Newest Member: Loyalandbetrayed

Wayward Side :
Please Help

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 Idontknowhattodo (original poster New Member #74949) posted at 4:35 PM on Tuesday, July 21st, 2020

Good Morning,

I don’t really know where to begin. First of all, I am the wayward spouse, but I think I might also be abused. I’m not sure and that’s why I’m here. I really need advice, I’ve never felt more scared, alone and trapped. About 4 years ago, my BH found out that I cheated on him, but we weren’t married at the time. I was a mess, I was in the middle of divorcing my high school sweetheart and yes, I was with BH at the time, but I was also drinking like a 5th of vodka every day and trying to drown my sorrows…I knew that BH thought of us as exclusive…but I didn’t. I was still technically married for the love of cheese! So, anyway, I had met up with a friend that I flirted with online and on the phone for a weekend about 4.5 years ago and we had sex and stayed 2 nights at a B&B. I also had an o.k. cupid account and talked to a few people on there, but had never met any of them. Anyway, I was on a path to try and destroy my entire life…and I almost succeeded. It culminated early on the morning of Thanksgiving, 2016. I stayed up very late (at the house I was still sharing with my soon to be ex-husband) and I was very drunk. I decided to go out and get some cigarettes at 3am and I got in a very bad wreck. I went through the window of my SUV and ended up in the hospital and then spending the rest of the night covered in sores and bruises in a county jail cell...this is the one and only time that happened to me in my entire life. I've never been in trouble with the police before or afterwards. Anyway, they didn't even press charges and I was released the next morning. My BH came to get me and he ended up taking me to his house and taking care of me for about a week. During that time, he decided to go through my phone and found evidence that I had cheated on him back in march and that I was also talking to different guys on o.k. cupid. He lost it and I started deleting texts and emails to try and cover up what I had done because I was scared that he would leave me and at this point, I was suicidal at the thought of trying to heal inside and out without any family and without him. I spent the next few months going to AA meetings and getting stronger. BH was amazing, he went to every AA meeting with me and really tried to help me heal, despite his pain over what I had done to him and to our relationship. Once I was past the danger of hurting myself, and I was on my way to healing, he wanted to dive into what I had done. We spent days and weeks and months going over and over who and what I had done...and together we decided to try and move forward.

…but here’s the thing…we never did. (Move forward, that is). I told him everything that I remembered and gave him full access to all of my electronics, but he was upset that I had deleted texts and emails and we couldn’t get them back, and because of that he says that to this day, 4 years, a marriage, and twin toddlers later, he can’t move forward. So he hurts me emotionally and verbally and he scares me with his temper. He’s broken 2 televisions and 2 guitars trying to “get his point across” during arguments. He’s called me, “A Selfish C***, Self-Centered, retarded, slutty, stupid, narcissistic, self-important, ungrateful, sociopath, and finally a waste of life” I know that these are verbatim because after about 2 years of him calling me names and scaring me, I started writing down what he said. BH says that I took those words “out of context” so of course they sound bad. However, I’ve never called anyone those things and they hurt me to my core. It’s been 4 years and to this day he checks all of my emails, he pings my phone when I’m at work to make sure that I’m not somewhere that I’m not supposed to be, he won’t let us go as a family to events at our friends’ homes, and even if I want to go see my best friend for a night and I offer to take the twins so he can relax, he throws a fit and so I’ve only seen her about 5 times in the past 4 years and I am not exaggerating about that. Here’s the worst part, I can’t take birth control because after the twins were born it started making me have a perpetual period. So, we use the catholic method, or the calendar method…and I think that he purposefully got me pregnant again. Because last week he asked me if I had gotten my period yet and I said no, but I’m bloated so it should be any day now and HE said, “You should take a test” And it was positive and he was ecstatic, he literally said, “Well, I’ll get a few months off from worrying that you’re going to cheat on me now!” and he laughed and acted like it was wonderful. Now, I have to decide whether to bring another life into the world with a man who scares me, or have an abortion…and neither one sounds pleasant. I think I’m going to get an abortion because I don’t trust him with the children we already have. I want to be honest with him, but he scares me. And when I tell him that, he acts like he’s never heard it before and that I’m being insane and gas lighting him because of our past. But I know that I’m not. I know that this can’t be right. 4 years of this up and down and over and over and I’m in complete despair. I am so broken and hurt and I just don’t know how much longer I can take all of this.

I guess I’m asking for advice and perspective. I know that what I did was wrong. I know that I should have been faithful back then, but ever since our restart I have been and more than that, I’ve been open to him in every way that I can think of. But anytime he does something horrible, and I get angry with him, he brings up the A I had from years ago and treats ME even worse! For example, on the 4th of July we had the twins and my big kids from my first marriage (DD 11 and DS 8yrs old) and we were supposed to do fireworks with the neighbors. I asked him to watch the toddlers while I lit sparklers for the big kids and he got very angry because the twins were all over the place and I wasn’t helping him keep them in line. I told him to just give me a minute and I came and grabbed our 2 yr old daughter and was watching her and the big kids with their sparklers and I turn around and he’s gone back inside with our boy twin. I went inside to find him and he had put our son to bed and gone to sleep himself…leaving me outside with the rest of our children, and the neighbors…completely alone. So I begged him to come back outside and help me with the fireworks and the kids and he said he would be right down, but he never came outside. I finished up with all the kids, gave them and myself a shower, put them all to bed, and came upstairs to lie down. I was angry and I yelled at our dog to move and then he got up and said “I’m leaving! I don’t have to listen to you b*tch about all the stuff you had to do.” And he left. And then he spent the entire next week either ignoring me or yelling at me and bringing up the affair and how he could never move on because I couldn’t produce these old texts. I even spent $50 on some software that he found to restore old texts to a phone and it didn’t work. It only went back and restored texts from 2018 and forward…nothing from before that time period. I feel like he’s using the A to keep me scared and isolated and so that he always has an excuse for bailing on me and the kids and I’m so tired of it. But maybe I’m wrong and I’m seeing things from my own incorrect perspective? Maybe it’s not that he’s emotionally and verbally abusing me, maybe it’s that I emotionally destroyed him and this is just the result and I have to either leave him or live with this for the rest of my life? That’s why I came to SI…I really need to know if I’m in the wrong…if this really is all my fault and I thank any and all of you who’ve spent your time reading this. I am just so lost and scared right now and I don’t know what’s right, what’s wrong, or really anything anymore.

Thank you, Idkwtd (WW)

posts: 5   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2020
id 8564730

foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 6:04 PM on Tuesday, July 21st, 2020

I'm glad you found us. Welcome.

I'm not sure where to start so I'm just going to dive in.

Name calling hurts, I know I experienced it myself. Yes, it can be abusive. And it's up to you what you are willing to accept. In my case I was willing to allow only if it was a true expression of my BHs trauma. As in, he couldn't just walk around verbally abusing me. Like, hey what's up slut face as he's pouring his morning coffee. Now, if we were actively talking about his pain and his trauma began to flood him and through his anger and tears asked, how could you have been such a slut?! Or, effin hell FL you're such a dumbass (I was), I even let it go that he said he wished that I would die. I was willing to see that differently. Can you imagine such pain one must be feeling to say those words to their once love-of-their-life?

YMMV, that was my tolerance and again you have every right to chose what you will accept.

But make no mistake your BH is traumatized as you yourself abused him physically and emotionally with your cheating.

See, if you didn't consider yourself exclusive knowing he did, that's something you communicate. Otherwise, your actions by cheating can cause severe catastrophic results, as you are witnessing.

In my opinion four years means nothing if certain things do not take place in that time. Also keep in mind even under the best of circumstances it could take 2-5 years for him to heal from your cheating. And, you guys have been doing your damndest to sweep this under the rug and move forward. It don't work that way babe. Perhaps you two aren't giving yourselves a fighting chance to work through this.

I suggest you read a book titled "how to help your spouse heal from your affair" its never too late to read this book. You might find that you could be doing things better yourself. With some true healing I believe his anger and hurt will subside and he will not lash out as he has.

Also, the pregnancy, I don't think it's fair to blame him or suspect it was his doing. It's not fool proof and you know the risk. You are aware of the times you should practice abstinence or other forms of BC like condoms. And does he know you are considering an abortion? As your hubby and the father, he should know. I think the choice ultimately is yours but you've already taken so much from him with your cheating, don't keep taking.

Isolation isn't okay. That is also abusive, and this should also be addressed. I do want ask if your best friend was aware of your cheating and if she condoned your behavior. Because, if you put yourself in your BHs shoes, there's no way in hell you'd be comfortable with him hanging out with a buddy willing to keep his secrets of the same extent.

[This message edited by foreverlabeled at 12:09 PM, July 21st (Tuesday)]

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

posts: 2513   ·   registered: Mar. 1st, 2016   ·   location: southeast
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 Idontknowhattodo (original poster New Member #74949) posted at 7:04 PM on Tuesday, July 21st, 2020

First of all, thank you for your response…and for reading my long and sordid tale, I really appreciate your perspective and advice. Now, I will attempt to answer your questions with honesty and as much self-awareness as I can.

Mainly, I wanted to check myself with this post and see if I’m being too harsh with my judgement of him. I know that you’re right when you say that we’ve swept it under the rug, but what do you do when your spouse will not move forward, doesn’t want to end your relationship, and refuses counseling? I really don’t know what to do at this point and I am tired of being wrong no matter what he does…and he has done some really awful things, like not going to the twins 1st birthday party, demanding that I submit to sex when I don’t want to, to “prove” that I love him, and turning literally any and every time I try to confront him over his unacceptable behavior into a referendum on my cheating. At this point, I actively avoid talking to him when I’m upset over his actions because I am afraid of the response it will illicit…I don’t think that’s o.k. I think at some point, he either needs to say, “Yes, we can go to counseling.” Or “No. I cannot move past the past.” Because this doesn’t feel healthy or right to me. I’m miserable, he’s miserable, and I feel totally helpless. I guess one of my questions to you and to all here would be, “Is it possible to be the Wayward Spouse, and also be an abused spouse? Because I feel like I’m being abused. I will look for that book on amazon today…I would do anything to help him if he would let me, but he says that since I can’t get the messages I deleted 4 years ago back, that there’s nothing I can do. It’s just so draining and I don’t know how much more I can take. I know that I hurt him badly and broke his trust, and I’ve apologized until I’m blue in the face. I’ve been submissive and I’ve been open and I’ve bent over backwards.

As to my best friend…she knows about it NOW, but she didn’t know anything about it at the time and the only time we’ve discussed the A is in regards to my BH and the way he treats me because of it. She had no idea at the time of the A because I was such a mess that I wasn’t talking to her or anyone else. I shouldn’t have been with anyone at that time…I wasn’t emotionally ready and I was simply a bad person or at the least a person going through a whole lot with no idea how to handle it. I’m not trying to excuse my behavior in any way by saying this, I’m simply telling you how I feel.

As for my pregnancy, no, he has NO idea that I’m considering an abortion…and I know he should know, but I am scared of his reaction. I am also fully aware that it takes two to make a baby, and I’m at fault as well. I just feel trapped and scared and I don’t have the option of saying no to him when he decides that he wants to have sex…his reaction when I say, “Not right now, or well, we can but please do anal only because I’m close to the danger zone.” He reacts by either questioning WHY I don’t’ want to, and then analyzing for hours and hours why I would turn him down even if it’s a simple reason…or it’s way way worse and he spends days scaring me by not picking up the phone when I’m at work, ignoring the twins and making them watch TV instead of play with him, or lashing out and calling me horrible names, breaking me down as far as he can until I crumple into a literal ball rocking back and forth and sobbing. I am terrified to tell him that I want an abortion…I don’t know what he would do, I really don’t. I wish we were happy, I wish that I could bring this to him and talk openly because I could really use a friend…but I really am afraid of his reaction. He’s never physically assaulted me yet, but he’s thrown things and hit me “accidentally” and I don’t think that it’s something he couldn’t do. He’s just so unhappy and so am I. I don’t want to end another marriage in failure…I really thought he and I would be amazing together, but he just seems hell bent on staying in the past and not giving me any kind of viable way forward since I can’t go back in time and un-delete those texts.

posts: 5   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2020
id 8564824

foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 7:39 PM on Tuesday, July 21st, 2020

Of course you can be the WS and abused spouse. Many of us can relate to that.

Many of us have been called names, we've had sex even if we weren't feeling it to show our BSs that we do desire them. We've tolerated smashed plates and belongings in expressions of pure rage. We've felt what you are feeling. You are not alone. And I'm sorry you feel this way and are experiencing this. It's no easy thing stepping into our BSs pain and facing it.

For many we would agree that at times yes it feels borderline abusive and sometimes it is flat out abuse. I don't suppose I necessarily excuse the behavior I just chose to see it through an educated lense of what this kind of trauma does to an individual and try to put myself in their shoes. So the name calling and rage wasn't a deal breaker for me.

My ex physically abused me once in the aftermath and 100 percent I wasn't about to wave it off as "just his pain" I drew a hard line that week and unfortunately a year later or so that one act played into my decision to leave him.

And if you are miserable and abused you have the right to speak up and draw your own line. And should! You have the right to leave at any point, and should if you fear for your safety both mentally and physically.

 I don’t have the option of saying no to him 

I don't care what you are saying no to, you absolutely have this option. What would the consequences be if you said no to sex? He would get mad? Say something about the affair? Break something? It may not be a desirable result but yes, you have the option to say no, to whatever it is.

In my situation I gave my BH many chances to help me fix this M. It takes two after all. And after almost 4 years myself of trying, I told him I can't do it on my own any more and he obviously wasn't interested in healing in a healthy way. He also wanted to rug sweep. Nope not a chance. So, I left. It was my only choice at that point.

You cannot make him want this. So you really have two options. Put up with it or not.

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

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foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 7:41 PM on Tuesday, July 21st, 2020

If there are certain things in those deleted texts he's interested in knowing, is it something that can be proven with a polygrahp?

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

posts: 2513   ·   registered: Mar. 1st, 2016   ·   location: southeast
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foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 3:49 PM on Wednesday, July 22nd, 2020

I admit I haven't been thorough in reading your post, there is just so much you have to say, and that's okay! I'm glad you are getting it out.

Like when I asked what's the worst that could happen if you say no... but I still stand by my answer. If you are not in immediate danger of your life, you have that option.

In my situation I learned that the BS isn't perfect and sometimes broken in their own way. So when this level of trauma hits them, they aren't going to necessarily be safe themselves. I had a ton of compassion for my BH in that regard, I understood it deeply.

I know in the thick of it its hard to be strong and not let this kind of treatment reach you and bring you to your knees. Like you said literally crawling into ball crying. Can you explain how he breaks you down that far? Are you in individual counseling?

Again I ask, if this comes down to the deleted texts, is it something you can get answers with a polygraph test?

[This message edited by foreverlabeled at 10:03 AM, July 22nd (Wednesday)]

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

posts: 2513   ·   registered: Mar. 1st, 2016   ·   location: southeast
id 8565174

 Idontknowhattodo (original poster New Member #74949) posted at 4:08 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

Thank you again for your input! To answer your questions, “What would the consequences be if you said no to sex? Would he get mad? Say something about the affair? Break something? It may not be a desirable result but yes, you have the option to say no, to whatever it is.”

I actually said no to sex last night so I can answer this with a real-life reaction and not just what I’m afraid might happen. My BH and I had sex at midnight last night, but he didn’t finish and left to go downstairs and get a drink, and I went to sleep. He was gone for about 20 minutes and then he came back and tore the blankets off of me and woke me up. I was half asleep and very startled and cold from the blanket being pulled away and I yelled, “NO NO STOP! Brrrrr!!! I’m trying to sleep!” and I never ever do that but I wasn’t fully conscious and it was very startling. He lost it and said, “Typical, you get what you want and then you just leave me hanging! I can’t do this anymore, you don’t respect me, I’m ready to end this sh*t.” (meaning our marriage) At that point, I was fully awake and I apologized profusely and told him that I was half asleep and the cold air startled me and I would absolutely have sex with him. However, he was in no mood to hear that and just kept going on and on about how selfish, self-centered, and disrespectful I was. I started crying because he has been awful to me for 4 days now because he’s been triggery. And when I say awful, I mean he’s either ignored me or been shouting at me for 4 days about the A that I had 4 years ago. To the extent of threatening to go to another state to find the guy that I cheated on him with and beat the crap out of him! Looking this guy up and finding his home address and work address and it scares me. Maybe it’s just blustering but HE says that the only way he can heal now is to go beat this man up. I think that because he’s a stay at home dad he just has too much time on his hands to sit around and think about this stuff over and over all day and night, but he says that I’m insensitive if I say that.

Anyway, as to your other question, I’ve offered over and over for years to do a polygraph test or go to counseling and even hypnosis to try and find the answers he’s looking for and he refuses and tells me that he doesn’t want anyone else to “know our business”.

It’s infuriating and I cannot tell you how tired I am of being the bad guy no matter what for four years on end. I don’t want to break up my family, but I’m getting so completely depressed and broken from being treated like this. I just want to be treated like someone he loves again instead of someone he despises.

posts: 5   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2020
id 8565643

foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 5:01 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

Jeez, IDKWTD.. I'm sorry I'm the only one replying at the moment. I'm sure others will come along and offer advice. But for now I guess you are stuck with me :)

Your last post doesn't make sense to me. You say you told him no on purpose but then in your description you were half asleep and so on. I'm not sure I would use his pain as real life experiment.

Anyway, his response was very typical of a betrayed spouse. Perhaps you don't fully grasp the deep level of rejection our cheating causes. And if he has been triggering lately, I just don't see that as out of the norm. You shouldn't subject yourself to things you aren't comfortable with but I feel like you may be lacking a little compassion.

You keep reminding us it's been 4 years. And I know on the surface that seems like a lot of time, but when it comes to infidelity it just isn't the same. Your BH is deeply hurt, and maybe it was a dealbreaker for him and he's not ready to face that. Maybe there are many factors that even you contribute to, that is prolonging his healing. Who knows. I too think that's an insensitive thing to say. If he's a stay at home dad maybe he feels just as trapped as you do. Many stay at home moms here cant just up and leave their cheating abuser.

When you ask him how you can help, does he give you anything to follow up on?

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

posts: 2513   ·   registered: Mar. 1st, 2016   ·   location: southeast
id 8565665

NeverTwice ( Member #74421) posted at 6:01 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

Apologies - not a wayward. Disregard.

[This message edited by NeverTwice at 12:01 PM, July 23rd (Thursday)]

"Solid boundaries discourage trespassing." - Shirley Glass

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id 8565688

 Idontknowhattodo (original poster New Member #74949) posted at 6:32 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

Thank you again for your advice, I could really use it right now. When you said, “Your last post doesn't make sense to me. You say you told him no on purpose but then in your description you were half asleep and so on. I'm not sure I would use his pain as real life experiment” That is NOT what I meant at all, .I’m sorry about that…I just re-read it and I can see how it could be taken it that way. I just meant that we happened to have sex last night so I had a real-life comparison and I didn’t have to guess at how he would react, I would never experiment with his feelings period, let alone in such a callous manner.

I’m sorry if I bring up the fact that it’s been 4 years too much, and you are completely correct, I don’t think I will ever grasp the level of rejection my cheating has caused him and I fully acknowledge that. I am just so tired and frustrated that no matter what I do or how I offer to help him heal, he turns it down. I don’t see him ever getting past this if he won’t go to a IC or MC or really, both. It’s starting to feel hopeless and I don’t want to break up my family, I love my BH, but I do not want to be treated like a sub-human for the rest of my life. I want my children to have a strong female role model and that’s something that I’m incapable of projecting when he’s behaving so terribly, and he triggers like this at least one week out of 4 every single month to this day. I don’t understand it and maybe I never will.

He is a stay at home father by choice, not necessity. I’ve begged him to go back to work because we really need more room since the twins were born and we can’t afford it on my modest salary, he doesn’t want to work and seems to me to be becoming agoraphobic. He even has a job he could go back to at any time, and I could be wrong, but I don’t think he feels trapped.

To answer your last question, “When you ask him how you can help, does he give you anything to follow up on?” He tells me that there’s nothing that I can do and new this week is him telling me that the ONLY way he will ever get past it is to go beat the crap out of AP.

posts: 5   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2020
id 8565705

foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 6:55 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

Well, earlier we talked about rug sweeping, and I wonder if it worked for you guys for some time and now the suppression is no longer sustainable and rising to the surface as of late? Or it's just been this way the entire time? Or on and off?

I just don't know how to help you. Because while yes he does need to address his trauma and do some healing, its not an easy thing to accomplish. This kind of trauma alters the mind in very devastating ways. People are built differently and recovery is messy, some have it harder than others.

I just can't tell yet if your expectations for his healing is unrealistic given the circumstances.

I mean the most normal thing you've said yet is that he wants to find the OM and kick his ass. Yeah, I bet that would make him feel better! Of course revenge seems sweet. I can't tell you how many post I've read here from our BSs and the fantasies they have beating the crap out of the APs or worse.

My own exBH left the house full of rage to hunt down the OM. I was worried sick for my BH terrified he land himself in jail with a felony charge. You need to remember why he is even in this position to begin with and try to put yourself in his shoes and find compassion.

Your posts are full of what you want and what you would have in an ideal world. But you nuked that image 4 years ago and as much as you want to return to a loving marriage, you have to understand why he despises you or what you've done. This is all natural for a betrayed spouse. And you cant rush it. He has the right to talk about his pain over your A for the rest of your lives together.

Maybe you need to analyze and get real if its something you are willing to accept without resentment and wishing he'd get help, so he can get over already. Because ya know 4 years and all. There is no time limit on his healing.

Have you read around in The Healing Library here? To the left of your screen is a menu box, you'll find it there. Tons of resources to help you understand exactly what you got yourself into by cheating and what you can expect.

If there hasn't been much work done on either side it's like yall are experiencing a perpetual first year out from dday.

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

posts: 2513   ·   registered: Mar. 1st, 2016   ·   location: southeast
id 8565721

 Idontknowhattodo (original poster New Member #74949) posted at 8:21 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

“Well, earlier we talked about rug sweeping, and I wonder if it worked for you guys for some time and now the suppression is no longer sustainable and rising to the surface as of late? Or it's just been this way the entire time? Or on and off?”

He’s been this way the entire time…and that is why I feel like giving up hope. I understand that he has the right to talk about his pain for the rest of our lives, but does he have the right to call me things like, “A waste of life, a slut, a c***, retarded, stupid, sociopathic,” and many other derogatory things for the rest of my life and never apologize to me ever again for any of it when he’s calmed down? Because I want our marriage to work more than anything else in my world, but I do not think that those kind of things lead to anything good and I don’t see how it helps him heal. It just hurts me.

“Maybe you need to analyze and get real if it’s something you are willing to accept without resentment and wishing he'd get help, so he can get over already. Because ya know 4 years and all. There is no time limit on his healing.”

That is literally what I’m trying to do right now, analyze and get real…again I apologize for focusing on the 4 years thing, I just didn’t know if people would want to read all of my posts and I wanted the information to be at hand. I have barely a shred self-esteem or self-worth left anymore…and I feel like I’m losing a grip on my own sanity because I’m scared that I really am all of those things he keeps calling me. I don’t have a close relationship with my parents, or at least not in a way that I could talk to them about any of this and I’m not allowed to talk to my best friend about any of it (BH won’t let me)…and I’m overwhelmed. When you say that the most normal thing I said so far was that BH wants to hunt down AP…I have to ask you, what is it about my posts that are so abnormal? I swear I’m just a person that’s desperately seeking advice to try and save her marriage & family and I am hurt by the way my husband has been treating me and the things he’s been calling me all of this time. Maybe it is hopeless…I sincerely appreciate your responses and thoughts. I really needed to talk through this and I will look into the healing library as you suggested.

posts: 5   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2020
id 8565753

foreverlabeled ( Member #52070) posted at 9:53 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

((IdKWTD)) those are hugs

I wasn't trying to imply you take his abuse indefinitely or ever. I'm just trying to understand your situation to better help you.

Because some of what you described seems on par and normal other stuff not so much.

Look bottom line is this, you cannot change him, you cannot make him, beg him, plead with him, cry, scream, or any other tactic to get him to see he needs help. Or get him to want it.

Look up the 180 while in The Healing Library and try to apply it to your situation so that you can detach yourself from him. It will help you to not take his attacks so personal. You will be able to grow stronger mentally and maybe make a better decision for yourself.

You need IC at the very least. Start there please. And tell us how we can continue to help you.

33 divorced Madhatter
Time is no ones friend, nor their enemy. It moves forward at its own fixed pace, careless of our wants to speed it or slow it.

posts: 2513   ·   registered: Mar. 1st, 2016   ·   location: southeast
id 8565777

BraveSirRobin ( Member #69242) posted at 11:02 PM on Thursday, July 23rd, 2020

Yes, it is possible to be a WW and be abused, and further, I feel that's exactly what's happening to you. You are describing abusive behavior.

Is it understandable behavior? To answer that, I recommend you read "The Body Keeps the Score" by Bessel Van der Kolk. I mean, I really recommend you read it, like tomorrow. It sounds like your husband has infidelity- related PTSD. Here are a few passages that you might find relevant:

"When something reminds traumatized people of the past, their right brain reacts as if the traumatic event were happening in the present. But because their left brain is not working very well, they may not be aware that they are experiencing and reenacting the past - they are just furious, terrified, enraged, ashamed, or frozen. After the emotional storm passes, they may look for something or somebody to blame for it. They behaved the way they did because you were ten minutes late, or because you burned the potatoes, or because you 'never listen to me.' Of course, most of us have done this from time to time, but when we cool down, we hopefully can admit our mistake. Trauma interferes with this kind of awareness, and, over time, our research demonstrated why. [He then explains neurological studies his team performed to understand the physical effect of emotional trauma on the brain.]

For a hundred years or more, every textbook of psychology and psychotherapy has advised that some method of talking about distressing feelings can resolve them. However, as we've seen, the experience of trauma itself gets in the way of being able to do that. No matter how much insight and understanding we develop, the rational brain is basically impotent to talk the emotional brain out of its own reality. I am continually impressed by how difficult it is for people who have gone through the unspeakable to convey the essence of their experience. It is so much easier for them to talk about what has been done to them - to tell a story of victimization and revenge - than to notice, feel, and put into words the reality of their internal experience."

That book was a revelation for me in understanding how the traumatized brain literally cannot heal itself through conventional means of therapy. This could be what's happening with your BH, especially if it's a complete character change from who he was before D-Day.

Does understanding this mean you should tolerate him abusing you? In my opinion, no. This doesn't sound like a safe or healthy environment for you and your children. If he's screaming, threatening, swearing, isolating and coercing you, your kids are learning that that's an ok model for a relationship. This is aside from what it does to you to live with that for years on end, which I think creates two traumatized parents instead of one.

I personally would have separated by now. And while my BH always identifies with the trauma of fellow BS in posts like this, he agrees that there are lines that there's never a justification for crossing. If your husband is not capable of addressing his rage, you are well within your rights to take yourself out of range of it -- even as the creator of the trauma.

If you feel you can stay, I would make it conditional on him seeing a trauma therapist.

[This message edited by BraveSirRobin at 10:08 AM, July 25th (Saturday)]

WW/BW 51 (Me)
BH/WH 51 (TimeSpiral)

posts: 2038   ·   registered: Dec. 27th, 2018
id 8565791

Lifeitself ( Member #71057) posted at 6:39 AM on Friday, July 24th, 2020


You said you were still living with your exH when you were in a relationship with your BH. Did you start your relationship with BH with having an affair with him on your exH?

posts: 80   ·   registered: Jul. 21st, 2019   ·   location: UK
id 8565885
Topic is Sleeping.
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