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double post

[This message edited by gonnabe2016 at 10:00 PM, March 27th (Thursday)]

gonnabe, I had that same gut reaction as he was talking with me. Thank you for making it clear to me that my gut was correct.

Hey Stu buddy I'm sorry to hear about what has apparently transpired in your marriage. I don't know how you're doing with this buddy but please hang in there. I know I'm thinking about you Stu all the time. Please keep coming back and posting updating. It will help you tremendously too. Hope to hear from you soon buddy.

Stu,

As tragic as your story has been, as it unfolded, I still can't help but think that your wife is trying to communicate to you....it is just in her fucked-up ability to do so.

I also agree with gonnabe's assessment of her being passive---to a certain extent. Your wife still has no clue on how to be open with you.

But she isn't shutting you out. Giving you full access...willingly...to her psych doctor, is one example of that.

I think that it is really going to come down to what you can mentally handle. You are going to learn more heartbreaking information, as you delve deeper. My guess is that you are about 75% of the way there. Do you have it in you to dig for the last 25%?

I don't think that there is a wrong answer at this time. If you want out, you are more than welcome to do that with a clean conscience---your WW's prior actions have seen to that. But you seem to be holding out for a possible happy future together, and I don't see anything wrong with that. You are still getting cooperation---although it is still mixed with lies and half-truths. That is better than many members get here. And if you are willing to keep trying, then who are we to tell you otherwise? Now, if your wife was uncooperative, and shutting you out....that would be a different story.

It's your call. It always has been. But you can't forget to put yourself first. You have to continue working on finding the "old" Stu.

It’s a very eerie feeling to know, that strangers know more about you, your wife, your marriage, and your life, than you do! These threads of insight, posted by intelligent concerned people are beginning, finally, to ring TRUE!

Yesterday my wife and I had another one of our long emotional talks, but this time it was at her psychiatrist’s office. She was emotionally distraught, almost hysterical as she told me things that her doctor had told me would be difficult for her to talk about. She told me that the many physical relationships she had were just that, physical. Like the ones she had with the fathers of some of our children’s friends. They were contacts with men that had no emotional connections with her at all. When she was in one of her moods (manic) she felt worthless and felt being abused and debased by her lovers proved “she was a piece of shit.” Her attachment to that Adonis guy was one of those relationships. She said he enjoyed the “depravity they shared.” Her contacts with him proved to her, she was worthless. They street drugs they shared just seemed to be part of that relationship. The “more out of it” she was just seemed to encourage him more. She said there were times he shared her with a friend or two. It was about here I told her and her doctor I needed to have her stop. She said that one of those times occurred on our first anniversary together; this was just a few months after our first child was born. Back then she had told me that she couldn’t be home because of work, and that the business trip would take a few days. This contact with him continued for years. She added that for her it was like going to the bathroom, something you have to do; many times it was just for the drugs only.

Her doctor asked if I was ok, I told him NO. He said he’d call my pharmacy and prescribe something for me, if I wished and we could continue tomorrow. I told him I’d call him. I left and went home and cried. There was much more she told me, but it’s extremely painful for me to even think about right now.

OMG Stu, I'm so sorry for the pain you are going through.

Stu, I'm very sorry for what you are having to deal with right now. I am also fearful of what the future Revelations will bring.

we are still here. We still have your back!

Stu,

On this current path, I believe that it is ultimately going to come down to (2) factors:

(1) Will you be able to work past the atrocities and betrayals of your WW?

and

(2) Will your WW ever have the capacity to love you like you deserve?

Again, I know I am beating a dead horse, but she is trying to communicate. It is just that she is so damaged, that repair(at least to an acceptable extent) may prove impossible. Especially that you have now discovered that there was no "pre-marriage bad girl vs. post-marriage good girl" anymore. The betrayals have been continuous and never-ending. But that decision doesn't need to be made today...unless you want out.

5454 continues to remind you to work on yourself. I can't stress that enough. I think that if you look back from your first post, you will see that:

--You felt compelled to ask your wife to marry you, over the phone, when she said that she was going to hook up with a guy. And you knew her propensity to sleep with men right away.

--You were certain that your wife was faithful from the moment of engagement. That she was now a changed person.

--You were certain that the OM was your best friend. He was probably your "closest ally" up until a few weeks ago.

--You were unaware of your WW's frequency(or infrequency) with her psychiatric doctor...during your entire marriage.

By know means is the above meant to be insulting. But these are important topics to discuss with your IC in building back a healthier, stronger Stu. Your mental health is paramount right now, and you need to keep focus on that. You have been dealt enough trauma to last several lifetimes...and the hits keep coming. So if nothing else, PLEASE take care of yourself. You have come very far, and you sure as hell have my admiration.

We met again at her doctor’s office. Surprisingly I was feeling OK. All the actions of my wife’s were not my fault, nor hers, to a degree; she’s mentally ill. She rambled on with many more disgusting bits of information about the things she has done, sexual and non-sexual. She said that she was sorry for the torment caused by her to me and our family. That she felt she was unable to tell me the truth without her doctor present, that’s why we’re here. She filled in the details of her involvement with my former BF. She said that her sexual relationship with him started in high school and continued on and off for years; even while she and I dated and after our marriage. She said the story about her first pregnancy was partially true. He (my BF) was the father of that child. They had agreed that neither was ready for a family and she did go to NYC to give it up for adoption; but she was very upset and remorseful she gave their baby away. She didn’t see him after the birth and got heavily into street drugs and prostitution; that’s how she wound up in Puerto Rico (she speaks Spanish); she continued her street activity there. She did get pregnant in PR but had a miscarriage, first month. A girlfriend had taken her to the hospital because of bleeding, she called by BF from there and they reconnected.

She said that once my BF found out I was dating her, he was always around. The fact that we were close friends didn’t hurt. We would double date, he’d join us if he didn’t have a date, he’d hang out at our apartment, we’d go to the community pool with him, he’d accompany us on many short vacations; everywhere we went, he tagged along, or we went with him. After we were married the same pattern continued. He come over after work and stayed for dinner, he’d be at our place on the weekends or we’d go to his. My wife and he would go to cultural events together, I didn’t like those things. Even though he was my BF, I’d complain to my wife that we never had time to ourselves. She always defended him. There were weekends that he slept over in the guest bedroom; even during the week. After he got married my wife and I would visit him at his home. It was my wife who would drag us to his place. This continued even after the children were born. It was so common, it was just part of our life; I thought nothing of it after a while. Remember he was my BF, like a brother to me (family).

She said she needed him for support and would see or call him when she was feeling a change in her body emotionally (depression). After I got my apartment she called him and he was on his way to see her when the car accident happened.

Since you were at your new apartment, we were going to meet at the xxxxxxx motel; that’s why her girlfriend was originally called to baby sit, she said. She said, she had stopped taking her meds around the time she spoke to his wife about their relationship and was getting very depressed. She said that she hasn’t acted out with anyone for a few years and has been faithful to me.

Regarding the paternity of the children, she has no idea who the biological father is and she again apologized and said it is despicable that she did this to me and us. She added, "Your the only man who really loved me unconditionally.” If I wanted a paternity test, it was ok with her.

As I said, I think I’m OK. I know what my options are, I have choices. I realize she is sick mentally. Can I deal with it, I don’t know? If she had cancer, TB, or any disease, I’d be there for her. So why not for this? The deal breaker might probably be the results of the paternity test. I have another IC coming up, will talk it out there.

If this is really the truth, even her doctor won’t guarantee it, I asked privately. Her stories keep changing, may be she doesn’t know the truth any more. But as I said, I have options and time.

We would double date, he’d join us if he didn’t have a date, he’d hang out at our apartment, we’d go to the community pool with him, he’d accompany us on many short vacations; everywhere we went, he tagged along, or we went with him. After we were married the same pattern continued. He come over after work and stayed for dinner, he’d be at our place on the weekends or we’d go to his. My wife and he would go to cultural events together, I didn’t like those things. Even though he was my BF, I’d complain to my wife that we never had time to ourselves. She always defended him. There were weekends that he slept over in the guest bedroom; even during the week. After he got married my wife and I would visit him at his home. It was my wife who would drag us to his place. This continued even after the children were born. It was so common, it was just part of our life; I thought nothing of it after a while. Remember he was my BF, like a brother to me (family).

She said she needed him for support and would see or call him when she was feeling a change in her body emotionally (depression). After I got my apartment she called him and he was on his way to see her when the car accident happened.

Wow. That's cake-eating at its worst that I have heard.

All I can say is that a good relationship is built on trust. I think it comes down to if you can ever trust her again. You've just uncovered a mountain of lies and managed deceit that would make the KGB green with envy.

Please do not let her excuse her actions through mental illness. It is not an excuse. She was aware of what she was doing. It sounds like she has some real deep seated issues but all of this was a CHOICE.

Regarding the paternity of the children, she has no idea who the biological father is

What kind of wife would ever do that to a faithful, loyal supportive husband? She has free will and deliberately made decisions that would give other men the chance of fathering her children and you the job of bringing up these children. This is contempt and disrespect for you of the highest level. Its possible all the babies she has borne in her life have been fathered by the OM. Thats a very strong emotional connection.

There were weekends that he slept over in the guest bedroom; even during the week.

You can also bet she was sneaking off to his room to have sex while you were sleeping nearby. Just a few days ago she was going to meet him in a motel for sex and had it not been for a very fortuitous car accident she would have screwed him.

IMHO you should tell her the only chance of reconciliation would be if both the kids were yours and then get them tested.

Bear in mind she feels very sorry for you, but her treacherous heart belongs to sleezeball BF.

After much thought, I'm going forward with testing. As soon as I get results I'll post it. I need to know one way or the other. If I just burry my head in the sand, I know it will destroy me; the uncertainty! Whatever the results, I’ll have to live with it (if negative) and find a way to cope. Then I can make decisions regarding my wife and our connection to each other. A friend of mine who works at a well-known lab as a cytotechnologist told me his lab also does this testing; he said it might be possible if he asks, to fast track it through. He got me the packaging I needed,and I gave him the samples I took today; he's turning them in tomorrow. Thank you for all the guidance about paternity testing. I told my children I was doing an ancestry search about them. One of you suggested this approach. Thanks.

STU - Sorry about how your situation developed.

I just wanted to offer a word of advice about the DNA test and make sure that you avoid any possibility of tampering or mishandling.

I hear you that you gave the samples to your friend to be tested. HOWEVER, I would just run a parallel testing via a conventional procedure, that is mail it in a lab without anyone you or your wife know touching it.

I know it sounds extreme, but with everything that has happened to you and your story, you never know.

Regardless, I hope that you and your kids get through this with as little damage as possible. I know you already know that the kids are just innocent by-standards... hopefully, they will not become collateral damage.

Best of luck to you.

Thank you for your concern. This friend doesn’t know my wife, he has never met her. He is a professional friend I met a few years ago and we hang out a few times a month with other friends who don’t know my wife either (Of course with her track record, I’m joking!). The packaging was sealed by me and I had to write my signature over the sealing security tape. I have confidence it will not be tampered with. Thanks again.

She said that she hasn’t acted out with anyone for a few years and has been faithful to me.

The problem with her saying this is that it really just doesn't mean much since all parties involved know that all she had to do was snap her fingers and your BF would be there. Her faithfulness doesn't mean too much when it is packaged with a go-to 'back-pocket' guy.

Since you were at your new apartment, we were going to meet at the xxxxxxx motel; that’s why her girlfriend was originally called to babysit,

Well this explains why your wife was called to the hospital and HIS wife either wasn't called or chose not to go.

Your WW's decision to meet up with your BF at a motel on the very day that you left your family home because of the devastation that she brought into your life is reason enough to hefty-bag her shit.

Your WW is going to need a LOT of intensive therapy before she is able to be any semblance of a *safe* person for you.....and honestly, I'm not sure that she'll be able to do it. Maybe it is just your writing style, but she seems very complacent. She'll provide you explanations when you ask a question and she'll apologize. But I'm not seeing the "omg, I'm so sorry that I've been so horribly deceptive and taken total advantage of your kindness and love"-type of awareness from her. The fact that she has not been burning her shrink's phone up since the revelation is NOT a good sign. Is she embracing her diagnosis and committing to taking her meds religiously? Is she on the computer researching her diagnosis and trying to find information and ways to manage it so that she can be a *safe* person?

My impression of your WW is that she is with you because you offer her stability and security and she knows that you have her back. When you started this thread, you were under the impression that she had been a faithful wife (and if you recall, I expressed my doubts about that based on the other stuff you had written).....and you know now differently. My question is, though, what has she REALLY given to you? What has SHE brought to the table? Nothing but illusory bullshit. she has portrayed herself to you as someone who she's not.

I have dealt with the *long-con*, and a (now)stbx who has some pretty serious FOO issues and, most likely, some type of 'diagnosis'. I remained in that marriage for too long after Dday because of the marriage vows that I took. The problem is that the marriage vows are meant for people who are acting with the good-faith intention of remaining true to them, they are not meant to hold someone hostage in a situation that is abusive. "In sickness and in health" doesn't mean that just because she's bipolar and has had an ongoing relationship with your BF that you are just supposed to 'suck it up.' (I'm reallyhaving a hard time with the fact that your WW arranged a meeting with BF when you moved out....)

I am glad that you chose to do the paternity test. Having that kind of question hanging over your head would just be too hard. Some people can do it (but I don't know how). What you HAVE to remember is that YOU are the only dad those kids have known. You ARE *dad*. I'm crossing my fingers that the results come back and show that you are bio-dad.

Thank you for your blunt, frank words. They DO ring true and give me much to think about especially after my meeting with my BF’s wife.

Your words:

My impression of your WW is that she is with you because you offer her stability and security and she knows that you have her back. When you started this thread, you were under the impression that she had been a faithful wife (and if you recall, I expressed my doubts about that based on the other stuff you had written).....and you know now differently. My question is, though, what has she REALLY given to you? What has SHE brought to the table? Nothing but illusory bullshit. She has portrayed herself to you as someone who she's not.

I have dealt with the *long-con*, and a (now)stbx who has some pretty serious FOO issues and, most likely, some type of 'diagnosis'. I remained in that marriage for too long after Dday because of the marriage vows that I took. The problem is that the marriage vows are meant for people who are acting with the good-faith intention of remaining true to them, they are not meant to hold someone hostage in a situation that is abusive. "In sickness and in health" doesn't mean that just because she's bipolar and has had an ongoing relationship with your BF that you are just supposed to 'suck it up.

It was the disclosure by her that my BF was on the way to her when he had the car accident that pushed me over the edge. I have loved this woman as she said “unconditionally” and was willing to work things out. Today I was thinking about resuming my relationship with her. Tonight I’m not. I met with my former BF”s wife, now separated.

She told me more details about my wife’s sexual encounters with her soon to be ex. She told me she found e-mails between the two of them that were incriminating. She accessed his work computer using the special password she knew so she could read his mail and documents. She used to be his secretary when they started dating; he never changed the password. Apparently he and my wife have been screwing each other right up to the present. She swore to me she hadn’t been fooling around for years; all lies. His wife said that about 8 weeks ago they were in Michigan, somewhere near Saginaw; where ever the hell that is. She said he told her he was on a business trip. He called her from there to say the weather wasn't good and he would be delayed. My wife had contacted me with the same story. The e-mails from my wife confirmed she would meet him at some hotel near there. When I checked my wife’s business schedules, she was away on those dates on business also. His wife said there were other e-mails and she showed me copies of them. They confirmed the two had physical contact on a number of other occasions; some of it read like cheap porn. She and I looked at each other and began to laugh. She said she was through with him; he had apparently been fooling around with other woman as well as my wife. She was taking her children and moving out of state, back to where her family lived. I told her I’m done also! I was willing to forgive, but there must be trust, it’s not there. I'm going to wait for the DNA results before I do anything.

(((Stu))) I am so sorry.

I had a gut feeling that the A never ended when you wrote about her meeting him after the car accident.

Hang in there, all of this sucks, but you now know your wife has continued to lie, even at the psychiatrist's office.

Stu .... WOW ... Buddy hang in there your wife has never been your wife.... She is a very sick person. On this level of evil betrayal. she has no way of getting out of this crap she has put you through. I really don't think you can make up a story so evil. Cold disturb sick woman I don't understand why she didn't just stay with him. She wouldn't have to go through all this bullshit. unfortunately you have got to get away from her. She didn't just hurt you. she did shit to you wouldn't even to an enemy. Seriously this woman or whatever she is (satan) I don't know what she was thinking that this was not going to blow up like it did. As for your BF he's got nothing coming. Best thing you could do. Act like he never even existed. He is dead to you. What a piece of shit. What's his excuse ( he needs to stay away form your whole family) but they won't..!!!

good luck buddy and keep posting

[This message edited by trojan007 at 6:41 AM, March 31st (Monday)]

My marriage lasted 10 years with a woman who has cheated on me with guys I knew personally as well as one night stands over the 10 years. Her deception was worthy of an Academy Award for her portrayal of the loving, faithful, nurturing wife. Why did she marry me? Gonnabe2016’s explanation is probably close

… that she is with you because you offer her stability and security and she knows that you have her back.

I did, she had it all. She was living two lives at the same time; the mother and wife, and the free swinging sexually perverted party girl. It was for a specific reason I began posting almost a month ago and it led (with the suggestions of my friends here) to the discovery my wife was not who she pretended to be.

I called her cell phone this morning to talk with her since she didn’t come home last night. But she didn’t answer; her Adonis boyfriend did. I realized the “Lion King” is right, there is a circle. My original posting started with her sleeping with him when I proposed marriage and is ending with him; what a coincidence. I guess she felt like being abused, that’s why she’s with him. She had said that when she felt worthless she slept with him, because he made her feel like shit; she is sick and I’m sorry I can’t help her. I guess she’s off her med’s again?

I didn’t sleep last night, but spent hours trying to open her laptop. I went through names and terms until I found the password. Boy did I hit the jack pot; my lawyer will have a field day with all the documentation. She still kept a diary; it’s all on the computer.

Question: Is this stuff usable by my lawyer if I got it without her permission?

The paternity test samples were turned in at 6:00 this morning. How many days till I find out?

Thank you all for the advice.