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Empathy Fueled Deceit

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Butforthegrace ( member #63264) posted at 11:05 PM on Tuesday, November 22nd, 2022

At SI, many advocate not publicly outing an AP because it may hurt the OBS or their children.

At the risk of a TJ, I don't agree with this statement, at all. It's pretty much established orthodoxy here that informing the OBS is the right, moral thing to do and also that it is usually in the strategic best interest of the BS to do it. The overwhelming majority opinion here is to expose the AP and inform the OBS.

"The wicked man flees when no one chases."

posts: 3986   ·   registered: Mar. 31st, 2018   ·   location: Midwest
id 8766348
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humantrampoline ( member #61458) posted at 11:09 PM on Tuesday, November 22nd, 2022

Publicly outing. Publicly being the important word. There's a recent thread of "I received an apology from AP". Case in point.

Edit: The point is that the empathy is assumed to be properly given to the OBS and children. Not the others who may be impacted now or in the future.

In my vision of empathy, I don't agree. It's more complicated.

[This message edited by humantrampoline at 11:44 PM, Tuesday, November 22nd]

posts: 590   ·   registered: Nov. 17th, 2017
id 8766350
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emergent8 ( member #58189) posted at 11:52 PM on Tuesday, November 22nd, 2022

Publicly outing. Publicly being the important word. There's a recent thread of "I received an apology from AP". Case in point.

At the risk of further threadjack, this was a pretty specific case. The BS in this scenario "outed" the WS in this scenario by intentionally ruining his online reputation 17 years later. The AP in the scenario was single at the time of the actual affair so this was more of an act of revenge rather than a true outing.

Most of the concern on the thread was not based on outing the AP, but the fact that it demonstrated a distinct lack of healing 17 years later and opened him and potentially opened his own marriage up to retaliation.

Edit: I see your edit. I get your point.

[This message edited by emergent8 at 11:54 PM, Tuesday, November 22nd]

Me: BS, Him: WS. Mid-late 30s.
Together 15 years, married 6 (11 m at D-Day).
D-Day: Feb 2017 (8 m PA with married COW).
5 years (and two toddlers) into R. Happy.

posts: 1026   ·   registered: Apr. 7th, 2017
id 8766357
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humantrampoline ( member #61458) posted at 12:01 AM on Wednesday, November 23rd, 2022

Understood about that thread being a specific case.

I get the point and I understood. Therefore, I did not make a similar comment there because i thought it would not be helpful. I am making a comment here. I understand people may disagree.

Is this a TJ? That's a legit question.

posts: 590   ·   registered: Nov. 17th, 2017
id 8766361
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realitybites ( member #6908) posted at 3:40 PM on Monday, November 28th, 2022

I don't think that one has empathy when one decides to cheat. They do it because they want to. No empathy there because they would have to STOP what they are doing to empathize with the person they are hurting.

My very simple take on this is that a BS has such a different head space that it just really does not occur to them, they just cannot fathom doing the same to their WS, so therefore we twist ourselves up into a million pieces to figure out some kind of saving grace, whether it is some form of "empathy" as you say here or some form of apology or true R, if that were to happen in your situation. I do believe that it is possible for a WS to change if they truly want to, but the act of it at the time as no empathy, IMO.

However I do think we struggle with trying to find some good in what is a truly bad thing, especially if we have decided to try to stay with our own WS. To find some good or something of any kind of redemption that allows us to stay w this person. We try to see some kind of empathy within them, otherwise it would be extremely hard to stay, they would be essentially evil, which is hard to swallow.

It's that old saying that who we feel are "good people" can still do "bad things". Take a teacher who has sex w a minor, take a priest who has sex w a young boy, take anyone who works within a church yet cheats on his or her spouse on the side, take anyone of authority who uses that position to cheat or steal or rape behind their spouses back. It can be anyone who "looks" to the outside world as a good and upright person, but not be so good behind the scenes.

Their empathy may be towards themselves, meaning they watch what people need or want and then try to do it as a way to look like they empathize, but not really feeling empathy, they just want to seem like they are a good person. True empathy does not need anyone to give you a pat on the back, you do it because you should.

Not sure if that makes sense.... just babbling. smile

Stop expecting loyalty from people who cannot even give you honesty.

He stopped being my husband the first time he cheated. It took me awhile to understand that I was no longer his wife.

posts: 6905   ·   registered: Apr. 16th, 2005   ·   location: florida
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 This0is0Fine (original poster member #72277) posted at 7:04 PM on Monday, November 28th, 2022

However I do think we struggle with trying to find some good in what is a truly bad thing, especially if we have decided to try to stay with our own WS. To find some good or something of any kind of redemption that allows us to stay w this person. We try to see some kind of empathy within them, otherwise it would be extremely hard to stay, they would be essentially evil, which is hard to swallow.

I'm may be a shittier person than many or most BS's. I do think before my wife's A, I was likely at least as susceptible to cheating as her (having now examined my old behaviors and boundaries more critically). I just had strong enough boundaries for the opportunities presented (few, and of low quality), and I wasn't a big enough piece of shit to actively seek out an A.

Love is not a measure of capacity for pain you are willing to endure for your partner.

posts: 2173   ·   registered: Dec. 11th, 2019
id 8767048
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