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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men Part 20
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 3:41 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No way I could be in Milwaukee and no have a beer.

I'll be danged!
Tred says that about every city he visits!


Posts: 6570 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
numb&dumb
♂ Member
Member # 28542
Default  Posted: 4:01 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Why do I suddenly get the feeling Tred drinks more than he lets on . . . .

Not judging or anything. just sayin'


Me-35 her-35

DS 1, DD 6
Dday 8/31/11. ONS that occurred 3 years earlier. Lied to for 3 years.

Every truth comes to light in a long enough timeline.


Posts: 2554 | Registered: May 2010
Adeahan
♂ Member
Member # 43005
Default  Posted: 6:33 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Liquid therapy tonight i havent really drank (to gt drunk anyways( since DDAY soi think i deserve one, im in the comfort of my own home, why not.


SWAT i just want tosay i have been keeping up with your posts and they way you have been handling yourself through all of this has been an inspiration, you are a good guy and i wish you the best :) same with all of you, its shitty how we had to meet but im glad i found this place.

FOOD!

[This message edited by Adeahan at 6:34 PM, May 21st (Wednesday)]


Me 33, H 31,D-Day 03/30/14, Together 12 years, married 2, 3 kids, 3 dogs, Working on R
"nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ainít about how hard you hit. Itís about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward"

Posts: 138 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Ontario, Canada
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 6:48 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

n&d
I'm more worried about the "suddenly" in your post.

Ascendant - I'm glad you saved, & posted that walism to LS out there. It was what I was referring to @ being in his wheelhouse some pages ago.

It really is fantastic - because it suits us as men - to a "T"...the part about being all paid-up for past butthurts...why not? Just copy it again on here.
Like me swingin cats, it needs to be on every menz thread.

There's another one that I'm missing, because I'm not smart enough to, you know, actually copy many of the deep wisdoms we read on here - perhaps the originator can read this and respond?
It was about why we respond differently to the A, as men, bc it attacks our need for respect...something like that. It had us all nodding our heads, that's for sure. I need to get that. Hear that again.
Anyone?

I'm not being 'needy', am I?


Posts: 6570 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 6:50 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WHOA!
Are you a freakin cook?
Party at Adeahan's!
What are those green things?

Posts: 6570 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 7:13 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here ya go, JJ.

This one post has helped me more than any other, probably. I read it during those early dark days after DDAY.

It sounds like you're getting the right mindset after initially being bombarded with tons of bad advice. Which is not to say that it's *completely* horrible advice, because giving your WS space to feel safe enough to share the truth (as they see it, not to be confused with objective truth) is a valuable tool in, you know, getting information you can work with and base practical decisions on. It's akin, in my mind, to telling an average looking girl how gorgeous she is so she'll take off her pants. She gets a little of what she wants so you ultimately get what you want. If you keep telling her, "Eh, you're sort of average and I've had better, but it's not like my weiner will rot off from touching you."...that's probably going to end in a romantic fail. Same way if you blow up at your WW every time she says something stupid, insensitive, self-serving or Lake District caliber foggy. You can take all of those gems, put them in your journal and use them as excuses to forget your anniversary or her birthday next year. It all comes out square in the end.

I've heard on lots of other forums that you can't punish and reconcile at the same time. It's a popular theme, especially from WW's on those sorts of forums who want to blame their husbands' failures or the state of the marriage for their out-of-character behavior. I happen to disagree. You just make sure you don't call it punishment. Call it "acting from hurt" or "triggering about x", where x just happens to occur at convenient times for you. There's a driving need in a great many BH's to obtain some sort of equity out of this process, to level the playing field. This is usually dismissed with a trite "nothing is ever going to make you even, so get over it" sort of expression.

I disagree. Even is whatever you say it is. Some guys pursue that sense of justice with RA's. The outcome is rarely what they expect it to be in terms of satisfaction, so it is considered a fail. I think RA's are more a failure of imagination on the justice/vengeance scale, and that's why people tend to be disappointed by them. They don't truly address the need for equity. A big part of what galls BH's over time is the sense that their wife got one over on them, that she has access to all of this secret information, and he can never have it. He's supposed to become Mr. Emotional Transparency and a surrogate female BFF so she never feels unfulfilled again and gets the Best. Marriage. Evar., and thus be content because she's not going to cheat on *that*. LOOK AT HOW MUCH HAPPIER WE R NOW THAT YOU DO EVERYTHING I WANT AND R SO AFRAID OF MY WILD SNOG-SEEKING VAGINA THAT YOU WILL NEVER DARE FAIL!!!!

Which, of course, ignores the fact that most of us were pretty decent husbands in the first place. This is one of the major issues I have with most infidelity recovery philosophies. They imply that the BH must clean up all of his shit, every mean thing he ever said, every insensitive thing he ever did and convert himself into the emotional version of Fabio in a way that precisely fits his wife's taste...and her job is to stop fucking other people. As if her fucking other people was the only thing she ever did wrong in the marriage, while *everything* he did was wrong. People conveniently forget that for every WS out there with a list of grievances for their spouse's failures, there is a BS who has been married to that WS who has a list of grievances JUST AS LONG that we accepted, tolerated and loved them through in exactly the way they did not accept, tolerate and love us. Instead, our shit became the legitimate fuel to justify their behavior.

Hello goose, meet gander. If you make me pay (which you have, by fucking other people as a way of dealing with it) for everything I've done wrong, then you've stated definitively that the way relationships should work is that people make others pay for their failures. No double standards. Either that, or we have to agree that I have now paid in full for everything I've ever done wrong, and for the rest of our married life, you have to shut the fuck up about it, because I've paid. It's not my fault if your method of exacting payment didn't work for you. You can't expect me to pay twice.

Which is a really long way around of saying by focusing on you, on what makes you happy and what gives your life meaning outside of the marriage, is a really good start. I was so sick of reading about relationships, about marriage repair, about understanding love-fucking languages, knowing your wife's menstrual cycle, understanding her FOO, blah, blah, blah, by about a year out, I was ready to join a monastery. Or get an 18 y.o. girlfriend who wasn't old enough yet to realize how fucked up she was by being human. Toss up, there.

Instead, I went back to grad school for fun. Wrote a couple of novels. Decided I could play video games if I wanted. Finally bought MLB Extra Innings so I could watch all the baseball I wanted. In other words, I invested my energy in finding out what brought me happiness instead of burning myself out trying to figure what would make her happy, and thus make my marriage a safe place.

Because one thing I learned: when you like yourself and you like your life, one part of it (like your marriage) going into the shitter doesn't take away your joy from the rest of it. It gives you the objectivity to decide what you want to keep in your life and what you can excise because it's become more trouble than it's worth.

It is infinitely better to be married because you want to be there but don't have to be than to feel like you can't imagine a future where you're not married to this person. Working on you is a way of preventing those sorts of failures of imagination.

And working on you is not fixing those things your wife has identified as problems with you. What the fuck does she know? This is a woman who handles life's curveballs by doing impersonations of the Holland Tunnel with her vagina. She is not qualified to diagnose other people's dysfunctions, let alone yours, whom she has identified as someone who is worth, or deserves, to be traumatized and punished for all the things she doesn't like about you.

You work on the shit *you* want to make better about yourself. Maybe you want to learn how to shoot automatic weapons. Maybe you want to study knife fighting or get some cool ninja-hacking skills. Maybe you realize that you're not assertive enough in the workplace and need to work on speaking up for yourself. We've all got a list of things we'd like to try out, to see if the destinies fit, but we put them on the back burner once we got married, because we didn't think our spouse could handle something so radically different. Guess what? Now is your time to explore those things. What's she going to say? "Who you're becoming makes me feel scared and helpless, like I don't know (how to control) you anymore?"
Guess what, I had all of those feelings from you fucking other men, and I had to grow up and deal. Welcome to the adulthood club. You should be getting a beanie and vest in the mail shortly.
So that's what part of my process looked like.

We're six years out. Happily married. My wife has done a ton of work on herself. I might get into that later.

You heal. Life goes on.


I refuse to let a wound ruin me.
**Guts over fear.**

Posts: 2064 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:23 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BOOM!
brother thank you.
Thank you for saving that.
It's right. It's real. It's gold.

She cheated because of her own reasons, not yours.
It needs to be written down.
On the tablet of your heart.


Posts: 6570 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Adeahan
♂ Member
Member # 43005
Default  Posted: 7:47 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lol i love to cook, just for friends and family though, i never got into it as a job, just a hobby, maybe one day...

the green things are called Fiddle Heads, they are fern you can eat, they are one of my favorite veggies to make, just trim them and boil them and throw some lemon on, so good, tastes like a cross between spinach and asparagus.


Edit: you guys are welcome anytime!

[This message edited by Adeahan at 7:48 PM, May 21st (Wednesday)]


Me 33, H 31,D-Day 03/30/14, Together 12 years, married 2, 3 kids, 3 dogs, Working on R
"nobody is gonna hit as hard as life. But it ainít about how hard you hit. Itís about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward"

Posts: 138 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: Ontario, Canada
HeartFullOfHoles
♂ Member
Member # 42874
Default  Posted: 8:26 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SWAT, you have definitely done a good job handling all your recent troubles. It's good to see things may be heading in a better direction for you!

Regarding closure. I hate that word! I spend months in agony with WW trying to say goodbye to OM, helped her recover a few goodbye emails she had left in the inbox too long or some how trashed, had to see and listen to all the pain she felt saying goodbye. Where's my closure!

Ascendant, that was a good repost. I could be mistaken, but that sounds like something WAL wrote.

I haven't been on for a while. Went on a bit of a trip. One that I could have ended up not returning from. Time and other things along the way brought me back in a very different place so that's a good thing. Hiked over 40 miles in under 24 hours of walking with many 1000s of vertical feet change. No blisters, but ended up in the hospital with Rhabdomyolysis and a CPK level of over 13,000 (around 100 is normal). Lots of saline (6L a day) in the hospital, liquids to drink and stretching have me mostly back to normal. Though I'm still a bit sore. Going to get my CPK tested again tomorrow to make sure it's back to normal. They released me when it got under 1,000 and told me to drink around a gallon of water and sports drinks a day to finish off the cleansing.

A much longer story hiding in all this, but I need to go now.


BH - Divorcing
D-Day 4/28-29/2012
Two daughters in HS

Posts: 139 | Registered: Mar 2014
knockeddown
♂ Member
Member # 43090
Default  Posted: 9:00 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ascendant - thanks for sharing man.

I just posted this in JFO wanted to see what you guys had to say about it:

I was sifting through old photos and videos on my phone today, because my phone had reached its storage capacity. I looked back at the old me and realize how terrible of a husband and father I was at that time. I truly did put my priorities first and expected my wife to pick up the slack where I was lazy. I look back and realize how I was failing our marriage. Not in a "I am to blame for the affair" kind of way, but in a "damn, I really needed this to happen for there to be a wake-up call for me" kind of way. Seriously. I did.
I was just an 18-year-old, 3-months-out-of-high-school kid when we met. I never grew into a man. I leaned so hard on my wife until I couldn't lean on her anymore. Don't get me wrong, I'm no dead beat. I am getting my doctoral degree and I have had a lot of pressure on me in multiple aspects of my life. Classes at night and clinical training during the day. I was trying to work a total of 4 jobs (including my clinical work) in order to lessen the debt load of my schooling. I am a very driven person, but I took my wife for granted. I always felt safe thinking that she would always be there. Now she is not. I will never enter into another relationship and let my guard down with how I am treating the other person.

These are hard lessons learned. That marriage certificate made me complacent. It changed the dynamics. I always thought that we would be together forever. I guess I was dead wrong.

Feel free to read the rest of my story on my profile (beware, it's kind of lengthy).


Me- BS 27 Always faithful
Her- WS 28
2 mo.? PA
Married 5 years (lived together 9)
2-year-old daughter
DDay-3/15/2014
Separated - living apart

Posts: 103 | Registered: Apr 2014 | From: United States
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:06 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, no, it damn sure was WAL. I am in no way, shape, or form claiming credit on that gem.


I refuse to let a wound ruin me.
**Guts over fear.**

Posts: 2064 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 9:15 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That is classic WAL. Should be a sticky on the Menz thread. HINT MH...HINT HINT HINT. It would be nice to be able to manage our own sticky threads within the Menz thread for these classics since we can't bump posts. Just a thought.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3910 | Registered: Dec 2011
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:18 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tred-

I've thought about that, too, but I wonder how it'd work without it being it's own forum, no?


I refuse to let a wound ruin me.
**Guts over fear.**

Posts: 2064 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:20 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Unless the BM link we use now opens into a page with *just* stickies and one BM THREAD w/out the option to start a new thread?


I refuse to let a wound ruin me.
**Guts over fear.**

Posts: 2064 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 9:40 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

C'mon man...I'm a manager. I give vision - MH implements . If it was me though, I'd make sticky notes a subforum of the thread. Always the first post, could hold 1000 posts max. No commenting, just stickies.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3910 | Registered: Dec 2011
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 9:41 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cross posted - something like that.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3910 | Registered: Dec 2011
sunsetslost
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Member # 39885
Default  Posted: 10:12 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trunk full of curds. And 3 year old sharp cheddar. Grandpa Bob came through big time!

KnockedDown:
IMHO there's a fine line between self blame and applying lessons learned for the "next one". Just make sure you understand the difference.


Divorced 7/11/14. New Beginning on the Gulf of Mexico. It's real nice.

Posts: 747 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: The beach.
sunsetslost
♂ Member
Member # 39885
Default  Posted: 10:29 PM, May 21st (Wednesday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And read the WAL post until it sticks


Divorced 7/11/14. New Beginning on the Gulf of Mexico. It's real nice.

Posts: 747 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: The beach.
lordhasaplan?
♂ Member
Member # 30079
Default  Posted: 9:20 AM, May 22nd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SWAT,
Once you get out of the drama cycle with WW and POSER this is going to hit you harder than you even imagined. But I want to go back to something you said on one of your threads.
After spending time away and only seeing WW with or about the kids it really hit me. I'm alright! I will be alright no matter what happens. I will be a great father to my kids and if we divorce, I'm sure in time I can find someone to share my life with. Lots of you have said this and I understood what everyone was saying. But I didn't honestly believe it. So much of who I am is tied to my family. Being an only child of a single parent, my life was good. It was so much better when I meet my BIL and became friends, his family became mine as well. Later his little sister became my wife and the love of my life. I was very, very happy. Was life perfect, not by a long shot. I love my wife and kids and that will never change. Can I forgive her now? I'm not sure and just two weeks ago that hurt me immensely. Now I know it will hurt but understand I can still be happy on the other side.

Hold on to this, it will help tremendously. Many on here have been where you are, it took many like myself months to get to this mental place. Once you reach this place, really embrace that you are in control, you will be fine no matter what. That is when you can truly make a choice. This is important, making the choice to stay or go from a place of knowing your fine, you are able to take care and build yourself without a W. That was when I finally committed to R, when I made the real choice to stay not because it was comfortable, not because I was scared, not because I feared life without my W. In fact, I saw that I was going to be fine, I was strong. Then I made a choice, what I wanted on my terms.
The rollercoaster will hit you as soon as total drama island ends and things start to go back to routine. Hold on to yourself! the sentiment you state above. You will be fine, whatever path you choose.


D-day: 5/18/10, lies and TT till (11/26/10).
No life should be passively relinquished due to the toxicity of others and taking steps to protect yourself may very well be the most important steps you will ever take.

Posts: 1897 | Registered: Nov 2010
Michman
♂ Member
Member # 41322
Default  Posted: 10:08 AM, May 22nd (Thursday), 2014View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Happy Memorial Day gents. It's my Friday.

Please take the time to remember someone who gave their life serving their country.


Betrayal is the only truth that sticks. -Arthur Miller, lol, that's rich.

Posts: 57 | Registered: Nov 2013
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