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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts-11
Compartmented
Member
Member # 29410
Default  Posted: 10:53 PM, September 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

duplicate post - sorry!

[This message edited by Compartmented at 10:54 PM, September 17th (Tuesday)]


Posts: 1062 | Registered: Aug 2010
trappe25
♀ New Member
Member # 38513
Default  Posted: 11:50 PM, September 17th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ripped - I am in awe.

Please keep posting. Your strength gives me strength and here I was thinking you needed strength. You may, yes, but I am in awe of your power. When I grow up, I guess I can hope to be more like you - no kidding. I will not only think of you during this time, but I will also draw strength from your composure during the last months/years you have endured so well . I just started watching A Game of Thrones of all things - renting it. I absolutely love it, but do not recommend it to watch, as prostitution is throughout, but that does not affect me - strippers and massage parlors do and only when I'm with H. But I'm watching this alone and reading the book now. But anyway, there is a very strong Lady of the North - don't remember her name, but she is so strong and composed and I think you and her character are similar in your approach to chaos. I will use her face when I think of your struggles. She loved her H very much and one day he came home with a bastard child (don't even know for sure if it is his) but she never lost her love for him. It's really quite interesting - I don't get to watch TV much either but felt the need to watch it, but anyway, her character is written quite strongly (as other female characters are also - but lots of nudity for the men). This is strange, but when watching it, I try to draw from her character's strength also - dealing with such turmoil with such dignity. I can only hope I can raise my next generation to be able to possess such traits. Strength and dignity in the worst of times. That is a goal I will work on. Thank you for your post and good thoughts to you.


Posts: 27 | Registered: Feb 2013
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 8:19 AM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Compartmented - good to "see" you too. No, the divorce drags on. Not only dealing with a SA, but an NPD. The attorneys say he's the worst they've dealt with in more than ten years. I think that says it all. But the good news is that my children are living with me and thriving for the past two years.

Trappe -
I've been reading your posts, and I just wanted to reach out and say I hope that you're NOT being dignified. This is still your time to yell and howl and cry and rock the boat and express your outrage and confront actions that are wrong, are unconscienceable. I read the following quote recently, and I think that all too often it applies to the wives of SAs, myself included in the past. We have been taught somewhere along the line to suffer in silence, to forgive over and over again to partners who are sometimes not worthy of forgiveness, to quash our feelings of hurt and outrage. Some of us are taught that all men cheat, but I know that's not true. I know a dozen men who wouldn't cheat on their wives.

A part of a healthy conscience is being able to confront consciencelessness. When you teach your daughter, explicitly or by passive rejection, that she must ignore her outrage, that she must be kind and accepting to the point of not defending herself or other people, that she must not rock the boat for any reason, you are NOT strengthening her posocial sense, you are damaging it-and the first person she will stop protecting is herself.

― Martha Stout, The Sociopath Next Door

Or acc'd to Jane Eyre, "I would rather be happy than dignified."

I hope this makes a little sense. Haven't had my coffee yet, but I just want you to know that dignity is bullshit when someone is hurting you. I did that for years, and ultimately I was left broken and without any dignity at all. Because it was only pretend dignity. Women who have real dignity wouldn't let their husbands do what mine did over and over again.

- Hope


Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
UMBL
♀ Member
Member # 39605
Default  Posted: 9:03 AM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey everyone - just a drive by post. I can't keep up with everyone! :(

It's end of year for the government so crazy busy at work for me and no time between therapy/meetings to really focus that much on anything other than getting what I have to get done actually done. It's a good distraction though. My H got his 3 month chip at group and I just pray that he "remains true to himself" as it says on the little chip.

This week I have struggled a bit with insecurity and fear on my end and wondered if he was up to something. Maybe because I'm so distracted with work I feel a distance that really isn't there. But then I let go and focus back on what I need to. That's really all I can do. As a control freak, that's a really hard pill to swallow though for me. I feel like I'm being lulled into heartbreak.

Thanks for all the words of wisdom Missy, Hath, CD, and the rest - love you women. Outta - if you are on or read this - let's touch base this week - in PEN not pencil - all my deadlines are today and then I'm FREE :) !!

Hope everyone has a fabulous Hump Day!


BW - UMBL "Unhappily Married But Looking". His most recent Yahoo chat group
WH - SA
Blended Family - 2nd Marriage
DDay #1 - Jan 2009
DDay #2 - June 2013

Posts: 57 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Alabama
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 9:45 AM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UMBL - Good to "see" you! I agree, sometimes being busy helps during the crisis.

RS - Sounds like you are a very rational woman. Seems many of the COSAs I know are logical women, not to say that they don't lose it sometimes but are overall quite logical. I don't think it matters whether you go to S-Anon or COSA. Pretty much the same literature and steps. There are no S-Anons close to me, so I go to COSA. I also go to CODA, since SA isn't the only addiction we are dealing with. Those are almost exactly the same steps, too. The only difference being I am powerless over others instead of I am powerless over SA.

AFM, we had another really good MC session this week. I requested that we start doing check-ins every week about recovery, so we set up how we are going to do that. Talked about how he chose me because I represented the "good mother" for him, that he had always been seeking. Just really love our MC CSAT, she is gentle but firm. We would not be able to progress in recovery as a couple without MC. Off to take care of the day!


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
cds22
♀ Member
Member # 39083
Default  Posted: 3:15 PM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Is this co-addiction?

My spouse is eating us out of house and home! He has always been a normal BMI but my guess is he is now a little overweight or right at the line. He is literally devastating entire bags of chips, boxes of crackers, jars of olives each night after I go to bed. The kids and I have no snacks -- I fantasize about putting a bike lock on our main food cabinet at night.

This started about 3 weeks ago. He has maintained his sobriety, still actively in recovery. We do have some life stressors right now. And due to the CSAT and Sponsor both digging in he has been on a very stressful run of 3-4 nights per week of SA/group/IC plus 1-2 nights of his paid job for a deadline plus spending time with the kids every minute he can. He is def. stressed and miserable with this schedule.

Anyway, I thought he should talk to his CSAT about this but he thinks stuffing his face is an embarrassing and irrelevant topic. But, isn't this co-addiction? Or at least maladaptive coping?

Thanks in advance for any insight!


Posts: 210 | Registered: Apr 2013
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 3:42 PM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh, yeah. My SAWH has definitely had struggles with carb addiction! Since he has given up work addiction, drug addiction and sex addiction, the carb one has been the last one for him to workout. Has your SAWH had any other addictions? Workaholism or over exercising? I know friends that have become sober from alcohol or drugs have said that food or cigarettes were a common thing to turn to early in recovery.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
cds22
♀ Member
Member # 39083
Default  Posted: 4:27 PM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks missymomma!

He has had some tendencies toward work addiction--no other addictions. Somewhat low level I think and hard to judge because in his field everyone works long hours. He was always happy to take vacation etc, but the seriousness and extreme rigidity and anxiety he had about work struck me sometimes like work addiction. He hasn't had any work addiction issues though since he started recovery from SA -- he is much healthier about work and has learned some good coping skills I think from the SA meetings that he has applied to work issues.

But, man is he stuffing his face!! I am hopeful when you say it may be transitory. I would just hate for him to trade addictions. And selfishly I would appreciate a snack now and then rather than finding empty bags and boxes everywhere!

[This message edited by cds22 at 4:28 PM, September 18th (Wednesday)]


Posts: 210 | Registered: Apr 2013
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 7:25 PM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

dignity is bullshit when someone is hurting you

OMG!!! I just may have this tattooed on my body.

And the overeating? He's substituting one addiction for another and should talk to his IC about it. I've been to NA meetings when celebrating anniversaries with a family member. The cigarette smoke is overwhelming, the coffee flows constantly and many are overweight. I also see a lot of spouse of addicts that overindulge with food to help us cope. I am a sweet addict, and it becomes a problem sometimes.

Trappe...I don't know what to say to you, except to encourage you to put yourself first. It's true there are some awful ICs and CSATs. A leading CSAT in my area doesn't get good reviews from many people. That's one of the reasons I suggest COSA or SANON. It's often a source of "gossip" about the best info and help to deal with SA.

On the issue of meetings, it's really about finding the chemistry. And that is never about the format of the meeting or the philosophy of the program, it's about the actual attenders. At least for spouses.

For SAA vs SA my SAfWH attends both depending on the night. While SAA has somewhat looser definitions, they do practice the "inner and outer" circle behaviors which he has used with his IC, and which I believe has helped him define his sobriety. To tell you the truth, I stayed out of it, left it up to him, his sponsors and his IC. That meeting also had a component that served to scare him straight. Many of the attenders were residential patients. Many were "famous" or prestigious in some way. And they were all on the verge of losing EVERYTHING; family, money, and liberty, as some were facing criminal charges. For my SAfWH, whose life was centered around making himself into a bigshot in whatever way he could, this was an eyeopener. These true BIGSHOTS were in the same boat he was. Scum who had compromised his family, marriage and morals for some low life whore(s).

He also attends an SA meeting because it is more convenient. I truly don't think there is a significant difference to him in our geographic area.

His one venture into a SLAA meeting wasn't positive. He experienced a number of people recanting their slips and felt that there was a level of voyeurism and arousal as a result among the others. Or maybe just in himself. In any event, he didn't go back, despite the fact that he probably fits their description better than the profile of an SA.

Just as a personal note, I DETEST the term SLAA-Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous. There is NOTHING loving about what goes on in the minds of an addict.


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 11:23 PM, September 18th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

His one venture into a SLAA meeting wasn't positive. He experienced a number of people recanting their slips and felt that there was a level of voyeurism and arousal as a result among the others. Or maybe just in himself. In any event, he didn't go back, despite the fact that he probably fits their description better than the profile of an SA.

I read this and let out a long, sad sigh. My STBX hooked up with multiple women (and probably men) from his group. I don't recall anymore which group it was, but it was a well-regarded 12-Step Group in a major metropolitan area.


Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
UMBL
♀ Member
Member # 39605
Default  Posted: 9:20 AM, September 19th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh sK and Choosing!! Your statements just freaked me out completely! I had never really thought about that potential. My H goes to SA meetings - he did not like the SAA meetings at all and felt they were too lenient with slips. He did mention that there are no women in his group and he wouldn't go to a group that was mixed - but given the right opportunity or strong enough pull this early in his recovery, I'm not sure that would stop him. ughggh....


BW - UMBL "Unhappily Married But Looking". His most recent Yahoo chat group
WH - SA
Blended Family - 2nd Marriage
DDay #1 - Jan 2009
DDay #2 - June 2013

Posts: 57 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Alabama
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 3:35 PM, September 19th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Yikes! That is a little scary. I do know of SAs that hooked up with others in their other 12 step group, AA. My SAWH has said that they do not get into specifics at his SA meetings, so as not to make it titillating. Seems those that indulge in specifics should be called out on that behavior in a healthy group!


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 4:43 PM, September 19th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

There are no guarantees, even in a recovery group. I've heard of a fair number of addicts meeting in recovery and pairing up, only to reinforce addictions. I've also heard of partnerships that were successful, their sobriety being a connection, and allowing them to support one another. My experience here has been in AA, NA and the related -anons. I also think there are VERY FEW women in SA recovery, not because they don't need it, but because it's not recognized or admitted. VERY few men in COSA or SANON.
And, of course, the key is a healthy recovery group. SAFWH's SAA group is lead by a professional, the others are peer led.

[This message edited by scaredyKat at 4:44 PM, September 19th (Thursday)]


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
SpaceJane
♀ Member
Member # 40303
Default  Posted: 8:15 PM, September 19th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you all for your answers and comments regarding the SA and SAA groups. I am so scared now of these groups! :( my WH just started going, I tried to ask him who was there and if there were any long term recovery people but he said nobody said how long they had been sober. I think it's peer led, I wish these meetings were led by some kind if professional. Sighhh..

I have had no luck with the SANON group by me, have called them and emailed them and nothing :( the CoSA group is more of an hour away .. I thought these meetings were everywhere :(

I left my home a month ago when I found out about the acting out, and since then we have decided to work on the marriage. I will be coming back home next week but I am not sure how to deal with things when I am there. Do you sleep in separate rooms? Resume "normal" life, like making dinner and walking the dog together?? We don't have kids so it was always just him and me, and our puppy :/ I really don't know how to act. I feel like we need to re-connect and there is so much to talk about but at the same time I don't want to make it seem like I am ok and hand it to him so easy :/ ... Any advice on what works and what doesn't when starting again? Is the 180 helpful in this situation?


Me BS: 29
SAWH: 29
M: 3yrs ; T: 12yrs
DDay1: 8/11/13 confessed to tip of the iceberg.
DDay2: 8/26/13 Found secret email, 7 yrs of CL casual encounters, dating websites, massage parlors, etc.

Posts: 61 | Registered: Aug 2013
womaninflux
♀ Member
Member # 39667
Default  Posted: 10:39 PM, September 19th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SJ I think you are smart to want to have a plan.

My SAWH and I are sleeping in separate rooms right now. We have kids (and dog!). Business is pretty usual otherwise - attending family events, school functions, going on family trips, etc. But I refuse to pretend we are a married couple when we are really just roommates at this point (and it's been like this for soooooo long and I just put up with it for way too long).

So definitely think about your boundaries and talk about them. "I will come home while we work on our relationship. I will sleep in the bedroom and you will sleep in the guest room. Please take all of your stuff out of our bedroom and use the other bathroom. We will eat dinner together and plan to spend X time together over the weekend. We will set aside X time every night to talk and reconnect." You get the idea. Also, talk about your expectations for R and his recovery, as well as what his goals are. And review these regularly. Talk about how therapy is going. Get the communication going.

ETA: Don't be scared of the groups. Most people are helped by them. It's actually comforting for SAs to know others who struggle with the same issues as this is something they never talk about and they are isolated with.

[This message edited by womaninflux at 10:42 PM, September 19th (Thursday)]


BS - mid-40's
SAWH - mid 40's
Kids - 2 elementary school aged
Getting tons of therapy and trying to "work it out"

Posts: 812 | Registered: Jun 2013
cds22
♀ Member
Member # 39083
Default  Posted: 11:39 AM, September 20th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SJ-Is he seeing a CSAT? Is the inpatient rehab an option at all?

I sort of have the vibe you are thinking about this as normal infidelity (eta: not his actions but more in terms of your response), don't make it too easy for him, etc. In my view, this is a sickness and it is all about protecting yourself and setting him/you up for the max chance of success at recovery.

I don't know the data on this, I don't even know if there is any. But everyone I have heard of who has been in successful long-term recovery worked with a CSAT in addition to SA group. The reality is that that the relapse rate is so high and the recovery rate so low that in my view you want to cross every T and dot every I to even have a hope of success.

I think it is a very good idea to think about your personal boundaries. For example, is his working with a CSAT one of your requirements for moving back in or remaining in the house? Do you want to be intimate yet? If not, separate bedrooms may make that whole situation less awkward. What kind of meeting and IC attendance do you need to feel comfortable staying?

I actually typed out a MS word document of my boundaries in our early days.

Only you know the best decision. I guess I just wonder, given that you have moved out, whether you want to time your re-entering the house with him being fully in recovery (that is CSAT plus SA meetings, sustained attendance for X period). Unfortunately -- and I speak from grim experience here as probably one of the people with a H with a faster early recovery curve - - there will be very little, probably zero productive working on the relationship in the first two months your H is in CSAT/SA group treatment. I personally noticed my H started acting like a considerate and loving partner again at the two month point -- though many are years out in treatment and haven't seen that consistently. However, we haven't really worked on our marriage in earnest and we think the earliest we can turn to that is this winter, almost a year after D-day. I have been looking into some books and we meet once a month with a MC as a stop-gap and to give me some hope, but that is it. And again, my H seems to be on the far tail of more rapid recovery so I think it is often worse.

I am saying all this because I want you to have realistic expectations and make the decision with full info. I would never have believed had someone told me last spring that after an infidelity it would be close to a year before we could even START intensive repair of our M . . . but that is the sad reality of SA treatment.

[This message edited by cds22 at 2:18 PM, September 20th (Friday)]


Posts: 210 | Registered: Apr 2013
cds22
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Member # 39083
Default  Posted: 11:40 AM, September 20th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SK, I have been thinking of you and sending positive wishes into the universe for your son. How is he doing?

Posts: 210 | Registered: Apr 2013
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 4:20 PM, September 20th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SJ - I absolutely agree with cds. Unless you absolutely have to for financial reasons, I would wait to move back in until you see the ball rolling. There is no way to work on a relationship with an addict until they are well into recovery. Their brains just can't be open to it until they have learned to take personal responsibility and in my SAWH's case, stop looking at themselves as the victim. If you are moving back in, definitely have some very clear boundaries. Love the idea of writing it out. Suggestions I received later in recovery were that you will go to treatment by _________ date, that you start working with a CSAT immediately, that disclosure will be done by ________, that we will not be intimate until I am ready and for at least 90 days, and there were a few more. I have to run but wanted to chime in.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
PollyA
♀ New Member
Member # 40567
Default  Posted: 6:03 PM, September 20th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SJ, I don't know your story, but like you, we do not have children, but a doggie son and a kitty daughter. My h claims the SA moniker and agrees it might stand for Selfish Asshole

on another page was a list of many places to go for help, and we've found the recoverynation.com site a pro-active way for both the SA and the partner affected by sa to deal with issues. There's also a Couple section which can help you decide what borders you have, values, and contacts for behaviors that are unacceptable.

we have found this very helpful. MC moves way too slow for me, and it's expensive. H still attends meetings and has a close buddy who is 15 years sober from his own complicated addictions.

He seems to be doing well, but I never guessed that for 6 years he had anonymous sex with 75 dudes, so I don't trust my powers of observation. he's always been fun to be with, but he's much more fun to be around, now that he is in recovery, that's for sure.

[This message edited by PollyA at 7:41 PM, September 20th (Friday)]


BW - 2 x's
WH - SA
DD1 - 4/2001 - 1 OW, left, returned, therapy
DD2 - 8/2013 - 75 anonymous men

Posts: 15 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: NYC
PollyA
♀ New Member
Member # 40567
Default  Posted: 6:03 PM, September 20th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SJ, I don't know your story, but like you, we do not have children, but a doggie son and a kitty daughter. My h claims the SA moniker and agrees it might stand for Selfish Asshole

on another page was a Liszt of many places to go for help, and we've found the recoverynation.com site a pro-active way for both the SA and the partner affected by sa to deal with issues. There's also a Couple section which can help you decide what borders you have, values, and contacts for behaviors that areunacceptable.

we have found this very helpful. MC sends way too slow for me. and expensive. H still attends meetings and has a close buddy who is 15 years sober from his own complicated addictions.

He seems to be doing well, but I never guessed that for 6 years he had anonymous sex with 75 dudes, so I don't trust my parts of observation. he's always been fun to be with, but he's much more fun to be around, now that's for sure.


BW - 2 x's
WH - SA
DD1 - 4/2001 - 1 OW, left, returned, therapy
DD2 - 8/2013 - 75 anonymous men

Posts: 15 | Registered: Sep 2013 | From: NYC
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