During my affair, loving the AP and loving my XH were not mutually exclusive. I loved the AP when we dated, before I ever met my XH. When we had the A, I justified saying "I love you" to the AP by figuring that it had just never stopped.
I now know that I was not *acting* lovingly toward either man ("love as an action/verb" vs "love as a feeling"). Just because I felt it doesn't mean it justified having an A, and doesn't mean that it meant there were loving committed actions to back it up---there weren't.
As for whether it was forgivable: eventually it was for my XH, because we are R'ing. It wasn't the dealbreaker when we divorced---it was one of many. He simply didn't want to be married to me anymore if I loved someone else, and I can't say I blamed him. I sure wouldn't have wanted it, if the shoe were on the other foot. Does it mean anything when I say it to XH, after having said it to AP? I don't know. I want a relationship with him for a variety of reasons. I don't really care about "love" as one of them, anymore.
[This message edited by heartbroken0903 at 10:58 PM, January 18th (Saturday)]
Married 2.5 years
Reconciling after divorce
I don't know. I want a relationship with him for a variety of reasons. I don't really care about "love" as one of them, anymore.
I think that's a very interesting statement 0903. I think it is very mature and logical. I hope, in your case, it doesn't mean there is no passion.
what is love? It's easy to say, very hard to define. To my knowledge, the closest, non-emotional, definition is simply wanting someone to be in your life. Allowing someone to be with you.
so your statement is simply, you want him in your life. you have forsaken others for that position. I think you are correct. but as i said before, i hope you still enjoy his company and feel passion from time to time.
I don't pretend to know the ins and outs of my parent's marriage problems but my mum has been with her AP for twenty years now. I believe her A is what's called an exit A. My now step father has brought great happiness to our lives and I am happy to have three parents, although I was angry for most of my teenage years about how my mother conducted herself during her marriage breakdown.
I had a very brief A at the lowest point of my life. There is no excuse for it but in all honesty, the pain I felt as a child didn't even cross my mind. I was bound up in a bubble of selfishness, all I could think about were my own needs.
I am no longer in that bubble though and I am deeply sorry for my actions and the pain I have caused my family.
I am so sorry you find yourself in this situatuon, I can only imagine the pain you are going through. I hope your WS will show remorse in time.
Yes, you get it. And yes, we enjoy each others' company very much.
and you have to understand, I was giving an off the cuff clinical definition. Not everyone likes that.
This forum is for BSs to ask questions of waywards and for waywards to answer. Please do not engage in a back and forth dialogue in here. Thank you.
[This message edited by Bdell at 9:32 AM, January 20th (Monday)]
Women in LTAs appear to have had emotional reasons for their As, and I can certainly get that. In my WH's case, he says it was almost purely sexual. What is even more confusing is that he is a very intelligent man who says he never allowed himself to acknowledge how is A was impacting our M or how it caused him to become distant and withdrawn.
Of course, consequences were never considered.
On dday, MOW was thrown under the bus with little consideration for her well being, and seemingly without any sense of loss or missing her in any way.
It seems quite cruel. I am the only one who seems to have any compassion for her.
How can this be? Their relationship lasted for so long. How can he just put her out of her mind.
We recently had a conversation and WH told me that due to costly errors she had made at work, he had considered firing her. I asked how he could have done that while they were in a relationship. What would that mean as far as losing her as a sexual partner?
He said that wouldn't have bothered him. he did say though, that he would not have been the one to do the firing so perhaps they could have continued the A outside of the office.
Just seems rather callous to me.
Can anyone here relate to this?
Let me explain. I have emotional problems that I have never dealt with stemming from my childhood, but expanding well into teens. Emotional abuse, physical abuse, alcoholic parents, etc. Having never dealt with my trauma, I have instead created a long list of emotional defensives in life that I use to feel 'normal'. Booze, working 12 hours a day, the A, porn, etc. you name it and I was hiding behind it.
The fact my A went on for so long has nothing to do with an emotional connection to the OW. I didn't care about her any more that I had an emotional connection with the bottle of wine I was drinking on a daily basis and reflect on your question with the same sort of puzzlement, like "huh? why would you think I would be emotionally connected to the OW. What a strange thing to ask???"
This is all about using any and all external elements to hide from my real feelings and to NEVER face my fears. The A went on for so long because it worked in that regard and put a very low requirement on me to give anything back (it was on out of town thing that would come and go with travel) - real emotions were not required.
I hope it helps...
Thank you. Yes, it does help.
I've actually been thinking about your new set of questions all day and formulating my response in my mind. However, I am at work. I am unable to reply to questions/posts that entail long and detailed replies while I am working because I only have access to SI on my cell phone during the work day.
Thank you for your patience.
First I'd like to say that Authenticnow gave you great advice when she said that the answers to these questions are really only important to you and your R as coming from your WS. However, in the spirit of providing outside perspective, these are my thoughts:
What have you done, as WS's , to reclaim the love and desire that your affair damaged?
I'm not sure if you mean reclaim it from my XBH or reclaim it for my XBH. I'll answer both ways. From him: nothing in particular. If he loves and desires me by me being myself? Wonderful. If he doesn't? He's in the wrong relationship then. Seriously, making a play for a man to "make" him love and desire me is a.) for me, wayward behavior (even if it's with my x-spouse) and b.) beginning-of-a-new-relationship behavior, which for us was 7 1/2 years ago. As for reclaiming it FOR him: I work every day at loving him. We have some issues that we're constantly trying to work through; personality conflicts that cause some problems. In some ways, we are not right for each other. In other ways, we are. As I've posted elsewhere before, I have determined that, for me, the ways we ARE right for each other overrule the ways we are not. As such, I work every day to love him by actions and show him the feelings of deep affection, friendship, caring, and concern that I define as "love."
How can you, after sleeping with another person, prove that you have ***any*** desire for your spouse,
I emphasized the word "any" to focus on it here as I broke your question into parts. I don't think having had desire for the AP during, and, yes, before my A means I didn't have any desire for my spouse...any more than having desire for my spouse means I was unable to have desire for the AP. Yes, obviously the fact that I was married and had vowed to "forsake all others" meant I wasn't *supposed* to have that desire---or at least act on it---that I was grievously wrong and immoral to have acted on it or given it any further thought beyond the passing---but I certainly don't believe that, simply biologically speaking, having those desires for more than one person is impossible.
that you desire them above the AP, and be believed?
Because we were completely apart for the first 2 years we were divorced, we were never at a point in our reconciliation where I was concerned with whether or not I was believed---and especially with regard to the point above.
And We are talking sex here, not relationship.
I just wanted to add something here about this. Sex used to be very important to me. I put a very high value on it, for reasons both healthy and unhealthy. However, it is no longer of much importance. I understand that for many if not most couples, a satisfying sex life continues to be a priority. To each his/her own. For me, it currently is not. Luckily, I have an understanding and seemingly like-minded partner.
[This message edited by heartbroken0903 at 8:48 PM, January 20th (Monday)]
Who initiated the R in your relationship and what caused that to happen? My WW had said previously that maybe we could be friends in a couple of years and I said no because it would mess with my recovery as she would have tried to change back to the person I fell in love with. I guess to me it seems unlikely that a couple could R after a divorce given what transpired. Thanks again for responding, it is appreciated! Having the ability to have WS's answer questions helps to try and help a BS when the other is unremorseful.
[This message edited by whereismylove at 2:19 AM, January 21st (Tuesday)]