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User Topic: Long Term Affairs - Part 33
Stronger4it
♀ New Member
Member # 39372
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ok. I’ve been lurking for a while now. It’s about time I said hello. Some times it’s hard to jump in. And I wasn’t going to do it back on Part 32/page 35 on the last one. (though it is nice to see you are all still friends).

I will give you the cole’s notes of my story. (more details on my profile) Then I have a question.

I’ve been with my boyfriend for almost 20 years. We have a DD who is almost 10 now.
I found out about the affair November 13 2012. It had been going on for 2.5 years. So we are coming up on a year now. The first month was raw. The following months, until April were that special hell of false reconciliation. WS and his AP were still in contact, and he was beginning to start another one. So we decided to temporarily separate. June - September.

We were killing each other. We needed space. I thought I might fool around and quickly thought better of it. I told him I was going to flirt with men and see what happens. He took up with his AP again.

So in July I told him not to come home in September. He clearly could not stay away from her so why bother? Then things started to change. His head was emerging from his ass. He ended it with her. He wanted to come home. He stopped lying. (I could tell because he would tell me things that did not benefit him).

He is in IC. We are in MC. I think he is moving back in November 1st. And we have had some good dates, and sleep overs. We’ve also had some really good talks. We are getting back on track!

Lately I’ve been feeling much stronger. I know I can be happy on my own. That was never a fear I entertained. I would like to reconcile. And I have my ducks in a row, and I know what I will do if infidelity shows up again.

So last week during our session I suggested to the counsellor that WS do a timeline. WS gives me more details (not the gross ones) about how a co worker becomes a lover. That was the home work for the week. I did one too. Pretty easy for me because I keep old calendars. WS said he did not think it would be helpful, but because I asked him to and that I thought it would help me, he would do it. If we discussed this in session, it would not spiral out of control.

Yesterday at our session, I got the first year. And I feel awful. I feel sick. I have more pictures in my head now. And I’m back to square one where I ask over and over again; Why? Why? How could you?

I was hoping the truth would take away the lies. I was hoping exposing the affair to the light of day would diminish it somehow. I didn’t. I’m really really upset and I don’t want to know anymore.

How on earth is a timeline helpful? Did I miss the small print: “Only use under doctor’s supervision. Not to be used if suffering from LTA. May cause drowsiness.”

I can stop it. I can’t be forced to hear the details. But in the long run, do I need to walk through the pain?

Thanks for reading.


Me BS 46
Him WS 48
Together 18 yrs
Daughter 9
DD Nov 13/12
Today ?

Posts: 43 | Registered: May 2013
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 12:05 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

All I have to say on the debate is that there comes a point when RSEB had done all she can and it falls upon her H to find happiness or at least some state that is better than the one he is in. And he has to WANT it. You can only do so much. Leading a horse to water and all that. And it becomes tedious and boring for all those around. Yes, he may be depressed. Yes he may have issues. Yes, he may be unable to forgive RSEB. But in the end, he has to recognise these things and DO something for himself. Go to the doctor, go to therapy, read about forgiveness/acceptance/unresolved anger and put HIMSELF into recovery.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3327 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 12:27 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stronger4it – welcome to our corner of SI, a much calmer and gentler place to be for those dealing with LTA’s.

How on earth is a timeline helpful? Did I miss the small print: “Only use under doctor’s supervision. Not to be used if suffering from LTA. May cause drowsiness.”
Comparison. I tried to work things out myself. I too had calendars, fWH’s calendar, mobile phone print outs for about 8mths. I wrote certain dates to do with events or job changes. Golfing holidays he went on. I looked at spending, credit cards, bank statements. Which was difficult when he had a company credit card for the most part. Times when I was away. I wrote all of this down and tried to work out when the affair started and when he had last been with her. I needed to do this because I slowly (realisation was as slow as a dinosaur realises its tail has been bitten…..) realised that he was TT’ing me. I didn’t have SI to turn to and knew no one who had been through and survived a LTA. I felt very much alone.

TT’ing meant I needed information. He was lying and I needed the truth. Not details, I didn’t want details. I didn’t want to know anything about the sex, things they talked about, or day to day detail of their conversations. I wanted dates, places. I wanted to know just how often they were together, where they had been, how many times they had little sojourns away. He had been minimising and lying and I was fed up with it. So I gave him an outline (taking out what I already knew) and told him to complete his own. And……………………….. he lied. Well, omitted some pretty big things he could not possibly have forgotten. And minimised.

So, in the end, after two years and meeting MOW towards the end of the first year and her BH towards the end of the second and got a load more information, I wrote my own document. 37 pages. It’s my Truth. I don’t care what he thinks of it. He’s read it and the only response I had was about 5 minutes of him picking a few things that put him in a bad light. So I shrugged and left it. He has his version (whitewashed and hidden away in the furthest corner of his head) and I have mine (Technicolor Truth).

It takes time to come to terms with what has happened. I found out that fWH’s oldest BF from school and uni had a 6yr LTA and that explained his move onto campus (he’s a lecturer). His BW waited around and when she was about to take a job that mean a house move hundreds of miles away, he got his expansive head out of his very tight arse and said he didn’t want her to go, he wanted to recommit, retake their vows and move back in. Now, she knew nothing about the OW and didn’t want to know anything. Not even her name. Nothing. So that is her way of coping with it.

Each to their own. But having opened that Pandora’s box, there’s no putting it back.

[This message edited by UKgirl at 12:30 PM, October 25th (Friday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3327 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 12:40 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stronger

How much one needs (wants) to know about their WS A is an individual choice. Everyone is different. I learned most of the gory details and yes, it is still difficult for me to deal with them. For me, this is still much better than not knowing and wondering. And my WW does not come near your WS desire to attempt and repair the damage.

UKGirl.. good to see you !

H&C Land Update!!!
I have been hanging out in the D/S forum and have not kept up to date in the LTA. I HOPE EVERYONE is doing VERY WELL.

I have been working (negotiating) with WW on the divorce decree. Trying very hard to keep her out of fantasy land as I have ageed to split everything 50/50, pay all of the kids expenses, AND pay her the state guideline on CS. And she still asks for more - I am getting much better at saying no without anger and explaining why. We are close to complete agreement!

WW signed a contract today on a home nearby. the kids will be very close.
stbxww closes the first week of December so her move should be complete by the end of the year and 2014 will be a new phase in my life.

I have joined a local D/S support group and am shocked at the awful things others deal with in their M. I am also using the meetup.com groups in my area to get out to events of interest.

It has been a tough four years; two during WW LTA and the two post DDay trying to R. The D also takes an emotional toll. Financially, I will be ok but drastically different from my current state. This will be another major adjustment along with the complete independence and the difficulties with my vision loss.

So, I expect a difficult transition the next 6-18 months. Shedding the negativity that exists in my life today should be a real plus though.

Best wishes to all. Be safe! Be happy! Be healthy! Live with ease!

H&C


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
Stronger4it
♀ New Member
Member # 39372
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you UKgirl and H&C for taking the time.

The truth is, he had an affair. There was a beginning, a middle and an end. There are lots of lies too. Like a bag of nails. I'm not sure if I'm being beaten with it or just lugging it around.

At the end of the day if he is remorsefulish, and isn't actively minimizing his actions, the dates and times are not going to contribute to my recovery.

Maybe it's just that I have to figure out what I need to know. Was it, "where the heck was I when this was going on?" or "What did you say to yourself to make it OK to fall in love with someone else?". Or even "Why should I trust you again?".

I don't think the time line is for me.


Me BS 46
Him WS 48
Together 18 yrs
Daughter 9
DD Nov 13/12
Today ?

Posts: 43 | Registered: May 2013
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 1:31 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey HandC! Glad you are doing okay and the negotiations are progressing. You sound GOOD in your post.

Welcome Stronger4it. Feel free to chime in whenever. The debates get interesting on occasion around here but everyone is always willing to help.

As for details and a timelines it really is up to the individual. My STBXW never gave me all the details and each time I found out something new it set me back right to DDay. the pain didn't last as long but it reset the clock so to speak.

If your WS is truly remorseful now and you need to know perhaps having the timeline written out is enough. You can always go look at it if you choose to do so but the pain is there already from what you have read.

I just hope your WH understands that even 1 year out, new revelations to you are the same as hearing them on DDay and set you back. I hope you find what you need to move forward whether you keep reading it or not.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1566 | Registered: May 2011
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 2:34 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

do not have much time...

welcome stronger

as for your timeline hon...it really is an individual decision...i was one that needed to know everything, and never had it, for me it would have been him showing me who he really was, trusting me with his secrets, trusting me with all the information....and i needed to put the pieces of my life in some kind of logical order...there were often gaps in my marriage that knowing the full truth would have made my life make sense...

what i learned:

well he didn't trust me with his shit so i obviously cannot and do not trust him...its a 2 way street after infidelity

i also learned that i didn't need to heal, but i would if i wanted to heal the marriage..but that was what i needed...

there are others who feel just knowing that it took place and the timespan is enough

there are still others who want to know as much as possible, including what color underwear...i wanted as much of the stuff as he could remember but could care less what color underwear or even what type...no thats a lie....my ws had switched from tidie whities to colored ones and i needed to know if that was why...but i really could care less what underwear any of his ow wore...or even if they wore any

point of my longwindedness when i have no time...

only you could decide what you need to know to move forward and like someone said, once you ring that bell you can't unring it so make sure you really want to know...

gotta run


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 4:42 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In Yatzee, if you don’t like what you the first time, you can reroll. Working on R is a bit like this, a chance to change the M dynamics and get a better M going forward. The thing is, if you re-roll results in three 6’s and two 5’s you can decide to take it as a full house or use it as your 6’s, but no matter how much you wanted a Yatzee you don’t get one. At least not this round. Now 7yrsflushed is moving on to the next round and trying again, and iwam will be someday too, and we wish them well. But for some of us, our second roll is “good enough”.

Hmmm…hello gang…I have been reading the opinions of everyone here and have been following the discussion between Tryn and LifeIsCrazy. I have to say throughout my years here at SI Tryn was one of the first people that drew me to tears. Here was a man whose wife cheated on him for 9 years and he has worked extremely hard at being there as a man that a woman would find attractive. He has invested himself and his money in many therapies and books and Marriage Getaways. I believe he has reshaped his way of thinking into being what his wife would truly love, respect and admire. Does this mean he is in any way responsible for his W cheating? No, but I suppose in his travels he has reassessed what he believes his W wants and he is trying to make her happy, to make her feel sexy and to do what he can to meet her needs. Initially when he began his recovery (and I was not here for those posts or his thoughts) but I am sure some of those changes MAY have come out of fear of losing his M or his W. Now I believe Tryn stands in his life and in his M very securely and all he has learned has indeed become engrained in who he is.
LifeIsCrazy, I must say as you said when you first responded to my post this week, I did not know you. Tryn and I have PM’d and as he stated he did reach out to my BH to try and let him realize that he is not alone and there is help. That was this past April. Of course my BH was not ready and to join a group online is not really his thing, so I don’t know if he will ever respond.
But LifeIsCrazy touched me in much the same way Tryn did a year or so ago. When I read how you felt about your W and you wanted to give her a chance and TRULY let her in again to your heart, I was crying. I am so happy for both your wives. I ache to have my BH come to me with those words.
What I do know about my BH. I do honestly believe that he has seen all that I have tried to help heal him and our M. He is someone with the highest walls I have ever seen, however those walls were constructed long before I came into his life. My BH’s father was physically abusive to his Mom, he was in and out of prison and he disappeared out of my BH’s life when my BH was about six years old. When my BH was ten years old, his cousin (11 years old) was his best friend. He and “L” did everything together. I am sad to say she was brutally murdered at 11 years old. He has had a very rough life and his family was never close. His Mom was tough and the way I knew her before she died and from the stories I have heard from my sister in laws, she was not the most loving mother. When his mother got word that his Dad had died, due to drugs and alcohol, my BH was 14 at the time. His Mom came in his room, announced that he had died and not another word was spoken about it. His Mom died 2 months after we were married of cancer. It takes A LOT to get him to crumble. He is king of “stuff it down” and it will go away. He was not taught a soft place to fall. Then he and I met. I was 19 he was 21, and I was a mush. He and I would talk for hours. It didn’t take long for him to let me inside, so there he and I were inside those walls, until DDay that is.
So he has said that there is nothing else I can do. He says it is no longer about me and the A, but it is about him. He is not happy. He thought WE were happy. He wants to die. He doesn’t know how to be happy again. I have been hurting. I have felt him close for a day and then pull away again for about a week or two, this is not once in a while, this is a weekly/bi weekly occurance for FOUR years. I have held him when he cries, then I would start to cry. I have let him vent. I have taken the name calling, the yelling, the throwing things. Some things I know I shouldn’t have taken, but I also know the rage I have read about from others here, and in the beginning a BS is broken and hurting like anything they have ever experienced before, so I do allow latitude.
So here I sit at four years. I am a stronger healthier person. At about a year out after DDay, it would crush me that my BH would never say “I Love you” anymore. It crushed me. I became fixated on it. He would kiss me goodbye every morning while I was still sleeping and I would lay there waiting every morning to hear if he said “I love you” with that kiss, but it never came…it still doesn’t come. He has said it 3 times since DDay and those were very scattered. I became obsessed with it. I had written about it in some previous posts. Now that my energy and fight is dwindling it doesn’t bother me anymore. And then the fact that it didn’t bother me anymore got me thinking. Had I gotten to the point of strength of “something’s gotta give”? I couldn’t give anymore. I have tried. I am sorry. I am embarrassed. I have healed. I have ALMOST forgiven myself, but that is a tough one. But I can say that I have learned to live with what I did. But what I can’t keep doing is living with my BH who keeps pulling the rug out from me on a weekly basis. It is hard to live with the not knowing.
If he would have tried at some point in these four years. Given just a little. He is so fearful. He is black and white. If I even bring up pre A issues that I had with him, he flips it to saying that I am saying my A is justified. I tell him it is not, but he gets very angry. He says he gave me all he could and it wasn’t good enough. He just doesn’t hear me which is why I would love to go to MC on a CONTINUOUS basis. We need help with communication and his defensiveness and I still need help with my passive aggressive nature. I am a work in progress. Aren’t we all.
So after he read all your posts, and I emailed him LifeIsCrazy’s post…he texted me and told me he was ready to fight for our M. I was doing the happy dance. He came home from work and surprised me with my favorite chocolate caramels, which he hasn’t done since DDay. It was a great day 
Today, he is at work again. We have texted, but he seems distant again. I am scared. I am scared we Are still in his cycle and he is gone again. This has to end, this cycle he gets in. He should be home in a few minutes so I guess I will see.
Atsenaotiem, when you made the Yatzee correlation I wonder when you say all you wonderful ladies are willing to just be friends/roomates with your FWH’s, why is that? Are they not doing all that you need them to do or was their LTA an “emotional deal breaker” of sorts for you? I know myself, I love being affectionate, I would not be able to settle for that long term.

Yes my BH and I have a long way to go, in very many aspects he is still at the very beginning of his journey. If my BH is willing to take his first steps I will gladly run back to him at the beginning of his path and take it with him every step of the way. I’m just getting lonely here by myself.
UK Girl, I do know that my BH needs to come to acceptance regardless of if he can forgive me or love me again. He has had a lifetime of experience doing it oppositely. He does have to be re-wired. I do know last year when we went to a few MC sessions every other week for about 6 weeks he gave up after the third session and told me I could/should keep going because he was doing fine just “forgetting” about it, that MC was bringing everything back up. He finds it easier to hide from it then face it, but he is SO head on with everything else in his life. I do hope he can reach happiness for himself, and if I could truly get my wish he would find happiness WITH me.


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 4:44 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stronger-
About the timeline.

I got one from my husband and it was quite detailed in terms of where and when and what happened.

He and the MOW were co-workers and the majority of the time they got together at work conferences, conventions etc. and these were yearly events-easy to keep track of.

I needed all of the details.

I needed to know what kind of life he was leading while I I was living such a different life.

I also needed to know that my FWH was willing to be honest and transparent.And willing to do whatever it took to reconcile.

And finally....in my case I think it was very helpful for my FWH to see the timeline in black and white -right in front of him.

He was someone that compartmentalized the affair.
It was in a little box separate from the marriage.

And I think when you do that there is a tendency to minimize to yourself and be somewhat in denial as to how bad your actions are.

I remember a story of one BS finding old emails that the OW and her WS wrote to each other.
In one, the OW reminds the WS that they were coming up on the 3 yr anniversary of the start of the affair.
The WS replied that she was wrong. It had not been going on for that long.

The OW had to convince him that it had been that long!

In the end he said something like-that's not good.

This man had totally minimized the affair to himself.

So- I believe that writing out a timeline can be beneficial for the WS. It forces them to take a long , hard , look at themselves and their actions.

But, like everything, it is a personal decision.
Everyone is different.

It may not be something that you need to heal or recover.

You know yourself better than anyone does.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 4:45 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

h&c- good to hear from you!
You sound strong.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 7:14 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB-

Did your BH ever see a doctor for his depression?

Would he ever consider trying meds for at least a short time?

He just sounds so depressed.

After d-day I cycled through all the stages-anger, grief, shock....but grief was something that I kept coming back to. I was grieving the loss of the marriage that I thought I had.

I understand some of what your BH is feeling.Going to IC and getting on meds helped me to recover from the trauma of the infidelity.

I know I've mentioned it many times but there is a book by Dr. Ortman- Transcending Post Infidelity Stress Disorder and it describes the symptoms and reactions of some BS who suffer from PTSD symptoms.
I did. Ortman says BS with childhood trauma are especially traumatized by infidelity. It opens up all of those childhood wounds.
Reading this book was very helpful for me.

Perhaps it would help your BH?

It's written for BS -both for those that reconcile and those that divorce.
Ortman believes that either way the BS needs to deal with the trauma in order to heal.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 8:00 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

As I sit here with my jaw on the floor (and not in a good way) I figured I'd share the exchange my BH and I just had. He had come home from a bday party with our DS and I had gone shopping with our DD. I was warming up some dinner, he was on the computer. So he says he was talking to another Dad at the party about his son being on a wrestling team. I was just looking at him, kind of surprised because our son is somewhat shy and I don't particularly like the idea of him wrestling, this is the first time my BH has ever mentioned wrestling. So he looks up at me and says

BH "are you going to be supportive"

I just kept looking at him. He got a bit louder and repeated his statement with agitation, the kind of tone that was pretty much dictating to me that I had better say "yes" or it would be the wrong answer.

BH "ARE YOU GOING TO BE SUPPORTIVE!?!

So I say "If I was going to sign him up for ballet would you be supportive?"

BH "WHAT ARE YOU FUCKIN STUPID??"

ME "Mr. RSEB shut up"

BH: "WE ARE DONE TALKING I DON'T WANT TO HEAR YOUR FUCKIN MOUTH"

I sat for a few seconds and said Mr. RSEB we were supposed to discuss this and you tell me I'm Fuckin stupid?"

BH "I SAID WE ARE DONE TALKING AND I DON'T WANT TO HEAR YOU FUCKIN MOUTH"

And I haven't said a word to him since. That was about 30 minutes ago. He went upstairs now.

Yeah so this is how he is "fighting for our M" and yes these are some of the PRE A issues I have an issue with...go figure. BH argument will be that these things don't happen ALL the time...but to me the point is that they DO still happen and that is what makes me withdraw and go figure believe that he doesn't love me.

Is it me? Can someone actually love you and speak to you that way?


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 8:32 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB, does it really matter if he loves you or not? The question is are you willing to be treated like that? I hope not. You don't deserve it. No one does.
(((RSEB)))


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8949 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 8:35 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB-
Wow.
That was quite an outburst.

Did your children hear him speak to you in such a disrespectful manner?

That does not sound like a healthy environment.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 8:53 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you ladies...no they did not hear him...so he went up to the spare room...i just came from talking to him. He said I am selfish and I should have just given him my support. He had SUCH an issue with me saying ballet. It got very loud from there on both our sides. This is the unsteadiness in his reactions that I turned away and tried to ignore at times. And I dont want to paint a horrible picture. I would say in our almost 15 year M this has happened probably 50 times or so. But the problem is that I know if something upsets him he CAN go to this. I dont believe for a second that I deserve that kind of language but how does someone make him see that this was completely disrespectful. He says I shot him down when I said ballet that I was completely disrespectful to him. I dont know. I left him alone after I started crying. He's sleeping in the other room-his choice and he said he will be fine tomorrow. Great my Dad and brother are coming over tomorrow. I wony be fine by tomorrow and I am wrong for that too.


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 11:15 PM, October 25th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB, just curious, when your H first asked you the question, did you consider responding to his question with "I don't know, I'll have to think about it" instead of staring at him? Were u being passive aggressive?


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 791 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
RSEB
♀ Member
Member # 34728
Default  Posted: 5:57 AM, October 26th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

MC Jack

RSEB, just curious, when your H first asked you the question, did you consider responding to his question with "I don't know, I'll have to think about it" instead of staring at him? Were u being passive aggressive?

At the time, the way he phrased the question he said it with a tone that led me to feel that the only answer he was willing to accept was "yes". That is how I felt at the time, so I was trying to think for a few seconds, which is when he asked again.

Yes for me to have said "let me think about it" would have been a MUCH better reply. I do believe he would not have gotten SO angry. I cannot swear to it, since your instance did not play out obviously, but I do believe he still wouldn't have been thrilled with that answer either.

He did wind up coming back to our room last night. He asked me if it was okay for him to sleep there, I said yes. He then hugged me as asked me to forget everything he said last night. He said he says some stupid things and he DID tear at me quite a bit which led to my tears. So we went to sleep.

I did not think I was being passive aggressive. I did want to discuss it, eventhough I know our DS, he is VERY shy and he would never want to join a wrestling team. Sure my BH can ask him, but I know my sons response will be no. Our DS does play soccer, basketball and baseball. I am not anti sports as my BH would make it sound. I do realize that sports are VERY important to my BH, that is how he got through his childhood and he feels sports made him who he is today. But getting back to my son, he won't want to join, and I don't see why we should both approach him as his parents as he REALLY should do it. I have seen this play out before. My BH wants my son to do Karate, my son says no. I also chime in telling our son he should try it. He still says no, and then my BH gets aggravated/insulted that our DS does not want to do it.

My BH takes almost everything personally. He feels the kids respond and listen to me differently then they do to him. Like yesterday when my BH was taking my DS to the birthday party. Right before they were going my DS asked me if I was going. I said no, Daddy is going to take you. He whined and said "Mommy I want you to take me". My BH heard him from the kitchen so BH said "what I'm not good enough" and my son just shrugged his shoulders. I told my DS that he is hurting Daddy's feelings and it wasn't nice. But that was yet another example of how my BH feels left out...and of course that falls on my shoulders too.

We have A LOT of work to do


ME - FWS


Posts: 259 | Registered: Feb 2012
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:20 AM, October 26th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RSEB..

Sister’s post is most powerful..

RSEB, does it really matter if he loves you or not? The question is are you willing to be treated like that? I hope not. You don't deserve it. No one does.

I think your response was appropriate.. Except to the language in the last part. You cannot get rattled.


Me, “Look H, You are not going to treat me with that kind of language. When you calm down and can talk to me in a way a loving M is supposed to work out solution differences, Then come to me. I am going to read my book, when you are ready, you just let me know.”


In that way.. you do what YOU can do.. and that is how you train him how to behave.

IMO.. As I guessed, your man is not mature. His past, no doubt has been far from healthy. He has been through far more than the average man. It may be the reason but it cannot be an excuse.

His behavior is manipulative. And believe me, I know how to manipulate. In my job, I manipulate.

Sister’s post are very attractive to me. She is most quality in an area. “Be” like her is my suggestion. She does not fear and has courage. She makes an ideal partner.. She does not take being treated poorly. We all are not perfect. We get out of line sometimes. A good partner will put you back on the right path. Njgal has that too. Just because they have that, does not mean change happens quickly. It does take time. People learn with repetition.

Mc’s suggestion is one where you can sit back and think about how to respond. Not a bad thing to do at all. I know MC is of super high intellect on the norm chart. Be like him.. Methodical. Professor ATS is kinda like that too.. lol..

Obviously your H finds you very attractive by the way he ended the night. You can strengthen your attractiveness by behaving a bit differently. It is hard because when dealing with a man like your H, he leads you down that path of anger, frustration, etc..

Me, “DD, do you want to wrestle?”
DD, “yes”
Me, “As long as you want to do this for YOU.. Will it be fun for you? It is going to scare the heck out of me.”

Stronger4it..

BH said "what I'm not good enough"

This is the kind of thing a BOY says.. NOT A MAN. A man has behaved in such a way were no matter what his kids say… He knows he is the best and quality. He knows he is a good enough.. HE behaves such.. If he was a man, it does not matter what my kids think or want. He earned their respect. He does not need to “ping” his kids. He “pings” them because he needs that affirmation “that” much. Stuck in what can you “give me” rather than confidence in himself.

If I was in your shoes right now.. I might approach my W and say…
“Honey, I want and need us only use word that are good, positive, so we might get to a far better M. I want us both to remove all cuss words from our when we talk to each other and also others.”
“Do you want the same?”

IF he says NO.. then you have an answer.. This man does not want to behave quality. His choice. You must consider making someone like this.. no longer part of your life.

IF he says yes.. you both work toward eliminating those types of words. Life will be a bit more pleasant. Progress made.

Of course.. that will be just one of many things….


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 7:22 AM, October 26th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow, that was uncalled for. Why is he so ANGRY? He wasn’t up for a discussion. Besides, isn’t it up to your DS to decide if he wants to try wrestling or not? It’s not a case of you being supportive towards your H, but being supportive of your DS – if he wants to do it! It’s an argument without substance. It’s an excuse for an argument.

Personally, I don’t think I’d be able to put up with that kind of verbal aggression. I think he needs to learn other ways to vent his held-in emotional stress. And to see things from someone else’s point. The world does not revolve around him and the more he tries to make it so, the less he is going to succeed and the angrier he is going to get. He is in all kinds of bad cycles.

I'm truly shocked.

eta - Come back in to give you a hug (((((RSEB)))))

[This message edited by UKgirl at 7:24 AM, October 26th (Saturday)]


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3327 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:29 AM, October 26th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stronger4it.. Welcome.
Please jump right in..

I’ve been with my boyfriend for almost 20 years.
Why is this? A commitment can be a beautiful thing.

Some people who cannot commit think and behave.. I can cheat because the promise is not “a vow”. Therefore I can cheat… A M commitment does take it to a new level.

Me? I would not let him move back.. I might start thinking if someone is not able to commit in an official vow.. I don’t want that. He must want to commit..

And he may tell you he will commit without an official.. but what does that really mean?

Why does the gay community want M so bad? Think about it.. sure it is for fairness in government benefits... but it is far more about the other part.. the official commitment part.

[This message edited by trynhard at 7:34 AM, October 26th (Saturday)]


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