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Divorce/Separation Post Reply     Print Topic    
User Topic: Emotional Water Boarding
erzulie
♀ Member
Member # 3293
Helpless  Posted: 3:09 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Every time I think it could not possibly hurt any more, I get surprised.

I sat and listened to WH explain last night how he understood that what he was risking was destroying me (risking my life to HIV, breaking my heart, devastating me as a human being entirely, pretty much), but, that he justified the risk being worth taking.

Then he went on and on about all the great support he's getting from his friends. How they all see him as valuable and worthwhile. That somehow, that makes him feel better about himself. I guess my telling him every day of our life together how much I loved him and how amazing he was didn't matter a hill of beans ... because I am not a Christian.

Seems WH has had some lifelong crisis of faith, that supposedly conflicted him terribly. He claims to have wanted to talk to me about it, but didn't feel that he could. And yes, he gave two reasons for that. One, that I used "Jesus Christ" as an expletive. And two, that when we went to see "Book of Mormon" last year, that I laughed. (sidebar - I asked my friends this morning to recollect that, as they went with WH and I to see it last year - and they remembered how my WH laughed his ass off together the entire night). Seems now, however, WH has decided that my taking him to Book of Mormon was offensive to him, and further evidence of how he could not trust me with revealing his deeper, Christian self.

So now he's renewing his relationship with Christ, he's joined a church and a church-based men's group, and is hanging out with his Christian friends (people I've never met) who will guide him on his journey to enlightenment. No idea what he wants from me, other than to have me to blame for his choices and saddle me with the responsibility for the relationship ending.

His lies and betrayal were painful enough. Him blaming me, though? That hurts the worst. I feel like I've been beaten up these past five weeks, and last night in counseling, WH went for the kill shot. I had to hang onto the wall just to walk down the stairs from the therapists' office, I don't think I've ever cried that hard. Most of the end of the session was a blur. I'm not even sure what the counselor was saying, my head was in a fog of agony for the latter half of our session.

I've been trying to piece it together ever since. I guess WH is going to cast himself the repentant Christian, walking the righteous path, and sinful corruptor wife me is to blame for his distraction from his holy journey. So he will rally everyone around him with his self-portrayal, and everyone will applaud him for his courageous rebirth. Blame will be placed squarely upon me, and WH will go on, find some nice Christian girl whom he actually values and would never dream of destroying. Me, well ... I get to sort out the tatters of my life and try to survive what he did to me.

I think really, though, the bottom line is that he never valued me. Telling me he loved me was just one of his many lies. He used me, took all I had to give, but didn't see me worth anything in return. How else could you explain how he intentionally destroyed me?

How does a person destroy someone they claim to love? How do they bludgeon them, over and over, repeatedly, in the face of their agony? How do they behave so selfishly, when someone gives them so much love and adoration? How much more is WH going to do to me? How much more can I take?

I've never felt more destroyed, on every single level, in my whole life. I just want to stop crying, and stop hurting.


A saying for my SI Family: "We may not have it all together, but together we have it all".

Fooled twice - almost exactly 10 years apart.


Posts: 3377 | Registered: Jan 2004 | From: California
StillLivin
♀ Member
Member # 40229
Default  Posted: 3:24 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

erzulie,
I'm sorry. You, and all of us, deserve validation that NONE of this was ever our fault. Truth, none of it was ever our fault. Simple. My STBXH loves to stick the knife in...and he does it ever so carefully that nobody else is around to see that side of him. Your H is an ass. But you got one part right, they don't value us. However, they are incapable of valuing us because they don't value themselves. Even the fact that he has to surround himself with "Christians". I'm a Christian. No true Christian condones adultery. He is putting on a false face. I suggest NC unless it is absolutely essential. Your husband also sounds like NPD.
Have a fantastic cry and let it all out. Unfortunately, that seems to be the only way to truly get through all this crap.
And post here. The support is pretty awesome.
FTG
(((erzulie)))


I don't need further confirmation of what a fuckwit he is. I already have plenty, thanks very much. -SBB
D: 7/2/2014

Posts: 2141 | Registered: Aug 2013 | From: AZ
Vulcanized
♀ Member
Member # 33523
Default  Posted: 3:29 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Seems WH has had some lifelong crisis of faith, that supposedly conflicted him terribly.

But not so much as to honour his M vows?

He claims to have wanted to talk to me about it, but didn't feel that he could.

BS. Warm-up to how he plans on blaming you for his A.

hanging out with his Christian friends (people I've never met) who will guide him on his journey to enlightenment.

New friends. Who don't know you, nor any of the details (or even the existence) of his A. If they do find out, it'll be easier for him to spin it.

WH is going to cast himself the repentant Christian, walking the righteous path, and sinful corruptor wife me is to blame for his distraction from his holy journey.

I think that only works if you are repentant.

WH will go on, find some nice Christian girl whom he actually values and would never dream of destroying.

I highly doubt that. He's hiding behind GOD. That's insane. I think there is a special place in hell for ppl who use God as their excuse for crap behaviour. Has your WH done ANYTHING to fix himself? It sounds like he's not doing anything. It's not as if he's magically going to be a different person w/the next one.


Song lyric:

You can't go to church on Sunday, sing His praise
go out and greet the devil on Monday

KWIM?


Me: MH 40s; Him: MH 40s (I had RA)
OW: 30s, moron; one of many
M: 8 yrs
3/13: D'd
-----------------------------------------------------------
Everything is as it should be.

Posts: 727 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Vulcania
Holly-Isis
♀ Member
Member # 13447
Default  Posted: 3:55 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't know his heart, but I'm going by a "fruit of the spirit" approach. He doesn't seem repentant. He also seems like he's not owning his choices.

MrH blamed his first A on me being agnostic. Obviously he didn't own his choices or have repentance since it was his first A. Yes, there was another.

Maybe your WH will get it here on earth, maybe it will take looking directly at Jesus and explaining how he felt he had a right to bash you with the person who gave His life for him (and you.). He will one day have to face the fact that he did not do what he's been commissioned to do as a Christian, love one another as Jesus loved us.


"Being in love" first moved them to promise fidelity: this quieter love enables them to keep the promise. *CS Lewis*

❣I hope my issues don't discourage ur healing. I've buried a lot & my WH hasn't done his part in R❣


Posts: 10985 | Registered: Jan 2007 | From: Limbo
caregiver9000
♀ Member
Member # 28622
Default  Posted: 4:03 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

PLEASE go No Contact with this ass!!

He has nothing of value to say, and just because he says it out loud in front of other people does not validate his words.

For what it is worth, the mythical crowd of new friends who "support" his new lifestyle and choices sound like the same group of "experts" that gave my ex legal advice and parenting tips. The mythical "everybody" or "they say" syndrome.

He only gets to hurt you if you listen to his bullshit. Trust me, it is bullshit of the first kind.

(((hugs))) You are better than this. Move on. Shut him out and shut him down.


Me: 43, independent, happy, despite co-parenting with a lower muppet
FT "Stretch" (and Skew!) ;)
DS 13 DS 10
S 5/2010
D 12/2012

Posts: 5584 | Registered: May 2010 | From: a better place
SerJR
♂ Member
Member # 14993
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's a load of horseshit, plain and simple. You know this.

For some it easier to destroy everything around them than it is to face the evidence of who they are.

I know how devastating and painful this is. You deserve better. I hope you know that.


Me: BH - Happily remarried.
Hope is never lost. It exists within you - it is real. It is not a force in and of itself - it is something that you create with every thought, action, and choice you make. It is a gift that you create for yourself.

Posts: 17093 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Further North than South
gypsybird87
♀ Member
Member # 39193
Default  Posted: 4:44 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((erzulie))

I'm so sorry. Your pain comes through in every word of your post.

Absolutely NONE of this is your fault!! He's blaming you because the only alternative is to blame himself, and lying, cheating NPD assholes don't do that. They will not allow the blame to settle at their feet, no matter how much dancing around they have to do to avoid it.

Your WH has chosen religion as his particular excuse. But that's all it is, an excuse. It could have been anything. I sincerely doubt that he's any more invested in this newfound religious enlightenment that he was in his relationship with you. It's just an expedient and "acceptable" excuse for him, one that few people are going to question (especially these new people who never met you or knew the two of you as a couple).

It's complete crap. Please don't buy into it.

And please, please stop attempting MC with him. Nothing good is coming from it and you keep getting more and more hurt. In the MC's office you are a sitting duck, a nice easy target for him to fire his shit at. You need to stop giving him this opportunity. Every time it inflates his ego more, and drains your heart and spirit more. Please put a stop to it.

Many hugs to you (((erzulie))).
You deserve so much better.


Me: Looking forward to the future
Him: Left behind in the past

Rock bottom became the solid foundation on which I rebuilt my life. ~ JK Rowling


Posts: 659 | Registered: May 2013 | From: Oregon
Sad in AZ
♀ Member
Member # 24239
Default  Posted: 6:11 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

erzulie, I don't know your story, so I have to ask: Why are you going to counseling with this asshole?? Listen to the others, go NC and divorce him asap. Move away from his toxicity. Do NOT buy into his bullshit. And please, spare me from jack Christians.


I solemnly swear that I am up to no good.

Posts: 19789 | Registered: Jun 2009 | From: Upstate NY
woundedwidow
♀ Member
Member # 36869
Default  Posted: 7:09 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Erzulie, as Gypsybird and Sad said, why are you putting yourself through MC with this man? He has no interest in improving your marriage, he just wants to use the counseling sessions as a forum for his sick need to hurt you. You need to take care of YOU and that means going NC with him. Please stop these sessions and let yourself heal alone with your wonderful doggies - believe me, they'll be much nicer company than your WH.


Be careful what you wish for the most - you may get it.

Posts: 363 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: VA
LifeIsBroken
♀ Member
Member # 27071
Default  Posted: 7:50 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a long-time close friend whose husband has had FIVE PA's with five different women through the last 30 yrs. Each time he gets caught, he finds religion. He is sooo sorry. "God" has given him a new direction at least 5 different times (5 that my friend knows about). My friend divorced him after the 5th one. He immediately found religion yet again, goes to the men's group each week, goes to church on Sundays. My friend remarried him based on his profound apologies and yet more promises this will never happen again. (Now my friend is in therapy trying to determine why she is so co-dependent.) What I'm saying is, religion is a convenient crutch for these kinds of people. It won't last. He will continue in the same direction he came from. He won't change because he won't fix himself. He may go through the motions for awhile but he won't change. Your direction is a different one. You will recover from this mess and learn a different way to live, a better way. A peaceful way. Why would you want to continue on the old path with him? Save yourself, break the ties and move forward, not backward with him. Sending hugs.....


Actions ALWAYS have consequences. Too bad cheaters don't consider the consequences BEFORE they create so much damage.

Posts: 430 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Massachusetts
k8la
♀ Member
Member # 38408
Default  Posted: 8:42 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sometime when you feel stronger, hold a mirror up to Mr. Christian and ask him if he sees Jesus in his treatment of you?

The truth of the matter is that he is not a Christian in any sense of the word. His lip-service Christianity is so superficial that a light dusting would strip it right off.


Posts: 121 | Registered: Feb 2013
erzulie
♀ Member
Member # 3293
Default  Posted: 9:00 PM, October 9th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I went and saw my shrink - he squeezed me in today.

Dear God how I love that man. He takes ALL of my life's cray cray, and breaks it down into terms I can understand. Similar to all of you, but just, more ... clinical.

He cleared up some of the greater parts of my mystery. You are all spot-on, in so many areas. I think my challenges are not so much in learning to understand these things ... I think it's the acceptance part that I grapple with most.

My Shrink asked me what I wanted - to really ask myself, what I want. My answer? I want it to be spelled out that this is not my fault. He then asked, "does WH know that?" And I said, "well, he knows me, so ... maybe". He then said, "well, if that's the case, then every single session that you attend with WH, that is going to be his goal - to do everything he can to prevent any clarification that this is not your fault. That's how he keeps his hooks in you, keeps you engaged. The Christian thing is just evidence that he's getting more and more desperate for ways to accomplish this goal."

Fascinating to consider.


A saying for my SI Family: "We may not have it all together, but together we have it all".

Fooled twice - almost exactly 10 years apart.


Posts: 3377 | Registered: Jan 2004 | From: California
Bravenewgirl
♀ Member
Member # 36267
Default  Posted: 4:53 AM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Your therapist is awesome.

WH, on the other hand, is a perfect DOUCHEBAG FUCKHEAD ASSFACE SHITBALL.

I would love to be a fly on the wall when he arrives at the pearly gates to get his massive smackdown from God, and a one way ticket to H-E Double hockey sticks.

I don't think God likes it when people use him to justify their utterly sinful and hypocritical behaviour.

I don't know how you don't beat the hell out of him with the book of mormon.

Remember, you don't have to go to MC with him. You don't have to listen to ONE MORE WORD of his self-justifying bullshit. You don't have to put your heart out on the table for him to stick a knife in anymore. Protect yourself, I beg you.

He is the source of all your pain. Time to turn off the tap of hot and cold running agony.

And who gives a flying fuck about what other people think and if they believe his lies? You know the truth, we know the truth and your real friends all know the truth. And his new friends? He will reveal his true nature to them eventually. Masks do slip.

FUCK THAT GUY and the bible he rode in on.

(((((((erzulie))))))))


Don't come around here no more
-Tom Petty

Posts: 661 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Canada
tushnurse
♀ Member
Member # 21101
Default  Posted: 8:50 AM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Erz I am so sorry that you are struggling so much now. However, I am going to be my blunt self here, and say
Don't you find it fascinating that he found God/Jesus and Faith all in the other woman's pussy?

Seriously this asshole, is just fucking with you. He sees you are weak, and broken, from his choices, and I am sure keeping you, and not D'ing are what he wants, afterall, who wouldn't want a housekeeper, laundress, and cook.

You really do need to go NC with him. Stop wasting, time, money, and energy on him. He has shown you who is 2 times now, and is attempting to rewrite marital history, to get him what he wants. FTG!!!


Me: FBS
Him: FWS
Kids: 15 & 17
Married for 22 years now, was 16 at the time. .
D-Day Sept 26 2008
Fully R'd, and Happy Happy Happy

Posts: 7791 | Registered: Oct 2008 | From: St. Louis
Chrysalis123
♀ Member
Member # 27148
Default  Posted: 9:48 AM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I want it to be spelled out that this is not my fault

Erzulie, he will never let this happen. He is mentally sick and driven to make YOU the bad guy. DRIVEN

It will not matter what you say or do...you could be Betty Crocker, Mother Theresa, and Victoria's Secret rolled into one and you still would not be good enough and also be at fault in his warped mind.

I knew I crossed over into emotional well being, when I did not give a flying fuck what he thought and knew he would blame me regardless. I got my voice back and took care of me first without him influencing me. It took years for me to get to that spot. (Keep working because I can see you stepping closer and closer to your new life.)

I then started seeing the pattern in his behavior from all the way back to when we first met.

So, do an experiment. Do something completely out of character for you. Change the game on him. Take your power back, get your voice back. The get out the popcorn and sit back and watch what will happen.

PS I tried MC with NPD-FT. Did it twice and got beat up emotionally both times.

Then I said, "NO" I am going to IC. I won't go back to MC until you go to IC as well.

It was hysterical to watch him spin this request of mine as a betrayal of my marriage vows bla...bla...bla...

Can you imagine him sitting alone with an IC? LOL In the meantime I got healthier and healthier while he got sicker and sicker. I never did go back to MC with him because he refused to get healthy and that is when I really SAW he had to have me to blame.

[This message edited by Chrysalis123 at 9:54 AM, October 10th (Thursday)]


Donít get to the end of your life and find that you lived only the length of it; live the width of it as well.†

Posts: 2605 | Registered: Jan 2010
Take2
♀ Member
Member # 23890
Default  Posted: 9:59 AM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How much more is WH going to do to me? How much more can I take?

Apparently he is still deeply conflicted about his faith. Using MC and "God" to beat on his faithful, loving spouse, and to excuse his horrid choices.

Where is remorse, repentance, and restitution in this mix...? These are what you would be seeing in words and deeds, if he was truly pursing his professed faith -- Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

Instead, he is hurting you to justify his evil choices...? to break you, humiliate you, and make no mistake about it -- to manipulate you.

It stops when you say it stops, ((((erzulie))))). No contact = no new hurts.


"We must be willing to get rid of the life we've planned, so as to have the life that is waiting for us." Joseph Campbell...So, If fear was not a factor - what would you do?

Posts: 4112 | Registered: May 2009 | From: New England
stupidstupidme
♀ Member
Member # 11888
Default  Posted: 11:40 AM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So he's taken to hiding behind a bible and pointing fingers. Lovely. That sounds VERY familiar.

I agree with the others that have said PLEASE go NC and stay away from him. This is NOT helping you to heal, and he is NOT someone who is healthy for your life - at least not now. Not anymore.


Confront the dark parts of yourself, and work to banish them with illumination and forgiveness. Your willingness to wrestle with your demons will cause your angels to sing. Use the pain as fuel, as a reminder of your strength
August Wilson

Posts: 19704 | Registered: Aug 2006
NewMom0220
♀ Member
Member # 39036
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just want to reiterate that going NC is the best thing to do. Do not pass go, do not collect $200, go NC and stop letting him mind fuck you.

I was in the same position. I sat and looked at the MC (the second one we went to post DDay) and I said: "I can feel my brain being penetrated as I sit here in front of you." That's how crazy and messed up the things my STBX was saying.

They all say it's your fault. No remorse. No atonement. Nothing. Just blame shifting and justifications.

I spent 7 months giving my unremorseful spouse the benefit of the doubt, and that's because we had a newborn.

Go NC and don't argue with him, don't rationalize, and don't ever take the blame.

[This message edited by NewMom0220 at 1:31 PM, October 10th (Thursday)]


Me: BS 36
Him: WS 37
14 month old DS
Married 5 years, together 8, DIVORCING!!! (taking forever)
DDay: 3/1/13 (4 Month PA while I was pregnant)
Sometimes all you have to do is forget what you feel and remember what you deserve.

Posts: 329 | Registered: Apr 2013
damncutekitty
♀ Member
Member # 5929
Default  Posted: 4:08 PM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

People with no integrity often change their beliefs and values to fit their desires.

When my XH became a cheater he also became an atheist in order to absolve himself of any moral obligations. He also became a feminist, declaring that marriage was an outdated institution based on ownership of women- because if he didn't believe in marriage then he didn't have to respect his own.


Keep calm and carry on.

Posts: 49446 | Registered: Nov 2004 | From: Minneapolis
caregiver9000
♀ Member
Member # 28622
Default  Posted: 4:55 PM, October 10th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It will not matter what you say or do...you could be Betty Crocker, Mother Theresa, and Victoria's Secret rolled into one

the visual image of this is to me! I keep wanting to say "Move along, nothing to see here" to my imagination.

When my XH became a cheater he also became an atheist in order to absolve himself of any moral obligations. He also became a feminist, declaring that marriage was an outdated institution based on ownership of women- because if he didn't believe in marriage then he didn't have to respect his own

THAT is some contortionist logic right there...


Me: 43, independent, happy, despite co-parenting with a lower muppet
FT "Stretch" (and Skew!) ;)
DS 13 DS 10
S 5/2010
D 12/2012

Posts: 5584 | Registered: May 2010 | From: a better place
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