Seeing my IC
As most of you know, Andi and I are separated and my IC was once our MC.
I have come to know my IC outside of her profession; we had lunch recently and saw a movie. We've talked by phone a few times, and there's been some emails and texts.
She told me last week that she longer wanted see me as a client, and that her history as Andi and my MC was no longer fitting because she is in fact a marriage counselor for those trying to reconcile. A few days letter she called.
We like each other and are really just friends right now. We've had some good laughs lately. I like her company and she knows me pretty well, so what the heck.
We haven't planned anything for the near future but my gut tells me we'll go out again sometime. She's a fabulous dresser, wonderfully groomed and fit.
I most likely will never tell Andi because at this point it would be none of her business and I expect her to move on too.
Not saying I'm getting serious about this Gal, but I like the company of a smart woman. She's been single for many years so there's no husband to piss off.
I think I'm seeing that I can move on. For years now I've been looking for permission, hoping to get tossed to the curb, is that messed up or what?
[This message edited by MyAndI at 2:06 AM, June 10th (Thursday)]
23 comments posted: Thursday, June 10th, 2021
Ladies of St. Elmos Fire Gang
Recently I've received two calls from our old college gang, the group has stayed pretty tight for all these years and many of us live near each other.
Both called to find out about what happened with Andi and one has asked me out for dinner, just to catch up. As much as I wanted to hang out I think it would hurt Andi. I know Andi and I are not together anymore but I know this would probably hurt her and there's no way it would remain private. So I gave the nice women a rain check.
I'm NC with OW and it's in no way a strain on me.
I am lonely for the company of the fairer sex, just being honest. I'd be happy just to go to a matinee and lunch.
I'm not comfortable posting in the D section so I hope it's OK to post here.
2 comments posted: Sunday, May 30th, 2021
Andi filed for D...
Andi filed for D, I was served Saturday. I've had all day to process it and I feel relieved, actually. I'm glad it was her decision and not mine. I didn't want be the bad guy.
IC told me two sessions ago that I was a conflict avoider, maybe that's why I'm glad Andi made the first move towards D.
I'm not going back to the OW, she looks less interesting all the sudden. I'll try to understand why in IC next week.
Andi will have to buy me out of our house if she wants it.
She said she had a lawyer who would draw everything up for both of us if I'd agree to it, I'm a little hesitant about that.
My sisters are saying "absolutely not" and that I should get an attorney. They never really liked Andi, but they always treated her kindly for my sake.
8 comments posted: Saturday, May 22nd, 2021
Andi does the 180
Andi offered R, but the offer is only good for awhile.
She left a letter on my windshield last night and said she was ready to move on if I could not find my way back to the marriage and R. She said it was unfair to leave the NC open ended for too long while I figured things out. There was no date or period of time specific for me to decide but she said I needed to get off the fence soon.
I have no clue what I want to do at this point but I do miss Andi. I'm still NC with OW.
IC Monday.
8 comments posted: Sunday, May 16th, 2021
Being alone...
The IC the other night asked about my family situation growing up and the women in my life going back to my childhood.
I was very much surrounded by women growing up, a single mother, sisters and cousins growing up in the same house; I was the only boy. When I got older my first intimate experiences were with older women -- mostly who I met through my older sisters and female cousins.
I don't remember a time since I was 15 when a woman was not in my life intimately. When they weren't fawning over me they were bossing me around -- running my life. And quite frankly I was very content with it. I like strong women.
The friendships I forged in college with the St. Elmo's Fire Gang were mostly with women.
I generally like the company of women, I don't mean this in the sexual sense; I like being around them and listening to them talk and laugh. I find them way more interesting than men.
I'm not a man's man; I never liked to hang out with the guys and engage in horse play. I preferred to hang out where the women were -- not to score -- but just to hang out.
Men are not that interesting to me -- too one dimensional most of the time, they just bore the hell out of me. If my roommate tells me one more time about the deal he got on his new car I'm going to slap him.
Now I'm alone, and I don't like it at all; it's been about two weeks since I moved out and I'm going bananas. I told this to the IC and she responded, "do you find yourself so boring that you can't keep yourself company for awhile and allow more time to gain some perspective?"
She then suggested that I had developed a dependency on the attention of women. She said in all my relationships it seems like I was not an equal partner with any of them. She said at this point I needed to become my own best friend and be the leader of my own life.
She also suggested the OW and Andi did not see me as a strong independent person -- did not respect me -- and is at the root of my current situation.
"You appear to be an inanimate object to them," she said.
This kind of hurt, she was basically calling me a P*ssy.
She wants me to maintain NC still, I see her next week.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 9:16 AM, May 14th (Friday)]
5 comments posted: Friday, May 14th, 2021
Andi contacted OW
I was copied in on an email from Andi to OW this morning, asking her to stay out of our lives. Andi told her there were still things to be ironed out between us and to please give us the chance to sink or swim on our own.
OW didn't respond--that I know of.
Andi wasn't visceral, rude or hurtful; she was quite dignified and calm actually; caught me completely by surprise.
I did find it strange that Andi put her foot down now with things so up in the air -- and so close to what looks like the end. But I'm glad she stuck up for herself/us.
I don't know if this moves the needle much in my desire to be left alone for awhile; I'm going to stick to NC like the IC recommended.
I really didn't need this on my mind today. I'm trying to get a story filed and my pimply-faced editor is pestering me.
Thanks to all for the input on my previous thread.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 9:27 AM, May 13th (Thursday)]
2 comments posted: Thursday, May 13th, 2021
IC and Andi
Went to IC tonight, our former MC, and she suggested that I go NC with both OW and Andi for awhile and stop flying by the seat of my pants "like a teenager."
She said I was letting OW and Andi run my life and it was time for me to figure out what I really wanted. When she asked me what I thought I wanted and needed I truly couldn't answer -- but she made a point that neither relationship was healthy and doesn't leave the door open, even a hair, to reconcile with Andi if I ever wanted to consider it.
I do know that OW didn't give me the distance I asked for in my R with Andi and broke NC, and Andi insists I targeted her BF for a revenge A, which I did not, while minimizing the impact of her own A.
Truth is OW pursued me when I was weak--which IC quickly pointed out that "that doesn't sound like a very good friend to have."
I said I believed both had a certain selfishness to them that didn't consider me at all.
We had all been friends in our college years and Andi and OW were the Alpha females in the group--they ran everyone's life basically.
What I did learn tonight in IC is that my life has changed forever, I can't undo anything.
In a weird twist, Andi left me a VM and said she was around to talk if I needed to, but that she respected my need to go NC for awhile. She said she wanted to work things out and for me to eventually find my way home--and I'm trying to figure out what I would need from her to ever make that happen.
She knows about recent contact with OW, and is surprisingly calm.
I do know that I'm as much to blame as Andi for this whole mess, looking back I realize that I didn't give her a lot of what she needed to feel safe after my Dday and most recently...It's my fault.
IC also suggested I go NC for awhile with our old circle of friends and keep my own counsel.
Still processing.
Those who can't post In my threads know who they are and I respectfully ask they honor that request.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 10:33 PM, May 11th (Tuesday)]
8 comments posted: Tuesday, May 11th, 2021
I'm sorry
Sorry to the WS's and MH's at SI, I'm confused and looking in different directions I guess. I think the revelation of another OM that I didn't know about for years has thrown me for a loop.
Word travelled fast and OW sought me out, I did not contact her--not that it makes a difference.
WifeHad5, it was a good call to shut down the thread. I known the WS's and MH's are here to do the hard work of R and I've I've failed miserably.
Yes, I'm full of contradictions and hypocrisy, not hard for the folks here at SI to see this.
But what is true:
I did give my best at R and believed (and so did the MC) that Andi minimized the pain her A caused the marriage while putting all the load on me in R -- to a point where our MC said she didn't want to see us anymore. She told us that Andi was just wasting her time. Andi's own family thought she was being a total ass about her culpability in setting fire to our marriage and so did some of our closest friends (true friends of the marriage)
Let it be clear from me to all the WS's and MH's here at SI that I DO NOT condone infidelity.
I have no what I'm doing right now, which is the only thing I can say with certainty.
I talked to the MC today by phone, and she is going to see me individually. I think I need to focus on fixing me right now. And besides MC, SI is the only place I can really go.
And I have not spoken to Andi, don't even know where to start.
46 comments posted: Friday, May 7th, 2021
OW came to visit
As you all know Andi and I are now separated, I'm living in town. I am headed for D, pretty sure, unless Andi completely takes responsibility for minimizing her A and owning the damage she equally caused to our marriage.
But I consider myself a free man at this point. OW stopped by last night, we went to dinner, and we ended up at her place. I spent the night and it was wonderful!
I felt a connection with her that was different then during the affair in that I'm no longer hiding anything, so actually being with OW was guilt free and on equal terms. I explained that I did not want to be tied down and she said she was OK with that. She was very respectful and very loving.
I see everyone lining up with 2x4s, but maybe sometimes certain things are meant to be. I never started Andi and me down the road of infidelity, she did, and I did give her every chance to accept her part in hurting our marriage. I don't feel I owe Andi anything at this point.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 9:52 AM, May 7th (Friday)]
21 comments posted: Friday, May 7th, 2021
I moved out today
I found a place in town with a friend. Don't know what I'm going to do yet, but I'm not interested in being with Andi right now; and my gut tells me that I'm not interested in R, ever.
Married in our 20's headed for D in our 50s. I really did try to R and I a came clean. I'm sorry to say that Andi's continued selfishness and lack of accountability about her A's is never going to change.
I just want to be with someone who is honest about their failings in life and owns them. Not looking for perfection, just someone who has enough pride in themselves and respect for the person closest to them to be sincere.
I know I hurt Andi, but I came clean and laid it all out there in the days after OW was discovered.
And I've had nothing but blame shifting and minimizing from Andi.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 1:17 PM, April 29th (Thursday)]
1 comment posted: Thursday, April 29th, 2021
Wife had another OM
In another thread I said I would ask Andi if there were any other stale danishes/donuts that she had before the OM that I knew about.
I bluffed her a little and gave her that look that I might already know something.
"I'm starting to hear some things from long ago, are you sure t%$#& was your only OM," I asked.
Her answer was "no" almost in a whisper, hard to hear, and she started shaking.
There was one other, and it happened during the fifth year of our marriage, when we were having sex almost everyday and planning our future. The sex with OM#2 took place in the office at night, when she was supposedly working late.
I told her at her DDay that if I found out she withheld other sextra-curricular activities that it would be over -- even if it came to light years later.
I asked why she never told me at her DDAY and she said it had been so long about, 20 years, and that she "didn't think it even mattered at that point and I was already paying the price for cheating."
I'm not mad, just numb now, exhausted, we had such a great time this weekend and now this.
I always had an uneasy feeling about a guy she was working with in the early years of our marriage.
I don't know what I'm going to do, I feel I have to keep my word from her first DDay -- that it would be over if she withheld anything -- and at this point I'm inclined to keep my word.
I told her to go to MC on her own this week.
She's been upset today, didn't go to work, but I have no empathy right now, none.
I know my A was wrong and brought pain into our marriage, but I came clean about everything.
My best friend in life is a divorce lawyer, think I'll ask how him how to get the ball rolling.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 10:46 AM, April 27th (Tuesday)]
16 comments posted: Tuesday, April 27th, 2021
She initiated conversation about OM...after a great night
I'm reluctant to talk about this because I may have to dodge some 2x4's.
We had a really wonderful night last night, dinner, sex until the wee hours of the morning, like the old days, and no talk of the A's. We have a nephew graduating from the Naval Academy and we talked about doing something for him. He's among the finest of young men these days.
Over breakfast Andi wanted to talk about the OM and why she had her A. I asked why we had to talk about it.
"I just want to focus on us," I said.
But I didn't resist any further and didn't minimize her need to talk about it.
She explained that her A was about selfishness. Growing up she was daddy's little girl and basically got whatever she wanted. This is true.
She then went about comparing me and her AP to deserts. Yes, those things we eat to satisfy our sweet tooth.
She said in life and in the bedroom I was the fully loaded banana split with Rocky Road ice cream, nuts, whip cream and the cherry on top - and the OM was the stale donut that had been sitting in the break room at work for two weeks that no one else wanted.
"I was greedy," she said. "I wanted the stale donut too."
"In the case of the OM, he was the donut daring me to take a bite," she said.
I almost lost it, then bit my tongue when I wanted to tell her that it was no consolation to me for her blowing the OM. I looked before I leaped this time, paused, and told her "thank you for being honest."
She said she needed to work on her selfishness, that the MC was right. She found a new MC for other reasons. I think she gets the creeps when talking to another woman about our problems with me in the room. I could feel some antagonism there between the two of them.
I'm still reconciling the banana split thing in my head. A lot to process there. Like she'd lower her standards over me to get instant gratification from a stale donut. I think this will come up with our new MC. She's always said the OM was just an indulgence, but I guess her explanation is her attempt to fix herself. I was glad I kept my mouth shut this time.
She also asked if I wanted to talk about the OW.
"no, she is the last thing on my mind," I said.
This is true.
If the OW was bleeding on the side of the road I wouldn't stop to help her. That's how much I hate her for breaking NC and putting things in a tail spin for us again.
No bashing please. I really am trying to save my marriage.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 12:44 PM, April 24th (Saturday)]
16 comments posted: Saturday, April 24th, 2021
Wife hid her OP's Broken NC
As I told you all back in February, my wife was irritated that I was friendly to her OM in a chance encounter at the store.
In MC the other night MH-wife finally told me that her OP broke NC several days prior to that encounter. She had plenty of time to tell me, and I had kept my promise to tell her the second my OP ever contacted me.
I was actually not upset at first that she didn't tell me, but her explanation ticked me off royally. She went back to the same old argument that her A was just an indulgence, that it meant no more to her than getting caught masturbating to porn, she again turned her anger at me insisting my 3-year LTA was a revenge A.
But I wasn't as mad as the marriage counselor. She ripped into my wife "for wasting everyone's time" with her refusal to accept her part in turning our marriage on its head.
The MC also said she was no longer interested in working with my wife unless she was determined to make progress.
"I cant't help the both of you if one of you refuses to budge," she said.
I found myself sticking up for my wife because the MC was quite direct and treated her as if she was a failure. I said we would certainly go elsewhere if she no longer wanted to see us and she agreed to discharge us as her clients.
It was an odd drive home, quiet for almost half the 45-minute trip. When my wife spoke she said she thought the MC didn't like her. She said she wanted to try and find another MC, but she wanted it to be a man. She said she didn't like the way the MC was gravitating to me, and showing little respect towards her.....WTF? I always thought the MC was fair and even handed with us and she put me in my place many times when I wasn't doing the hard work. I said she could go ahead and find a new MC of her choice. I doesn't matter, I just want to get us to a clearing where can get to the new normal, whatever that is, as long as it's healthy for us.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 11:14 PM, April 21st (Wednesday)]
11 comments posted: Wednesday, April 21st, 2021
Just One Day...
How many of the WS's here (and BS's too) have been able to go a whole day recently without talking about the A or As?
How many of you have actually had an entire day when it was just about you and your BS and you talked about your future with hope and opportunity?
What I wouldn't give for just one day of it being about the two of US and not the OW...I need peace.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 8:30 PM, April 11th (Sunday)]
28 comments posted: Sunday, April 11th, 2021
Old Conversations about OW Circling Back
We think we may have successfully jettisoned OW from our lives.
But now I'm being accused again that my three-year LTA was a revenge A to her PA that lasted a few months, and it is FUCKING NOT TRUE.
I explained AGAIN over breakfast that I was in a weak position for awhile after her A, holding an abundance of insecurity, and OW did take advantage of that. OW was a friend of my wife's and people always said that OW kind of had a thing for me.
I'm also not at all unattractive (I've been told I'm a dead ringer for Tim Fleming on Heartland) and have been hit on by women all my life. But I never indulged in infidelity after I got married and I intended to stayed true to my wife even after discovery of her A.
In BS' anger this morning she said I went looking for it just as a "fuck you" to her. I WAS NOT. In my anger I replied that she did in fact suck the OM's d*ck often during her brief A without a single thought to how I might feel about it. I on the other hand resisted OW for a long time -- but all the attention she was giving me evolved into a serious relationship - with all the things that come with it, including sex. I don't just fuck someone to hurt someone else. People who do that have more serious problems.
These are all things I thought we had reconciled awhile ago in months of MC.
She believes that her A wasn't as bad as mine because she didn't love her OM, she just "indulged him for awhile," she said. She never planned on leaving me and that it didn't mean anything to her -- as if this is supposed to make me feel better.
So now I'm supposed look back on all those days she doubled dipped as meaningless. She's gotta lot of fucking nerve and I'm seriously thinking about leaving.
I want a relationship free of the baggage of affairs; I seriously don't know if I can take it anymore. We're living in a non-divorce, not a marriage and I have done EVERYTHING I can to reconcile.
We don't have kids and I'm thinking of taking a reporting job out west. Seriously, I just feel like leaving.
We've been married 35 years and we're both not yet 60, we still can have plenty of happiness ahead of us without being together.
It may be time to just call it day. There is no stop sign but I would like to hear from the WS's also
[This message edited by MyAndI at 11:14 AM, April 8th (Thursday)]
36 comments posted: Sunday, April 4th, 2021
Fow reaching out again...grrrr!
...but not because I want her to. OW has been texting me and calling our friends to ask about how I am doing...each time I get a text or email I discourage it...and each time I tell my wife.
She's been blaming me for the FOW's attempts to reach out -- that somehow I sent pheromones into the air to make it happen. Nothing could be further from the trust. I have ZERO desire to have any dealings with OW whatsoever, as she was a conspirator with me in crushing my wife's heart.
So I'm fighting two battles right now. One, to jettison the FOW from my life and two, to get my wife to trust me and believe that I'm being upfront and diligently rejecting any advances from the FOW. No stop sign, but please no bashing.
It has been a full time job in the last two weeks trying to reassure my wife. I am exhausted and frustrated. Oh if I could turn back the hands of time.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 8:51 PM, March 25th (Thursday)]
12 comments posted: Thursday, March 25th, 2021
Covid-19 gotcha
A buddy of mine finds out his wife has been with her former AP because of COVID-19 back-tracing. She had to report everyone she was with to the local health department when she contracted COVID-19. My buddy has the passwords to her voice mail and hears a message from the health department that lets on to him that his FWW was somewhere she wasn't supposed to be. My buddy now has COVID and having a tough time of it. Affairs have consequences and in the age of COVID you risk getting your BS's sick. Just one more reason to stay true and work things out at home.
0 comment posted: Sunday, March 7th, 2021
Ran into her OM
We ran into ww/bw's OM in the store before the Super Bowl last week. He was with a woman, assumed it was his SO. He looked over at us and I waved hello, asked him his pick for the game and he liked KC. Just a little small talk and we were on our way.
I Did not feel anger towards him and this bothered my wife. On the way home she asked why I had to be so "chummy" with him. I said I wasn't being chummy but holding a grudge gave him power that he's not really worthy of. I was also trying to show that me and the wife were getting on just fine. It was my way of protecting her -- but my wife saw it differently -- that somehow I didn't care a bit that he's his seen her naked. I told her I was not mad that OM found her attractive because she is quite beautiful. And I told her this in the car. This seemed to bother her even more.
I felt hurt actually that she thought so negatively about that exchange when my first instinct was to protect her/us.
A long time ago I decided not to let OM take up time and space in my head and our MC encouraged me to maintain that attitude.
So in reminding her she's beautiful and trying to protect us, I've fucked up some how. These are my days lately. I'll bring it up in next MC.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 12:56 AM, February 12th (Friday)]
3 comments posted: Friday, February 12th, 2021
Movie night
We are in a movie-night-group on our block and we get together the 3rd Saturday of every month to watch movies and socialize -- and each time a different couple hosts.
After surviving recent triggers together over the holidays, low and behold this past Saturday our host gave us all the choice between Bridges of Madison County and a A Walk on the Moon. Well, it was A Walk on The Moon where the husband, played by Liev Schreiber, has to go back to his sweltering summer job in NYC and leave his wife and kids at their vacation home in the Catskills, I think most of you know the rest.
I actually liked the movie but WW/BS was triggering, getting up often to do little chores that didn't need to be done and fidgeting with her phone, I could tell she was not doing well. We made it through the movie but she didn't want to talk for the rest of the night. In the morning she was upset that I didn't have any issues with the movie.
Then I was irritated and said in the case of both movies I'd be the chump off working while the happily married wifey enjoys strange d*ck for a weekend.
"So WTF are you worried about," I said. She said she was upset because I wasn't triggering about the movie also.
Life does have to go on I said. We shouldn't be bogged down with the past, the past shouldn't own us, we should own our future.
AND I"M SICK OF TALKING ABOUT IT, I'm so over her PA, I hardly think about it anymore. I don't know how often she thinks about my A anymore but I think it's a lot. I told her I wanted us to focus on other things besides the A-s, I want TO LIVE AND BE HAPPY TOGETHER. I wish she could to the same place I am....acceptance.
I accept that her A happened,I love her and I want to just stop TALKING about my A all the fucking time.
Sorry to vent, better here than at home.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 10:21 PM, January 28th (Thursday)]
13 comments posted: Thursday, January 28th, 2021
Holiday Triggers
My A triggers WW/BW during the Holidays. Though her A was much shorter, my considerably longer A spanned through several Christmases -- and after full surrender of all my emails after DDay, much of the pillow talk between me and OW through email was during the holidays.
I know when W is triggering and I remind her it's OK too talk about anything she wants. I know it helps her but it triggers me about what a shameful ass I was at the time. I don't ask her about her A anymore for the same reason. I don't want to remind her of the shame she felt. I hope I'm making sense.
[This message edited by MyAndI at 8:57 PM, December 16th (Wednesday)]
1 comment posted: Wednesday, December 16th, 2020
