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I didnít want to believe it...but here I am again

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nekonamida posted 5/6/2019 12:30 PM

Tushie's advice is golden.

This isn't a battle that you can fight alone. You can't force him to be a good father. The best you can do is bring this up in court and reserve as much custody as possible so that he will stick to the schedule or allow you - the good parent - to do your job. Therapy for your kids will help them deal with the fallout that he has inflicted and will continue to inflict by not being an invested father.

beauchateaux posted 5/6/2019 13:14 PM

Cheaters do things for various reasons. Maybe he doesn't care anymore, or maybe it makes him uncomfortable to be around the kids because it's just a reminder of what kind of person he's become. Easier to go and be with OW, who gives him all validation, all the time. She's his yes-man right now because she got what she wanted.

That won't last. It never does. One day, he'll realize what a jagoff he's being and how despicable he was to you and his kids.

But you aren't going to sit around waiting for that to happen. No, you're going to move on with your life and support your kids, and one day, you'll be free of the pain of this - and you'll have kept your dignity and integrity (and the respect of your children) intact. THAT is worth more than whatever temporary reprieve from reality he's getting right now. And it's worth more than the bonafide lying cheater the OW has 'won' from you.

It may not seem like it right now, but you are getting the better deal here. Stay strong.

Heartinpain posted 5/6/2019 15:27 PM

Thanks everyone! I actually do have the kids in counseling. We started that last week.
I donít even know this man in front of me. Like I said before, if there was one thing I was sure about him, it was that he loved his kids and would put them first, but I guess I was wrong.
He told me last night that it would be easier if I just let the kids meet the other woman. Seriously? It has been two weeks! They havenít even processed us not being together, let alone someone else. Not to mention, when he does have the kids, it would be nice if they had his full attention, rather than having to compete with the OW for it.
Right now we are on a week to week schedule. The kids are super busy and I have a hectic schedule too, so I draw things up week to week. But itís mapped out for this week.
How did I not see what an asshole narcissist I was married to? 18 years?

Odonna posted 5/6/2019 16:24 PM

Heart,

Good for you for getting the kids into therapy so fast. Even if they resist, this is what they need as a safe place to process what is happening to what they thought was their stable family.

There are apps for setting up parenting plans and communications that I have seen others use here so look that up as a structured and safe way to plan for the kids with him. One poster (see Affair Baby Coming thread) got the court to prohibit contact between her son and the OW and OC until he had an appropriate amount of counseling and felt ready. Talk to your lawyer about that, and also options for getting the kids a guardian ad litem, who is an advocate exclusively for them.

ChamomileTea posted 5/6/2019 19:02 PM

First off, I agree with Odonna in that you can work with the court and with your children's therapists to decide when/if it's psychologically recommended to allow an introduction to the OW. The guys and gals in Separation/Divorce can give you a lot more detailed advice on that. Also, there are parenting apps which can make it easier to get your schedules made, minimize time in discussion with the STBX, and create a pretty accurate picture of who's doing what with the children.

So, there's that. But this bit is blowing my mind...

He told me last night that it would be easier if I just let the kids meet the other woman.

How in the world is this guy comfortable enough to even say such a thing to you? Giant narc, much? I know you're a high road kind of lady, and while many of us would have torn off his head and spit down his neck (figuratively) over a statement like that, it's not your style. So, here's the question... what is your style when this guy goes too far? Because that was too far. He just left the home a few weeks ago after stringing you along for months, the children are sad, disoriented, and confused, and he thinks he's on good enough terms with you to suggest that bringing them around the home-wrecker is a good idea? He needs to be taking a wide berth right now, but apparently he's not one jot concerned, because if he was, he'd have swallowed his tongue before he let that particular inanity out of his mouth.

Again, not suggesting you alter your style, but rather how to do a less familiar NC or a more frosty LC (limited contact). His problems aren't your problems anymore. HE decided on that. He shouldn't feel even slightly bit comfortable with dropping a bomb on you like that.

The 180 is nice for creating distance, but sometimes you have to really cool it down in order to enforce boundaries. ie. If your style is "just the facts", the factual response could be "the children's therapists and a court of law will decide when and if it is advisable to allow contact with (your adultery partner).". If you're implementing grey rock, you'd probably use a less inflammatory descriptive for the AP, but if not, a graphic one is more likely to make him squirm but not pejorative enough to invite a verbal sparring match. Don't forget, he's no longer a good enough human to be worthy of argument. If your style is more along the lines of "no response is a good response", you just walk away, hang up the phone, or don't respond to his text when he's stupid. In that case, he learns that if he wants to have a conversation, he's got to be on point and that insults/stupidity stop discussion.

It's all about getting some boundaries laid down so this guy isn't torturing you anymore. Whatever your style is, that's okay. You're just about getting the job done and saying "I don't tolerate abuse/stupidity anymore".

((big hugs)) I'm sorry he did that to you. :(

Heartinpain posted 5/10/2019 16:40 PM

You will never believe this...my STBXH sent me flowers at work for Motherís Day. They are from ďthe kids.Ē Are you kidding me? Do you know how many times I got flowers at work before this happened? Zero. My brother told me itís all part of him wanting to be the good guy in his own story.

He obviously doesnít understand the torture this is to me...sending me flowers while in the same day driving to spend the weekend with the OW. Or maybe he just doesnít care...

ChamomileTea posted 5/10/2019 18:03 PM

It's image management. He still wants to think he's a nice guy and that after a painful transition, you'll go back to being his friend. In his mind, it's all just so unfortunate, but everyone will end up a big, happy family.

I'd take those flowers down to local nursing home and give them away. I'd also tell him to go fuck himself, but that's me and not you.


ETA: He's going to keep doing things like this until you put a stop to it. I know that's an uncomfortable position for you to be in, but he's delusional.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 6:04 PM, May 10th (Friday)]

timespent posted 5/10/2019 18:18 PM

Definitely image management! He doesn't care about it being tortuous to you because it's all about him!! What a jerk. He DOES NOT deserve you!

Heartinpain posted 5/15/2019 16:26 PM

Bad day today. Fight with the STBXH. I told him that I have no obligations to tell him anything except about kids or money. I told him after everything heís done, heís expecting a hell of a lot from me- I feel like he thinks we should be friends. Wtf...you walked out on me and our kids, lied to me for over a year. But I have to be your friend? No thanks, I have enough friends. He knows exactly what buttons to push to upset me. I broke down at lunch and just cried.

fareast posted 5/15/2019 16:45 PM

Sorry Heartinpain:

Itís a common ploy for the cheater to want to act like you are still friends. You see, if you are still friends, then all of his cheating and lying couldnít have been that bad. He gets to show people what a good guy he is. Not! Donít fall for it. Kids and finances only. Limit contact. He is just trying to push your buttons to reel you back in, and you get hurt all over again. Good for you for stopping him in his tracks.

You will be coparenting with him for a long time and it is best to start establishing boundaries now. Do a hard 180. You are doing this for your own well being. Good luck.

redrock posted 5/15/2019 16:59 PM

HIP

Did you meet him or was this just messages exchanged? I made the assumption you met him

Understand that he still gets the ego kibbles when you cry, get upset and express your pain He wants to see this because that means he still may have a back up plan

The pain is can be almost unbearable in moments But he is not going to get it Come here Vent away Cry and type Hit your pillow do anything else to train yourself to not expect or be surprised by his cluelessness

If he can keep you in the friend zone that means that you accept what happened was for the best

I know you want to understand and discover how he went from one extreme to the other I expect over time you will thaw to see all of the ways you carried him as a husband and parent

You need some space and boundaries to get stronger You will Try to do more communication through email text is too instant you may not have the self control not to go off on him But I learned a lesson a long time ago write you email walk away for a couple of hours then go back and edit the emotion out

No ones perfect out of the gate This is a life crushing experience But I do hope that over time youíll come to realize how meeting and talking with crazy is simply a frustrating waste of time

[This message edited by redrock at 5:02 PM, May 15th (Wednesday)]

Charity411 posted 5/15/2019 18:05 PM

HIP, I know it doesn't feel like it, but you are doing really well given the short amount of time since your last DD. You have gotten to realizations way faster than I did when I was where you are.

So much of what you are going through is brutally familiar. I second the opinion that sending the flowers, wanting to shake your hand and other attempts at being buddies is all about making it seem like he's the reasonable one. What I learned is that it really isn't an act on the part of someone like him. He really believes that it is totally reasonable that he is moving on to the OW, and you should just be fine about it. My guess is that he not only thinks he's being a good guy by wanting to stay friends with you, but he's patting himself on the back because he thinks he's saving OW from being miserable with her husband. He's the hero in his head. He's also throwing you kind gestures to get you to go easy in the divorce settlement. Don't buy into it. See it for what it is.

I think you are doing everything right. It's unreasonable to expect that you aren't going to break down even when you're trying not to. You made a life with this person, and everything you thought about your future going forward is gone. If you have to cry, don't worry about what he thinks about it. He's going to think he's all that no matter what you do. What matters is what you do with your attorney. Play hardball, because your kids are counting on you.

Charity411 posted 5/15/2019 18:14 PM

[This message edited by Charity411 at 8:49 PM, May 15th (Wednesday)]

Heartinpain posted 5/15/2019 20:09 PM

Everything was over text. No meeting in person. I learned my lesson about that after DDay #2

Heartinpain posted 5/19/2019 19:44 PM

My STBXH is a fucking moron. And I told him as much today. Decided that 4 weeks post DDay }#3 was a good time to introduce my two youngest to his AP. Iím so mad. We had discussed this earlier and I told him that I didnít want that to happen just yet, I though it was too soon. He said heíd respect my wishes. 2 weeks later...heís introducing them.

He canít see anything but himself. I guess in all of this mess, I had hoped heíd keep his kids as his number one priority. But he so obviously is not. I lost it with him, and as usual he just justifies and explains it so heís not the bad guy. So many justifications:
1. I wanted the girls to meet her because if they didnít like her, then it would be over.
2. He ďasked the girls if they wanted to meet her.Ē When they said they did, it was no longer his decision, but theirs.
3. I told him earlier I the week that I was no longer obligated to tell him anything about my life that didnít concern him, so he decided that he didnít need to tell me about this.
I hate him. I fucking hate him. Then he decides to tell the girls, before he drops them off to me, that mom is mad at me about this. Nothing I say to him stays between us. He tells them everything. My girls came home sobbing because mommy is mad at daddy and they think itís their fault. They are afraid to tell me that they liked AP because theyíre afraid Iíll be mad. Iím so mad. I feel like I canít get through this. Iím not strong enough. Itís bad enough the emotional turmoil heís put me through, now itís extending to my kids. Please help me.

ChamomileTea posted 5/19/2019 22:37 PM

On the one hand, cooler heads in the Separation/Divorce often remind us that it's not really possible to keep an AP away forever. After a divorce is final, there have to be really compelling reasons for a court to order that. But... your WH isn't divorced yet. I think you'd do well to suss this out with your attorney, and while you're there, take off the kid gloves. And not just as a matter of retribution, but because your STBX obviously does not possess the common sense necessary for protecting your children's future. As the only sane parent available, that task will fall to you.

Your WH has squandered your love and good will, the respect of his children, and will eventually do the same to everything he touches. Make sure it's not your family's financial security.

I'm so sorry he did that to the kids and that he's treated you so disrespectfully.

((hugs))

The1stWife posted 5/20/2019 03:59 AM

Iím so sorry he undermines YOUR attempts to put your children first.

Heís selfish and self centered and has no idea of the damage he is doing.

From this moment you donít ever discuss a thing with him. You are not pleasant. You are not chatty. You intersctcas little as possible.

For your own sanity.

Then discuss with your therapist how to handle this introduction with your children. What to tell them. How to make this work in their best interest.

Iím sorry he has become so stupid!!!! I know it is maddening.

Heartinpain posted 5/20/2019 22:04 PM

Why do I continue to think logic will be affective? Why do I even try? Why do I maintain the idea that he will put anyone before his own selfish needs? Why do I keep hoping that he will at least make the kids a priority.? Why even bother? Why do I think he will acknowledge what heís done to me? Why do I expect an apology for the hell he has put me through? Why canít I just accept him for what he is? A selfish, narcissistic, manipulative jerk...all I do is set myself up for more hurt and disappointment. Youíd think Iíd figure this out. But apparently not...

Starzen posted 5/20/2019 23:45 PM

Why do I think he will acknowledge what heís done to me? Why do I expect an apology for the hell he has put me through? Why canít I just accept him for what he is? A selfish, narcissistic, manipulative jerk...all I do is set myself up for more hurt and disappointment.

Because you have integrity and higher morals and values, and thus think others do also, and can't fathom how empathy and compassion just doesn't exist in some people. You aren't alone in your disbelief.

In my case, I just didn't want to admit what he was..it hurt way too much... I hurt for who he turned into, I hurt feeling so foolish. I was ashamed for putting up with everything I did. Accepting who he really was meant I also had to accept how I handled it, which in hindsight did not save the relationship anyhow.

I also didn't want to accept/admit it, because I knew that was the moment I would give up on him, and I wasn't ready. Continued false R's and him moving right in with her when I finally stuck to my guns and forced him to leave, proved it, but you know, I still wonder where the previous guy went that used to fight for us. All these months later I still don't want to believe it, but it is what it is and when I catch myself wondering "why", I just tell myself it's no use, yell at myself if I need to, we will never know because we don't think like them, and then I get up and do something productive. I'm resigned to just scratching my head on his behavior and decisions, wondering why some do not have the strength to fix things.

Edie posted 5/22/2019 04:16 AM

A selfish, narcissistic, manipulative jerk...all I do is set myself up for more hurt and disappointment. Youíd think Iíd figure this out. But apparently not...

Sorry to read your latest episode Heart. Read up about grey rock technique... I hope it will help.

Spend some time in the divorce and separation forum and pay heed to Chamomileís post just above,

Hugs for the hard time heís giving you. Youíll get through it, youíre clearly very resilient and practical.

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