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ASCL, prayers for restoration of your M. I did not pick up on your original post but I have read this thread. Can you point me to the story when you first posted about your troubles? I am intrigued by your situation. Blessings to you from a BH.

Content/trigger note: post contains prayer and also sexual details.

Happy MLK Day everyone! As a biracial black/white woman married to a South Asian man, Dr. Martin Luther King’s words have special meaning to me. (I hope that’s okay to post as it’s not politics; just commemoration of an important US holiday.)

I keep promising updates and not giving them. Life has suddenly become so busy.

My husband had a great first week at his new job. He actually texted me halfway through his first day to check in. I have been bringing him lunch every morning and have texted him in the late afternoon every day to check on things.

I took Cephastion’s advice and asked my husband if we could meet to talk. I also took some other posters’ advice and have been giving him written lists of things I am doing to change and asking him for feedback on things he needs from me. I have also been giving him lists of all the things about him that I love and that make him a great man. All of these have been given to him in the form of written notes placed in his lunch.

On Friday my husband surprised me by popping up unannounced in the early afternoon at my brother’s (where I am staying). My brother is away for a work project and I am there alone. I was surprised, but pleased. I let him in and he explained that he got off early. I told him it was fine and I was glad to see him; that all I was doing was applying for jobs until it was time to pick my son up from school.

He said, “I’ve read your notes. And I know that you said that you want to meet and talk. So let’s talk.”

I was happy - but not prepared. I didn’t really know where to start. I guess I had thought I would have a chance to get ready for our talk. I don’t do very well with lack of preparation. I asked him if we could pray before we talked. He said yes. We prayed. First silently.

Then I felt the urge to start praying aloud. I just let the words pour out from my heart. Nothing pre-planned. Just my feelings. How deeply sorry I am and how grateful I am for God’s forgiveness. How I know I don’t deserve but one day I pray I will possibly have my husband’s forgiveness. I thanked Him for the blessing of the new job and for our son’s progress and for all of our family and their lives. I thanked Him for second chances. I thanked Him for revealing people who did not deserve to be in our lives. I thanked Him for watching over my father and asked Him to let him know that I miss him every single day.

By the time I was finished praying we were both in tears. My husband is NOT a crier. He is a man’s man - sports, cars, all that stuff. Before D Day only once I had ever seen him cry. At my dad’s funeral. (He cried a LOT after D Day.) Now he was crying at this prayer. I stared at him in bewilderment. The tears on his cheeks shocked me into silence.

He said, “The day your dad died I promised myself that I would take care of his little girl. But I failed. I didn’t protect you from that bastard (he said my former boss’s name). And I didn’t protect you from (he said the OM’s name). I’m sorry. I’m so sorry.”

I started crying again. And told him HE had NOTHING to be sorry about. None of this was his fault. None of it. He tried to interrupt me, to say that he should have listened to whispering in his mind that caused him to suspect the OM had a thing for me, but he dismissed it as paranoia. I looked him in his eyes (something that’s hard for me to do as I have Asperger’s and I hate eye contact - it hurts). I told him NOTHING was his fault. Then I told him I was deeply in love with him and that I was grateful for the day I met him.

He embraced me. He kissed me. I kissed back. And now it might get TMI, but I bent over, unbuckled his pant and...I went down on him. Something I have wanted to do for over 8 or 9 years since we stopped. Since my son was a baby we have pretty much only had “vanilla sex.” I was scared he wouldn’t let me, but he did. He caressed my hair on the top of my head and he moaned aloud and it just made my heart palpitate. (I apologize if this is too graphic. And FYI, the next part is equally graphic.)

We made love right there on the floor. NOT vanilla. He let me ride him...he took me from behind...and lots of other things...it was amazing, just like it used to be when we were first married. I screamed out his name and he clasped my hand as he was inside of me. I had a powerful orgasm and moments later he did too. When he finished, he didn’t pull away. He stayed wrapped up with me on the floor. He stroked the side of my cheek and he smiled at me. He told me that he has never seen another woman as beautiful to him as I am.

It became time to pick up our son. He got up, got dressed. He said I should rest, and he kissed my forehead. Said he would pick our son up today.

And...I haven’t heard from him since. Not Saturday, not yesterday. Not today. My son has called like he usually does, but no texts, calls, or visits from my husband.

I plan to bring him lunch tomorrow morning (he’s off today) like I usually do. Tomorrow my son is with me overnight, and also Wednesday. But I don’t know what to think of this situation with my husband.

Should I reach out to him or continue to wait for him to reach out to me as to not rush him?

Should I let him know how good I thought the sex was? But even better to me was the time before that. When we connected after the prayer, when we were talking. I could feel the heavy emotions in his heart. Like he felt burdened about not being there for me and maybe now it was lifted? I never knew.

Is this hysterical bonding? Was it wrong to go down on him without asking? In case it was a trigger?

I want so desperately to believe that this means something. He came to see me! On his own. That couldn’t just be horniness...could it?

Why is he staying away from me? Do you think he regrets what happened?

Please. I am so confused...

[This message edited by ASoCalledLife at 1:51 PM, January 15th (Monday)]

Its possible he feels weak for "giving in to you". That's my honest thoughts on why he hasn't contacted you since.

Randy,

I was worried that might be the case.

I think its just part of the whole process. Not necessarily bad, and I don't think it was just a case of being horny, it probably meant something to him. But because of that he probably just wants to pull away a bit as a way to protect himself.

Should I contact him? Or continue to give him space?

I don’t know what to do.

What happened with my boss was NOT my husband’s fault.

What happened with the AP was NOT my husband’s fault.

It kills me inside to think all these months...close to a year...that he’s been blaming himself for any part of it.

I had no idea.

I think so. Something like..."Just checking in to see how you are doing. I'm really glad you decided to stop by the other day. It felt good to be close to you again and meant a lot to me".

I wouldn't mention sex explicitly. I don't know if that might be a trigger or whatever. That's just my thoughts.

Okay...here goes. I’m going to text hkm.

(Crossing all fingers and toes.)

He texted me back:

I’m fine. Thanks for checking.

So is that how it happened with him?

(Him is the AP.)

I messed everything up again. I read everything wrong. Oh God. I didn’t even think about the parallel. Oh God.

Everytime we make progress I take us ten steps back. I’m such a stupid failure. He came to talk. He didn’t come to sleep with me. I’m such an idiot. No wonder he doesn’t want to be married to me.

I feel like crap. So foolish. Crying...going to go lay in bed.

Lord God. Please help me. Please. Help me.

ASCL. You DIDN'T MESS UP! Not in this man's opinion!

(TMI warning here --I wish your PM's were enabled since I don't typically go public with much TMI)

This is EXACTLY the kind of thing that I went thru with my own wife! It's a good thing...like surgery on one's self to get the shrapnel out...it's sounds crazy I know but you have no idea what it's like to be a man. Being cuckolded is incredibly...cruel and difficult to explain. But I think you ought to take another man's opinion for it that this is a good sign.

If he is saying and doing those things with you, then what you need to see it as is COURAGE! He's FIGHTING for you AND HIMSELF. That's what it was for ME at least. Facing Goliath, the uncircumsiced Philistine. He doesn't have to do this. Especially with TEARS and honesty! He CANNOT be allowed to be in second place in his OWN estimation if he wants you and the marriage. In that sense I agree somewhat with the other male posters on here. But it's the RESPECT...the HONOR that you show him...THAT'S what he lost along with you and the marriage (among other things). And he's facing

1) the reality of what you did with the AP/other man did, along with

2) his own view of having let you and

3)HIMSELF suffer dishonor from the actions of your blasphmous, hypocrite employer without acting in a way that your husband deems honorable of himself and

4) his own response (or lack thereof which may equal cowardice or bad "husbandry" to that assault/threat/insult/affrontery and shameless rape attempt...

He's in a LOT of pain.

The thing you did almost certainly triggered him, but if he's able to face those things..those DAMNED mind movies and horrific realities...it's a torture that only a brave soul can really face and conquer in my opinion.

But I didn't feel brave or courageous when I was crying like a baby at the thought of my own wife doing what SHE did with other men. I just know that I had to know what she'd done...and I had to wrap my tortured mind around it all and even go through the "motions" myself with her...it was horrible for me...but I couldn't let it be my "master". I had to MASTER those movies (still working on that, btw, but it's much better than it was).

Having a baby isn't easy on a man. Especially an alien baby. We're not made for that kind of thing, mentally or emotionally. But I think that it's like giving birth to a tumor or something cancerous.

I'm just kinda freely spouting here on "paper" I guess, but it's not as easy for a guy as you might think to deal with the fact that our wife has been taken to task by another man and we've been dishonored without any kind of return fire or blow being given in response. It's like we just sat back and "let" someone rape our daughter or own own body without a fight or protest. It's kinda dehumanizing to our sense of who we are and what we are supposed to do and be.

ASCL. I want to focus on his reply to you. Clearly, it was designed to hurt you and maybe an attempt to even the score. However, there is no evening the score in this case, for a lot of reasons... He will have to understand this and accept it in order to determine if you can R. His comments suggest he is nowhere near ready for that at this point.

If you feel this way, perhaps you can reply with something along the the lines of, “I can understand why you might ask that question, but no what happened with POSOM was nothing like what we did. What we did was better, I was proud to have made love with you and instantly regretted having sex with him. I’m sorry I made an awful, selfish decision and hurt you.”

You might need to tell him how you FEEL about HIM. I think he's trying to fight for the marriage and for himself and even for you, but...if I'm right, it's gonna be hell for him until he gets to the top of that "hill".

Men fight for ribbons. Medals. Honor. Respect. They HAVE to respect themselves. He is now working again. That is HUGE, IMO. He needs to be the provider--the primary breadwinner, IMO. He needs to earn his own self-respect.

Adultery DESTROYS that.

In some cases, some men have enough self-respect stored up in "reserve" that they seem to handle it relatively well. They just 180 or dump the problems and do what they feel they "should" and they seem to escape relatively unscathed. I don't think that most of those men are the kind that tend to seek out and post here on SI. I think a the majority of the frequent posting guys on here that have a boatload of self-respect are ones that got it along the way to recovery, personally.

Maybe I'm wrong there, but nevertheless, your experience with your AP along with what I suppose to be your husband's cultural and emotional mindset along with your own testimony and issues would make for a kind of civil war inside his head as I imagine it. I think he's trying to face the truth...the reality of what happened...his own sense of perceived "shortcomings" in the marriage as well as sexually where you're concerned.

Give him that chance. Let him WIN his self-respect back. Answer him honestly about the sex with the AP (which you've already done a lot of previously) but let him work for it some. I'm not saying for an instant that you should lie...or resist him or his questioning. I'm saying that he needs to FIGHT for his own honor, IMO. And honor doesn't come without some work or suffering or courage and also some measured success.

I think he needs to win you back in his own mind. Win the sex battle, win over the mind movies, win over your own judgement, win over being the breadwinner, win over keeping you at arm's length, win over having you get your way or what YOU want (for a time, at least). I think he is fighting for YOU. But you've GOT to weather whatever storm he dishes out (I don't mean abuse or unhealthy boundaries there however!)

I mean that thing you mentioned about eye contact. I think he needs to see himself as being more valuable to you than your own preferences or comfort level to some extent. When I was facing my own wife's "testimony" about what she'd done with other men, I ended up yelling and using words she's ever heard me use before. I needed her to STAY PUT and NOT RUN OFF! I needed her to value ME and honoring me MORE than "honoring" her own stupid EMOTIONS that were largely responsible for the compromise she made to leave me and screw other men! I needed her to show me that she was willing to sit there and "for better or for worse" with ME like I had done so many times for HER. And if that meant that I wanted some space or to cuss or to scream (I never threatened her....EVER!, btw) then that's what I needed. Some earnest money. It had to COST her something. Some real emotional discomfort. Because she HATED conflict. And I knew it.

In your case, the giants he faces are likely somewhat different, but I think he needs to see himself as a man that fought and WON the war instead of a quitter or a deadbeat who didn't care enough to stop things before they got out of hand with your AP. Let him conquer his shame. Help him be the man he wants to be.

He's literally at war with himself over his feelings for you. His heart desperately wants to be with you. But his mind is telling him not to do it, that your betrayal showed your true colors. His mind coming to terms with his heart will take a good long while.

This is actually one of the key parts of R. I look at what happened as progress for you.

ASCL- Breathe. Slow down. Your H allowed himself to vulnerable with you and now he hates himself for it. As much as you keep mulling this over in your head he did the same. His reaction is 100% normal BTW. He reached out to you. Why? Is anyone's guess. You probably will have to ask him. No more passing notes. You will need to talk to him.

His question, to me, sounds like someone who wants an answer. He heard a lot of things that you told him that killed his identity as a man. It is going to take a long time before he can process this and put it away.

I think the only answer you can give him that gets him to listen is to explain to him why it was "better," and how it meant a lot to you. He may think it was a manipulation. He is not going to take your words or actions at face value anymore.

No time for games or innuendo. When you prayed you just let the words come out. It was honest and he saw that. It spoke to him. He let himself believe what he hasn't allowed himself to for a while. He needs to see your remorse.

He is scared and it is going to take a whole lot of honest vulnerability on your part to reach him again.

He wanted to and probably still wants to talk. Ask him if for the opportunity to do so. What happened. Happened. It is not unusual when people are being that vulnerable with each other.

There is no right way or wrong way to do this. It is a lot of trial error. Over time you figure out what works and what doesn't. You accumulate lots of stuff that helps and you keep doing that. Marathon, right ?

You didn't mess up.

That's the pain talking from your husband. I've said that more than once along the way during my R.

My wife reminds me that our intimate moments are better because there is real love and real feelings involved. But I do need to hear that, I do need to be wanted by the person I'm with. My wife works hard at eliminating any doubt.

It all takes time.

Hysterical bonding was hard for me when I went through it with my WW. I reacted in much the same way, but at the same time I couldn't get enough of it. I went through several weeks of alternating between lust and self-loathing. After a while I got past it, but it took time.

Don't give up on him. Listen to him and respond to him. Be honest even if it hurts, 'cause like others have said he is processing it.

you didn't mess up.

men are different from women. his reaction was the first thing that came to my mind when I read your post.

its a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

At some point you have to hook up sexually to get back together. so it's good that you made that happen.

the standard BH concern would be whether you were like that with OM - meaning the sexual response and lack of inhibition - and if you were like that, but not with BH during M, why? For a man it is translated into being an inferior man sexually - and thus an inferior man.

so one thing you need to do, at least in your own mind, is answer your BH's question, and figure out what that answer means.

also, best wishes to you. you sound really sincere in your remorse and efforts. they will pay off for you no matter what happens.

[This message edited by MC_Jack at 7:19 PM, January 15th (Monday)]

Actually, when I stop and think about the context of your earlier posts, I personally think you couldn't have done any better if you'd wanted to!

I agree with what Numb&Dumb said, btw, about your spontaneous honesty and candidness during the prayer. You were also "candid" with your actions, in fact. And likely to a certain extent, your husband was with his as well.

Communication--even through sexual expression is a fantastic sign, IMO--even if it's pain that's expressed. A much WORSE sign is for him to just go shields-up and cold and like a stone with you or ot go all stoic and non-feeling. If he's gonna share the "good" like he did sexually and be vulnerable like he was, you've GOT to accept the "bad" feelings that go hand-in-hand with that. That's a necessary part of the healing and reconciliation process, too, so buckle up, if that's where any of this is headed.

Besides...you just broke the "sound barrier" with how you said ya'll's sex life had been for most or all of your entire marriage! That's HUGE for most guys! In spite of the pain and the trigger aspects that almost certainly came out of this for him, that alone HAS GOT to be a serious boost to his shattered confidence...especially since it wasn't scripted or premeditated and happened on HIS terms and timing. It's not like he couldn't have said "no, thanks" or "not yet" or just acted cold & calculated and distant.

The fact that he's wounded and in pain and will have a painful recovery should be a foregone conclusion for you since you've owned up to so much of your own crime in this thing. Maybe you aren't aware yet how truly traumatized he actually is/was however. Well, if he's willing to show you how much pain and hurt you and your AP have put him in, then that's a form of "communication" that he doesn't have to reveal. And if that's the first time you've really seen him that vulnerable and emotional then there's another "sound barrier" you've both broken through TOGETHER!

And what he shared with you....oh my! I feel that even in my OWN heart and soul because that's the way I felt and STILL feel towards the one I told my dying mother I would take care and charge of when she died! I can REALLY relate to what he was saying to you there, because I know...I know what it's like to be disempowered by another person from keeping those sincerely-promised commitments to loved ones on their deathbed...

You've GOT to let him make that right...you've GOT to let him keep or at least TRY to reclaim his place as your "keeper" and lover and guardian of you that he took upon himself when your own father died.

Remember that you are Mrs. "Life" (I don't know his/your last name). A lot of himself and his self respect is tied up in you. Of course that also makes his pain and shame and agony all the worse, but I am fairly certain that he needs you to be "strong" for his sake as well as your own and your son. Stay your course and BE his wife on whatever terms (non-abusive of course) he and you can live with for now. And don't just be a total pushover either. Serve him and love him and your son...and yourself some too, along with Christ. I don't mean that you should be "selfish". I mean that you are Mrs. Life. You are NOT a WHORE. You failed him horribly, yes. But that is a past event. Don't fail him in the present. Be strong for him and for your family and faith's sake. It will help him to remember who he married and who he loved/loves. It will help HIM as well.