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Long Term Affairs Part 38

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MalibuBayBreeze posted 7/24/2018 23:53 PM

The walls I am working to break down when it comes to us as a couple- are consistently going back up. Not a day goes by when I don't think about four years of lies. Betrayal.

Same here. For me I don't think those walls will ever come down. They will just keep rebuilding themselves. They have to for my protection. I can never let myself be put into such a vulnerable place again. Afraid to speak up. Manipulated. Made to walk on eggshells.

Fuck that.

I kept my wedding rings on for a while, but started to wear them less and less. I only wear them when we socialize, and lately there have been times I have gone sans rings and don't care. At one time they represented my marriage and I was proud to wear them. Now they represent a lie and sit behind a picture frame on my dresser.

I relate to so much of what you wrote 4yearsoflies. How do you feel being away from him? Are you finding yourself more anxious or less once you were apart?

If he's doing it again, I just won't know. How could I know now?
He hid it for over four years.

To live with that kind of doubt all of the time, is what is so hard.

It's what makes me question everything even more.


I always say if he does it again I will know. My gut will start screaming, the red flags will begin waving. Been there done that, I'm a seasoned pro and know what to look for. What behaviors will be triggers. What my response will be.

Then I have the part of me that thinks like you. How would I know? He was able to carry on a LTA with a married woman and it took years to get caught. Next time he would know the mistakes he made. He would take it deep underground.

That thinking makes me not trust anything, and no it is no way to live. I don't want to feel there's another one out there he hasn't met yet or that he'll wind up back with her. It eats me alive a little every day.

We all have a right to happiness. Our Waywards certainly made sure they exercised that "right" despite being married. Where's our happiness? Are we condemned to lives that will be forever scarred by this? Where the hell is the fairness in all of this?

My WH went to another man's home, fucked his wife, and thought he was "the man". He has so far surpassed anything I was suspicious of. There are times when he's talking and all I'm thinking is what a POS he has to be to have done that. Repeatedly.

How could I not have seen through those rose colored glasses what he really was long ago?

hopeandhealing posted 7/25/2018 00:22 AM

Sorry for the delayed reply. Had our 22nd anniversary on the 20th (not a celebration of any sort, pretty triggery) and then have been mostly off the grid camping.

CaliforniaNative,
My WH did have four LTA, but I didn't discover any of them until last year, 5 years after the last one ended. So no, he didn't see my pain over and over. He saw it this past year and says on that basis alone he could never cheat again. If he done this to me once, saw my pain and did it again, I would without any hesitation have filed for D that day. Infidelity is bad enough, but to see someone's pain and do it to them again, I have no words and certainly do not possess that degree of grace for that level of assholery.

Amanda, GMC
I can understand what you are both are saying with my ICs comment that he didn't do this to me, he did it to the M. I said the same thing to her...we- he and I are the marriage and he certainly didn't cause himself any pain (quite the opposite as I understand!!)! I think her intent was he didn't set out to hurt me/cause me harm, I know it sounds asinine, because how can you expect any other possible outcome, but it wasn't done out of malice i.e. "Wow, that Hope, she's such a bitch, I am going to cause her the most pain she has ever endured in her life". My WH's thoughts were "I am not getting enough sex at home and I deserve more. Hey, here's a willing open orifice, so I'll do that! It's ok Hope won't get hurt because she will never know"...and he was right I didn't know for 17 years. His last A ended 5 years ago. I rather suspect he thought he was in the free and clear, take it to his grave.

His As were only sex. He didn't spend money on them, no extra time, no dinners, no movies, no meaning really. Texts were about the next hook ups, when and where. Get the deed done and leave....super classy and heartfelt. I have equated these women to live blow up dolls. They used each other for NSA sex.

I am sorry there is so much pain on this thread, it's palpable and it breaks my heart for everyone posting. Our stories are all awful and our journeys through the grief and loss so very long and painful. I am sure none of us expected to be here, I certainly didn't. Our stories also don't feel as though they are ours anymore with a LTA. It is truly a different beast. We ask ourselves what was real? What was authentic? Was anything said, actions taken honest? Did he/she ever actually love me? I know I questioned it all and I felt like an imposter in my life.
I would look at photos and want to take the all down. My internal dialogue was on overdrive to every trigger. Movies, songs, photos...infidelity is everywhere. I didn't realize that until I too became a statistic.

- our wedding photo -"liar"!
- Photos of our children- "right and you were f**king AP1/2/3/4 when that was taken", take it down,
- my wedding ring - Lost a diamond after dday..."wow a sign from the universe, take it off, in my eyes we're not really married anymore anyway"

Everyday, all around me reminders of the shit sandwich I was trying to swallow.

In all of this analytical thinking, I became very angry at what was stolen from me, years and years gone in one day because of one selfish person's acts of betrayal and web of lies. MY beautiful memories were disappearing and being replaced by awfulness. My internal dialogue to his As was tainting my whole history, MY life, when I did nothing wrong. So I made a conscious decision to take those memories back. They are still MY story and were meaningful to me. I will not allow his selfishness to destroy my memories of my life in particular, my children's childhoods.

This was MY life story and it was real; it is one of fun, honesty, compassion, love and kindness as seen through my eyes. That does not have to change. He can own and have the shit memories that are of his creation and though I wish for him to heal, I don't wish him to ever forget what he chose, how he treated another human being he professed to love. I am grateful not to live with that. It is HIS burden to bear, not mine and not yours either.

I wish you all some peace and better days ahead.
((()))

[This message edited by hopeandhealing at 12:38 AM, July 25th (Wednesday)]

hopeandhealing posted 7/25/2018 02:19 AM

Malibu,

How could I not have seen through those rose colored glasses what he really was long ago?

Because our frame of reference is not as a wayward, so we don't see it. It truly is beyond our realm of comprehension that someone we have chosen to be our life partner could do this to us. How? We would never do it to them, therefore we expect the same virtues to be extended to us...and we were wrong, gave them far too much credit for their broken, selfish characters.

The question is, who is in front of you now and is he/she worth it? Do you believe change is possible? What is the evidence before you?

I don't think those walls will ever come down.
.

I think the walls have to come down to move forward. Blind, implicit trust? no, never 100% again. But if we can't trust and be vulnerable, what kind of M will we have? That's not the partnership I want to create and live in 10 years, 5 years, even 1 year from now. I don't yet know if I will be able to love my WH deeply again. It won't be the same for sure, but will it be enough? The jury is out still, but I am trying and letting go of worrying about the outcome, which has given me a huge amount of peace.

northeasternarea posted 7/25/2018 07:43 AM

The past will always affect us, but I refuse to live there. Our relationship is irrevocably changed. I know what he is capable of. He continues to show me that he is no longer that man. Maybe one day I will truly believe it. I think the work of reconciliation will never end. It’s up to him to make staying worth it for me.

LifeisCrazy posted 7/25/2018 08:01 AM

Hi everyone. What an incredibly important conversation.

It is the duration of the affair that ropes us back in emotionally. 6+ years later, totally and completely reconciled, I still struggle with the reality of my wife's betrayal. We're at a point where the marriage is so good (and so much better than it ever was) and the discussions already so old that I no longer bring them up. It's not worth having to subsequently dig each other out of the rabbit hole.

Yet, for all the positive points I make about how reconciliation CAN happen, it is this one that is most difficult for me. It is the realization that my wife was able to be THAT person, for so long, that remains etched in the back of my brain.

It really is amazing. We have a wonderful night, have sex, wake up together and shower (a regular event now - very "bonding - I would highly recommend it!) and get ourselves ready for the day together. And then, in the midst of it... Wham! "Three years. Three fucking years." My brain still goes there.

I'll be driving to work, happy as a clam, and just like that - it comes back like a thunderbolt.

The thing is, I no longer even mention it to her. As much as our communication has improved there are things, to me, that just aren't worth the conversation. After all, what am I going to say? That it hurts? That it sucks? That I hate the shit sandwich I was given? The reality is that she already knows. And I know that she's sorry... down to her bones. So why bother? Why fuck up the mojo and start a pity party? It's this weird confluence of wanting to talk but, at the same time, not wanting to talk. Often you need to weigh the need against the benefit.

So here's how I cope - and maybe it will help someone. I've come to realize that I simply can't focus myself on the past. I no longer allow myself to look at a picture of us running a 10-mile race together and think, "She texted him on the way home." I just don't let myself. There are too many things during that time period that I enjoyed - and I enjoyed it on my own, despite what she was doing. I simply don't let the affair tarnish my positive memories.

It is hard. There are reminders of her infidelity everywhere. I recently went back to my old hometown up north and, everywhere I went, there were reminders and triggers that really tugged at me. But you know what? There were also a lot of really good things... and I simply chose to focus on them.

I sometimes want to post whenever people throw out the 2-5 year time frame thing. I want to let them know that 2-5 years might be a good reference for when you start feeling better... but the truth is, after all these years of learning... you NEVER get past the infidelity. It never goes away. It never gets "better." Yes, you learn to tuck it away and begin finding healthy ways to manage the pain of it all. But infidelity is something that we will always live with.

I am hoping that each of you can get to the point where I am - where the reality of the LTA is just something that happened. It's a memory that you look back on and say, "Yeah, that happened to us," and just go on with your day. It takes a long time to get there and a lot of mental toughness.

But it can be done. And you can get there.

hopefull77 posted 7/25/2018 08:19 AM

Lifeiscrazy you are a year ahead of me and I agree with you...and that 2-5 year thing is spot on as well...

Chaos posted 7/25/2018 08:32 AM

Thank you LifeisCrazy

As another "Three fucking years" LTA BS, your comments really spoke to me. And I needed to read them today.

I would love to get to the point that you area. To know it is possible gives me hope.

MalibuBayBreeze posted 7/25/2018 09:25 AM

The question is, who is in front of you now and is he/she worth it? Do you believe change is possible? What is the evidence before you?

Well, he's not acting like the scumbag he was during the A. He talks in terms of "we, us and our" as opposed to "me, mine, I" all the time so that's a change. His tantrums have faded, though there has been a bit of snippy behavior recently. I'm no longer having it which is a change in me. When he was upset and frustrated about something regarding DS last week and started the "I just can't" mantra, I calmly and matter of factly responded, "then don't". He asked what I meant, and I just walked away and went to take out the garbage and went to bed without saying another word. I simply wasn't going to be drawn into the bullshit. I'm done with that.

He must have done some thinking because the next day he acted completely different.

He shut down talks about the A and really never gave me the answers I want. But he knows damn well I do not trust him, I make my comments and don't care if he likes it, and he's well aware of the fact that I am still struggling. But I'm slowly coming out of my own fog and plan to get the wheels in motion to do things for me. To get things rolling that will make me happy, fill my time and fulfill some long held plans always put off due to putting everyone before myself. No more.

But those walls? They're staying up. Even if we were to split up and someone new came into my life, they'd be up. I would never give my heart to someone again. I'll never trust him or anyone with it.

I do love him, but I am no longer in love with him. That ship has sailed.

LifeisCrazy
I hope I can reach the point you are at. I'm 2 1/2 years out and honestly don't believe it'll happen but maybe it will.

LifeisCrazy posted 7/25/2018 10:04 AM

I do love him, but I am no longer in love with him. That ship has sailed.

I would caution you against hanging your hat on this definitive.

It takes a long time - A LONG TIME - for many waywards to "get it." And, yes, I know that 1 year, 2 years, 3 years... that IS a "long time." But it can, and does, happen.

Not for everyone, of course. There are people who simply don't have it in them. They will never be able to put the marriage first. I have written on this site that spouses know each other very well, especially if you've been married a long time. When you look in your husband's eyes - and I mean, REALLY look - does he have the CAPACITY to "get it?" I know that we all WANT to say yes, but we also know that there are some people who just don't have that capacity. Is this your husband? Is he someone who, even when he's saying all the right things, is actually just still protecting himself? I ask that for an obvious reason - if he doesn't have it in him then you really need to consider whether or not you can stay.

On the other hand, if your answer is yes - then he still has learning to do. And he must. He must take an active responsibility to learn what you need so that you can heal.

My point? If he CAN do this... and if he WILL do this... then you may find a renewed love for him that you think has left forever. I know that my feelings for my wife had gotten so tarnished with the years of bullshit following discovery that I was actively contemplating leaving. And then, out of almost the clear blue sky, something clicked. And it was amazing. There was my wife with all the characteristics that made me initially fall in love with her, acting in a way that was comforting and warm and supporting and kind....

Where did it come from? Who the heck knows. But it shows that it can happen. And, if it does, well... love is a funny thing.

All the best to you.

gmc94 posted 7/25/2018 10:30 AM

Is he someone who, even when he's saying all the right things, is actually just still protecting himself?

Yes. Honestly, I find time vs capacity very confusing, in that how do we know a WS has the capacity if we don't allow enough time?

Personally, I really don't think WH has the capacity. I got him to go to therapy early in the M.... I think he blames the IC, but I always felt he just wasn't really invested in it. Like he thinks he can go talk about his problems or what's on his mind (both of which do not come easily for him), and that's it. But he was never really willing to do the work to dig deep, then dig again, and then continue to dig. He wants to upend a spade full of shizzle, and tell himself look! I found a worm! Guess that's what's going on... and move on. The problem is that if he'd kept digging, he'd find the real stuff - the snakes and rocks and bugs and all the emotional "stuff" that has been buried.

I do know my WH has the capacity to lie, keep important things secret, and to live a double life for a very very very long time.
One thing I've been "stuck" on recently is this:
Over all the years of his PA, I can see him googling how to help treat ED, or how to get my wife to fuck me with ED (WH has some health issues), or how to spice up our sex life.... but NEVER, not one fucking time in a decade, did he google "why am I having an affair" or even ask himself this pretty basic question: why am I doing this? Even when he's in the A "compartment" of his life, he never asked himself or sought any advice about why he was engaging in such destructive behavior (and I don't mean destructive to me or our family - but destructive to HIMSELF). It shows such a complete disregard for any self reflection or authenticity in life. I knew this about him, but I thought that the bad "coping" was confined to the drinking and occasional angry outbursts. I was clueless that he was coping via kibble and sex.

WH's mom died in mid-2000s - the same time he says that I changed. I urged him to seek some therapy - he always refused. 3 years later, and a week after his EA turned PA (little did I know...), I began my own therapy. I again urged him to seek therapy and MC. He refused. Only now - after his AP "outed" him to me and his world is crumbling around him - is he going, but I feel very strongly it's been pretty half-assed. I feel he's going for me and to save the M - but NOT for himself and to save himself from himself!

Yesterday during MC he said "I am looking for you" (I can't even remember what the context was). It really struck me. I said, you have no biz looking for me or any other woman.... you need to be looking for yourself. Figuring out who you are and who you want to be, regardless of whether it's what I want or don't want. Only you can do that work - I cannot "fix" you, and "you can never respect or love me until you respect and love yourself". He looked completely dumfounded and it's then - when I look straight into his eyes, I see nothing... emptiness. A blank stare. Those are the moments I feel no amount of time will create the capacity. I love my H, I really do. And I wish the best for him.... but not at the expense of my own safety and mental health - not at the expense of my own life.

WhyAgainWhyHer posted 7/25/2018 12:32 PM

It seems like everyone here is reconciling even with the LTA's. We aren't. His plan is to be with her sometime next year.

Bestthing posted 7/25/2018 16:18 PM

This is a really helpful discussion for me. I struggle with whether I would ever get over the duration. From the veterans here, the answer seems to be no, but I can choose not to let that thought linger. Then I ask myself if I can live with that. I think I can even though it may always cause a little ache in my heart. It would be nice to have a little ritual like a mutual deposit every time the thought occurs so that we suffer through it as a couple. Otherwise, I may feel resentful if I have to endure it alone for the rest of my life. There are many stupid things we did individually and as a couple that we can now look back and say yeah we were so young and ill prepared, we did that to ourselves. I can’t believe we survived it! I hope that with time, this affair will take on this color. The truth is if his affair wasn’t such a huge kick in the butt, we may never have woken up to the growth that we needed. We were truly stuck for years. Sometimes what it takes to get something unstuck is an earthquake.

As for the photos, that is exactly what I told my therapist today. They are Affair 1, Affair 2 etc. written all over them and for my children’s happy faces to be in the photos further defiles my family. So I took them all down. Yet, I can’t have my happy memories stolen by this AP and my then weak addict husband. I am going to frame only photos without my husband during the three years that he was “away.” The kids and I still had a fabulous time in those vacation spots. I still own those memories.

As to not being able to trust my intuition about WH’s cheating behaviors for three years?! Well, let’s not give the AP and WS too much mythical powers. If we REALLY wanted to text and screw someone else, any of us has the skills to keep it underground. They are not so smart. So our spouses have to realize that we can also cheat if we choose, that we can fall out of love, eventually throw in the towel because of their immaturity. In other words, they can lose us as easily as we can lose them. All love entails risk. If the spouse as he/she comes today is worth the risk, then go for it. The person that did the cheating is another person, an earlier version or temporary insane version depending on the circumstances. Life is about growing after all. For us BS, forgiveness is a feat. It takes just as much courage to forgive as to D. This reconciliation is a personal challenge somewhat detached from the outcome.

steadychevy posted 7/25/2018 16:56 PM

WhyAgainWhyHer, not everyone whose spouse had an LTA id reconciling. I wanted to have the opportunity to see if R was possible. WW never did the basic steps I needed to get to that point. I don't know if I could have/would have R'd but would have liked the opportunity to find out. I filed for D.

I think what LifeisCrazy wrote is correct. Recovery is a long process whether together or not. Do you ever get through it? It seems to me you just are able to deal with it better and the effect on you is minimal but the reminders/triggers are still there. They just hardly cause a twinge unlike before. There are posts from people who have been a long time out of adultery and feel like they are healed here on SI that have something happen that affects them fairly substantially. The recovery time seems to be fairly short but the effect is still there years later.

4yearsoflies posted 7/25/2018 21:55 PM

MalibuBayBreeze

I relate to so much of what you wrote 4yearsoflies. How do you feel being away from him? Are you finding yourself more anxious or less once you were apart?

In the moments that I am busy, I am perfectly fine. BUT whenever there is a quiet moment, a triggery song, a realization that he hasn't told me he loves me or misses me...
Then I go into negative cycle mode. I wouldn't call what I feel anxious. The longer I'm away, the deeper my apathy becomes.

And I was falling deeply into that abyss during his affair. My journals been three years ago, and are all about emptiness and the void that was in my life.

When we are together, trying to reconcile, it is better. But I have another week here without him. And Since I know what he is fully capable of, I know he could hide it. Really well.

So what does my gut tell me? I don't think he'd be stupid enough to do it again , but that's what I thought once before.

Although in my heart of hearts I want this to work, I am absolutely leaving my options open. Because I, like all of us,
Deserve to be loved fully, completely, and with honesty.

hopeandhealing posted 7/26/2018 02:04 AM

GMC,

you have no biz looking for me or any other woman.... you need to be looking for yourself. Figuring out who you are and who you want to be, regardless of whether it's what I want or don't want. Only you can do that work - I cannot "fix" you, and "you can never respect or love me until you respect and love yourself".

^^^ So true. I hope your WH heard your words and is able to truly reflect on what you said, understand it at it's core. It sounds to me like he isn't able to communicate the emotional stuff, be vulnerable, own how he was capable of doing what he did. Until he is, I don't think he is really a safe partner.

People who are capable of LTAs don't just make a bad decision, they are capable of a whole different level of deceit, living a second life, betrayal or enormous magnitude, it's truly mind boggling in an awful way. Until he gets to the why and how, digs deep, he hasn't really done the work to ensure it won't happen again.

Actions over words. He should want this for himself, because he recognizes he was broken.

I remember the day my WH said, "even if we don't work out, I am keeping up with IC because I need to fix me, figure out how I could betray not only you, but myself so profoundly". It was a day of hope for me, that he was willing to do the work. These WS need to do the work.

donna3 posted 7/26/2018 17:10 PM

So much good stuff going on here. At 4+ years out, the sting is not like it was but I still have moments where it kicks me in the gut and I cry. But then I remind myself that things are wayyyyy better now, my H reminds me very often that he is in this 100%, that everything he does is for me and our M. He was always a very selfish person in our M and that has totally changed.

The truth is if his affair wasn’t such a huge kick in the butt, we may never have woken up to the growth that we needed. We were truly stuck for years. Sometimes what it takes to get something unstuck is an earthquake
. Yes, besthing, this is so very true for us. And for that reason when I am triggering I remind myself that we could still be on that road, stuck in ho-hum. We both have worked so hard at this R that what we have now is amazing. But at such a large cost, especially to me. I do love him, probably more now than at least for a decade prior to the A. But wow, I wish he would have just told me how unhappy he was rather than going online to find someone, anyone to give him the ego kibbles he felt he deserved.

I do not believe that he will stray again, but I do not give 100% trust in him or myself. I will always be on guard for certain behaviors. But then again, he is always on guard - he says that he knows at any time I can justifiable walk on the M due to what he did. We both live with our fears.

Three years is a long time to lie and deceive. Maybe I could be well over this if it was just a few months of crazy behavior and then, oh my god, what have I been doing. But no, time after time a conscious decision to deceive was made. There was no "mistake" here. Its was totally on purpose. That is still very hard for me to swallow, as it is for all of us.

by now we have stopped talking about the specifics - although there are things i would like to know. He lied to me so much in the beginning and I handled things so poorly that I did not get some of the answers to specifics. At this point it does our M no good to rehash. Yes, we talk about the A and the hurt but not details (did you hold her hand when you were out and about walking around? for example) I have stopped telling him every time I trigger and get hurt. To quote Brene Brown, "I no longer use it like a sword, a way to cut him when I'm hurting."

Thank you LifeisCrazy for your insight. Your words are very though provoking and very encouraging.

We are all doing what we need to do to get thru this. Stay or go, we need to make peace with ourselves. the day after Dday, I told my H that my healing comes first. I cannot deal with his problems, he needs to. I still feel that way sometimes but mostly I know that at this point we have to work on all this together. He does own his own shit, but he has been a lost soul since the day I met him. Various attempts at IC just never did anything for him. But after all this went down, he did some serious soul searching on his own (with the help of the internet) and has made a real positive effort at being a different person. I told him he needs to do this for himself first, then for me. He now actually likes who he is now on most days.

I know I need to let this hurt go, but sometimes I think that I am afraid to let it go completely time will tell

MalibuBayBreeze posted 7/27/2018 00:20 AM

Three years is a long time to lie and deceive. Maybe I could be well over this if it was just a few months of crazy behavior and then, oh my god, what have I been doing. But no, time after time a conscious decision to deceive was made. There was no "mistake" here. Its was totally on purpose. That is still very hard for me to swallow, as it is for all of us.

I definitely think if he had a ONS or a very brief fling, a week or two, I would be able to move on. I may sound crass and catch a lot of heat for this, and I don't mean to diminish the pain of any BS no matter how long the betrayal, but I envy those who are not dealing with trying to recover from a LTA.

A ONS wouldn't have taken his effort, energy, emotions, time, and attention. It wouldn't have put someone else on a pedestal while I was kicked to the side. It wouldn't have robbed me of years of my marriage and memories. It wouldn't haunt me by wondering if it's another woman he really wants to be with instead of me. I would not be experiencing triggers on such on high level. My heart would have been hurt but not shattered.

People who are capable of LTAs don't just make a bad decision, they are capable of a whole different level of deceit, living a second life, betrayal or enormous magnitude, it's truly mind boggling in an awful way.

It is. I can't comprehend how two people agree to do something like this, and continue to do it. How does it even happen? Seriously. I cannot imagine the amount of time and work that goes into running a well oiled machine such as a LTA.

I really question if anyone who is capable of such deceit has not been to the rodeo before. I may be naïve but they had to have had strayed prior and just weren't caught. That would build their confidence to get away with it, each time pushing the limits. I do not believe my WH's LTA was his only infidelity. I just don't but I can't drive myself crazy over things from the past that I can never find proof of. But he was way too comfortable for this to be the only one.

I would caution you against hanging your hat on this definitive.
It takes a long time - A LONG TIME - for many waywards to "get it." And, yes, I know that 1 year, 2 years, 3 years... that IS a "long time." But it can, and does, happen.

It doesn't matter if he ever gets it. I loved this man like none before him. From the first kiss I knew he was "the one". All my worst fears of infidelity have come to fruition and then some. There's no coming back from that. The moment I had a name, I saw her picture on FB, she became real and that was the moment I stopped being in love with him. He instantly changed in my eyes and heart. Nothing he could ever say or do will restore that. My love is still there, but in a drastically different way.
Although in my heart of hearts I want this to work, I am absolutely leaving my options open. Because I, like all of us,
Deserve to be loved fully, completely, and with honesty.

4Yearsoflies
I feel the same.

There are so many good people here at SI. People with integrity and boundaries. Who honored the vows they took. Who value marriage and family. And I wonder why our paths didn't cross with such like minded people and instead crossed with ones who could hurt us so profoundly.


4yearsoflies posted 7/27/2018 07:33 AM

Donna3 and Bestthing

Everything that you wrote was spot on.
That is the mindset that I need to keep myself in if I want to continue to build this new marriage. The part that you highlighted, the part about there needing to be an earthquake to make some change, ---is what my WH and I had talked about.

And it is all about mindset.

Yet at the same time I have to continue to protect myself. I can't yet fully be vulnerable. I won't let myself.

Add on that he's going through so much turmoil with work stuff with his business, that I don't really think I'm anything but another matter to deal with on his to do list at this point.

So I strive to have empathy, and feel I magnanimous when I can dig up a few kind words. Meanwhile my discomfort and struggle continues alone.

This yoyo lifestyle is wearing!

Just rereading what I just wrote, it's clear that my brain is fighting itself.

[This message edited by 4yearsoflies at 7:43 AM, July 27th (Friday)]

Bestthing posted 7/27/2018 10:00 AM

I Just want to give everyone here a hug this morning. Reading your posts, I feel like you took the words right out of my brain.

I agree that we need to bring that wall down for the marriage to be great. After suffering through a LTA, none of us should be settling for an okay marriage. It better darn well be GREAT, otherwise it’s not worth the suffering and second guessing. The blind trust we had was fantasy. Yes, we all miss the peace and comfort that came with it, but it wasn’t real. So, we have to think good riddance to the blind trust. We are older, wiser and more in step with reality now.

To dismantle the wall, though, we have to know exactly what we are dealing with at the moment. We can’t just let any lying thief inside our walls. If you feel that your WH has more affairs that he hasn’t told you about, you don’t have enough facts to decide whether to let him in or not. How can you make that decision without all the facts? Can you explain that to him and maybe offer a one time emnesty within reason? If he doesn’t come completely clean now, your wall will always be up, and why would he want a marriage like that?

A meme says forgiveness is when you stop wishing the past is different. I hope to get there one day.

For my WH LTA, what made it last 3 years were his constant need for validation, his inability to say no (boundaries), and his inability to deal with anxiety. A little free sex thrown in was enticing, too. Once we figure out what made them sick, maybe we can look at it as 3 or 4 years of sickness. They look back and feel sick about what they did because they WERE sick and addicted and went along with the momentum because they were too weak to fight it. Would it be easier to take if we refer to their LTA as long term sickness?

In my daily life, I bring the subject up whenever and wherever. Heck, he found time to text OW everyday at the beginning, drove 2 hours, bought her breakfast, fucked her, and drove two hours back in time to pick up the kids from school. He can spare a couple of minutes to listen to me vent when I am triggered. I am afraid that if I stop reminding him how much it hurts, he will forget and do it again.

FightingBack posted 7/27/2018 11:04 AM

I haven’t visited this thread in awhile. The “cast of characters” has changed somewhat, but we seem to all be united in our struggles and our pain.

I am almost 7 years from dday and I find it comforting to know that this is a place where people understand me.

My husband has certainly changed since dday. He has become more loving and thoughtful and he has been faithful. I so wish that we could have got to this point in our relationship without the LTA blowing up our world though. If we had, I think I would be perfectly happy. But the A still occupies my thoughts and emotions and I am unable to talk with him about it.

Although he claims deep remorse, he has never been able to bring up the subject. After all this time, I bring it up less often as well because my requests for discussion and help are still met with the “deer in headlights” look.

He wants to forget. In fact, he claims he never, ever thinks about the LTA unless I bring it up. I think I am at last stepping back and distancing myself emotionally in self-preservation. I have even told him this and although he says that he doesn’t want me to feel this way, does nothing to invite that dreaded discussion.

We are on the same page in all other aspects of our life, just not this dark shadow which seems won’t go away. I can pretend for awhile that it didn’t happen, and can almost feel happy, but it is never far from the surface.

I become resentful when I feel I have to deal with this on my own. It is very lonely.

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