SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

T/j

Suicide is generally considered to be the ultimate act of selfishness.

Ouch! Empathy much? I've suffered from depression off and on my whole life and have been suicidal several times. The first time I was 10 years old and in fourth grade. I just couldn't see a way that life would ever be okay. I wouldn't wish that on anyone and I would never add to that pain by calling them selfish.

I guess suicide is selfish but it's hard to think of others when in a place of such pain.

End t/j.

I'm sorry for you both A1, and for your kids.

Your situation has really been difficult to watch. You go from having a lovely marriage for the last several years only to find out about the old affair. The pain for you both has obviously been significant.

Given the tone this thread has taken at times, I would point out that I haven't seen any indication she attempted suicide when OM died. Clearly losing you has been far more painful than losing him. I don't know if you can take any comfort in that with respect to her cheating.

Even when divorcing, she is always the mother of your children, and so her well-being will always matter to you because it matters to your children. And it's often hard to not care about someone you made a life with. You are a really good man and I wish you all the best.

Take care.

[This message edited by sudra at 9:46 AM, February 14th (Wednesday)]

I really hope that ohforanewme also contributes. Between him and spaceghost007 you have some (unfortunate) subject matter experts.

But both are great guys.

Not telling your daughters takes away some potential help she might have. I know that her relationship with them is strained due to the A but I think they would likely change their attitude towards her if they knew how profoundly this has affected her and she could use that support right now. This whole tragedy has cost her the marriage and also damaged her relationship with her children. She is probably feeling very alone. I would rethink telling them about this especially if you think they could be supportive and empathetic towards her. I understand why it is hard for you to be there for her so maybe you could get them to do it.

Yes, spaceghost, ohforanewme--and don't forget about yhgtbkm. In each case, the waywards had mental meltdowns.

[This message edited by MidnightRun at 10:57 AM, February 14th (Wednesday)]

First let me say that I'm not giving any advice. Advice is usually given by people who have experience in the field they are advising on. They give advice on what they would do and what would make themselves feel better. Oscar Wilde said, "Experience is simply the name we give our mistakes". So, mine are simply observations.

I noticed two important phrases you made in your update. One was, "I still love her" and two "my best friend". I can't even imagine your hurt and I understand your need to divorce in order to heal. Divorce doesn't mean that you have to cut her completely out of your life. I have read where several couples divorced and severed the legal aspect of the marriage but continued to cohabit. I believe your wife would understand this and be glad to be given that choice. If I remember, you stated earlier you didn't think you would ever marry again. Cohabitation means everything is your decision without the legal binding. Not a marriage but still being together. I would think doing without something you love and miss because you feel like you have too, is like the adage of "cutting off your nose to spite your face." And speaking of choice, I know that you fell you were second choice for many years. In cohabitation you are either first choice or no choice at all. Something else to think about. Even though it was a very LTA, when the POS was killed she became depressed and needed therapy. When faced with losing you she became suicidal and needs a psychiatrist. Appears her choice changed considerably. If you continued to live with her after the divorce, you are not living with the wife who had the affair. Instead you are living with a woman, whom you have no legal obligation to, because you chose to live with her. If you have sex, you are having sex with a woman you are living with and not sex with a wife who cheated on you. I would think it would be better than spending life alone with nothing but work to fill the void. Plus, I'm pretty sure that with all things considered, she is very much in love with you.

Everyone is always concerned with consequences. What are her consequences. There must be consequences. So here are my observations on her consequences.

1. She has permanently destroyed the life she had and loved.

2. She has lost that total love and respect of her husband and children.

3. She threw away her marriage.

4. She will always be seen as a woman who cheated, lied, and deceived her husband and family. A woman who was selfish and put herself first and above everyone else.

5. She will know and never forget that she will always be viewed as something less than what she should have been.

6.She will know and feel the hurt of knowing that the man she was suppose to love above all others will never forget what she did to him.

7. She will always look at the man who was her husband and wonder what he is thinking.

8. She will forever live with and die with the hurt in her heart of the unspeakable damage she did to the lives of those she loved and who loved her.

9. Her world is forever changed from the good it was to just the existence it has become.

Emotional consequences can be so much more detrimental and longer lasting on a person than

physical ones.

A very good friend of mine once sent me a quote that applies somewhat to my observation.

"Love does not mean you can live with her. Love means you can't live without her."

In this case you can substitute "her" with "him". I think your wife showed a very accurate demonstration of this quote. She had rather be dead than to live without you. She didn't try to kill herself when the POS was killed. In military intelligence we use to call this an "indication".

I do know that people do change even if it takes years for them to wake up and see what they became and what damage they caused. There was once a man who was a captain of a slave ship. He caused untold pain, misery and death to so many people transporting slaves from Africa to the New World. During a storm at sea in 1748, when he thought all was lost, he became a changed man. He became a minister and a avid crusader against slavery. His name was John Newton and he wrote the hymn "Amazing Grace". People can change but the hard part, for us, is accepting that change and accepting back those that have changed.

Make the decisions that are best for you and those you love. Anyone can give advice but it is you that has to live with the decisions you make, not the people who advised you. Your girls are gone so live the life that will make you happy or at least content. Not the life you think you have to live because of the circumstances and situation. I do wish you well.

She doesn’t want the girls to know, so I have kept quiet.

AmbivalentOne

So your wife didn’t care if her girls found out she killed herself (if she was successful) but she doesn’t want them to know that she tried to kill herself.

Of course any suicidal talk should be taken seriously and 911 called. Therapy is a must. I just want you to know that people that attempt suicide fall into two groups. Those that want to be successful and those that don’t. Those that don’t want to be successful want attention, sympathy or victimhood.

I’m a retired medical examiner and have investigated thousands of cases over 30 years to determine if they were homicide, suicide or accident.

My daughter is a physician and covers a large emergency department. She sees many people that want attention. They have two things in common. The first is that they use methods that take time such as pills. Some cut their wrist very superficially. The second is that they do it where they can be found.

I’ve had cases where the person that was supposed to find them had something unexpected come up. The result was they were not found and ended up passing away. What I had to figure out as a medical examiner is do I rule that a suicide or an accident.

I have no idea what group your wife falls into. Again, all people that even talk about suicide should be taken seriously and get the help they need.

[This message edited by Michigan at 4:02 PM, February 14th (Wednesday)]

A1,

Great to have you back. Thanks for the update.

I am sorry to hear how broken your WW is. It should be you as the more broken one after what you have gone through.

I am glad you still care enough about her to be there for her and hopefully that never goes away but I am also glad that you have kept your focus and discipline and are proceeding with the separation and divorce. You have chosen it as the best course for you and as most can't get over betrayal at all, let alone the massive one you have been dealt.

I would suggest that those who say that you shouldn't keep what she did regarding the suicide attempt a secret are correct. Your daughters, despite their anger at their mom, could be an asset in keeping your WW's head above water during this challenging time for her and take off the worry off of your back during this challenging time for you.

I know several here are taking shots at her IC and I have mixed feelings about this one. On one hand, the IC worked for your wife and not you. The IC probably felt strongly that the marriage would not survive if she informed you about her intense 9 year affair. The IC was right in this regard. As I have alluded to before, you were the victim of massive fraud. You provided a great lifestyle with very hard work and your wife blew the trust that a SAHM is given to conduct a massive affair and even as you alluded to before, gave the OM the best she had. Then she covered it up for 9 years and almost got away with it but blew up 9 years of your relative youth (the last 9)based on a lie. I point this out, not to rehash, but because I believe the IC knews this and gave her the advice she did. So in that regard, I don't blame your WW or IC. On the other hand, I do blame them both as some of the others here do because 1) There never should have been any cheating in the first place and 2) The truth is the best way to approach things and the IC and WW had this opportunity to come clean and botched it. If I cheated for 9 years, I would hide it out of self preservation. The deal is though that I don't cheat so it will never become an issue

I credit you, A1, because you have handled this situation very well. Your mentality also provides you a unique ability to move towards your (IMO rightful) objective to leave the marriage but it also allows you to have compassion and still care so much about her that you would be there for her if she needed it.

Again, I am glad you have returned. I knew you would.

Yes, this thread has gotten nasty at times. I don't blame anyone for that. Everyone has your best interests in mind. Some are pro-D, some are pro-R, some are good at slapping you on the back and coddling and some are the 'take your time' to make a decision crowd. I never felt you disappeared over being 'turned off'. I knew there had to be some kind of issue.

However, in the end, emotions fly because people are saddened, angered and sometimes flat out triggered by your story. To me, it's the 'skeleton in the room' issue. As I have referenced here before, we've all been through the infidelity wagon on this forum but your case is in my Top 5 among the worst so it makes me always wonder how many similar cases are out there. I just discovered someone on SI who endured an 18 year affair at the hands of his wife with a best friend of his. Shocking. I am a cop, 24 plus years on. My schedule was not always easy so it's one of these 'if it happened to A1, it could have happened to me' thoughts that creep into people's minds. I consider myself low risk because the wife and I always knows where the other is, there is complete transparency, she comes from a great moral background and I am an excellent detective if I thought something was off. She also works massive hours.

However, your thread has triggered many but it provokes thought and it is a valuable experience for some newly betrayed to see how well you have handled things and to watch you march out of infidelity

This is heartbreaking. You and wife are in my prayers.

To the ones than are using this horrible turn of events to pile on his wife says WAY more about you than you can imagine. I am shocked at the lack of humanity in some of these replies.

First let me say that I'm not giving any advice. Advice is usually given by people who have experience in the field they are advising on. They give advice on what they would do and what would make themselves feel better. Oscar Wilde said, "Experience is simply the name we give our mistakes". So, mine are simply observations.

anoldlion: I don't understand - are you saying you are not a BS? I do not agree at all with your quote on love meaning that you can't live without someone. That is a sick dependence.

My wife attempted suicide as well.

It was not motivated by selfishness. It was motivated by blinding pain brought about by the realization of what she had done.

I have nothing to offer really except to say you are not the only one to have gone through this.

[This message edited by redsox13 at 8:17 PM, February 14th (Wednesday)]

Sending thoughts and prayers to your whole family.

I tried to die, I never revealed it to my child at that time, or my future children. But, I now feel it was an accumulation of depression, and hopelessness.

Sometimes death can seem preferably. I remember one night sitting out in the freezing cold, and just thinking it would be so much easier to let go of life.

Maybe, she needs help to see a future path, without so much pain. To be able to raise her chin up and feel a sense of pride, to feel worthy.

I wish you well.

I am not going to lie. Seeing her like that was one of the hardest things I have ever experienced. Despite our recent history, I still love her and knowing how close my best friend of so many years came to dying by her own hand really threw me for a loop.

I am still committed to separation and divorce, but this event really shook me up. She doesn’t want the girls to know, so I have kept quiet. She is now back at her sister’s, but under the care of a psychiatrist, which is a relief.

Every thread here focuses on the actions of one person, almost always a wayward partner. Yet when the threads develop, they become the story of the betrayed as much as they are of the betrayer. And if anyone reads this thread and can put aside the WW and the affair, they will see that the most amazing thing is the picture of AmbivalentOne that emerges.

A1, as the quotes above, and your actions throughout this ordeal show beyond a shadow of a doubt, you are a man of incredible stability, decency, and compassion. You have never lowered your standards or lost sight of who you are and who you want to be, even when the pain left you eating so little that you collapsed from a combination of exhaustion and malnourishment. And throughout it all, you have had a certainty about what you need to do for yourself to extricate yourself from a situation that was not of your making.

I wish I had had your presence of mind when I stumbled through my own trials. I really hope that you find the happiness that you so richly deserve.

I am not a particularly religious man. I would say that God and I have a nodding acquaintance. I think he has better things to do than worry about me, so I don't bother him very often, but I am going to say a prayer tonight for both you and your WW.

AO so sorry that this story has turned in this direction.

I know despite everything she's done that you don't have to love her as your wife but she is the mother of two of the greatest gifts god has ever blessed you with and that's your daughters.

She was also your friend and even though she lied to you and failed in that role as well it doesn't mean that you still don't have love for her.

You know first hand what it's like to have your heart broken and to get to a place in life that you don't think the pain will ever go away.

That's the tragic thing about suicide is that a person gets so far down in a hole that they can't see any light and thus any glimmer of hope is hard to see and an overwhelming sense of helplessness comes over them and the solution to make this pain go away is permanent (but their grief keeps them from truly grasping the magnitude of choosing that option).

I watched my SIL take her life and she left five kids without a mom (two of them were twins who were three yrs old when it happened). It devastated my brother's family and the rest of my family as well as we were blindsided by it. All the why's and what ifs.

I also wanted to say that those who are pointing out that she chose to attempt this knowing she was losing you and not after she lost OM and what that may imply all I can say to that is when she lost OM she had you to fall back on (along with your daughters and that life) and this time there is nobody else to fall back on.

Hang in there.

This is a tough situation and there's only so much you can do.

Right now your WW needs professional help and all you can do is let her know how much it would hurt you and your daughters not to have her here.

Again so sorry. I pray that she finds the peace she's seeking and that you find the wisdom you're seeking (and needing right now) in order to process all of this and t guide our steps moving forward.

Please keep us updated AO and I also hope that you will continue to take care of yourself!!!

Thank God they were able to revive her! Those who say this woman tried to kill herself because she is selfish, or to get attention, should keep thoughts like that to themselves. This is a woman who in the last 3 months has lost her husband, her children, her home, her entire life! She's been exposed. No doubt word has gotten around town by now. She has no career of her own. This is her rock bottom. It's because of this that I was afraid she might try to commit suicide. I am so sorry that turned out to be the case.

I KNOW, I KNOW.... she had a LTA that was absolutely horrible. I am not sticking up for her behavior. She absolutely does not deserve to have a good man like A1 for her husband. But she does have the potential to make a fresh start from here, and live a very fulfilling life. With this particular case, there seems to be a strong "BURN THE WITCH" mentality for A1's WW. I disagree with this sentiment. She obviously had SERIOUS issues to not only have this affair for 9 years, but to also hide it for another 9 years. A1 is doing what he needs to do to get himself out of infidelity, and move on with his life. He has chosen to D, a decision that most of us would have made, considering the circumstances.

But for now, I think anything D related should be put on hold. While she's not longer your wife, in the non-literal sense, she is still the mother of your children. Someone you have built a life with. Someone you've had a friendship with since you were teenagers. Someone you still do love and care for, despite her A and the upcoming D. Help her get the care that she needs. I know that you'd probably rather she just not be your problem anymore, but she's going to need your grace and your compassion to help get her off the road to suicide. You've even said she's become a great person, and will make the next guy very happy. Sounds like you are correct. She deserves another chance to find happiness, as do you. You are no longer her husband, but you can still be her friend. Perhaps, even in D, you two can help each other move on with your lives.

I think that you should tell the girls. Obviously this is your WWs decision, but I think it would help. It would cause your DDs to reassess their feelings for their mother, and then perhaps they can start to rebuild their relationship. Part of the reason she did this is because her own daughters hate her. But if she had been successful in her suicide, your daughters would have to live the rest of their lives with the pain of having lost their mother while on bad terms. Even though this issue is entirely WWs fault, I think it's going to take all 4 of you to help each other move on and get your family to a better place.

Also, I hope you take care of yourself. You're definitely a busy man, and you're spread pretty thin right now, professionally. Take some time for yourself now and then. I'll be wishing for the best for you, your DDs, and your STBXW.

This!

Great advice Fenderguy. I absolutely agree one hundred percent with everything you have put forward in your post.

longsadstory1952

Suicide is generally considered to be the ultimate act of selfishness. Doesn't sound like your wife has changed much in the last few months. So very sad. It really seems like in her mind, it's always all about her. Good luck

Great point to make at this time, not. The poor woman is at the end of her tether, I hope you are proud of yourself. No doubt you will come back to say it was all her own fault. A truly empathetic person...

Good luck to you A1. I think you should tell your daughters, as they need to support their mother despite what she did to the family. That is what families do.

I am glad you have an abundance of integrity unlike some.

A1, sigh, what an update. I’m sorry your STBXW attempted suicide. I didn’t expect to read that, and can imagine that it was difficult for you to deal with. Probably more of the same feelings as you had watching her cry inconsolably from your hospital bed a few weeks back. I agree with those assessing her attempt as a reaction to hitting rock bottom. I’m glad she could be revived and is getting the professional help she needs. Hopefully, being given a second chance will ensure she stays on course to be a better person for the second act of her life.

I suspect she’ll need some help from you to encourage your DDs to re-engage with her. Please think about the best way to do that for both her and their sakes. To a lesser degree, I expect you’ll benefit from them re-establishing some relationship as well.

I agree that her attempt should not change your course one bit, but perhaps downplaying (or better yet, leaving unsaid) where things are headed in the short-term is best for all. Given the grace with which you’ve handled everything so far, I expect you will address this challenge equally as well.

Also, the vaccine clinic is a great idea for those that want to participate. In general, more people should get the flu vaccine.

no I have to disagree with the Fenderguy here.

I haven't seen a 'burn the witch' mentality since he has come back.

All I saw was compassion for a woman who created such evil. It's not deserved but it is here, even from me.

Some people feel that anyone critical of their cheating spouse is out of bounds (that's not a shot at you fenderguy) but your comment on putting D on hold shows your angle which I disagree with.

However, I agree with everything else Fenderguy said. We are here for A1 but the facts here are the facts and A1 has repeated them multiple times so why do people refute them to assist a marital predator of 9 years ?

Do you really think that giving A1's wife props is somehow helpful to him ???

I think not. If you do, let's take this off board and we will have it out

[This message edited by Western at 6:44 PM, February 14th (Wednesday)]

Sorrowful Moon, are you suggesting that some of this is A1's fault ??? If not, please clarify because as of right now, it is all of her fault, Despite her current mishaps