For those of you with more than one d-day, looking back, were there signs that his R was false? That the A was still going on? That he was still lying through his teeth? Want to trust R, but obviously can't trust a thing right now.
Simply put, I was afraid he would leave and I was afraid to take my kids and go.
But after putting up with his antics again and again, I finally got myself to a position where I COULD go (finished my education, got a better job, etc).
When he cheated yet again, he was quite surprised when he wasn't "forgiven" yet again.
Looking back there were definitely signs. He never came clean. He only confessed to what I saw myself or someone else told me. Nothing more.
He NEVER gave me passwords to his (multiple) email accounts. He never apologized.
What should have slapped me awake was a point that I went to IC. He came along for a session, and was very happy to tell the IC all of my issues, but he never mentioned his repeated infidelity as a possible cause for any of it.
He also always had to have female "friends" and I was made to feel like I was controlling or paranoid if I objected.
WXH (serial cheater, 12+ OW. Undiagnosed SA?)
Note: I edit often for typos/clarity.
So, I'm just going with R/IC/MC for a year and and see where it leads us. I've been shooting for R, I swear I'm a good forgiving Catholic girl, but this shit sucks!! Jesus kept turning his cheek and so will I. Because you know what, it's dang hard, and hard is not what people want. People want easy and I'm not easy. lol. Ok, now I'm making myself laugh. I'm such a weirdo today...Again, sorry. Like someone told me, I just have better skills now...:) Gotta look at the bright side, right.
[This message edited by libertyrocks at 5:14 PM, July 31st (Wednesday)]
After the first affair he was still so angry that I spied on him, installed spyware on his phone, etc. when I caught him the second time he just handed me the phone and made me the administrator.
Yet... I still dont' think he has done much work as a WS, maybe has as a BS.
Now, I'm stronger. What i put up with back then I wouldn't put up with now. It's amazing how a little time can give you perspective.
That said, I can forgive his one affair. As of this time, I won't forgive his 2nd. He saw the agony it caused me and he did it again. i can't imagine how screwed up he was to do that to himself. Obviously, it will take a lot of introspective work to heal himself from this. I'm watching closely.
[This message edited by rachelc at 5:28 PM, July 31st (Wednesday)]
4 kiddos in lower 20's
“Courage is the price that life exacts for granting peace."
Looking back over last year, between DD#1 and DD#2, there were definite signs. If I knew then what I know now, I would have saved myself months and months of horrible pain and stress. What I can identify looking back as false R, gaslighting, and rugsweeping:
1. As time went on, he became less emotionally connected to what I was communicating about DD#1. He got frustrated when I talked about it or showed that I was upset. The remorse he showed initially faded over time.
2. The fights got more desperate on my side and closed off on his. I would explain, he would look blank or pained. I would explain MORE how I felt, he'd start to gaslight and deny. It escalated, rather than resolved as the year played out.
3. He was twitchy increasingly about transparency. I knew there were things I could ask about or see and things he would hackle up over.
4. His behaviors quickly reverted. When he was initially caught, we fought. He denied, used all the same bullcrap excuses we've all seen. Then, when he had no where else to run, he felt guilty and made promises. None of them stuck beyond a few months.
I'll be honest - DD#2 was worse than DD#1. It doesn't get easier. The only reason I'm around now is that all those things I listed above aren't part of the picture now - well, so far. I trust him less by a magnitude. Whatever illusions I had that his behavior was an isolated episode were blasted away in the radioactive mushroom cloud of DD#2. Anything resembling previous behavior is a complete deal breaker now.
And he knows it. I don't know how I would have managed without the education and information I learned here. I would have done at DD#1 what I did at DD#2 - kicked him out, had NC separation, arranged counseling, 180'd the hell out of him.
I hate to be all "eye for an eye" but my situation backs the premise that there has to be really strong measurable consequences for the idiots to have a chance of connecting to reality. They have to feel pain. You can't love them back. You can't "nice" them back. They have to do the work and make it right, or everything else is denial on both sides. Like a butterfly band-aid over a partial amputation - too little, no help, and just more debris to clean off later.
No, I didn't feel R was real after dday1. I honestly couldn't feel anything. I knew there was more and it finally TT'd out turning into dday2. Number 3...well, he considers it a dday, I really don't. It was just more specifics of what events I already knew had happened. I honestly think he just got tired of me informing him I knew more than he was telling me. Gut instinct. Now, my gut tells me I have it all and I do believe we are in R and R is real.
To address your specific questions at the end, not in R because of my gut feeling; the A was not still going on; he was lying by omission.
For me, the strength came from understanding I had to work healing myself stat. Didn't matter if that meant deep thought and evaluation or just remembering to drink a glass of water.
Hang in there.
Yes there were signs it was still going on but he's really good at covering his tracks. All I had was a gut feeling and his non chalant approach to R . He's nicer than before because first time around he was the devil incarnate. He says the right things and shows up promptly after work. No over night trips, no night's out with the boys. I suppose you could say we are both faking it. It's a shitty way to live but it is what it is. Hopefully this won't be my future.
[This message edited by Ostrich80 at 6:19 PM, July 31st (Wednesday)]
I went to talk to my ins agent who is a girl I've known since I was 18. She's actually married to my exbf (not sure if she knows that). Explained the reason for dividing my ins. She said her husband had cheated on her early in their marriage (16 yrs ago) and that she had cheated on him 2 years later. They got through it but she said it's never the same.I told her I heard its 2-5 years to heal from an affair and she said..."Noooooo...way longer, way, way longer."
I told her I've heard a lot of people ask themselves all the time "why did I stay?" and she said, "Oh yeah, I asked myself that just last week." And they've been married 14 years past HER affair.
I truly do respect and honor people with the strength to stay and face R. I thought I had that strength, and maybe *I* do. But I don't think my STBXWH does.
That is why I filed. And he proved me right by going back to see her 2 days before I actually had the chance to file.
I'm already fuzzy on the timelines. I keep a journal at home though. I keep one on here but haven't been posting too much on it lately.
I don't know why I kept up hope after the first false R. I worry that I'm a glutton for punishment sometimes. But what I think it really is, is loyalty to the end. I am someone that doesn't walk away from people easily at all. Even at my own expense.
I'm getting better slowly. 5 times more assertive than I ever was during the M.
Fast forward to 2012 - DDay 1 in my signature. He decided he was in love with a co-worker that he chatted with every day. She lives 1600 miles away. I asked him to leave again. We agreed on the day and when it came, I begged him to stay. He didn't.
The next few months were torture - until I found SI. This site saved me. I got stronger - and he noticed my indifference growing. He finally took his head out of his ass and we started dating again. After 10 months of separation, he moved home.
Two months later, I discovered that in between 2006 and 2012 there were 2 more OW. THAT night I told him that I had learned to live without him and I could do it again. He had to choose to get rid of all of his bad influences or he was out again. This time, he chose to stay. He dropped everything else!
So, I've had multiple DDays but each time I've learned a little bit more about myself. I am a strong woman who does NOT NEED a man to survive. I can take care of my kids, my house and me just fine.
He is the picture perfect husband right now. Our relationship has not been this good in years. Moving out made him appreciate what he always had but was too stupid to see. Even with his changes, I'm still waiting for that other shoe to drop.
IF there ever is another DDay, it will be the last. And divorce will immediately follow.
[This message edited by RedRose at 9:38 PM, July 31st (Wednesday)]
Luckily they were all sort of together so I just count it as two months of hell.
Definitely a gut feeling for me. My gut still churns away now about what happened but as I've always been a naturally untrusting person and wh has always been a rugs weeper and developed a violent temper due to his affairs , I had to weigh up the consequences of digging.
It became a scab and ripping it over time and time again. I just decided to say, look We have to move forward. But from this point on honesty and transparency is a must.
We're still working on the honesty and transparency part, but it's getting better.
[This message edited by lauren123 at 9:46 PM, July 31st (Wednesday)]
I am also a firm believer that you have to earn your way out of a marriage, you can't just walk away when it gets too hard. I made vows and was sticking to them. We went MC and he promised the world. Even had the therapist believing his BS stories. We also have a special needs child, I couldn't upend his world without trying to work things out. But you can't work things out on your own.
Oh..and my 4th dday...was a few weeks ago...when during an argument he blurts out that the encounter he told me about on dday3 was made up..he lied. He LIED. He told me this lie because I wouldn't stop asking him to tell me everything(because he has never admitted to anything that I didn't have absolute proof of and my gut was screaming). He lied. He purposely inflicted more pain on me. He knew what it did to me on dday1..and he turned around and did it again.
Now? he's all full of love for me..Im so wonderful..he can't live without me...
But no IC.
No SI(won't even read here).
Won't talk about what he did without yelling and getting mad).
I told him I needed to see more..and he's showing me nothing.
Walls are up...exit plan in progress.
[This message edited by confused615 at 5:54 AM, August 1st (Thursday)]
..that feeling you get in your stomach, when you heart's broken. It's like all the butterflies just died.
The last DDay came in the midst of a family tragedy. Emotionally I couldn't give him much. See, if XH wasn't "first", then he couldn't tolerate it. I was barely making it through the day, and then I found out he was up to his poor behavior, and knew I could never be with him again. He had to go.
FYI...even with documented proof of his last indiscretions, he denies it and has lied to our DD19's face about it all. Some things will NEVER change.
A counselor asked me a question, that has stuck with me. She asked "when does one mistake become a behavior trait?" I realized my XH didn't make a mistake, it was his behavior, and will probably always be his behavior.