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User Topic: What do you think?
anv5
♀ Member
Member # 39217
Question  Posted: 12:21 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest opinions please!!!

If a couple is separated but have not filed divorce papers...is it still cheating for one of them to have sex with someone else?

WH doesn't really see that part of what he did as cheating because "we were separated & I thought we were over" my opinion is then why could you not At Least file before screwing around with other women. Am I wrong? Also he hid this from me for almost 5years lying everytime I asked any questions about that time period...

Just want to know what other think...am I overreacting to consider it cheating & be so upset over it?


BS(me)30
WH 29
1 Child
Married 11 yrs
D-Day: 4/9/13 he cheated in '08 & now + trickle truth & tons of lies 6/27 Found more, swears I really do have the whole truth now.
2/2/14 found out more...it seems the TT never ends.
Trying to R

Posts: 71 | Registered: May 2013
NikkiD
♀ Member
Member # 38173
Default  Posted: 12:29 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yeah it is...at least have some papers drawn up even if they arent filed..

My WH did the same thing....


"Spoil me with Loyalty; I can finance myself...."
ME: BS-33
HE: WS-32
Married 3 years, known 20
2 kids
D-Day #1 12/30/12
False Recovery
D-Day #2 1/21/14
LTA 5 years-ish
Riding the "Struggle Bus"
Living apart....

Posts: 668 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Midwest
FeelingSoMuch
♂ Member
Member # 38814
Default  Posted: 12:30 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My personal thoughts only. If you're separated, you're not together. It's not cheating, but I imagine it still hurts like hell.


Me: BH
Her: WW
Together since 2001, married since 2007.
D-day: Feb. 20, 2013.
Broke NC: 2 phone calls since
Today: In MC and IC, attempting R.
It got easier: They no longer work together.

Posts: 505 | Registered: Mar 2013 | From: Canada
Tesa
♀ Member
Member # 10002
Default  Posted: 12:30 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

To me, this is about betrayal and lies. Maybe it's not "cheating" but does it matter whose definition is right? He lied to you all this time by not telling you when you specifically asked!

Posts: 1060 | Registered: Mar 2006
sportsfan
♂ Member
Member # 9918
Default  Posted: 12:37 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My good friend and his W were separated for a couple of years - they were not going to get back together - D was inevitable. They have since D.

Well into their separation he began seeing someone. She was/is nice and clearly good for him. Not until after their D did he tell his kids that he was seeing someone. They understood - they are actually more comfortable with her than they are with their own mom.

I don't consider that what he did was cheating. His M was over and he kept that relationship private out of respect for everyone.


Posts: 1929 | Registered: Feb 2006 | From: PA
losingmyground
♀ Member
Member # 36070
Default  Posted: 12:44 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree with sportsfan....at least it takes place after separation. I am sure it hurts just the same, but that would be an indicator that the marriage is over.


Married 13 yrs
3 kids 13, 10 & 1
I'm 34
FWH 37
Affair lasted 6 months
Ended 09/2011
Found out 06/2012
My father died during the affair
In the middle of Reconcilliation

Posts: 291 | Registered: Jul 2012
sisoon
♂ Member
Member # 31240
Default  Posted: 12:45 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The couple is still M. Sex with someone outside of M is cheating, by definition. No excuses.

It's not as evil as cheating without separation, and I'd certainly try to justify it if I did it myself, but it's cheating nonetheless.


fBH (me) - 65+, fWW (her) - 65+, Married 45+, together since 1965
DDay - 12/2010
Recovered, not yet fully R'ed
I share my own experience because it's the only experience I know, not because I'm a good model.

Posts: 9757 | Registered: Feb 2011 | From: Chicago area
sportsfan
♂ Member
Member # 9918
Default  Posted: 12:53 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'll add that my friend had filed for D well before he began seeing someone. There was 0 chance that they were going to even attempt R. It was a nasty D - she even went after his frequent flyer miles. The D took around 2 years - I didn't see any reason why he needed to wait until the papers were signed for him to begin enjoying life again.

Posts: 1929 | Registered: Feb 2006 | From: PA
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 12:57 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If a couple is separated but have not filed divorce papers...is it still cheating for one of them to have sex with someone else?

As sisoon stated, technically yes. In my opinion though, if the couple is separated and have no intentions of getting back together, then the marriage is already over so start living your life. It's a personal decision. Hiding the fact that you had sexual relations while separated is probably what makes it more like betrayal. It all depends on the mutual understanding of what the separation is for - is it a break to clear the air and catch your breath, or is it a formality on the path to D.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3741 | Registered: Dec 2011
cancuncrushed
♀ Member
Member # 28156
Default  Posted: 1:01 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Its never a good thing. BUt if you are separated the marriage is already in serious trouble. To me, if you move out, its probably over. Separation could be just time to divorce with clear head. No impulse. It all hurts. Mostly the lying. And rejection. I am not familiar with separation ending in happy marriage. I am familiar with lying spouses who avoid stepping up.


a trigger yesterday

Posts: 885 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: athome
anv5
♀ Member
Member # 39217
Default  Posted: 1:45 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just to clarify I had moved out because he was so angry & wanted me gone not because I wanted to leave. I was trying very hard to keep the marriage together & he said he needed "space" so I gave it to him. I guess I feel if it wasn't cheating then why did he make things up & lie for all these years. I had a right to know when we got back together too but that's a whole other story.

I guess most people don't consider it cheating. I guess maybe I would have felt differently if he had at least filed paperwork first & not moved her into the house he kicked me out of that I was still helping pay for. Or if it hadn't been with the woman who had spent a year & a half trying to break up our marriage. Or if he had told me then instead of me finding out after we have been back together for almost 5yrs (he didn't tell me I found out & had to pry it out of him) I don't know I guess I will just have to try to let it go.
Any advise how to let it go?


BS(me)30
WH 29
1 Child
Married 11 yrs
D-Day: 4/9/13 he cheated in '08 & now + trickle truth & tons of lies 6/27 Found more, swears I really do have the whole truth now.
2/2/14 found out more...it seems the TT never ends.
Trying to R

Posts: 71 | Registered: May 2013
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 1:48 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was trying very hard to keep the marriage together & he said he needed "space" so I gave it to him.

Sounds like in that context it was cheating. Again, if you are married, sex outside of the marriage is cheating. There are arrangements where it isn't betrayal because both parties are aware that they are no longer mutually exclusive, but it doesn't sound like that is your case.


Married: 17 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3741 | Registered: Dec 2011
Jospehine85
♀ Member
Member # 35971
Default  Posted: 2:08 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My personal opinion:

If you separated with the agreement that you would not see others and were actively working on the marriage with a goal of living together again, then it is cheating.

If when you separated it was because one partner told the other that he/she was done with the marriage and was moving on, then no it is not cheating.
There can't be any wishy-washiness about it. If it is clearly stated, "I am done, I am filing for divorce", then it is unrealistic for either partner to wait until the divorce is final to start seeing other people. Some divorces take years.

Like it was said above, it may hurt to find out that your partner did have sex with someone else, but you also have the choice not to take them back.

On a side note, it would be wrong to not tell your spouse that you have slept with other people prior to resuming the marriage.


Me - BS 40s
WH - 50s
4 Kids
Dday May 2012

Posts: 811 | Registered: Jun 2012
IAmPsycho
♀ Member
Member # 39337
Default  Posted: 2:23 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think it's cheating. Until the D is final, I think it's cheating. If a spouse wants to start dating, they should rush the divorce along. Around here a D takes about 60 days, surely pants can stay zipped for that long!


BS (me) 43
WS (him) 48
Married 25 years
Reconciling for 12 years
DDAY 01-16-01
A with my best friend
Lots of children from 24-4 weeks old

Posts: 62 | Registered: May 2013
MediumRare
♂ Member
Member # 35128
Default  Posted: 2:23 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My personal opinion is to stop yielding the benefit of the doubt to morally bankrupt people... period.

It's this kind of crazy making that BS's fall prey to and it needs to stop when you put your foot down and decide to stop playing into the madness.

In a lying, cheat's mind, it's not cheating if you're separated. Or.. it's not cheating if you're in a different zipcode. Or.. it's not cheating if they did it drunk. Or.. etc. etc. etc. See the pattern?

You both have rings, you both still have 50/50 marital assets and accountability, you both are Mr. and Mrs. and nobody told the other they could go fucking someone else, or if there was any doubt in the matter, a simple phone call or email question could have sufficed.

In the end, it's just MORE wayward bullshit and we shouldn't even be asking such questions or getting into the CRAZY making cheaters try to spin on their betrayed mates.


BS (ME): 44
WS(HER): 42
9 years
OM#1- 20-something loser, stole bunch of my things after she had sex with him in our bed (no condoms, STDs)
OM#2- 24 year old, unemployed loser, lives with mom & dad
DDay 1/2012
NC 3/20/2012
SGASDay 4/1/2012

Posts: 712 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: California
anv5
♀ Member
Member # 39217
Default  Posted: 2:25 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Like it was said above, it may hurt to find out that your partner did have sex with someone else, but you also have the choice not to take them back.

Maybe...but I really I took him back not knowing that he had sex with her. I knew she was around him but I believed him when he swore up & down that nothing had ever happened and nothing ever would, he didn't like her, she wasn't very nice to people, she wasn't attractive to him etc. So yes I had the choice of wether or not to take him back but not 4 1/2 years later I really don't feel that I made an informed choice because of the lies & maybe I would have still gotten back with him but it would have happened differently (including an std test)


BS(me)30
WH 29
1 Child
Married 11 yrs
D-Day: 4/9/13 he cheated in '08 & now + trickle truth & tons of lies 6/27 Found more, swears I really do have the whole truth now.
2/2/14 found out more...it seems the TT never ends.
Trying to R

Posts: 71 | Registered: May 2013
TrustedHer
♂ Member
Member # 23328
Default  Posted: 2:33 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Obviously, people have different opinions on this stuff.

I view "Marriage over" and "Divorce final" as two different milestones.

My marriage was over on the day I chose to file for divorce rather than shoot her and her lover (OM#3), those being the only 2 options I saw.

The Divorce is not yet final, 4 1/2 years later.

I'm a believer that "Marriage over" is the more important milestone; the rest is just courts and paperwork.

But separation with intent to reconcile is most certainly NOT "Marriage over", so yes, I agree, it's cheating. Or it's lying about the word "intent", which amounts to the same level of deceit.


Take care of yourself. There's a great future out there. It won't come to you; you have to go to it.

Posts: 5115 | Registered: Mar 2009 | From: DeepInTheHeartOf, TX
ifinallyfoundme
♀ Member
Member # 39523
Default  Posted: 6:59 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My personal opinion is to stop yielding the benefit of the doubt to morally bankrupt people... period.
It's this kind of crazy making that BS's fall prey to and it needs to stop when you put your foot down and decide to stop playing into the madness.

In a lying, cheat's mind, it's not cheating if you're separated. Or.. it's not cheating if you're in a different zipcode. Or.. it's not cheating if they did it drunk. Or.. etc. etc. etc. See the pattern?

You both have rings, you both still have 50/50 marital assets and accountability, you both are Mr. and Mrs. and nobody told the other they could go fucking someone else, or if there was any doubt in the matter, a simple phone call or email question could have sufficed.

In the end, it's just MORE wayward bullshit and we shouldn't even be asking such questions or getting into the CRAZY making cheaters try to spin on their betrayed mates.


I agree, it is cheating until the divorce is finalized, declared etc. I've seen too many couples reconcile even while going through divorce. The married partner is hands off and I personally do not want to be someones rebound.

There is always a chance, no matter how small the couple may get back together and as long as they are legally bound . As someone says if you are that excited about dating again, speed up the divorce.

[This message edited by ifinallyfoundme at 7:00 PM, June 17th (Monday)]


Posts: 180 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: United States
million pieces
♀ Member
Member # 27539
Default  Posted: 7:23 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I view "Marriage over" and "Divorce final" as two different milestones.

My marriage was over on the day I chose to file for divorce rather than shoot her and her lover (OM#3), those being the only 2 options I saw.

The Divorce is not yet final, 4 1/2 years later.

I'm a believer that "Marriage over" is the more important milestone; the rest is just courts and paperwork.

But separation with intent to reconcile is most certainly NOT "Marriage over", so yes, I agree, it's cheating. Or it's lying about the word "intent", which amounts to the same level of deceit.

Totally agree.


Me - 42
2 kids, 9 and 11
D-Day 2/5/10, separated 3 wks later
Divorced 11/15/11!!!!

Posts: 1231 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: MD
silverhopes
♀ Member
Member # 32753
Default  Posted: 7:28 PM, June 17th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So let me get this straight...

The OW had been sniffing around for 1.5 years while you two were married, trying to break up your marriage.

Your H said he "needed space" and kicked you out, though you wanted to keep your M. --> Right there, that sounds like wishy washy on his part. He did not clearly intend to file for D, nor did he even clearly say "we're separating", just "I need space from you".

You two remained in contact during the "separation" - were you two intimate during this period? Did he ever lead you to think that you might get back together? - and the whole time he screwed the OW in the home you two still owned and had her live there with him like a wife. And lied about it.

Then, after you moved back in and the marriage was "on" again, he lied to you for 4.5 years and didn't tell you that he'd slept with her, etc. And you found out on your own. (Did you know she was living there with him? If so, and he was lying about their "involved" status - then yeah, even bigger red flag. You don't not tell your wife that you've moved another woman in to the marital home and are screwing her after kicking your wife out of said marital home. You just DON'T. If he wanted to play girlfriend with someone else, he should have ended the marriage by filing, then honestly told you that he was seeing someone else, and then properly fought you over the home, not just simply moved in your "replacement" - at least be an outright cheater instead of a hidden one. What a mindf*cking asshole )

Yeah, I'd say that's cheating. There's nothing "marriage over" about it - more like "I'm cake-eating and cloaking the truth in shadows to be able to do whatever the fuck I want without consequences or hard work", from how it sounds.

How long after you moved out did he start sleeping with her? Do you suspect an EA or even PA was going on before the "separation"? I'm sorry, the whole thing sounds very fishy, and since he wasn't honest and didn't handle it with integrity, I don't feel like he has the right to use the argument "we were separated". That's invalidating. He was cake-eating.

[This message edited by silverhopes at 7:39 PM, June 17th (Monday)]


Find peace. Or sleep on it.
"Not my monkeys. Not my circus." ~Polish proverb (<~~~ as a codependent person, this comes in handy sometimes!)

Posts: 3882 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: California
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