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User Topic: Long Term Affairs - Part 33
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 7:16 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome 3 Years

My thoughts are with you as this must be a very difficult time for you, especially as your DDay is so recent. Please lean on us during this difficult time.

Unfortunately, I am one of the BS on this forum where R was unsuccessful - but I will give you my perspective nonetheless:

... him saying that he loved me while he was out with her. Ugh.

Saying he loved me was a rarity during the A; however, a few months after he moved out (which was my decision), he apparently went right back to OW & I later learned that many of these I love you texts to me were sent while driving to be with OW. Makes no sense whatsoever to me.

Ever since DDay he's been telling me he wants to be with me. That he loves me and never stopped loving me. That he'd been wanting to end the A for some time without me finding out.

I got this too. Then I got a few indications that NC had been broken and a half-hearted R effort. Just bizarre.

In my case, I would say both the above examples are consistent with my WS as a cake eater - not wanting to leave the M, but not willing to give up OW either.

You know you are torturing yourself with reviewing all these texts, don't you? I can't fault you though - I did this for quite a while. I think it's a normal part of processing what happened and trying to make sense of it. Especially at this point in your recovery.

It's great (relatively speaking, lol) that you saw how the nature of the texts with OW changed over time. It does give credence to what your H said about wanting to end the affair. Sounds like the A had run its course and lost its magical feeling.

Wishing you and everyone else well.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 7:17 AM, December 16th (Monday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 7:26 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi 3yearfool,
Reading in the healing library (yellow box upper left part of SI intro screen) and posting on SI is a start for trying to find a center in the turmoil of your new life. I also recommend the books Not Just Friends by Glass and Sexual Detours by Hines.

See an attorney to see what separation and divorce would be like, what your rights are. This does not mean that you need to file, but know your options. Look at your finances and take steps to have money only you control. Build a reserve for the future to pay for attorney fees, moving him or you out of the house, whatever. If everything eventually works out you can use the money for a vacation. Expand or reinforce your network of social friends for support outside of your WH. Take care of yourself. Eat even if you do not feel hungry, drink water, exercise, avoid or be very careful with alcohol.

Seeing an IC is good, it really helped me to sort through all of the feelings I had after dday, and with values-clarification re: me and my M. I would pass on the MC. You are too raw and injured to accept your WH as a full and trusted partner to work on the M. Your WH has admitted he is only there out of penance, and he has to figure out his own issues before he is capable of working with you on an emotionally intimate relationship. Consider giving yourself 6 months or so to work through your emotions and get to acceptance and start healing. Then, this summer you can look around at your life, yourself, and your WH and decide if you want to stay with him, leave, or just keep watching.

Tell your WH what you need from him for you to not divorce now, and consider possibly working in the future to R the M. Typically this list of boundaries would include absolutely NC with any OW. Testng for you and him for STDs should be a requirement, no more unprotected sex with him until you see his results. A written timeline of his A with the level of detail that you are comfortable with. Full access to his cellphones, computer emails, etc. Transparency in where he is and what he is doing. FWW used to text me photos to prove where she was. She would call on her office rather than cell phone if she was working late to prove where she was. Turning on a cellphone/gps tracker is another good way to prove where he is at any time. You may ask him to read the books I recommended above, and to discuss with you how they do or do not apply to his A and your M. Tell him you want him to be able to explain why he had his A, and what made it OK for him. You may want to know how he was able to meet with and have sex with this OW and lie to you and pretend everything was OK, and what is different now so that you can feel safe staying with him.

Finally, it is my opinion that WS that participate in a LTA have some personal that allows them to sustain a LTA, and that must be identified and “fixed” for the LTA WS to be able to R the M. What that thing is can vary, a lack of empathy and discomfort with intimacy seem common. Alcohol and other addictions can play a role, as can FOO issues and personality traits. Not all people are the same, but something let him go 3 years without falling so in love with her that he left you, and yet he was able to come home from a trip with her and act normal around you.

iwam,
It does seem that like th eproverbial frog in the pot of water, we acclimate to accepting a level of crap that is stunning when we become aware of it. At least pfm is consistent in showing you that you are making the right choice in the path that you are on.

Hi mitz, Old_Dip, Laura. It is nice to "see" from you.

--Ats


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 9:45 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome 3 Years. This is a great forum to get support. It can get slow or go very fast in here so keep posting. My STBXWW had a 3 yr LTA with a coworker along with a prior A that I found out via TT, hence my 7 yr marriage at the time was a complete sham. Others have kind of said what I wanted to say but I just wanted to add one thing about the comment your WH made concerning MC.

I know why I have to do this. To prove that I love you."

IMHO, that comment by itself shows he is clueless on why he has to "do this". My guess is he doesn't even realize what he actually needs to do to make himself safe. From your story he seems to want to rugsweep which will not help anything. He isn't anywhere near "the proving that he loves you" part and his wanting things to return to normal isn't going to work. Normal and your old M are dead and gone, he killed it with his A. Going to counseling to "prove" that he loves you is the WRONG reason for going to counseling for him. Yoru WH, going to counseling because you asked him to or to prove he loves you will not accomplish much. He should be going to IC to figure out why he had an LTA in the first place. What is jacked up in his mind that made him even think it was an acceptable form of coping with whatever problems he couldn't figure out.

Please be careful and please keep reading in the healing library and on the site. The WS that want to stay but don't realize they actually need to fix themselves end up as dry adulterers. They think they can "will" away any future temptation but they never get to the root of the problem which means at some point they will stray. Your story is not mine but my STBXWW didn't fix herself either and i woke up one day realizing I had been in false R for a year. If they don't truly figure out why they did what they did then how can they prevent it from happening again. I am not trying to scare you just want to point out that your WH saying he is sorry and loves you is not enough. He has to dig deep and figure out why he did what he did, get to the bottom of it, and put some firm boundaries in place to prevent it from happening again. Otherwise he is no different than a drunk or drug addict that thinks they can go cold turkey one day.

Please take care of yourself. Dealing with the LTA fallout is tough whether you have a truly remorseful WS or not. There is so much time that has been tainted and filled with lies that it hurts for a long time. It does get better though. You help it get better by detaching and focusing on you. You have a lot to process. IC helps, take care of yourself physically, spend time with friends, make some time for you to discover yourself again. I am not saying leave but I am saying spending time on you WILL help you get through this. You can't control your WH but you can control yourself and your own healing. Your WH has to fix himself or he won't truly be safe for you again. If he can focus on fixing himself then you can focus on you and strengthing yourself in parallel. I wish you the best.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1580 | Registered: May 2011
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 10:00 AM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hope you are feeling better today IWAM.

A new beginning.
Whatever that looks like-and it will be different for all of us. Some parts of it will be better, other parts will be worse.
But all of us here on LTA are survivors.

And we will survive and even thrive with our 'new normal'


^^^What NJGal wrote is so true.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1580 | Registered: May 2011
ReunitePangea
♂ Member
Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 4:36 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome 3year, sorry you are here.

While I am glad that you feel you have NC in place and your WH seems committed you your M - a few of the things you mentioned sound like he doesn't get it yet. You have a recent DDay so perhaps he will "get it" soon. It took my WW 6 weeks to get some things.

A few weeks ago I tortured myself by looking at some of his texts to OW on an old phone from 2011 before WH took the phone and hid it

He shouldn't be taking the phone and hidding it from you. That is the action of someone who doesn't fully "get it" and is acting like there is more that to the story than you have been told. Him trying to hide the phone is not a good sign.

My heart is so completely broken. I am in IC and we've had a couple of sessions with an MC. I'm not sure it's helping. Regarding going to the MC, he says, "I know why I have to do this. To prove that I love you."

That is not the reason he should be going to a MC. He should be seeking counseling to figure out what is wrong with him that led him to live this double life. Personnally I have not gone down the MC path so I am not an expert but I often read about people seeing MC's so soon after their DDay's and wonder if it is doing them more harm than good. I think an IC right after DDay is an excellent idea. MC though seems like a place where compromise is made between the spouses and right after DDay there is not much compromising that should be going on. That is for latter in the process.

If your WH wants to prove that he loves you - tell him to go get an IC and figure out why he made such shitty decisions so he can make changes in his life so you do not get hurt again. When he is done with that then go to a MC to fine toon any differences.


BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 406 | Registered: Nov 2012
TheThreeYearFool
♀ Member
Member # 41218
Default  Posted: 4:40 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for the support, everybody. It's tough because as much as I know it's not my fault, I feel like I should have known better. Like I should have found out sooner. Seeing those texts reminded me of how close I came to catching him, but WH always had a plausible excuse.

But for nearly three years?!?! I do feel like a fool. How can I ever believe anything he says now?

Going to counseling to "prove" that he loves you is the WRONG reason for going to counseling for him.

I agree with this completely. WH just does not get it. He says he always loved me and was always happy with me, so why can't we go back to the way it was?

I have told him that "love" which can accommodate having a romantic relationship with someone else is simply not a good enough love for me.

I've given him "How to Help Your Spouse Heal From Your Affair" after I read it and highlighted parts. It helped, a little. I've also finished reading "After the Affair" and left it on his nightstand.

I'm in the middle of "Not Just Friends" on my Kindle and it is hitting home. I can completely see how WH crossed boundaries and went down the slippery slope. Quite willingly. Once I'm done I'm going to tell him I need him to read it.


Me - BW 36
Him - WH 40
Together 11 years, married 6
3 year LTA with former coworker
DDay 10/29/13
He says he wants to R... can I live with what he's done?

Posts: 120 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: United States
ReunitePangea
♂ Member
Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 4:55 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But for nearly three years?!?! I do feel like a fool.

I know it is hard, we probably all beat ourselves up over feeling like we were a fool on some level, but try not to spend too much time doing this. You didnt know because your WH tried hard to make sure you didn't know. Some BS's seems to have suspected something may have been going on. Others, like myself, had no clue at all.

That doesn't mean we are fools because we had no clue. My WW always told me she loved me - we actually had a really good M, she would admit that too - she still cheated for 12+ years. I know in my case I choose to see all the good things rather than noticing small traces of clues of her bad behaviour - doesn't mean you were a fool. The fool is the one who was willing to risk it all for nothing.

so why can't we go back to the way it was?

You can't go back to exactly the way it was because that person thought it was ok to cheat on you even though he was happy and loved you.

[This message edited by ReunitePangea at 4:56 PM, December 16th (Monday)]


BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 406 | Registered: Nov 2012
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 9:24 PM, December 16th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

3years: 3 years is a long time, yet is a drop in the bucket for many of us...my ws had a 30 year affair and in the latter part simultansously had a 12 year affair and then add to that a few short ones...and i never had a clue...oh wait there was one clue...and i mean one clue..

a bit tmi...pfm (my ws) when we didn't have sex for a week usually because of my period...when we next did have sex he didn't and couldn't last as long as when we had regular sex which was most of the time...so anyways...one nite after a week...he was lasting, and lasting....and i distinctly remember sitting up in bed during the sex and asking him why? and did i have to worry about it...? of course he said no.....and it wasn't until a decade later that i realized that of course i had something to worry about....

anyways....there are many of us....and its more then being fooled.....we took vows and we meant them...and sadly thought our spouses did too.....sadly we trusted because thats what we are supposed to do....after all who ever believes their spouse would be one of the spouses who would be a cheater....

millions, upon millions of people get fooled by their ws's....there is a great post in general...honest had posted a link to it a page or 2 back....well worth reading

miracle update: i am feeling a bit better....still have a little ways to go.....methinks the season, mixed with the antiversary comin, mixed in with coming down to the homestretch, mixed in with living like this for so long, mixed in with "seeing
all i put up with, mixed in with the knowledge that my dreams of "family" need to change.....i don't think all of my kids will elect to live with me....yet another blow...one in particular...manchild....i keep telling myself its probably for the best seeing as how he and i have been at some major odds lately....but still he is my son....and after all the shit, he will want to live with his father....the irony of it hurts....

anyways...one day at a time....looking forward....moving forward and i am more then confident this funk will pass....i just hope it passes sooner rather then later..

(((tribe)))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 1:11 AM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome 3 years fool to our little corner of SI.

I feel like I should have known better. Like I should have found out sooner.

Many of us feel that way, but we trusted. I trusted so much, that I ignored so many red flags and if I was suspicious, WH always had some excuse or gaslighted and I believed him. Sometimes I wonder, when looking back, that I might have readily accepted those excuses, because I did not want to face what the alternative could be.

I remember my 88 year old grandfather telling me to be careful if a young man tells you he loves you because he doesn't know the difference between lust and love. Real love takes years to build.

I believe that is true for any age man or woman. The feeling of "love" may be what is felt in the moment and not true, mature love. Unfortunately, I think a lot of WS's may not have been capable of a true intimate emotional relationship.

Miracle: I'm so sorry. It is so very hard. Holidays are a hard trigger too. So many memories of the past, FOO issues, etc. get mixed up.
As for manchild, I know it hurts that he said he wants to live with his father, but this is not a rejection of you. He's doing what a lot of teens/young men do: he's at a rebellious stage. I guess he somehow feels his father will be more lenient and let him get away with more things. I am sure that he will end up changing his mind once reality sets in and he actually has to deal with him one on one. I am and always have been very close to my oldest DS, but he opted to live with his father right after he graduated high school. Mostly because it was convenient to his college and friends, but also he said he wanted to get to know his father better. It hurt, but I understood the circumstances. DS needed to get to know his father and clear up some FOO issues of his own. I am still very close to DS.

Change is scary. Very, very scary. But lifeais always changing, even if we try to hold on to what we had. I know I've been in limbo for far too long and didn't want to change. I've been paralyzed. But I know it will change nonetheless. DS18 and DS 15 sometimes talk about when they graduate college and get their own apartments. I know I have precious little time left with them. Of course, you still see your kids, but it's not the same as when you live with them. I guess I have to get ready for my future, as they are getting ready for theirs.

NPD tells me he won't be home for Christmas, and I have mixed feelings about this. On one hand, I'm relieved and on the other, I feel incredibly hurt and sad.

Change is not easy.


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 6:23 AM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks honest

As I read your post, when I got to the part that npd won't be "home" for Xmas...I'm sorry hon, nut my first thought was "thank god"

and yes its a double edged sword that swings...because its yet another blow for your kids that dad won't be here for them for their holiday....but then again something tells me that they will probably be happy that he is not here period!!! which is sad.

use the time dear heart....use it wisely grasshopper....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 10:39 AM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I know it is hard, we probably all beat ourselves up over feeling like we were a fool on some level

RP hits this on the head IMO… It does not have to be that way.. We control our own beliefs, values, and attitude.

Infidelity is the ultimate reject.. even back before M when someone breakup for whatever reason our egos, our self-esteem, our sense of who we are gets damaged.

A peace about us is something we must develop.. an attitude.

We can check our ego's at the door.. the door to a new life, a different kind of life. Let the light bulb go off and SEE what happen to US! You can be at a far greater peace.

See.. If you with all your heart and sole follow and behave in a certain way, it does not matter to the evil that happens to you. It is always about you and what you could have done or not done and you know you are imperfect but you gave it your all. You know people do not always make good choices in life. Perhaps you didn’t even know what you did was pushing someone away. Perhaps you didn’t know how to open a person up, or behave in ways that person would open up to you... It does not matter to you. Your ego is check at that old door. You can look at yourself and say.. So what. That was who I was.. but no longer. My Self esteem is about now.

I did the best I could. I cannot control what others do or not do. I accept the things I may ahave done. What I did may have influenced a choice. It does not mean anyone deserves to have evil given them. Evil is just part of life.

All I can do is not be that kind of person again. And you can be in a relationship with a NPD or BPD person. You cannot control those people… I just won’t ever accept bad behaviors despite that persons, or even my bad FOO history, taught to me or them.

If my DD told me that she wanted to live with my W..
“that is OK honey. You make the choice you believe is best for you.“ I let them make that choice. I may have feelings that are hurt because my DD cannot see that; but it is not my choice. I am the best to lead them to what is most healthy. And if they cannot see that, they must feel pain to change. I will lead continually though. People make mistakes. I let them make a mistake. And they might be less part of my life. There choice, not mine. Do not betray me in a big way, The ultimate consequence will no longer be a part of my life. And I will be at great peace with that. Why?

Because I know that if I continue to be at peace with myself.. no matter if it me single, or M, my good will come as a consequence of ME always doing, behaving, learning.. To be the best quality possible. I never think of myself as the perfect quality… I am always improving. I look at giving first.. and giving could be giving to another is a way you may not think.

Giving is also saying to another, “you can yell at me all you want, I am not going to listen to you unless you can talk to me in a good way. What makes me want to give you what you want by yelling. Yelling is controlling. I don’t treat you that way and I won’t be treated that way. ” Reset: “Now, I am going to go shopping and when I come home, you can talk to me in a good way." You are giving that person a chance to change.. to good behavoirs. It becomes thier choice.

Develop ways to not let your emotions take control of you own happiness. Iwant.. You have no fear of losing your H. He is as weak person.. he is far on the left side of the bell curve of weakness for a man. It is the way it is today.

I have the power over my money. If I need a car, I am going to get one. I will take my time deciding because that is a huge decision for me. I will do it in a calm collect way and make a good choice. It will be a choice based in my ability to pay and ability to keep security. No car salesman is going to influence my choice. You just give me the features and benefits of that car and nothing else. A car saleman told me once not to go to Starbucks everyday and I can afford it.. "That is not your choice to make is it?"

And the new way is to love yourself… When you do.. You will not be that

1. Anyone can become a betrayed spouse.

I am not "anyone" so I will not ever be betrayed again. That was the old me. I am above that.. I will fall in that 20% of most happy marriages. If someone told me I could win that mega lotto with those good odds.. I would be most excited! I would do it over and over until my 20% paid off! My ego is such. My self esteem is my new attitude. Love always protects. Before you cheat on me, I will see YOU WAY in advance. Because cheaters do not love the way they need to love. You will see it if you pay close attention. I am paying VERY close attention. I have no fears.. I will live in a shack.. I am willing to risk death for my own happiness. I may hurt you or others along the way... But when I know I am right is it what needs to happen. It is an attitude.. a belief.. to have courage with change.. I look at myself first.. without my ego interfering..

when you don’t want to have sex with me.. That tells me something.
When you yell at me.. That tells me something.
When you are not building me up.. but tearing me down.. That tells me something.
When you are not laughing with me… That tells me something.
When you ridicule me..
When you are not giving me quality time
When you behave like a single but M
When you spend our money foolishly
When you shut down
When you behave ugly toward others
When your roving eyes look at others way too much
When you are not giving me new experiences…
When you only want my body…
When you don’t want me around..
When you have too close a relationship with the opposite sex…
When you want to give yourself to someone of the opposite sex..
When you don’t kiss me..
When you are depressed…
When you…. ON and ON… That tells me something.

We know these things.. Those bad behaviors always make us feel a certain way… Unhappy. Never again shall I be just.. "Content" when someone is not loving me... or will I ever switch into a mode of bad refuges.. refuges that deep in my soul are unsettled.. I will not ever be "content" with that.. For me being at peace comes when I am living as I know I should, loving those I ought to love in honesty and integrity, being at peace of conscience with God and having no emnity between myself or another person. THis is may choice and nobody else.. life is way to short not to enjoy.

I am no fool any longer. Yes I was a fool. I was foolish. I let myself be a fool. Not today, I am paying attention. I no longer hide behind those famous last words..”I DO”

And my ego is such.. My self-esteem is such..
“Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.”

I feel good about me.. I don’t need any person to make me happy. I am happy because I am at peace with who I am.. what I do.. how I do it.. because I have researched it.. I have listened.. I have read..

I can have a bad feeling. I can also change that bad feeling into a good feeling. That is the power I have over ME!

I do all those things above..It is effort.. and I don’t let them happen to me. Ever Again. And Yes, I made the choice to R out of fears. But that is no longer me. I don’t fear being single. My being single will be your choice W, not mine. And I will be attractive. If you choose to be unattractive to me.. You are going to have something said to you in every situtation.. and done is a kind way... and yes it may hurt you.. you are going to get pressure.. And I will RESET you to safety if you so choose to continue you will get my ultimatum.. And the final ultimatum will be enforce with courage... for my peace.

And the key is knowing how to place pressure in a fair way.. the right way.
“what about that comment brings me closer to you? When you can decide to be the kind of person I need and want.. Then you come talk to me.. ”
“Why do you think yelling at me bring me closer to you? I am not going to yell at you and You are not going to yell at me.”

This is what I know about LTA people.. We did not have something about us. That something is above. Sure.. we needed less. We accepted less. Perhaps even when we wanted more… We must want it.. We insist on wanting it.

Just being a good provider is not enough
Just being a good sex partner is not enough
Just being nice is not enough
just being who we were, is not enough

We must do them all.. we must know them all.. We must sometimes do them when we don’t feel comfortable doing them too. We must be open enough to make sure our relationships know what we want.. And we must also love ourselves to know that if someone choose not to fill our wants.. we must know that the end will be a new beginning with something new.. And not fear it. The right fit will fall into your lap.

Yes, I want to win the lotto.. but at the same time, I can live in a shack. I will make that shack my shack…

I no longer have any bad feelings about my W. She had an infidelity relationship.. it is no different than my feelings for the girls I dated who have since gone on and M other men.. Those women betrayed me too. I betrayed one of them too.. That is who I was... but, I hold no ill will toward those women no more than I do with my W. That was who she was at that time. I was a far different person 5 years ago too. I like the new me far better. The new me is far different.. I still have much of the old good me.. but vast improved this go around.. And had I not changed, I would have ended up being cheated on again and again. I no longer view "I do" the same way.. it now includes something new.. The "I do" is mutual.. in every way.. even if I don't "need" those "wants" of the ideal relationship..I give those "wants".. I insist on the "wants"..

My W never did any "heavy lifting" along this path.. she took seeing my pain.. some very bad choices I made along the way.. she endured things where she had every right to make me no longer part of her world.. but as I started to change she reacted in a very postive way.. Most people know when they are not behaving.. they then try not too be that person. And some don't. Those are the ones you eliminate from your world. It become thier choice, not ours. And if someone does not want to love me, I am ok with that.. I know my behavoirs are attractive enought that a good person will see it.

And I do know my hurt is gone. My triggers are just minor memories now.

I so wish you peace like the peace I now have..


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
TheThreeYearFool
♀ Member
Member # 41218
Default  Posted: 1:23 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You can't go back to exactly the way it was because that person thought it was ok to cheat on you even though he was happy and loved you.

Quite true. I should mention it's not me saying that -- it's WH who says, "Why can't we go back to the way it was before? Why can't we go back to normal?" He's literally said that he feels like we had a great M before "except for this one thing."

And it's true that his staying out all night was about the only thing we fought over, but of course I thought I was arguing about his drinking.

But I've told him, "before" had room for him to have the A. The time he considers "normal" he was able to lie to me constantly. And that's not good enough for me.

I am giving myself six months or so before making any decisions, mostly to take the pressure off myself. Because every day I think, shouldn't this be a dealbreaker? Why am I not leaving? And I just punish myself more.

This morning was rough as well. When I was heading out the door for work I looked around our living room and everything was a trigger. They had sex on our couch. He bought the console when he was with OW at Crate and Barrel, using her discount card (that I think she got for registering for her wedding gifts there -- OW started cheating less than six months after her wedding). He bought that end table on the way back from a trip to DC with "friends."

I feel like WH was trying to build a life with her IN MY HOUSE. And now that the A lost its glow he's rewriting the A history rather than rewriting the marital history.

At least work is keeping me busy.


Me - BW 36
Him - WH 40
Together 11 years, married 6
3 year LTA with former coworker
DDay 10/29/13
He says he wants to R... can I live with what he's done?

Posts: 120 | Registered: Nov 2013 | From: United States
7yrsflushed
♂ Member
Member # 32258
Default  Posted: 3:12 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sometimes I wonder, when looking back, that I might have readily accepted those excuses, because I did not want to face what the alternative could be.
This was me Honest. I did this for sure. It's one of the reasons I was so pissed off after I filed for D and we separated. So many signs that I saw and chose to ignore. I was engaged once before and my "fiance" at the time cheated on me then. STBXWW knew about this past relationship and still did what she did. After Dday I would think back and see all the lies for what they were and realize that I knew but just didn't want to believe it. The hotel on the credit card statement that she blamed on a friend. The trips out of town to college reunions. The cell phone. The subtle shifting of the seat in the car that I noticed when I got in but never questioned her about or when I did she said it was from her grandfather. The overnight stash of undies and sextoys that I found under the spare tire when we sold har car. She said they were for us but she just hadn't used them. Teh blindfold had glitter smudges on it so I knew it wasn't knew. Teh stuff under the tire was 6 months before Dday and kind of cemented it in my head but I still couldn't face it. I also did n't have any real proof. The story of the crazy wife coming up to her job to harrass and accuse her of sleeping with her husband. I let her talk her way out of that. Going out on weekends and coming home well after the clubs had all closed. Supposedly being in the movies with a friend but I can't hear anything in the background. I could go on forever with examples but as others said it doesn't reflect negatively on me it reflects poorly on my STBXWW. I struggled with alot of anger at myself after she moved out because of this but I have really mellowed out lately. For me it's proved detrimental to my healing to dwell on things I had no control over in the past so I decided to work on letting them go. I still get irritated when around STBXW but I no longer get mad even when she does dumb shit.

Don't beat yourself up too much 3years, it's all part of the process. Realizing the person we married isn't who we thought they were and that they are/were capable of such deception can stay with you for awhile but it goes away eventually. If you R, then your WS doing the work to fix themselves and helping you create new memories helps. If you go the D route like myself and some others you still work through it and move on. Either way it gets better eventually. Take care of yourself.


D-day 5/24/11
BH = Me
STBXWW = Her
2 children
The first true sense of calm I felt in YEARS was when I filed for D...
Separated 6/2013, D official around 6/2014

Posts: 1580 | Registered: May 2011
iwantamiracle
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Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 4:16 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

need to vent: it would seem that the beat goes on for me....i just found out today that the job is not coming through with the promised salary....and of course i am still having some mini meltdowns...good thing i go to ic tonite....

i only skimmed the posts but tryn i am really hopin that i read some of your post wrong.....hon....there are no guarantees in life...you cannot affair proof any marriage....unless you are given the powers of esp from god, you cannot possibly ever believe that you could not be cheated on again....there are many who will tell you that the sex never stopped....there are many who will tell you that there was not a single sign...or the signs were reasonably expained.....and if you are never to believe a partner means living in your own fabricated hell.....so when a man tells a woman he is tired....are we supposed to immediately say...hell he cant be tired...he must be having sex with another.....if a woman tells a man that she is tired...hell she cannot be tired she must be having sex with another....

and there are enough of us here who could tell you that believing that you will see it coming or should see it coming means you are living in a fantasy world.....it can and does happen to anyone....and believing otherwise will probably tempt the fates to test you my friend!!!

and thank you for your words...you are right in that i have no fear of losing my husband....and that is not what has gotten a hold of my emotions right now....and i am going to let you in on a little secret...we are human and we are full of emotions....and i would be a fool if i believed i could control them at all times....there are times we need to "feel".....its the part of not letting the emotions take control of us full time, letting the emotions guide us when our heads tell us otherwise, letting our emotions take us to a place of no return..thats the part that needs to be developed to avoid that....because that puts us into a deep pit...much harder to climb out of...

we need to allow ourselves the luxury to feel the pain, just not to let it take over...and it is a luxury....it means that when the pain is gone we will appreciate the happy that much more...

you know, this may sound so obscure...there are times when i have to pee...yes i said pee....and i am unable to go to the bathroom because there is not one available...so i hold it and hold it...when i finally find one and am able to urinate the relief is huge....and it feels so good to finally be able to do so....and i always joke that thats gods way of telling us to appreciate the little things in life...when everything around you seems to be falling apart...you at least will get some relief when you can get to a bathroom....

by the way i had a huge smile on my face this am when i received a wonderful pm from one of our oldies....she has gotten married to a new man...and is of course happy...thats 2 now.....2 oldies that married someone new since i first joined this club...

and thanks honest for your kind words as well....and again i cant help but be so happy that npd is not coming...
methinks that god is giving you the time you need to finish lining up those ducks and i think soon he will hand you the gun to finish them off...and i want a front row seat

(((tribe)))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
ReunitePangea
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Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 5:08 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

.....so when a man tells a woman he is tired....are we supposed to immediately say...hell he cant be tired...he must be having sex with another.....if a woman tells a man that she is tired...hell she cannot be tired she must be having sex with another....

I think you are saying things that are not exactly what Tryn said.

He said....

when you don’t want to have sex with me.. That tells me something.

I actually feel the exact same way. If my WW tells me she doesnt was to have sex with me, it definately tells me something. Now if it is just once in awhile, it is a small something that I am not that concerned about and likely will ignore if there are not other signs. If it happens frequently, it tells me that I need to go into full detective mode. I may have been clueless before but I am much more knowledgable now. My WW used to tell me she was "tired" when she was having sex with OM, I'm not falling for that line again.


BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 406 | Registered: Nov 2012
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 7:16 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey all - been awhile -

I actually feel the exact same way.

^^^me too. I'm thinking 'not wanting to have sex with me' from a big picture sense. Not the incremental fatigue spell.

I got the 'we are not sexually compatible' comment. I did not know back then what I know now. I probably just argued with her and made it so I was less 'compatible'. Having read a lot about attachment disorders and the avoidant personality, if I were to hear about sexual incompatibility in any context other than my penis actually not fitting into her vagina, let's just say I am reacting differently. That includes protecting myself, but not arguing.


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 7:34 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi everyone!

Unfortunately, I have not been following the LTA thread and am not up to date on the happenings here.

I do want to wish all a pleasant holiday season and send {{hugs}} to those struggling through them.

I am officially divorced! as of Monday December 16, 2013. It has been a long slow road through attempting R and then D. And my in house separation is also creeping to an end. I have a contract (inspection tomorrow) for a condo next to m work. No more waiting for the bus to go home as I will literally walk 5 minutes or less from my office to my new home.

2014 will be a transition, at times a tough transition and hopefully with some enjoyable times ahead. Wishing all the very best!

Be safe! Be happy! Be healthy! Live with ease!

H&C


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 11:02 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

pangea: i actually think i did understand....

that tells me something:

i disagree....or actually i agree but not for the same reasons....i don't believe that marriage is always going to be hunky dory, i don't believe that people will always be easy to please....we all have our days, and sometimes our funk can last longer...

example: during my marriage: i was unhappy, after pfm raped me my sex life with him dwindled to the point where it was null and void about a year prior to d-day....

compounded was the foo issues and fighting between us over them....we fought all the time....

meanwhile...i didn't cheat
through all the shit that "could" have told him something....it only told him that he had the right to be the one doing the cheating

not all cheaters fit into a neat little package and defining them as so will end up leaving you in an unhappy state of being...because at every bad turn you will say is this telling me something

now as bs's, we will always run the risk of triggering, when those red flags appear....but again not all red flags are red

but what has changed is US...we should no longer accept behaviors that are unwarranted...or so i hope...whether or not your partner is cheating....the bad treatment should be unacceptable PERIOD!!!....its called go to mc or see the lawyer....that is something i will embody in the future....people are human and are bound to be imperfect....expectations need to be realistic......

that tells me something is not always telling you the person is cheating is what i am in a very long winded discomobulated way of trying to say


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 11:03 PM, December 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

h&c: congratulations and i am so sorry about your divorce...a double edged sword it is...

and i am so happy to hear that your future is looking bright and more importantly that you are looking forward to it...


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
ReunitePangea
♂ Member
Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 7:43 AM, December 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

that tells me something is not always telling you the person is cheating is what i am in a very long winded discomobulated way of trying to say

Miracle - we may be saying the same thing.

I said before if it is just once in awhile, I notice but am not that concerned. If it happens frequently, it is a major red flag. Is that not the same as what you just said above?

If my WW goes 6 months of giving me the too tired excuse 50% of the time, I can tell you with 95% certainty that she is cheating. Now that is my situation, not yours. All I am saying is that Tryn's statement is a common red flag for some BS and I can very much relate to it. I think it is good advise by Tryn that a BS consider this potential red flag and see if it applies to their situation.

I know Tryn gets a lot of heat here for saying that he is affair proofing his M. I for one do not think that is possible. What I do think is possible in my case though is that I am LTA proofing my M. Sure maybe my wife may cheat on me again and there is nothing I can do to stop it.

There is no way though that she could ever have another LTA again though, I have way too much knowledge now and know the red flags to look for. I think I have always been a quality person, but that doesnt mean I cant improve a few things here and there. I have given my WW conditions and established boundaries with consequences that I know she has not intention of breaking them. Can she go out and cheat, sure, I am powerless to stop her if she does, but no way can she live a double life like she did - eventually I would know and it wont take me that long to figure it out.


BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 406 | Registered: Nov 2012
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