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She doesn't miss the kids or volunteering. She needs to be spending time with her own child, instead of someone elses. She is still deep in the affair fog. I bet money she is still communicating with him and hiding it from you. Her parents need to jerk a knot in her ass and snap her back to reality. You say she is working a lot of hours, I would be very suspicious of what she is doing before and after work. I bet she is probably seeing him while she is there. I would follow her to work or sit back and watch her activity at work. If you can't, maybe see if your father in law will help you out. She is definitely still in touch with this douche bag.

Apologies all, its been a rough few weeks
We've been in something of a state of limbo, not knowing which direction anything was going in... even being intimate a few times.

That all changed yesterday. Out shopping as a family and I notice that she'd had was being particularly careful with her phone. She made the mistake of standing in front of a mirror in an Opticians while responding on her phone - and I see the name, and a few words that particularly stood out. She claims that they'd only reconnected a few days ago... whether I believe that or not now seems utterly irrelevant. I know now that she does not love me as I love her.

So yeah, it looks like it's over. Still trying to navigate that and how to lessen the impact, particularly on my son, but that's what it is now.

It goes without saying that i'm pretty cut up right now. I'm consumed with thoughts of failure and self loathing.

Trying to focus on making sure that I am able to be there for my son when this bombshell is dropped on him. He has to be my focus now.

Thankyou to all that took the time to respond. Your words did help.

I’m so sorry. Thinking of you and your son. Stay strong and take care of yourself.

I’m sorry for you and your family.

It does not seem like your wife put the effort into reconciliation because she had the other man on her mind constantly. And if that’s her mindset you just cannot get your marriage to be her priority.

Nothing you did or didn’t do caused her to cheat. She chose to cheat all on her own. Despite your family. Despite your history. Despite your love.

You don’t deserve this. But if you end up D please put your son’s needs first. He is the prize here and deserves the best.

I suggest trying to limit any contact between your son and the OM should you D. Your son doesn’t need a revolving door of men in his life. Your wife needs to keep that separate and away from your child.

It appears that quite a few people who cheat have trouble removing themselves from the addiction, the fantasy. Using a lawyer to define your immediate next steps would be more than prudent. When she sees the writing on the wall is being written in indelible ink she may get off the fence once and for all. Of course that does not mean you need to once again offer R.

I'm so, so sorry.

I don't think you ever mentioned, is the other man married?

Please have consults with more than one lawyer to understand your rights. You need to stay one step ahead of her to protect yourself and your son.

So yeah, it looks like it's over. Still trying to navigate that and how to lessen the impact, particularly on my son, but that's what it is now.

It goes without saying that i'm pretty cut up right now. I'm consumed with thoughts of failure and self loathing

Let's be clear, you didn't bring this on your son or your family, she did. She has cheated on you and her son repeatedly so spend time with this man. It is very sad and pathetic, but in the end she is just showing you who she really is.

I can understand how this has been emotionally a devastating roller coaster for you, but I want to be clear, you didn't fail and there is no reason for self-loathing. You simply expected that your wife would be faithful to you and your marriage, the same commitment you made to her, she failed at keeping that commitment. If you are guilty of anything, it is the very forgivable error of extending the trust to one's spouse that isn't earned. Unfortunately, that is a real shit sandwich to swallow nevertheless, but you certainly haven't failed here.

The only thing that cheaters understand is strength and toughness. Stop being nice to her. Stop being the doting husband who is head over heels in love with her. Do not sleep with her again, you are putting yourself at risk because you have no clue who and what she has been around. Start the 180 and start detaching from her. Setup a parenting schedule where when it is her time you will go play a round of golf or go have a meal out with the dudes, just anything so that you aren't around and she has to do this on her own. You are no longer her husband, she left you a long time ago, it is time that you make it clear that she is no longer your wife and that you've left her. Get the D filed and have her served. Prepare yourself to separate completely and get that ball rolling as soon as you can. I know that it hurts and you are deeply hurt by all of this, but the only way out of it is to show some anger, strength and most importantly consequences for her. You cannot trust this woman and need to take care of yourself and your son's future, because she clearly isn't concerned about it.

I remember how it felt when they were still talking. A great sadness and feeling of hopelessness. Feeling down that he never really tried. Feeling second best again. Having nothing to hope for.

This is giving her energy. She is protecting it. She values it.

You have done all you could do. Been reasonable and gave her the chance to try.
I know you're in deep sadness. If she's truly chosen another path for life, limit interaction so she can't hurt you over and over.

Thank you all again for your words of support.

I've told her that she needs to leave this house as quickly as possible and she is in the process of making that happen. I've been the one to pay rent, bills etc for almost the entirety of our relationship so im staying here. The timing does suck as Christmas is fast approaching and that potentially means an awful conversation with our son at a time of year that I wouldn't have chosen.

However, I didn't choose any of this!

With regards to that conversation she has agreed that she needs to take the lead on that, with me present, and it will boil down to this being in no way his fault, that we both still love him very much, but that his Mam no longer loves his Dad and so she is leaving to live somewhere else. That he will still very much have both of us in his life and will spend time both at his current home and wherever it is where she will be living.

We've agreed that shared custody is in the best interests of our son and are in the process of working out the logistics of that.

She's looking at places that are quite close to where we are now and i'm conscious that means inevitably running into eachother in settings not related to our son. I also have to accept the possibility that it's high likely that i'm going to run into both her *and* him at some point in the future and that's going to sting when it happens. Hopefully I can fight the urge to pull his head off of his shoulders

I can't help but think that when she's in the situation where she has to pay rent and bills on her own then reality is going to land on her hard. It's not something that she's ever had to do and times are currently hard for everyone - especially renters! I don't take any comfort in that thought or have any petty feelings about the possibility and I hope that she can craft some sort of life for herself for our son's sake if nothing else.

As we live in rented accommodation it's simply a matter of removing her from the tenancy agreement when she leaves. Our finances are entirely separate and have been since before my son was born. They were joined at one point, but had to be separated again for... reasons. We've talked about shared belongings and what she will be taking vs what is staying and there have been no disagreements other than I want her to take our marital bed with her but she doesnt want to. If she doesn't take it then i'm going to either sell it or donate it to charity.

Christmas presents that have been purchased for our son will still be from both of us.

So far it has been amicable in terms of discussing what needs to happen next.

She looks very very broken and i'm sure that I do too however I'm starting to see that I need to harden up and just get through this horribleness as quickly and cleanly as possible. There has been some talk... discussing the relationship, the past and the like, and in hindsight I dont think that should have happened. It's just digging at an open wound. It doesnt really matter why it all happened, just that it did!

When I see her so upset there is an instinctual urge to try and comfort her and I recognise that I need to fight the hell out of that as it does neither of us any good. I did tell her this morning that she needs to recognise that she's doing what she is doing because she believes that its in her best interests and should be focused on that instead of feeling sorry for herself.

I think that i've 99% accepted that this is definitely over. That 1%... I don't know what that is, but I know that I need to nix it. I ask myself if I still love her, or if I love what she was. I think that its that person that was that I desperately miss. I read about the pick me dance and see that i've been guilty of that at times. Another thing that I need to fight the hell out of.

I do see that what I very definitely need right now is a hug... but not from the person who used to give me that.

I reached out to my parents and let them know the whole story - basically everything that i've told you all in these posts. They're worried about me and my son as parents/grandparents always are :) My mother mentioned that my father said that the last time that I stayed at their house with my son, a few months back, he thought that something wasn't right with me. That I seemed sad. I think that's probably been my state of mind for a long time now. I'm going to see them this weekend - I realise that I've not spent enough time with them since the sh*t hit the fan at the start of this year.

For the first time today I started thinking about the future in a more positive light. I started looking around our (sh*t!)... my home and thinking about what I could do, where I could move things when all of her clutter will be gone. I have a lot of home gym equipment that's always been shoved away wherever we could find space so part of one room will be dedicated to that. I looked at myself today and realised how much I have let myself go over the past few years... yikes!. We (damnit!) ... *I* have a third bedroom that was original my sons nursery before he graduated to the bigger bedroom. I'm thinking about putting my guitar in there, a couch, a big TV, an xbox and building a gaming room for both my son and I. Something that we can build together. I'm also thinking about picking up a push-bike so that we can go on rides together.

I also came to the realisation today that building my entire sense of self worth around being a father and husband and leaving no time for anything else has left me in a less than desirable place. All of my time has been divided between work, childcare and family time. I have people that I "know" but no one that I consider a close friend and that's a hard pill to swallow! So I need to work out how to make new friends as a 42 yr old man ! I've arranged to meet up with someone that I used to pal around with at work, back before remote working became 100%, for a catch-up. I'm conscious that I need to make sure not to offload all of my personal sh*t on them. That wouldn't be a particularly nice thing to do to someone.

There's an ideal in my head of who I want to be going forward and I need to work out how to make that a reality.

In all honesty I'm scared stiff about the future... but also a bit hopeful y'know? I'm still riding a rollercoaster and the lows are frequent and very very hard to deal with. A big reason for those lows is that the spectre of having "the conversation" with our son still looms over me and I hate it and hate that there's no way that it can be avoided. It pulls me down at times but, again, I didn't choose this reality!

I've been looking at https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/documents/library/articles/discovery/the-simplified-180/ and a lot of it makes sense. Does anyone have any experience of implementing that where reconciliation isn't on the cards?

That's it for todays mental diarrhoea. I think that writing this stuff here does help.

Thanks again everyone.

I've been looking at https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/documents/library/articles/discovery/the-simplified-180/ and a lot of it makes sense. Does anyone have any experience of implementing that where reconciliation isn't on the cards?

The 180 is for you the BS to gain some distance and space from your WS. Stepping back emotionally and detaching will help you to see things more objectively to make decisions and take actions to protect yourself and your son. I think based on your latest post that you've been able to pull yourself back from her a little bit and see her for what she is. She clearly does not have what it takes to do the work of reconciliation. That may change, she may one day be capable of that kind of personal self-reflection and growth, but by then you will have moved on and will have found someone great to spend your life with, if you so choose.

A word of advice, don't engage in any discussions with her about the relationship. Keep it to the facts. You are roommates now who at the moment share custody for your son. As hard as it is, don't ask her how she is doing or engage her in talks that don't benefit you, if you must, post here at all hours of the day when you feel the urge to engage her on anything other than need to discuss topics.

I'm glad to see that you have a good support network in your parents and I would lean on them as much as you can. There is a bumpy road ahead and I hope that maybe they can help you with a little bit of spoiling their grandson while you take some time for yourself as needed, because believe me, you will need time alone for yourself and they can help you out, which is what grandparents are great at (at least my parents were lifesavers there). Reaching out to an old work pal is also a good deal. There is nothing saying that you cannot have a friend coming out of this situation. Finding yourself and your own happiness is going to take time and you will to show kindness to yourself, because it won't be progress in a linear fashion. You will have your days, but keep walking the path forward.

On the conversation with your son, there is no good time to have that conversation. My wife forced me to have that conversation on New Year's Eve 2020 and I'm still mad as hell about it. We had agreed we would do it and she sped up the timeline on me because she was eager to get to spend time with her loverboy. Our son was aware that something was going on, but it wasn't until we spoke with him about it that he understood (age appropriate) and it put us all at ease in the house. Stick to age appropriate facts and keep it sweet and simple. Let him know that he can come to either of you at any time and you will be there for him. It won't be easy, but the longer you drag it out, the harder it is going to be.