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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men - Part 16
StillGoing
♂ Member
Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 7:58 PM, December 15th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Collector, let me see if I have this right here.

Your wife cheated on you with a friend of yours from work, but downplayed it and convinced you to remain friends.

It then turns out she cheated on you with this same man again.

She had unprotected sex with both him and you within a 12 hour span and got pregnant, and you were basically tortured by not knowing who the father was for the better part of a year at the very least.

Despite all that, she continued to find ways to remain in contact with him.

NOW she's writing a fucking novel about it, in the supernatural teen romance genre (disturbingly that has its own shelf now) - and the theme is about the female protagonist, torn between two very different men.

At what point do you think you will allow yourself to feel really fucking angry about that guilt-free? When she includes pictures of herself rubbing a disembodied zombie dick on her cheek in the graphic novel release? What she is doing is thoughtless, selfish and cruel on top of the inherent insipidness. You don't have to be supportive of that shit. She could have written damn near anything but she chose to deliberately romanticize her affair and ask for your input. Sir, fuck that noise. IMO you are well within reason to tell her you don't like it, want to read it and why. If she wants to carry on with it that says volumes.


“Fate is a fickle bitch who dotes on irony.”

Posts: 7110 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
TheCollector
♂ Member
Member # 38890
Default  Posted: 10:56 PM, December 15th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yes she is a sahm. We have our daughter who is now 18 months. Her nephew who is almost 4, and her mother who is supposed to be getting her life together because she went through a divorce.... I'm the sole income and we are surviving but that is all. No savings.... My story in my profile was written a good long while ago. I was just too lazy to retype it on the phone to today's standards. That is how she acted then. Now she has really been trying for the most part. She asks me oftenif I want to talk about anything and I just tell her no I'm fine. She tells me all the time how lucky she is to have me and she loves me soo much. I'm the one that pushes away and I think that's cause with everything she has told me I still know she is minimizing and withholding info. Makes me not want to talk. Took me a year and a half to get her to admit that it was consensual.... To be honest I think I'm really only here till a really good strong bond is established with my daughter...

And stillgoing if only I knew then what I know now..... That's honestly all I can say. I was led to believe and she still swears it was one kiss the first time.... And the post Dday contact lasted 2 weeks and you make a great point. I am going to tell her tonight that I want nothing to do with it. I know what she will do. She will pitch a small fit then delete it and vow never to write anything again.


Infidelity really IS the gift that keeps on giving...

Posts: 62 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: thecollector
sunsetslost
♂ Member
Member # 39885
Default  Posted: 11:13 PM, December 15th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Collector, i read your profile. I don't know how you fellas with children do it. I'm going to PM you. We can talk anytime.


D Day: 6/13/13
Moving on. Every Single Day.

Posts: 490 | Registered: Jul 2013
TheCollector
♂ Member
Member # 38890
Default  Posted: 11:30 PM, December 15th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sounds good sunset.

And the simple and the answer is...well cause we have to....for them.

[This message edited by TheCollector at 11:31 PM, December 15th (Sunday)]


Infidelity really IS the gift that keeps on giving...

Posts: 62 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: thecollector
nuance
♂ Member
Member # 28793
Default  Posted: 11:33 PM, December 15th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

She will pitch a small fit then delete it and vow never to write anything again.

Collector, in this case you ask her if you can delete it instead. For "closure".


Dday May 2000. R'ed.
People suck.

Posts: 1159 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: California
Brandon808
♂ Member
Member # 35619
Default  Posted: 12:27 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Collector this...
She will pitch a small fit then delete it and vow never to write anything again.
...is completely on her. Reactions like that show she is not capable of seeing your POV, your pain, at all.


xBH
D final 8/2012

Posts: 3365 | Registered: May 2012 | From: southeast
Thefly559
♂ Member
Member # 40268
Default  Posted: 5:03 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hate to get off topic gentlemen. But I will without a doubt buy the beer. Actually I think this is a great idea to once a year pick a spot and everyone chips in like 50 bucks and we meet up for a get together. Gives us something to look forward to something like guys night out , maybe a card game or something. Ok ok. I'll bring the entertainers. ( strippers) lol.

So I was talking to abbondad and he suggested I post this question here because I am having a really tough time getting away from these nightmares , almost every night I wake up , often crying still after 8 months ? They seem to be getting worse as I go ? Maybe it is the pains last ditch effort to stay before I release it all? Maybe it will never go? I don't know ? But I figured I would pick the brain of some of the experts on if it is normal and when and how to get them to stop ? Or is it just a passing stage I have to live through as I have all the others?
Thank you in advance and looking forward to that once a year get together in a sunny hot spot , maybe Florida or maybe we can change it yearly so we can vacation too.


"what does not kill you , makes you stronger"

Posts: 580 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: nyc
Justgreatnews
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Member # 41666
Default  Posted: 6:46 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dang, talk about living thru stages....Its been 3 weeks since I found out about this distant past affair, and I'm really no better at all.

She's been great, sweet, anything you could ask, but I still blow up at her daily. I've laid everything from anger to dismay to disgust on her. At least I can sleep most of the night now, though.

Anytime I get feeling normal, I get an image in my head of them with their hands on each other and go right back into the dump.

That's why I so badly wanted to get my hands on him. What a slimy coward. At least when I called him he had was off guard, with the speaker phone on and some associates in his office. He started off thinking it was a joke, then backed into the deny, deny mode. By the end, it was obvious the jig was up and he was panicked.


Posts: 261 | Registered: Dec 2013 | From: United States
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:38 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

NOW she's writing a fucking novel about it, in the supernatural teen romance genre (disturbingly that has its own shelf now) - and the theme is about the female protagonist, torn between two very different men.
Why IS this a genre all it's own? It's not a new trope by any means, the 'torn between two different men' idea, but why is women's literature?

That's not to say that the idea is solely confined to chick-lit, I'm sure there are examples of it in men's literature, but I can't think of any off the top of my head. I'd say more often, the women in books aimed at men are *at most* an afterthought. They tend to exist as one of the rewards for being so *awesome* or having an adventure, or as one of the obstacles to a man's greatness. Not that it's any better or worse as an idea, just curious about the differences and why they exist.


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1604 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:47 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In response to your situation, Collector:

Actions, not words.

It sounds as though your wife is saying all the right things. Which, frankly, is the easy part of all this. If she can't see past the tip of her nose and imagine that a story about some poor woman torn between two men would be potentially hurtful to you, then she's not really all in at this point.

I don't really employ this all that often, but I think this is the perfect situation for a 180. Live your life, stop paying attention to whatever it is she's doing. Whether she wants to write one book, a trilogy, or an anthology that brings in gargoyles, were-bears, and cameo appearances from the cast of 'Glee', just ignore it. I'd advise you to stop playing the role of supportive husband... because, well....it didn't work out so hot for you the first two times through.

Work on finding out what makes TheCollector happy as a man (and father, to be sure). Stop devoting so much head space to what's going on in between your wife's ears. Take care of your responsibilities as a member of the household and father to your kid, sure...but outside of that? Pick up a hobby. Watch some TV. Hang out with some friends. Get a life outside of your wife's role for you.

ETA: There is a very strong possibility that your wife (and her mom) is going to get all squirmy and cranky and generally act like a baby once you stop caring what she's doing all the time and focus on yourself. That's fine. I mean, really, what does she know? To rip off another WAL-ism, this is a woman who handles life's curveballs by doing an impression of the Holland tunnel with her lady parts...meaning, she's not qualified to tell you anything about what being a safe and stable partner is supposed to be....and my guess is that's par for the course for her mom as well.

[This message edited by FacePunched at 9:52 AM, December 16th (Monday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1604 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
DefeatedDad
♂ Member
Member # 41026
Default  Posted: 10:55 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hate to get off topic gentlemen. But I will without a doubt buy the beer. Actually I think this is a great idea to once a year pick a spot and everyone chips in like 50 bucks and we meet up for a get together. Gives us something to look forward to something like guys night out , maybe a card game or something. Ok ok. I'll bring the entertainers. ( strippers) lol.
So I was talking to abbondad and he suggested I post this question here because I am having a really tough time getting away from these nightmares , almost every night I wake up , often crying still after 8 months ? They seem to be getting worse as I go ? Maybe it is the pains last ditch effort to stay before I release it all? Maybe it will never go? I don't know ? But I figured I would pick the brain of some of the experts on if it is normal and when and how to get them to stop ? Or is it just a passing stage I have to live through as I have all the others?
Thank you in advance and looking forward to that once a year get together in a sunny hot spot , maybe Florida or maybe we can change it yearly so we can vacation too.

Im a year and a half out from D-Day and it does get better but not much. I still have the nightmares three to four nights a week. Some of them are doozies.

My fWW does what she can. She will wake up and rub my back and tell me she's sorry. I go bacok to sleep and I'm usually okay.

They say it takes 3 to 5 years to get past the worst part of infidelity, but I have talked to BSs who are ten years out and who still trigger from time to time. So settle in. It is going to be a long ride.


Me - BS 46
Wife - WS 44
Son 13, Daughter 17
Married 22 years
D-day May 16, 2012
TT D-Day 2 9/25/17
TT D-Day 3 1/02/14

Divorcing her sorry a--.


Posts: 217 | Registered: Oct 2013 | From: New Mexico
nomoreplease
♂ Member
Member # 32755
Default  Posted: 11:11 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't wanna seem like an unsupportive dick husband

Another relevant WWS…

Yes, because part of remorse is recognizing that the way they viewed the marriage (and the BS) was a delusion created to justify the sort of bitter, resentful thinking that led to the A.

(It was, in essence, lazy stereotyping because they didn't want to actually accept the validity and sovereignty of another human being in the relationship.)

That's why whenever a WS shows up here and spends more time talking about their BS and how their BS isn't following the R script or otherwise doing the things the WS wants or expects, I know they're full of shit. Because their spouse still isn't a real person to them -- they're a cardboard cutout who is refusing to follow Little Miss Princess's script.

In situations like that, a BH committed to staying and reconciling is best served by acting as unpredictably as possible on a regular basis. You force her to accept you as your own agent outside of her control. When she makes it clear what she wants or expects as her conditions of R, do some of them and completely ignore others. Pick up new hobbies. Build a life that doesn't include her. Force her to deal with your reality instead of her fantasy of you.

Oh, she'll be a bitch about it and accuse you of game-playing or whatever. Just recognize that she's trying to get you to go back into the cage where she wants to keep you.

Ever wonder why princesses always have unique names, but Prince Charming just gets a generic title? There's some deep chick psychological insight there.

(BTW, most of the content in this post is directly attributable to LadyV, who first developed this theory. She used to always say that the most useful thing a BH could do after D-day was to rock the princesses's boat to constantly remind her that she's not the hero of this fairy tale -- she's the evil witch. She's Ursula rather than Ariel. The step-mother rather than Snow White. Because in all the stories, the true princess is virtuous above all, whereas the wicked other is grasping through connivance and lies for external validation of beauty, youth, and power.)



'one walks away saying "I fought to save God's ideal," and the other must always admit, "I fought to destroy God's ideal!"'

Posts: 343 | Registered: Jul 2011
numb&dumb
♂ Member
Member # 28542
Default  Posted: 11:41 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

almost every night I wake up , often crying still after 8 months ?

I found that if I got a release out of my system before bed, it helped. Melatonin supplements help too.

Angry exercise fit, writing a letter to your WW, watching a sad movie and letting yourself cry. Breaking things in a safe way (buy some old dishes and smash them in a garbage can) Venting on SI helped me too. Chopping wood. Heck anything to give your mind a break. Taking a 10 minute break everyday can work too. Schedule it, keep doing it for whatever you are thinking at the time.

Sadly processing it is the only true way to help stem this. Processing is highly individual. Meds can help too. Tell you GP and be honest about the about why. (trust me they won't judge you)


Me-35 her-35

DS 1, DD 6
Dday 8/31/11. ONS that occurred 3 years earlier. Lied to for 3 years.

Every truth comes to light in a long enough timeline.


Posts: 2457 | Registered: May 2010
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 11:53 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Anyway, has anyone managed to get any satisfaction out of the other man?

You wont get any satisfaction at all from the OM.

OM is safe from me only because Im to dumb to figure out how to not get caught. My freedom is more important than any sort of sweet revenge.

Size or ability of the OM would not make a difference. WWs OM is military trained and a vietnam vet. But Im military trained as well and have much nastier abilities than he can even dream of. If it were otherwise and if I were inclined to want to hurt him a bullet in each knee would definitely equalize things.

OM did contact me by phone some years after Dday. Me and WW had moved back to a city near to where he lived. (on dday we lived 2000 miles away from him) He called and said that he had hired a lawyer and given him all the details of his and WWs affair. And should anything happen to him that the lawyer would tell the police who to go after for the crime.

I just laughed at him because if I really had it in my mind to hurt him. He would have just disappeared and would never have been found. If it came to that I would not care about the consequences at all. Still though I suppose this phone call indicates that he was indeed worried.

In the end though I am not going to ruin my life just to give some payback to a worthless piece of shit as OM.

I have told WW that if she still has feelings for OM that she should just GO. GO to OM and have a nice happy life together. We split 50/50 everything and thats that. GO and have a happy life. Frankly I would prefer it if she would just do that.

Personally I just want to enjoy whats left of my life. Create some good memories to take with me into the here after. WW will definitely not be among those good memories. I have started going my own way and following my own interests. Making my own life better with out much thought of my WW. Her life experience is her business and responsibility. Not mine.


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
bobf
♂ Member
Member # 41412
Default  Posted: 11:57 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Have you ever felt like knee-capping someone with a Louisville Slugger? (I prefer a 34 oz-31 in myself)

I won't do it, but the main object of my wife's OEA I found out last week looked her up on LinkedIn and read her profile. She really hasn't used her LinkedIn profile for months and it was an action that I took that got her to go look at it. My wife notified me as soon as she saw it and we talked and I deleted her LinkedIn account right after that.

The bastard had agreed to not contact her. He didn't "contact her" but he sure as hell was sending out feelers because in LinkedIn (unlike Facebook) it shows you the profiles of others that have viewed your profile. So she would know he is out there and interested.

I trust my wife, but still it was upsetting and made me think about baseball and kneecaps.

I am still proceeding about contacting the other BS and have her home phone number but have not been able to catch her home (I suspect she works). Now working on getting a work email or phone number.

I was hesitant before about contacting the other betrayed spouse but once I saw that this guy, let's call him Vermont Guy, was looking for my wife after the NC was in place, it's no holds barred now.

(Disclaimer--I will not kneecap anyone--just saying I was upset).

[This message edited by bobf at 12:00 PM, December 16th (Monday)]


Me: BH early 50s
Her: fWW late 40s (kmom2662)
7 Wk OEA, Skype, Cyber
DDay 10-4-13
Married 20+ years
Currently in R

Posts: 142 | Registered: Nov 2013
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 12:13 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A hammer is a better tool for kneecapping. You get a couple of friends to go to his house with you. Knock on the door. He answers and your friends grab him and hold him down while you shatter his knees.

He will remember you with every step he takes for the rest of his life.

Dont do it. To much chance of getting caught. And you get your friends tangled up in your mess.

Honestly I think the best revenge for me would be for WW and OM to end up together. They deserve each other.

Contact OMs BH and let her know of the break in NC. Does she already know of the affair?


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


Posts: 3086 | Registered: Sep 2007
StillGoing
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Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 12:30 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Why IS this a genre all it's own? It's not a new trope by any means, the 'torn between two different men' idea, but why is women's literature?

That's not to say that the idea is solely confined to chick-lit, I'm sure there are examples of it in men's literature, but I can't think of any off the top of my head. I'd say more often, the women in books aimed at men are *at most* an afterthought. They tend to exist as one of the rewards for being so *awesome* or having an adventure, or as one of the obstacles to a man's greatness. Not that it's any better or worse as an idea, just curious about the differences and why they exist.

Sub genres constantly develop around interest. "Paranormal teen romance" is a current popular mix drawn from sci fi/fantasy, young adult and romance; given the romance part it aims at the teen girl demographic, raking in the 30-40's age bracket of SAHMs.

You're right that women in a lot of fiction aimed at men are eye candy and toys. Robert E. Howards Conan had himself a different gal at the end of each story with two exceptions AFAIK - one was a pirate queen who was not just sexy and horny but totally badass, and the other was the princess he rescued in Hour of the Dragon and I think he settled down and married her or something.

That's to be expected though. Conan stories are the male version of romances. They're fantasy fulfillment about being strong, smart, and all around awesome. Stories like LotR lacked strong female roles because they were set in an environment that mirrored a mythological Earth where social functions were clearly defined in many ways. Even there the shieldmaiden Eowyn was pretty fucking amazing, and not just cuz she was a pretty girl:

And she's very much the product of her mythology. Comparative female hero figures would be someone like Brynhild, who was the original Sleeping Beauty only she was a Valkyrie that defied Odin so he stripped her of being a Valkyrie, still liked her a bunch and gave her one boon, she said Let Me Marry The Best AlphaMaleDudeBroEVER and so he stuck her in a house surrounded by magical fire and put her to sleep to be awakened by Baddest Mofo Ever, Sigurd who totally fucked up a dragon by lying in a ditch.

Badass as they are they are still supporting roles because that is generally aimed at dudes. I think Blue Sword and Hero & The Crown are pretty fucking epic, but the main character is female and so as a heroic fantasy it's not a couple of books you hear about as often as, say, Magician (Riftwar); the main characters in Magician are guys.

So with the popularity of VAMPIREZ OMG on the rise it was a pretty safe bet Paranormal Teen Romance was already occupying vast tracts of L-Space and when it popped into existence it was as if it had always been there. In the end it's the same exact thing from a different angle: wish fulfillment fantasy.

Which is why writing a book about your affair with your AP as a sympathetic love interest and asking your husband to read it and be supportive is really fucking vile.


“Fate is a fickle bitch who dotes on irony.”

Posts: 7110 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 1:12 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hot damn. SG, you nerdy, nerdy bastard. Youz tha best.


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1604 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
bobf
♂ Member
Member # 41412
Default  Posted: 1:14 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Razor

The other betrayed spouse, the wife of Vermont Guy, does not know of the affair. It was an online affair, my wife and her husband met through Dreambooks: Adult Pen Pals. I was able to identify the guy quite quickly (see my profile for the F-ed up way I discovered who he was--I still have nightmares).

I know their home phone number and have tried to call the wife while Vermont Guy is at work but no answer. Either she doesn't pick up or works a similar schedule.

I am working on getting her work phone number and email.


Me: BH early 50s
Her: fWW late 40s (kmom2662)
7 Wk OEA, Skype, Cyber
DDay 10-4-13
Married 20+ years
Currently in R

Posts: 142 | Registered: Nov 2013
Razor
♂ Member
Member # 16345
Default  Posted: 3:50 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

One thing that always bothered me is the rush of many (not all) WW to want to get on about *fixing the M*. Theres always a disclaimer that the affair is all their fault. BUT. The M was awful and contributed to the WW having a affair. The BH is often listed as inattentive and cold. No conversation. No sex. Neglectful. And abusive (at least emotionally).

What I hear when this is said is.

O poor little victim me. My horrible husband abused and neglected me so I became so desperate for attention that I had a affair.

Such a common theme.

Horse shit. Really was the M THAT bad? You would think the H would have noticed. Funny how so often I hear that the M was 50/50 the responsibility of both. And yes some how MY 50 percent is larger than hers.

Before WWs PA started she was in a EA with her OM. I didnt know what an EA was back then. I had no idea. But looking back thats what was going on. At least 5 years of a EA. Then according to my WW. OM wanted to take their relation to the *next level*.

But during that EA. And actually for years and years before it. WW was a total shit in our M. She was demeaning. Verbally abusive. Physically to if you count the times when she deliberately went in and broke something of mine. She put holes in our walls throwing crap around the house.

And yet Im the abusive one? Im the one that caused the problems in the M?

WW used to complain about me working to much. Working late. But if you were going to be confronted when you went home after work every night with Medusa. Wouldnt you stay late? I admit there were a few times when I knew the shit was going to really start to fly when I got home (oftimes for no apparent reason). And on those times I would deliberately work late so she would be asleep when I got in.

So M problems contributing to the environment that made the LTA possible? Why didn't I cheat then?

[This message edited by Razor at 3:52 PM, December 16th (Monday)]


Forgive and forget = Relive and regret.


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