Next time, I'm quoting you, should be an insightful response
I was most definitely in your shoes through the 8th month. It actually came out very sarcastic and bitter. What happened was an eye opener. Her reply of "I honestly don't know" gave me an opening for suggestions that she actually seemed to accept. She didn't feel that *I* was force feeding her the answers, rather guiding her to them.
I learned a lot from that simple question.
Quit it and don't go there!
"Drop That Smurf! This question assumes that a smurf requires oxygen to survive, which is a valid assumption considering smurfs fear drowning as much as any normal air-breathing creature does.
Furthermore, if smurfs require oxygen, then they must have some kind oxygen-transport molecule in their bloodstream. In vertebrates, this molecule is heme with an iron atom at its center and is what gives blood its red color. Since smurfs appear to be vertebrates, we can assume they also have heme in their blood. Now when a naked-skinned vertebrate is choked, namely humans, their faces turn red because surface capillaries in the skin dilate and blood rushes in. Assuming the same thing happens to smurfs, their faces would turn purple. Believe it or not, this was answered on an episode of the Smurfs, in which one of them threatened to hold his breath until he turned red. But instead he turned a dark purple.They are peaceful creatures, for one you should not choke them.Choking smurfs is illegal.Let's pretend that smurfs are little blue human beings. Human beings turn red at first when you choke them. Red+Blue = Purple.I happen to know from experience, that if you choke a smurf (which you can do), they turn invisible. Its actually a very simple concept if you are intelligent enough to understand it, which, unfortunately, none of you are.I once choked a smurf, but seeing as they don't have any lungs it didn't do anything.I'm sure if you choke a Smurf they would turn white. It Chokes the blue right out of em.Logically, I would say red, but I think it would be sweet if they turned green or orange or something really bright."
[This message edited by Stillkicking at 11:44 AM, June 14th (Friday)]
Apathy is a weapon of mass destruction
It's ok to feel lost, it just means your alive.
Speaking of tag lines gents, I'm running a contest for a new tag line for StillLovingHer down in F&G with only modest (read could be funnier) results. A little help for our brother?
She was miserable the whole time. It was too hard for her to listen for an entire day because it, in her words, "painted the betrayer as a bad guy."
Defiled, my mouth dropped open when I read this. Stunning, but it explains the mindset of a wayward. Somehow, they were justified in committing the ultimate marital crime. Someone else (you) must be the "bad guy", right?
What is the BM thread if not "a bucket of truth?" Thank you FP.
Rock on Brothers....
Question is whether you're still being the fool if you've been through that process of steering and the WS has already been trying to pull the wool over your eyes and demonstrating token compliance... When do you decide you get to make that call to distinguish between compliance and participation, remember, we're pretty whacked initially ourselves, and then, when do you let your WS know that their compliance or pretend R is bullshit (or do you let them know at all)???
Well, that's the thing I guess. Doesn't matter who is driving if the one behind the wheel is taking directions from the passenger.
I'm not sure if there is a way to differentiate compliance from authentic participation in the moment - and that's why I think early on you should steer your course. Lay out your boundaries and don't let her change your direction. Tell her you need drive to MC at least once a week, and she needs to see a doctor. She can ramp up her acting skills and fake it, but that's really the best anyone can ever do - be honest about their own shit and what they need and want.
If she doesn't want to do that work you can't make her. Going with the driving thing still, you can drive her to MC but you can't make her go in. You CAN leave her ass at the curb instead of compromising and just driving on with her giving directions from the passenger seat.
Don't feel like a fool for being authentic. Being authentic is fucking hard.
I'm triggering a bit this weekend
Father's Day weekend 2012 had a blow out with my WW when I discovered a secret CC bill. She left us for a week and spent the night at a hotel. Doing god knows what. Discovered she was hooked on pain meds and told some people I was an asshole to put it gently. I asked her when she returned if she had an affair. Her response
Someone else (you) must be the "bad guy", right?
Her reaction to the conference really was a strange experience. From a therapy standpoint I think she was expecting for two things to be addressed. 1) how to get a BS to come to terms with the A, and how to direct clients in the healing process. And 2) What went wrong in the marriage to cause the A, and how to fix those marital issues to prevent it from happening again.
She didn't get anything close to that. Instead the presenter opened with something along these lines. First off let us get one thing out of the way. Nothing and I mean nothing in the marriage caused the A. The A was caused by a character flaw in the betrayer. Blaming the A on problems in the marriage is a non-starter.
Ouch, right of bat she knew she was in trouble. I don’t want to bore you with everything that was covered, I mean it was a long day of session after session. But from a therapy stand point she really was expecting fixing the marriage to be part of it. She was told that all those perceived problems in the marriage are now basically mute. The A made the marriage and those vows it was based on null and void. The betrayer has very little room to demand anything of the marriage. The only step if the betrayed is willing is to start a completely new marriage and somehow find a way to recreate trust, love, and respect. That is a daunting proposition for anyone. Especially when you still has kids to care for, jobs to work, and bills to pay. It’s not like high school, or college, or even the A for that matter, where you can dedicate all your time together on the relationship.
Not sure if everyone here agrees with that take, starting from scratch I mean. But I realized early on that was something I would probably need. My WW would have to make me be IN love with her again. Expecting me to STILL be in love and for that to carry us through just wouldn’t cut it.
Mister rabbit says, "A moment of realization is worth a thousand prayers."
MC Jack _ I had period of this too. Mine was more like . . checking her out and then wondering if she would have been faithful or not. Ultimately it would lead me back to a trigger or despair about the choices I made in my life.
It was a bad time for me, but I got better by realizing that my W made some bad choices for the wrong reasons. I made choices for the right reasons and continue to do so. That is all I can control inside or outside a relationship. My choices. It can take some time to get there, but it makes it easier for me most days.
Now I just think . . .Wow, no matter how good she looks I bet there is a husband at home who is tired of listening to her."
FP- Nice Fathers day combo. Mind if I borrow ?
DS 1, DD 6
Dday 8/31/11. ONS that occurred 3 years earlier. Lied to for 3 years.
Discovered she was hooked on pain meds and told some people I was an asshole to put it gently.
Does your WW have her drug issues under control or is she getting help?
My STBXWW was abusing the hell out of xanax, hydrocodone, valium, morphine, and methadone during the last few months of her A. She had used them periodically throughout our marriage but towards the end it was scary at times. Ironically if it wasn't for her drug use I don't know that I would have found out about her A. We were working through her addiction issues (which had already drained me emotionally towards her) and she drops the A on me.
She not only blames me for the A but she tried to pin the drugs on me too. According to her if only I showed that I cared more she would not have needed to abuse the meds and had an affair. She would have been a healthy functioning adult right? NOT!!
I can work with the addiction stuff but the A and blaming on top of it all was just too much. It showed me how into herself my STBXWW really is.
I'm triggering a bit this weekend
Me too, brother.
I need to go do something, exciting.
Maybe skydiving -- but I don't trust the local place.
True story -- a few years ago I went along with a couple of buddies who were doing newbie tandem jumps. I did not jump (pragmatic family man, you know).
Anyway, while they were training I was watching one of the employees pack some chutes. He said his regular job was construction, but he was currently suspended -- for safety violations.
I'm not sure if there is a way to differentiate compliance from authentic participation in the moment
I'm triggering a bit this weekend
Me too, brother.
I'm with you B444, Later. I might have hit the anger stage. Can't hardly stand to look at my wife, and my blood has been boiling for a few days now. If it wasn't FD Weekend coming up, I'd probably get out of town for the weekend. I couldn't do that to my kids, who right now are the only reason I'm not divorcing her lying, cheating ass.
Not sure if everyone here agrees with that take, starting from scratch I mean. But I realized early on that was something I would probably need. My WW would have to make me be IN love with her again. Expecting me to STILL be in love and for that to carry us through just wouldn’t cut it
I agree with this. It's tough when you have 15 years of history. But for me, I had to start over, cause she blew the shit out of our old marriage.
But for me, it wasn't about my wife making me fall in love with her again. It was proving to me that she was worth being in love with.
I still loved her. But even with that love, I was ready to divorce her cheating ass. She had to show me that my love for her was in my best interest.
I'm with you B444, Later. I might have hit the anger stage. Can't hardly stand to look at my wife, and my blood has been boiling for a few days now. If it wasn't FD Weekend coming up, I'd probably get out of town for the weekend. I couldn't do that to my kids,
Eaxctly what I have been thinking all day.
I have heard of women getting on the same "cycle"...maybe that is happening to us.