SurvivingInfidelity.com Forums
Wayward Side
User Topic: It's not getting easier
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 6:22 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

6 weeks and counting since I moved out. She has made it clear that she isn't changing her mind. That this is her path and I need to move on. She wants to move forward with a divorce and start her life over. She said she tried for 10 months but she doesn't have any more to give to the marriage. Our marriage is over - her words. This whole situation is overwhelming to me mentally and emotionally. I'm having a difficult time accepting this and focusing on how I can make my life better. I still go to IC every week. I see my kids as much as I can. I've accepted the advice to start taking care of me. My problem is that as soon as I wake up in the morning sadness kicks in and my mind begins the torture of depression the entire day until I go to bed. I can't make it stop. Sometimes I'll try and rationally think that this is what it is. Start moving forward with my life. Be positive and things will get better. Then why do I have this feeling in my heart of despair? We had everything for 16 years. So many great memories. Our marriage was great. Then bc of my selfish and other personal issues I strayed for 3 months. Now our world is turned upside down and I can't stop spiraling. Yesterday I was hanging out with my son-12. I could tell he was sad. When I said goodbye bc his mother was coming home I could see the sadness in his eyes. He's a sweet sensitive kid. Very grounded and sometimes older than he is. He understands this is where we are and why. And he's not always sad. But yesterday he was. Which made me more upset with myself for turning my family's world upside down. And there's nothing I can do to change it. I'm still in love with Kate and miss her. I miss my family. I'm trying to come to grips but I can't shake this.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
BaxtersBFF
Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 6:40 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Hi kroma,

I'm sorry that this is that path you find yourself on. And you've probably heard it before, but it will get better with time. Working on you means working through what you've done, not just to your BW and your kids, but what you've done to you.

I have a theory regarding the feelings you describe from the time you wake up until you fall asleep again. That theory is that there is something in those feelings that is comfortable to you. I remember those feelings to some degree. It isn't that you "enjoy" the feelings, just that they are what you know, or they hit on something that takes you to another time emotionally that you may not recognize. I think that you have to get to the bottom of that before you can really begin to accept what is happening in your life right now.

What do you do in IC?


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6097 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 6:50 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

I've been in IC for over a year. I started immediately after d-day. I've discussed everything from my past, my family growing up, my job, my A, the AP, who I am now, who I want to be, my wife, my kids, but lately I spend my time dealing with what I've been going through weekly. She gives me good advice. A lot of the same advice I get from this site or my friends and family.
As for my feelings from morning to night I hate them. My sleep is off. I don't eat regularly. I've lost 20 lbs in 2 months. I hate this funk that I'm in. I'm confused and frustrated. It's hard hearing those words come out of Kate's mouth. I want to be happy. But it doesn't seem possible without her. She was the woman of my dreams and anyone else is second best and will always be. Just struggling still.....

Admin - I forgot to uncheck the STOP button....looking for advice from anyone. Can you fix that please? Thanks.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
JustDesserts
Member
Member # 39665
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Your pain is palpable. And your efforts to save your possibly unsaveable marriage sound earnest and thorough.

It's too bad those contemplating straying can't be forced to read your words first. I think a lot of them would think twice if they did.

And reading your words those of us who are being given the gift of reconciliation can remind ourselves just how lucky we are, and the responsibility we have, to be authentic and true. To hold dear and tight the love and trust we are handed by those we hurt the most.

Is there anything else you can think of regarding your reconciliation attempts that you haven't tried? Sort of making sure you've "left it all on the field".

Sorry for your pain. Chin up, though I'm sure that is much easier said than done. Your words do help others.

JD


2 year EA/PA. DDay 3/12. Broke NC 6/13 w/one stupid 5 line e-mail (which brought me to SI). Me: WH, 50. Her: BW, 49. Married 19 years. Two kids. Dog. Reconciling...together.

Posts: 403 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Suburbia, New England, USA
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

JD

If I could tell my story to anybody that even thinks about straying I would. The single most horrible thing I've ever done. I have hurt my wife beyond belief. It's been over a year and she still feels the pain. It kills me to know I did this. My kids will be ok but I know they wish things were different. My wife, kids, family, friends, job, everything and everyone gets affected. One thing I will say is that no matter who I'm ever with I will never put anyone through this. Never.

As for leaving it on the field I've tried evrything I can think of except accepting this outcome. When this 1st happened last year we got back together too quickly. She never had time to heal. So the last 10 months she's become bitter and angry and now wants closure. I agree that we should be separated. But I was hoping for a trial separation. I was hoping that we would be separated and at the same time figure out how she can handle the anger and what I did to her. She says she can't get past those 3 months regardless of how great our life was and what it could be. No matter how far I've become as a person. It all doesn't matter. It's her choice now and this is where she's at.
I've been on the internet all morning looking up info on how to cope hoping to find something I haven't learned yet. My days are just so long and sad. I hate waking up and I hate going to bed.
For those that have the gift of reconcilliation-cherish it. Cherish every single second. Bc it could all be over just like that. If Kate evr gave me the opportunity to be hers again or to even try she would not be dissappointed. I guarantee it. She would be loved, respected, cherished, appreciated and taken care of like she deserves. I know I can give her everything if she wants it to happen. I just don't think she wants that anymore. A sad ending to what was a beautiful life.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
Card
Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 11:00 AM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Kroma,

This is the reality, some BS's cannot stay in a marriage with someone that betrayed them. It's not that something is 'wrong' with them, it's actually a more rational approach when you think about it....

Thant being said, are you just giving up and giving in to your own confusion about all of this?
Allowing yourself to become a victim of your own endless self pity?
That's what it sounds like to me....

Have you read any books about marital recovery from infidelity?

The one that helped me the most was; Surviving An Affair, by Dr. Willard Harley, Jr.
I followed it up with his other books, of which my favorite was, Fall In Love, Stay In Love.

Take the time to start reading and investing in making the changes in yourself, as outlined in books like these. Otherwise, you're going to spiral down even farther.

I'm here to tell you that moping around, allowing confusion & depression to take you over is very un-attractive. Take the steps necessary to be the man your wife and children need you to be.

It sounds like you've dug up enough of the old bones buried in your past. Maybe it's time to focus on looking ahead with a fresh vision.



WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 12:03 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Card,

Believe me if I could just walk away and start working on me I would. It's not like I don't want it to happen. It's not like I enjoy feeling this way. I'm just feeling overwhelmed right now and reaching out for anything that might help. Your suggestion on the books is a good idea. After the A I read a book called After The Affair. In fact my wife bought a copy as well. I learned a lot from it. Your advise to read more is a good one.
I'm not looking for any magic words here. I'm just having a difficult time with knowing I will probably never have a relationship with Kate again and will never have our family together again. I'm doing the best I can.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
BaxtersBFF
Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 12:21 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

I'm just feeling overwhelmed right now and reaching out for anything that might help.

Then take some heart in responses from those who have gone before you. You will make it. You have to work through it. But you also have to be ready to work through it. Sometimes it takes a while to even be ready to begin working on it. Take your time if you need.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6097 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
unforgivable5
Member
Member # 38797
Default  Posted: 12:29 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Hey Kroma,

I'm sorry you're in the place you are. Even though my BS and I are attempting R, I am well aware of the fact that it could change at any given moment. It sucks. and I feel for you. I really do. Its obvious you are in tremendous pain.

What Card said...

Take the steps necessary to be the man your wife and children need you to be.

Maybe this is what your wife needs to see. Perhaps she still sees you only as the guy who cheated on her and stomped on her heart. Maybe she doesn't see you any differently. And maybe its because you aren't any different. From some of your past posts, it seems you keep reacting in a similar way to things that gets her upset. So she sees you as the same old Kroma.

Become who you want to be. Decide right now the man you ought to be, and move towards that. Because this, what you are doing right now, its doing you no good. Its actually doing you alot more harm, and in the mean time doing more damage to what's left of your relationship. I know you hurt. It's probably more hurt than you have ever felt in your entire life. But alway always always remember that she has been hurt more than she has been in her entire life.

Change to be the man you were meant to be. The man to keep her safe. Show her that man each and every day through your actions. Make her your driving force to change. At the end of the day, it may or may not matter to her. But you'll be better a better man. And that's all any of us can hope for.


WH
D-day 3/4/13

Posts: 80 | Registered: Mar 2013
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 12:38 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Unforgiveable

I'm moving into a better place for myself and for my kids. It's closer to the house. Bigger than my apartment. I'm hoping I will feel better by just having a better place to hang out with my kids. Kate has seen me change over the course of the year. In fact it's not the change but why the change. You're 100% right that her hurt is worse. I can never imagine what she went through. And I'm sure she's going through a lot at this very moment. She definately wants me to be happy and take care of myself. To have a better place for the kids to go. Although she is a driving force for me to be a better person I know I need to do this for me. I also know I need to let her go for her. I just hope she comes back.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
Sal1995
Member
Member # 39099
Default  Posted: 12:51 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

From a BH perspective, one thing my wife's affair taught me is that we really have no control over someone else's actions. The flip side of that - a WS has no control over how the BS reacts to the trauma of discovering the affair. They say that for some it's a dealbreaker. The truth IMO - it's a dealbreaker 100% of the time. An affair is for all intents and purposes an emotional divorce of the other spouse, if not one that shows up in court records. A broken deal. The only question is whether the spouses are going to enter into a new deal with each other. And that has nothing to do with a marriage certificate.

All you can do from here on is move forward and be the best man you can be. Be the best father you can be. And if given the opportunity, be the best husband to Kate that you can be. Words are nice, but your actions will tell the true story about what's in your heart.

Best wishes, I hope it works out for the best.


Me (BS)-45, WW-42
PMs with men only, please
DDay 2/17/13, 9-10 month PA/EA
Final NC late Feb. '13
M - 18 years, 4 children
Reconciling

Posts: 1357 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 12:59 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Sal

Interesting you say that about the dealbreaker. Kate is right when she says our marriage is over. She took her ring off a long time ago and last week she asked me to take mine off. Bc it doesn't mean anything to her. Through this whole experience I have often said that if given a chance to R it would be a fresh start. New marriage. New rings. New vows. New everything. A fresh start on the second half of our life. Problem is that's an opinion of one. One thing I can tell you through this whole mess is that my relationship with my kids have gotten so much better.

That's a positive. Thanks for the advice.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
ontheslope
Member
Member # 40574
Default  Posted: 4:27 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

kroma,

Best advice I can give (and this may sound trivial), is exercise.

I don't know if you run, or jog, or work out, or whatever, but your mind needs a break, and on my darkest days, exercise was what helped. And not just a little bit, but exercise until you can't do it anymore, until you are exhausted past exhaustion. At some point during that exercising (a long run, lets say), your brain will shut down. It's a natural response, a focusing of energy, if you will. Your brain will stop with the thoughts and the turmoil and it will focus everything it has on putting one foot in front of the other, or lifting that next weight, or climbing that next stair.

And then, when it is done, you'll get that little natural endorphin release and maybe, just maybe, you'll feel normal for a few minutes.

I know it's not much, but it's what I got. There are no magic pills or special tricks to this stuff. If your mind won't stop, if the depression and whatever is getting the best of you, if you're having trouble sleeping, exercise.

And like I said... not just mild exercise... do it until you can't do it anymore. It helps. It really helps.


Me: BH, 36
Her: WW, 37
Two girls 8 & 10
Married 12 years
Dday: July, 2009

She wants answers... I'm still trying to figure out what the questions are.


Posts: 269 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: Maine, USA
rachelc
Member
Member # 30314
Default  Posted: 5:47 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

awesome post, Sal.
it IS a dealbreaker, for most people... sometimes the BS is pretty PA about letting us know though...


his Ddays: 2/10, 7/11
my Ddays: 1/12, 4/12 broken NC 12/12

me (WW/BS): 48
him: (BS/WH)52
4 kiddos in mid 20's

Me: I didn't sign up for this.
Him: you're already in this. All you can do is resign...


Posts: 4779 | Registered: Dec 2010
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 6:58 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

I'm a PT/DT instructor for my dept but when this happened I stopped. I miss working out and your advice is right on. I shifted my focus on making everything right and never continued to help myself. Thanks.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
jstbreathe
Member
Member # 40829
Default  Posted: 8:10 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Respectfully, if you don't mind me asking because my WH won't talk about it. Why don't you think of the possibility of losing your wife and devastating your family when you are taking those first steps down the slippery slope into an A? I don't understand how you can love someone so much, have a perfect life and happy marriage, and yet risk everything for someone and something that means nothing to you. I could maybe get that you have an extreme lack in judgement once, but then why stay in it? Why repeat it?
Regardless, I feel very sorry for what your wife, your children and you are going through. If I could give any advise from my own experience, I would say you need to make it all about her and her pain right now. Try not to focus so much on yours because right now she doesn't really care what you are going through. She is hurting so much right now that she can't help you. Help yourself by helping her. Try to be around, even if she says she doesn't want to see you. Just be available. Help with the kids, wash her car, fix things around the house. For me the absence just created more distance, and the more he was around the more I came around. Good luck,I wish you all the best.
BTW...There is a post "The Life Boat", I'm not sure how to find it, but it was very insightful. I have a copy which I sent to my WH, I changed it a bit by removing the abbreviations. If you would like it I can post it for you.


The trust of the innocent is the liar's most useful tool.
Stephen King
Me: BW
Him: WH
Married: 18 years
2 sons, 11&15
Trying to R

Posts: 149 | Registered: Sep 2013
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 8:27 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

You bring up great points about why. There is a long story as to why and what and it's something I learned not only from IC but from reading posts and looking at myself for a year. We did have the perfect marriage for a long time which is why this is so hard for Kate. Bc she doesn't understand why either. Even after IC/MC and talking it still makes no sense. Not to me either BTW. I make no excuses and have owned all believe me. No matter what the why's are there's never any excuse for straying. Period. Bottom line was I was selfish and had a total disregard for my family only thinking of myself. Something I will hate forever.
I offer to help every day. Between our two kids sports and just me coming around the house when she's not home to mow or clean or whatever I'm always offering. Cook dinner and leave before she gets home. Anything I can do to help I'm doing. And she's been great letting me do those things.
If you don't mind reposting that info that'd be great. I'll try/look at anything that could help. Thank you.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
ophelia24
Member
Member # 38438
Default  Posted: 8:58 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Hey Kroma,

I think what you are feeling makes perfect sense. Because when we actually have to face the consequences of our actions, it IS incredibly painful. Knowing that we have hurt our partners, children, family and friends with our selfishness, not to mention ourselves, is a sober lesson.

I wouldn't rush past the lowness you feel now. Because that is where you are at, and you are finally really feeling the true extent of your loss. And the loss is devastating. Feeling all this is what is going to change you. You will get through this, and eventually you will start to like yourself again.

Unfortunately, and as hard as it is, feeling the agony of your actions, the pain of loss, is the only way to getting into a healthier place. There is no going around it - only through.


ďLove does not begin and end the way we seem to think it does. Love is a battle, love is a war; love is a growing up.Ē
― James Baldwin

Posts: 255 | Registered: Feb 2013
ophelia24
Member
Member # 38438
Default  Posted: 9:04 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

...and if that means that this brings you to your knees with the enormity of it all, then that is where you should go.


ďLove does not begin and end the way we seem to think it does. Love is a battle, love is a war; love is a growing up.Ē
― James Baldwin

Posts: 255 | Registered: Feb 2013
jstbreathe
Member
Member # 40829
Default  Posted: 9:09 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Thank you for your honesty and insight. I guess that really does some it up... there just isn't a good answer for why. We too had what I thought was a wonderful life and family, it's so hard to believe this could happen to us. I guess that's what most people think though.
Anyway, here's the post...

Weathering The Storm

Batten down the hatches and ride out the storm. Anchor yourself and stop rocking the leaky boat.

First thing first. You blew up your marriage ship. It is dead in the water and it is your fault as the wayward spouse (WS). There is a life boat. You and your spouse escape the sinking ship in the life boat. Now, there is a storm of the century barreling down on your little life boat and you need to hang on.

1. There is no room in the life boat for the affair partner (AP). NONE, NO ROOM AT ALL. If you keep them in the life boat with you it is going to sink. If you throw them overboard and keep trying to pull them back in or they keep hanging on the side YOUR BOAT IS GOING TO SINK! The only way to get them out of your life boat is to tell your spouse everything, EVERYTHING. Timelines-to-toenails. Once that is all out in the open all of the extra weight in the boat is gone and you have a chance to survive.

2.Your betrayed spouse(BS) is busy. Your BS is bailing water like mad, trying to keep themselves from drowning in the bottom of the life boat that you have them trapped in. They canít stop bailing during this storm to soothe you, to comfort you, to make sure you are okay. Suck it up, man up, and help bail. They are in the boat with you, as long as they are in the boat with you then you have a chance. You have the chance to save your spouse and yourself. DONíT WASTE IT.

3.Your spouse is exhausted. The Storm drops down to a steady rainfall. You are in the middle of the ocean with no land in sight. You are both still in the boat. When your spouse canít bail anymore itís up to you to save you both, so start cleaning out the bottom of the boat. It will feel like you can't ever find the bottom, that the water just keeps rising. KEEP BAILING! Even if your spouse is passed out. YOU HAVE TO KEEP BAILING TO SAVE YOUR LIVES! This life boat is the only chance you are going to get to save your marriage, itís small, rickety, and leaking. Despite all of itís flaws this life boat is all that is saving you and your spouse.

4. Getting ready to work. The storm has passed, the skies are still overcast, itís cold, windy and miserable and you are still stuck in the middle of a turbulent sea with a spouse that doesnít trust you in a leaky, crappy little boat. You canít make your spouse trust you. All you can do is COMMIT to saving yourself and your spouse.

5. Prepare yourself first. Get it clear in your mind that you are in it for the long haul and reassure your spouse that you are not going to leave them alone in the life boat. EVER! You are going to stay in that life boat until your spouse throws you overboard. Tell them that over and over again. Let them know you are working your ass off to keep them safe. Your spouse canít help you. They are exhausted, wounded from the blast, battered by the storm. Asking them to help you would be like asking a Prisoner of War to fight for the country that captured them. It is just wrong. You need to gather yourself together. Rinse off the dirt and grime, find anything useful floating in the water that might help you fix the life boat.

6.Repairing the life boat. You need to find all the tools and material to fix the life boat. You may have to dive to the bottom of the ocean and salvage an old ship wreck. You may have to paddle your life boat around to find flotsam and jetsam to use. Start at the bottom. These tools consists of Councelling, Books, Self healing resources, etcÖ Use the tools and materials that are at your disposal to clear out all of the murky water and start repairing the floor of the life boat.

7. There is mud, muck, seaweed and dead fish in your boat.

****The dead fish have to go first. They are thoughts of the other person (OP). Why the hell are you missing them? If you miss them so much get a divorce. That is the bottom line. If you leave the dead fish in the boat, all that you are going to get is a life boat that stinks of death, decay and rotten fish. They were a anatomically correct life-sized blow up doll and they used you in the same way. Put them where they belong. Out of your thoughts.

****The seaweed is next. This in the idea that somehow your spouseís behavior before the affair added to the reasons that you had an affair. Yep, you heard me. The affair is 100% your fault. Is 50% part of the overall marital problems theirs? Nope. If your thinking was messed up and led to you have an Affair, it was and is probably messed up thinking about the dynamic of your marriage. You can become tangled in marital history and lose sight of what you are fighting for, and lose your commitment to saving your marriage.
Iím not talking about rewriting the marriage history to justify an Affair. Iím talking about subconscious blame shifting onto the normal problems that a marriage faces. Like when your wife didnít pay attention to you because she was too busy raising your kids.

Hope this is helpful. I will be praying for you.


The trust of the innocent is the liar's most useful tool.
Stephen King
Me: BW
Him: WH
Married: 18 years
2 sons, 11&15
Trying to R

Posts: 149 | Registered: Sep 2013
jstbreathe
Member
Member # 40829
Default  Posted: 9:17 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Oops, some got cut off.

****Muck is a little trickier to clean up. This is inside you. The whyís and reasons. Muck is slimy and has a tendency to slip through your fingers. Muck is the guts of your internal issues. Every individual is different, each individual has different issues, be they Family and Childhood issues, Drugs, Mental disordersÖ the list is endless. It is your job to find each slippery part inside you. Your BS canít help you do this. It has to be something that you do for yourself and by yourself. You can report it to your spouse or not, depending on what you are comfortable with. If you do share this journey with them make sure that you reassure them with each report that none of your issues have anything to do with them, that they didnít cause the issue, and that you donít expect them to fix it.

****The Mud. The mud has to be rinsed away. This is your self acceptance. Forgiveness if you like. Divine or from the self. Without forgiving yourself you will always feel dirty. I put the Mud last because without doing all of the work if you forgive yourself it is just cheap forgiveness. It is false forgiveness, a lie to yourself to make you feel better and to let yourself off the hook. Real forgiveness requires reflection, exploration of self, an intimacy with yourself, and understanding who you were then is not who you are now. (Changing who you are is more than an idea that you conceptualize, it is consistent action over a substantial time period. You know when you have achieved change when you actively are consistent and it becomes second nature to correct yourself before you step wrong, instead of stepping wrong and then fixing it.)

Your little life boat hits land. Whew, your both on solid ground again, but your legs are weak and shaky. All of the action, change and accomplishments that you have achieved at this point will help you. The sad fact is, all of the change in yourself that you accomplish may not save your marriage. Your spouse may not have waited for you to finish cleaning the boat. They may have jumped into the sea before you were done. They may have swam off into the sunset. If that happens, donít give up on yourself. Fixing and finding yourself will keep you afloat even if you are alone. Whether or not your spouse will brave this journey with you now is not your choice. Your spouse may choose to walk away. Solid ground does not erase the fact that you blew up the marriage ship to begin with. You owe it to yourself, if your wife, family and marriage is your choice, to commit to your marriage completely from the moment you climbed on board the life boat. You canít take a dip in the sea to test your BS and see if they really want you in the life boat. You have to stay the course. Tie yourself in. Even thinking about abandoning the life boat can sink it. If you are standing there rocking the boat, eventually you are going to fall out or knock your BS out of the boat. Will you just stand by paralized and watch her drown, or will you do everything you can to save her, yourself,your children and your marriage?

That means DO NOT say:
ďGet over it.Ē
ďItís been long enough.Ē
ďAre you going to punish me forever?Ē
ďDo you want someone else?Ē
ďMaybe you donít really want me.Ē
ďI should just leave becauseÖĒ
ďI canít change who I amÖĒ



The trust of the innocent is the liar's most useful tool.
Stephen King
Me: BW
Him: WH
Married: 18 years
2 sons, 11&15
Trying to R

Posts: 149 | Registered: Sep 2013
Deeply Scared
Administrator
Member # 2
Default  Posted: 10:32 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

jstbreathe...

That was an amazing post...thank you so much for laying it all out in such detail with so much emotion behind it.

Really great stuff


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 197359 | Registered: May 2002
badchoice
Member
Member # 35566
Default  Posted: 10:54 PM, October 15th (Tuesday)

Sorry you find yourself in the spot. I can relate.

jstbreathe, thanks for posting this. I needed to read this tonight.


Me: fWH/BH 46

Separated transitioning to D


Posts: 725 | Registered: May 2012 | From: L.A.
jstbreathe
Member
Member # 40829
Default  Posted: 6:21 AM, October 16th (Wednesday)

I love this post, it explains what a BS really needs. I did not write it however, it is a copy of someone else's previous post. I don't know how to find the original posting, but luckily I had copied it for my WH. It has great insight, I hope it helps.


The trust of the innocent is the liar's most useful tool.
Stephen King
Me: BW
Him: WH
Married: 18 years
2 sons, 11&15
Trying to R

Posts: 149 | Registered: Sep 2013
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 7:49 AM, October 16th (Wednesday)

Justbreathe
Amazing. I keep reading it over and over. It hits home and gives me strength to keep moving forward with the hopes that Kate will come along for the ride. Either way moving forward is the only way to go.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
badchoice
Member
Member # 35566
Default  Posted: 9:03 AM, October 16th (Wednesday)

Either way moving forward is the only way to go.

right there with you.


Me: fWH/BH 46

Separated transitioning to D


Posts: 725 | Registered: May 2012 | From: L.A.
Jrazz
Guide
Member # 31349
Default  Posted: 11:44 AM, October 16th (Wednesday)

Kroma, I've been reading through this post yesterday and today and I think you're getting excellent advice. I just wanted to say that you should be very proud of your outlook and gameplan. It's ok if it's still scary and hurts sometimes... just having the road map will make things easier.

Keep doing what you're doing - you're on the right path.

Sending strength.


It is better to be slapped with the truth than kissed with a lie. -Russian Proverb

Posts: 17066 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: California
jstbreathe
Member
Member # 40829
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, October 16th (Wednesday)

kroma, I hope your Kate will find it in her heart to give you a chance to prove what an amazing man you are, and how much you have grown. If not, be the amazing father you need to be for your children. They will benefit from seeing your transformation.
It's interesting to me how I can empathize with you, but have none for my WH. I guess it's difficult to feel empathy for someone who has caused you so much pain. Maybe this is where Kate is at.


The trust of the innocent is the liar's most useful tool.
Stephen King
Me: BW
Him: WH
Married: 18 years
2 sons, 11&15
Trying to R

Posts: 149 | Registered: Sep 2013
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 12:08 PM, October 16th (Wednesday)

I have to be honest. This post has helped me out tremendously. The advice has been great. And so is the support. I still have my moments but when I re-read the threads I know that what I'm doing is right. And the outcome is out of my hands. Do I pray everyday that she changes her thoughts? Or that she feels that our relationship (maybe not our marriage) is worth putting energy into? Of course. All the damn time. I love my family very much and would do anything for them. I'm sure there will be bad days to come but right now I feel positive thanks to you guys.


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
GraceRunner
New Member
Member # 39856
Default  Posted: 12:16 AM, October 17th (Thursday)

I think it is normal to grieve the loss of something so important. Be patient with yourself. You have received great advice on how to keep reaching out and moving forward while you grieve so that you don't get stuck in this spot. I am praying for you and your family.


Me - FWW, 38
Him - BS, 42
Married 15 years
2 young daughters
4 month EA/PA, DDAY 10/12

Posts: 39 | Registered: Jul 2013
undonelife
Member
Member # 38421
Default  Posted: 7:52 AM, October 17th (Thursday)

Krona, I'm a BS. I was struck by the post where you said your wife asked you to take your ring off, that it meant nothing to her. Have u heard the term "standing for your marriage"? I would say leave your ring on. It will remind her when she sees it that you still want the marriage & maybe it will help remind you if the AP ever tried to contact you or if another woman crosses your path who shows interest in you and you're tempted to return the interest. Look at that wedding ring each day & remind yourself you are still married and redetermine to do the best for your marriage. Even if she D's you & you still want to reconcile it doesn't have to be the end. If you are a person of faith continue to pray for her each day and for your marriage. Use the ring to remind you to pray & do the right thing. It may take years and she may be testing you to see how sincere you are toward her. But keep that ring on, pray & do all you can to be a better man. FWH & I are in R for about 7 months now & he's doing a ton of changing but I still don't trust him & still am not sure I want a life w him. It's very hard to even look at him some days. Your wife I'm sure has some of the same feelings.


Me: BS 53 Him: WH 51
M: 28 years
DDay 11/25/12 TT 9/9/13
OW:20 yrs younger McOW
Kids: 2 teens

Posts: 186 | Registered: Feb 2013 | From: Dark Hell
kroma
Member
Member # 39964
Default  Posted: 11:29 AM, October 17th (Thursday)

Undone
Here's a little back story about the ring. During our 1st R time period there would be days where she didn't put her ring on. When she was angry or feeling upset. That used to drive me crazy. I always noticed it right away and doubt about us would set in. Towards the end of the summer when separation was apparent she stopped wearing it all together. She also had mentioned many times that me wearing my ring bothered her bc I never took it off during the A. To her these particular rings are meaningless. There was a time when we talked about renewing vows with a different wedding day and new rings. Something I hope to do someday. So when she asked me to take it off 2 weeks ago I respected her wishes and did so. Subsequently she said that it made her feel better which is why I continue to not wear it.

As for the ideas you brought up I will say this. First the ring sits on my nightstand next to a picture of Kate and I when we were dating 20 years ago. I see it every morning and night and always gives me hope. Second one of the things I've learned in the past year is that I never had boundaries in our marriage. I was flirtatious often calling female friends "honey" or "babe". I came to find out from Kate that it always bothered her and gave her a feeling of mistrust. I don't do that anymore. I also now understand the importance of boundaries in a relationship. That being said if someone were to notice me not wearing a ring and showed interest I'm not concerned about how I will handle. I am 100% committed to R with Kate if given the chance. I know right now she hasn't given me any thoughts that this will happen. But until the D papers are signed (hopefully never) I will move forward for myself and hope and pray that she can come around. I will also attempt to not put myself in a position now or if we're together. I have no desire or reason to do it. That is not who I am. That is not what I'm about.
As for the OP I am not concerned at all. There's been NC since last November and I plan to keep it that way no matter what. She is part of the reason I lost/hurt my family and quite honestly am a little repulsed by her.
Lastly Kate is the same as you in that I am the trigger. At least for now. I'm hoping time will heal and only good thoughts will run through her head when she sees me.
I appreciate your thoughts about the rings but I think Kate feels better, regardless of us together or not, that I'm not wearing it. But trust me. It's hard not too. I hated taking it off but I feel better knowing this makes her feel better. Even if it's only a little.

[This message edited by kroma at 11:32 AM, October 17th (Thursday)]


Me WS 44
Her 42
Kids x2 G-13, B-11
Married 16 years
D-Day 09-30-12
R for 10 months
Separated 09-01-13

I will never give up on my wife. Never. I will love her forever....

The best thing about the future is that it comes one day at a time


Posts: 88 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: new york
Topic Posts: 32