understand now where my head is at.

Again, just relaying what my experience has been, but that doesn't make it 100% what yours will be. And if you are unwilling to give of yourself to your husband in this way then you are better off leaving him to find it with someone else. I say that without malice or judgement.

Lonleygirl posted 9/24/2019 12:32 PM

He deserves someone to look at him and swell with love and pride to have him. It's not fair to him to be putting in 100% to the marriage if I'm not. He needs more emotional connection. I find that in my kids. He puts too much of his happiness in my pocket. He used to say he needed me and i would say that isn't healthy. We create our happiness and others add to it, so he should want me, but not need me. I fill voids with my kids and I've been really active in the addiction community since my cousin passed last year. Which he wants no part of that. He is a good person, but we really are going diff directions. I would rather sit in a room full of recovering addicts than his self riotous stuffy family members. I do understand what you're saying and i appreciate you time to reply!

Darkness Falls posted 9/24/2019 15:08 PM

I would agree more with those who say “tell” if the divorce were because of the affair (i.e. leaving for the AP) and it were truly a blindside and her H was legitimately left scratching his head wondering “WTF?” because he thinks the marriage is good. But if he’s in agreement with the incompatibility and that his own emotional needs aren’t being met, then I don’t see avoiding further conflict as a bad thing if the M is simply over.

Believe it or not, marriages can be over for reasons other than infidelity—EVEN IF infidelity had previously been present. I know the party line here is that once one spouse cheats, every single problem in the M relates back to that, world without end, amen—but I totally believe her because she’s describing my marriage too.

[This message edited by Darkness Falls at 3:11 PM, September 24th (Tuesday)]

xhz700 posted 9/24/2019 15:13 PM

Missed the stop sign, my bad

[This message edited by xhz700 at 3:36 PM, September 24th (Tuesday)]

ff4152 posted 9/24/2019 15:14 PM

Darkness Falls

Excellent post. Nuff said.

hikingout posted 9/24/2019 15:15 PM

I don't know if I agree with you DF - about it describing your marriage. You have put a lot of effort in getting things back to good - your husband is unreceptive to that. I don't get the sense her husband is unreceptive. It sounds like he wants the emotional connection and she doesn't. You aren't hiding an affair, and you are much further out. You guys actually went apart and got back together after your A. I can see why it would be tempting to you to relate to these feelings but I don't see your situation as the same. Just my two cents. If you decided to get a divorce, you would likely not get any of the feedback that this woman is getting.

[This message edited by hikingout at 3:17 PM, September 24th (Tuesday)]

hikingout posted 9/24/2019 15:18 PM

Honesty leads to intimacy.
You never gave it a chance, and you will make the same mistakes in future relationships.

xhz700 - I hate how you can make the same point with so much fewer words that me. Ha ha. Sorry I had to give you a shout out, I haven't seen you on in a while.

xhz700 posted 9/24/2019 15:20 PM

Missed the stop sign, my bad.

[This message edited by xhz700 at 3:36 PM, September 24th (Tuesday)]

Darkness Falls posted 9/24/2019 16:43 PM

Hiking,

I see your point. It’s not exactly apples to apples. It just struck a chord with me because my H puts ALL his emotional energy into our kids and there’s literally nothing left for me—and no interest in providing any.

I don’t know the right thing for Lonleygirl to do. I am the last person with all the answers, lol.

hikingout posted 9/24/2019 17:02 PM

Well heck DF I don’t know either! But I do know that the feedback she is getting is based on things that are different from your situation. Be well.

etaoin posted 9/24/2019 17:21 PM

I only know from this thread, but it is clear you do not love your husband. Your comment about his family says it all. But you asked why it feels so crazy. The answer, like it or not, is that you live with a lie everyday.

By all means get divorced. It's clear that it will be better for everyone. Here's the thing though. Sooner or later you will meet someone new. You may want a real relationship. Inevitably the question will come up about why you divorced. Are you going to lie to your potential partner? Are you going to swear him to secrecy?

The thing about lying is that it never really goes away. It just keeps building. Would you like to know if your new partner carried on a secret affair?

Not really sure what you are looking for in your posts, but if all you want is approval for your conflict avoidant behavior, I doubt you will get much here.

Anyway, think about what your future might look like and make your decisions accordingly.

foreverlabeled posted 9/24/2019 17:22 PM

I know the party line here is that once one spouse cheats, every single problem in the M relates back to that, world without end, amen
That's just not true. We don't often talk about problems here that aren't related to infidelity. When the M is still in question around here it's because wayward mentality is rearing it's ugly head. Or because a BS just can't get past it (totally legit). This isn't a marriage counseling forum, it's surviving infidelity.

Here we have a poster who hasn't even attempted that. I'm totally okay with her ending her marriage but don't come at us like you tried to even survive this shit. And don't pretend like you are trying to better yourself by ending a M that was tainted, no explanation, and a spouse being in the dark that this M wouldn't have ended without the fact that you had an affair.

Zugzwang posted 9/24/2019 17:45 PM

Where do you guys ever stop and think about a person- a human being deserving to know about their own lives? It is just sad when I see waywards that can't even see that basic human right they deserve. The people you chose to hurt some time out after hurting them. That there is that lack of selflessness towards another person that deserves and is entitled to know what they got in return for their own fidelity and honor. The right to an informed decision about their own lives. It isn't like she is moving on from this and disappearing out of his life. She will still have to co-parent. You cheat on someone, you manipulate and lie to them. You never tell. You are still a liar because you never told. Time doesn't erase that. Maybe to those that have no problems with lying and can justify it to avoid stuff I guess.

Honesty leads to intimacy.
You never gave it a chance, and you will make the same mistakes in future relationships.
Bingo except, take out mistakes. The same choice. The same behavior and coping skills because the very basic first one will alway always be your foundation. You cheated and you didn't give him the chance to work on that. You took fidelity from him and didn't offer the same.

This isn't about divorce or not divorce. This is about how a person takes away another human beings rights for their own selfish perspective "trying to save him from feeling bad " . About your continued path of conflict avoidance. About your need for control. Hey, if you truly believe you can be a changed good healthy person while continuing to lie and take away another human's rights. Then continue to do so. Come back in 10 years and let us know how that is working out for you. He has know idea how you took advantage of him and that is just wrong and sad. You apparently have no issue with lying.

So, if everyone that believes lying is wrong still is so off the mark. Why are you crazy?

foreverlabeled posted 9/24/2019 18:00 PM

It is just sad when I see waywards that can't even see that basic human right they deserve. The people you chose to hurt some time out after hurting them. That there is that lack of selflessness towards another person that deserves and is entitled to know what they got in return for their own fidelity and honor. The right to an informed decision about their own lives
Zug, you know as well as I do that this doesn't come easy. You know as well as I do that we didn't understand this until we were faced with it. And that is the denominator here. Whether confessed or confronted our BSs show us what it means to have that right taken away. No one will understand that right otherwise.

Zugzwang posted 9/25/2019 06:10 AM

I agree. Though with people that choose to not confess I believe there is something else going on. Something missing. Even when I was cheating I knew that lying, deceiving, and manipulating someone was wrong. With those that choose to not tell, they have decided that those basic principals are not there. That it is okay and that you can be a good healthy person and still do those things and worse continue to do it and believe that is simply just stops and doesn't continue indefinetly.

Justsomelady posted 9/25/2019 08:23 AM

Well, we know she isn’t going to change course at this point. To do so would require too much of her psyche. She would really have to face herself if she told him. She can’t get beyond the basics. And she’d have to face his pain. This is never going to happen, in my opinion. Not sure why she came here. She isn’t capable of that level of accountability because she is still too entitled and too busy running, avoiding, and controlling others.

BraveSirRobin posted 9/26/2019 08:35 AM

LG, one thing that comes across in your posts that I think you should be exploring with your IC is that you want to present all of your decisions as noble. You're leaving your BH because he deserves better. You're not telling him about the A because it would hurt him. You're just so invested in your kids.

All of these things have an element of truth to them. It sounds like you and your spouse are a fundamentally mismatched. Knowing that you cheated would hurt him. You love your children and want to give them opportunities. All true as far as it goes.

But stopping at that is an ultra-wayward thought pattern. You've found the whys that paint you in a rational, self-sacrificing light. "Sure, I cheated, yes yes that was very wrong, but here are the real reasons I'm divorcing without coming clean, and all of them are about someone else's needs, not mine." You can live with that view of yourself, so you stopped there.

So what happens now with those kids who get to do things six days a week? Do you keep them almost all the time, so your XBH doesn't even get to see them in passing? Or do they spend 50% time with him, and he has to force himself into your preferred lifestyle of shuttling them around? Or he declines to do that, and they stay home with him and resent him for it? You've set up a family culture driven entirely by your own desires and expectations. Now you're pulling the rug out from under everyone and declaring that it's for their benefit. At least own that the reason everyone will have to majorly reorder their lives is to give you what you want. You don't get to paint yourself as the hero here.

Experienced waywards are concerned because you lack the courage for honesty with yourself, and regardless of how honest you are with your husband, that's what's setting you up for future failure. The pattern remains dominant in you, and so yes, I think you're going to keep lying, to yourself and to others.

[This message edited by BraveSirRobin at 8:39 AM, September 26th (Thursday)]

hikingout posted 9/26/2019 09:01 AM

Wow, I know what BSR says is hard to hear, but that is truly the crux of what you need to take a look at. Even if it isn't to save this marriage, which I am inclined to believe we are past this. It's about getting away from destructive patterns in your life at this point, or you will continue to repeat them in variations. You will suffer. Others will suffer.

I just want to say that BSR's post is 100% on point, and to remind you that the mirror we are holding up for you is because we have been in some of the places you are. We want better for you. It's truly constructive feedback if you can view it that way.

Zugzwang posted 9/26/2019 17:26 PM

The pattern remains dominant in you,

YES times infinity! Those that don't tell stay stuck in the pattern of unhealthiness.

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