So, I guess I'd love to hear any techniques ya'll have for dealing with this. My overwhelming feeling when he is doing X is "he did this to her, and took pleasure from it." I guess my major hangup seems to be him giving her pleasure. It kills me.
So, I have both stopped and not stopped having sex when this happens. (I am able to "carry on" sometimes and it goes away.) This morning we stopped and he just held me and I felt angry and betrayed. This is normal, right?
What I want from him at this time (besides making it un-happen, which he can't) is to somehow diminish it. He can in some regards, because he knows now that it was empty and meaningless and selfish, but I am looking for something more. It is like I want to hear something negative about the actual act. The problem is, I don't think he can come up with that except that it was wrong of him to do it, and then he tells me how he feels about it now.
It also certainly doesn't help that at the time, he thought he was expressing "love."
Sigh. This sucks. If someone can tell me they got through this stage, I'd appreciate it.
Edited for clarity
[This message edited by bionicgal at 7:24 PM, October 7th (Monday)]
DDay - June 2013, A was 2+ months
In MC & Reconciling
Global editing disclaimer - I edit almost everything I post, and I am not going to post why every time. ; )
I used to picture us making love in a room with a mirror (like in an interrogation room where the police can see through it). OW was on the other side watching us, unable to stop us, and seeing how little she meant to him. I could see her, but he couldn't. At first I thought it was a little out there, but I realized that it helped me take back sex since I felt like I had some control in all of this.
Were together 7+yrs, Ended R.
Hopefully, "this too shall pass... ?"
[This message edited by bionicgal at 1:08 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]
[This message edited by SI Staff at 1:10 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]
I showed a Facebook photo of OM to a few women I know. I didn't give them any background. They all said he looks like a dirty rat or some variation of that. One friend, who actually knows what happened, apologized for laughing. She said that when she heard my wife had cheated, she expected the guy to be really good-looking. She was shocked to see his photo.
Knowing he's an ugly dude has helped me when it comes to sex. It helps to know I'm more attractive and actually care for my WF.
Related, my WF hates that I did what I described above. I understand why, but it made having sex with her a better experience for me.
The mind movies that kill me are of them sharing non-sexual, intimate moments.
Not anyone that would ever turn a head, that is for sure. Cute at best, on a very good day. No vixen.
But, it is the fact that he was giving her pleasure that is killing me right now. Can I pretend she faked it? I don't know. Can anyone relate? How do I think my way out of that?
[This message edited by bionicgal at 1:39 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]
Can I pretend she faked it?
Yes. She was probably an ego boost for him. The A doesn't mean she was better at doing physical or emotional things. It doesn't mean she was prettier, either. She was pure ego kibbles.
I know this isn't easy. There are better days ahead. Keep leaning on us. We're here for you.
[This message edited by SI Staff at 3:00 PM, October 6th (Sunday)]
I don't always feel like this. . .but it is a rough one. I am alone with too much to do as well, so I am stressed and lonely.
Thanks for the support, guys.
you have NOOOO idea how much i feel your pain. UGH. it totally just sucks, doesn't it?!?!?
I have been working very hard these past couple months with my MC/IC to try and regain back the joy and pleasure i once found in sex. I mean, i enjoy it, but not like i used to, due to the A and the mind movies.
Once technique we came up with was to replace the mind movies. My IC says to think about my fantasies...really spend time thinking about them. Think about what i enjoy, what i like, what turns me on, etc. Then, create my own mind movies using those fantasies, and superimpose them over the yucko mind movies.
The other thing i have had to do that has helped was to deconstruct the A. I had this idea in my mind of what i thought it was. I had this epic, awesome grandiose love affair all played out in my head. Once I started asking questions, getting details about specific encounters, and their meet ups in general, I was able to wrap my head around what it really was...i am beginning to accept that it was nothing like what my WH and i had/have. So, sometimes, when i am struggling with mind movies, I try and go to the place that knows that OW never ever shared with my WH what i did. What they had wasnt an epic, awesome grandiose love affair...it was 2 broken selfish people sharing nothing more than sex that "wasnt better just different." She didnt get the best of him.
I'm not all the way there yet, and sometimes i still struggle. Its hard, but we are working on it together. Day by day, building new memories, a new marriage.
hugs to you.
If it's allowed, and works, the link is here: https://www.survivinginfidelity.com/text.forums.asp?tid507737
WH and I are 8 months from DDay now and, on the whole, are doing well. He is doing everything he should to help us heal. However, still, still, I find myself obsessing over the physical stuff. I've always struggled with this even knowing the reasons behind the A (WH FOO issues and poor/non-existent coping strategies) and knowing that the sex was bland, unfulfilling, even knowing that he was manipulated by a very mentally unstable OW. Still I struggle with mind movies especially during sex with WH.
But I have hope! My IC suggested picturing the mind movie that I have playing in black and white and poor quality - she said to project it onto a blank wall, large size. Then she asked if I could picture a good movie of me and WH - which I can ('twas quite explicit! ) and for this to play bottom left of the big movie in small size but colour and in HD. Next I had to stretch that small, glorious movie right over the top of the poor quality black and white one and focus on that!
Since then I've read more about this and a NLP technique called 'Swish' which really is just a posh way of saying what the above is.
When I tried it out I was concerned that it would take too long to 'set up both screens' etc as you are told to imagine !! But what I discovered is that before long simply the word 'swish' was working for me. In fact, I subconsciously changed the word from 'swish' to 'switch' as I found that when I said it to myself I immediately switched to another thought - any old thought not even necessarily A related.
I'm not saying that it will work forever, but even if it is just for a slight reprieve it may help. It is horrible to be in this position but we all need the help and support we can get.
These things helped me dodge the mind movies:
1. Imagine her cringing in the corner of the room crying watching you.
2. Imagine her alone and lonely in her cold bed.
3. Magnify her physical deficiencies. If she has big boobs imagine them flopping to her waist, if she has bad skin imagine it as much worse, if she has bad hair imagine it as lanky, greasy and smelly etc. Whatever applies in your sich, if she is overweight imagine her as monstrous.
4. Imagine their manoeuvres in bed as clumsy and awkward.
5. In your mind watch him getting out of bed and leaving her to go home. Watch her get back into bed alone and sad.
6. When he made a "new" request I flatly refused to participate. Tough luck for him. (I will never forget one night he did something quite new - my response "No f...ing way". We both knew he had done it with one of them even though we didn't discuss it. He never tried again.)
These worked for me in the early days and may help you.
Do what you feel comfortable with. You owe him nothing. It is his job to make you feel safe with him sexually.
- During the day I think about what I want to do with him at night. This can be simple or really planned like what I want to say, do, positions, wear, etc. It gets me in the excited for the evening. Sometimes I will email him with teasers.
- I initiate and tell him what I want
- I keep talking
- I tell him to talk and compliment me
- I don't try to please him, he is in charge of pleasing me
- If any thoughts sneak in I think of a stop sign and say "stop" in my head and then refocus on telling him what I want
I did ask him early on that he had to "throw me a bone" because I am 16 years older and the OW couldn't have been perfect, he told me the following:
- She asked him "What do you think of my 23 year old breasts?" (her words per wh) and he just mumbled because he knew mine were better. I don't mean to brag, but mine are darn awesome even after 2 kids :-)
- He said when he touched her, he felt her fat roll and felt disappointed. He thought she would have been in better shape.
- She shaved down there and was all stubbly. He felt she was trying to play up how young she was by shaving it all off and he didn't like it and he didn't like the stubble. (obviously, it wasn't a show stopper)
- Afterwards, he realized "She wasn't all that." but she flattered him and he needed the ego stroking. He struggled with ED for awhile and just started taking Viagra, so he said he felt young and virile, because she didn't know about his performance issues.
As much as I don't want to put other people down, it really helped me to hear those things. Therefore, I can make my own mind movies knowing there are things that he preferred with me.
[This message edited by ILINIA at 5:35 PM, October 8th (Tuesday)]
I do like the suggestions from everyone - I do picture the AP alone or watching us walk away together and it helps immensely.
UK Lady - good one! I remember that.
My FWH and I had chance to house sit for a friend. They have a pool and a fire pit, and a secluded backyard. We had a very romantic evening making love in the pool and then being in each others arms in front of a fire, all while under the stars. We just felt so very close. So now when mind movies (or guilt/shame for him) hit, we both use this memory to rebound and refocus us. Putting our sights and thoughts back on US and not OW.
4 - 6 months of TT'ing
RDay 7/2013 :)