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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts-11
outtanowhere
♀ Member
Member # 39001
Default  Posted: 7:44 AM, August 25th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WIF,

Unfortunately that's the best they can do right now besides showing you true remorse. Positive signs? I would certainly think so!

May the light keep shining on all of us!


BS - 57
SAWH - 60 multiple encounters with prostitutes and other sex workers
Married 36 years
Dday - 2/19/13 - found the emails
I'm not crazy I'm just a little unwell

Posts: 497 | Registered: Apr 2013
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 8:34 AM, August 25th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Very good signs. The fact that he is sharing, huge.
In my experience, both with sanon and with the couples meetings, addicts and the partners who are working the steps are among the wisest people on earth. If the addict is able to get out of his own ego,and the partner able to get out of their pain and well earned indignation, there isn't a better place to learn about how to cope, not only with this addiction, but with other dysfunctions in one's life. It isn't a silver bullet, and it doesn't provide a script, but the 12 steps teach how to manage your OWN life. And those with long sobriety teach by example.
But DO insist, as one of your boundaries that he begin working actively with a sponsor. He needs to do that to really do the work.


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 9:03 AM, August 25th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Woman - Yes, good signs! They are certainly better than red flags, LOL. SK is right about working with a sponsor. A good sponsor.

Outta - So glad you are having fun with the GBs! Time with kiddos is the best. Don't have any yet, but some of my best friends already do.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
84CF
♂ Member
Member # 40112
Default  Posted: 4:00 AM, August 26th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am slowly discovering that i think I belong in this forum. I feel so deceived, so violated, so used, so afraid, so, so stupid.

Posts: 54 | Registered: Jul 2013
outtanowhere
♀ Member
Member # 39001
Default  Posted: 8:02 AM, August 26th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

84cf,
I think we all felt that way in the beginning but, just know in your heart that it wasn't stupidity. What makes you feel this way is that you unconditionally loved and trusted someone who abused that trust. It's such a violated feeling but, stupid? No!


BS - 57
SAWH - 60 multiple encounters with prostitutes and other sex workers
Married 36 years
Dday - 2/19/13 - found the emails
I'm not crazy I'm just a little unwell

Posts: 497 | Registered: Apr 2013
UMBL
♀ Member
Member # 39605
Default  Posted: 9:21 AM, August 26th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

good morning everyone!

Outta! Congrats!! I was thinking of you and hoping you were enjoying your weekend!

SK....pain and indignation..you named what I feel exactly and I think you are right - I need to work the steps to be able to let some of that go.

WIF - that's wonderful news and yes, I think that's all positive signs!

Welcome to all the new posters!

I had a wonderful weekend away for our anniversary with only a few bittersweet moments and one meltdown. The pain and indignation is what did me in on Sunday night...After an amazing weekend I just could not let go of the fact that he was willing to just throw everything we have away...and I kept waiting for him to "share" over the weekend and he never did. It was, in my mind, the perfect opportunity to connect and talk about SA and struggles etc...and in his head, he wanted to just connect and be and not talk about it. I told him last night that the only difference I can honestly see is when he is sharing his feelings, his struggles etc...that the rest of the time he appears to be my wonderful, sweet, patient and kind husband that I've always known and that would flirt/cheat on me in a heartbeat. I keep looking for signs and clues so I won't get broadsided again...and I know in my head this is all pointless but I can't stop regardless...so him talking about his addiction gives me comfort. I need to work the steps..I think this would help tremendously. This morning I also feel awful that I ruined our last night with all of this and yet indignant at the same time...:( He is trying to hear me and help but he is very confused as to what I need from him..which honestly I can't blame him there, I am so confused as to what I need! I can't even write about all of this without getting confused! AHHH!~


BW - UMBL "Unhappily Married But Looking". His most recent Yahoo chat group
WH - SA
Blended Family - 2nd Marriage
DDay #1 - Jan 2009
DDay #2 - June 2013

Posts: 57 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Alabama
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 8:30 PM, August 26th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

outta - yay! Hoping you are able to bask in that glow of grandbaby happinesss for as long as possible!

boon- so sorry. All of the emotions you are feeling are completely normal. Glad your SAWH is getting the help he needs and you are in IC. One. day. at. a. time.

wif- wooohoooo!! Seems like good signs to me! Enjoy for now, but keep watching - time will tell.

84CF - welcome, and sorry you are here. Read what outta wrote over and over again - she is wise. Feel free to post as much or as little as you like - we are here for you.

UMBL - glad you had a good time for your anniversary. I totally get what you mean about being confused. Sometimes everything seems so clear and other times, it is all muddled. Maybe those are the times that our mind is trying to make sense of something and it is just before a breakthrough? I don't know, but it seems like after those times, something big happens - a big realization, or some peace. Here's hoping that's what's going on with you!

((((((SA spouses)))))))

Thank you for the strength you give me everyday...

ETA: SK, thank you for your lovely post. It gives me hope, and it's so nice to hear that recovering SAs and their spouses are some of the wisest people on earth! Also good to hear that the skills we are learning will help us in other areas of our life - makes me feel the LIGHT!!!

[This message edited by numbandnauseous at 12:24 AM, August 28th (Wednesday)]


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
CheaterMagnet
♀ Member
Member # 33581
Default  Posted: 9:11 PM, August 26th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So, I had to go to the house today. I snooped. He has condoms in his bedside table. Now, he did help with the recent AIDS Foundation event and I know the condoms are from there but why would he need 2 pks of 6 condoms? And why is one pkg open?

Oh, and the orchid I bought my first weekend here to celebrate our new life is blooming. It only blooms once a year. I remember how happy I was that day. Hoe excited I was to be starting life in paradise with my best friend. And now here I am. I can't stop crying. How did this happen? How is this my new life?


If Happy Ever After did exist, I would still be holding you like this.
All those fairly tales are full of shit.
One more fucking love song I'll be sick. ~ Maroon 5

Posts: 923 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Kailua-Kona, HI
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 11:33 PM, August 26th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((((CM)))) Look, I get how crappy this is. You got dealt a load of sh*t. I'm going to be a Pollyanna here....
You are still in paradise. I visited there several years ago and cried when I left. I'm coming back, asap. Go sit near a beach, a waterfall, a mountain, a flowering shrub and rejoice in the special woman YOU are. Forget his skanky ass. Just take time to breathe and live...
Let go and let God.
Holding you in the LIGHT from boring old NJ....


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
CheaterMagnet
♀ Member
Member # 33581
Default  Posted: 4:24 AM, August 27th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you SK. It does help so much just to know you are all here for me. Even though I don't add much, I know that here I have people who get it.

When you DO make it back here, you'd better look me up. I'll treat you to a meal and a mai tai.

Hanging in there for one more day.


If Happy Ever After did exist, I would still be holding you like this.
All those fairly tales are full of shit.
One more fucking love song I'll be sick. ~ Maroon 5

Posts: 923 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Kailua-Kona, HI
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 12:48 AM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

CM - glad that you're hanging in there and taking it one day at a time. So sorry for what you've discovered and the cognitive dissonance of seeing the orchid and the condoms. Also the shock of "how is this my life?" Huge hugs to you.

One of the women in my SA spouse group told us about a movie about SA that's coming out on Sept 20th called "Thanks for Sharing." It's a pretty mainstream movie, starring Mark Ruffalo and Gwenyth Paltrow. From the trailer I saw, it talks about 12 step programs, sponsors - looks pretty realistic.

I had the money discussion today. (Background: SAWH and I are working on a budget; we are putting all of our expenses into Quicken. For the cash that SAWH has taken out, he has $300 of a $400 withdrawal labeled "miscellaneous." I had a psycho fantasy about how I would handle it bc I was so angry, but then the wise women on this forum advised me not to go apeshit on him. )

So, I asked him about the money tonight and he................ got defensive. WRONG ANSWER. He acted like an asshole, getting pissed that I was even asking about the money, saying that "I knew you would react this way." (My response? "Then don't fucking do things like this.") He said that he can't put everything on the cc/debit card, said he needs cash for when he travels, that he can't pay for cabs and other things with credit.

I explained to him that if he knows that I think he is an SA, why would he have so much money categorized as misc? My assumption will be that it is going to his addiction. He said over and over that he has receipts for all his cash purchases, so I left it at that. We'll see if he can produce them and if not, I will lay down the law re: NO cash to be taken out.

He still does not think he is an SA; I spoke with him about how the CSAT that runs our SA spouse group was saying that a paradigm shift is coming because there is talk about SA in the media and there are people on both sides: one camp saying that it is real and the other saying it isn't. SAWH's repsonse? "Well, they may prove that it isn't real, just like the myth about mercury in vaccines causing autism was debunked."

He is in such deep denial. I know I should just run, but I am waiting to see what his polygraph shows next month. He is also working on disclosure.

I'm so confused. I know that all the signs are pointing to him not being close to being in recovery. I don't know why I am still hanging around.


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
cds22
♀ Member
Member # 39083
Default  Posted: 8:22 AM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

N&N: I am so sorry. That sounds like an awful situation. I am with you -- I don't see how anyone can recover from a disease they are denying exists! I also think it is going to be a real barrier to full disclosure and you having confidence in the disclosure.

Can you ramp up your IC? Maybe make a list of all of your visceral thoughts and fears of what D will mean or feel like -- and then see where you are being too extreme, too global, telling the future, etc and then correct your thought -- this is a classic cognitive behavioral exercise.

I also wonder is a total separation an option? As in everything looks like a divorce but you aren't legally divorced. You have a separation custody agreement and financial agreements. Then if he goes into recovery you could reunite without having to remarry. Just a thought.

Outta: congrats on the grandchild!!

CM: Ugh. I am really sorry. Understandably that raises alot of concerns.

Boon and other new members: welcome!!


Posts: 210 | Registered: Apr 2013
womaninflux
♀ Member
Member # 39667
Default  Posted: 8:35 AM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I get what you are saying about accounting for the cash...but please remember (and this is a good reminder for myself as well!) that the only thing that WE can control is ourselves. We don't have any control over what the WS/SAWS does - and their recovery is up to them. We can only work on healing ourselves. If we place our healing/future happiness all on them...we will inevitably end up not where we want to be.


BS - mid-40's
SAWH - mid 40's
Kids - 2 elementary school aged
Getting tons of therapy and trying to "work it out"

Posts: 810 | Registered: Jun 2013
hathnofury
♀ Member
Member # 32550
Default  Posted: 10:41 AM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well, I think one of the hardest concepts for me to grasp when beginning this process was the detaching from SAWH vs. establishing and enforcing boundaries. Yes, you cannot control what they do. BUT, you can determine what you need to feel safe in the relationship, to be able to stay in the relationship, to be able to do in-house separation, etc. and have boundaries to protect that.

So while you can't "force" him to account for cash expenditures, you can say it's a dealbreaker for staying in the M. And even if you D, he will have to account for cash withdrawals as part of the divorce, so he really needs to do it either way. Of course he can choose not to, but in that event you need to divide the assets in half and put it in a different account and leave anyway, right?

So here's what I would do. Again, this is an opportunity to for him to build trust, and if he has any interest in R he would be happy to comply. This is just standard SI stuff, nothing to do with SA really, the WS should be willing to do whatever it takes. He accounts for all cash expenses going forward. Extra credit for receipts for the past month and going back further. This is a condition of staying in the M and considering R. He does not do it, you will re-evaluate your options.

So say he won't do it. Fine. Then inform him now he will now have to do it as part of separating assets, that you will assume all cash withdrawals are for acting out and you will expect to be reimbursed for those as part of asset division. So he still has a choice not to do it, but you will get the reimbursement for that choice.

Say he grumbles and says he will do it. Make sure you are crystal clear with your expectations. Say ALL cash expenses must be accounted for, there is no more "Miscellaneous". Receipts will be kept and shown to you. Cash in wallet should match the difference. You will do the same. You will need to check on this once or twice a week, because it is so easy to forget when you spend cash and aren't used to doing this. Again, he needs to know this is coming from a place of love, and is his opportunity to prove his trustworthiness. As far as he is concerned it has nothing to do with SA.

As far as YOU are concerned, it is establishing and maintaining boundaries that let you feel safe.


BS 43, SAWH 38. M 15years, together 17. Body count in the triple digits. Both in recovery, trying to R.
Three kids under age 11.

Posts: 1410 | Registered: Jun 2011
Phoenix9572
♀ Member
Member # 39987
Default  Posted: 1:36 PM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I posted on here a couple of weeks ago and I'm sorry to say that things have rapidly spiraled downhill. I caught my WH soliciting call girls yesterday. I even had the guts to text one of them and get the scoop. I found out that he has been buying restaurant gift cards (that he said were thank yous for clients) to use as payment for services. I'm so disgusted and hurt. I called him and told him to come home and get his crap. I packed up his stuff and had it ready to go. He tried to talk to me but I kept repeating that I don't care/ I have nothing else to discuss with you/ I will discuss it with my lawyer. I know I threw him for a loop because I was dead calm during all of this. He's finally pushed me over the edge to separation or D but that's where I'm at.


Me - 40
WH - 42
Married 18 years
kids - 14, 12
DD - May 13, 2013
DD2 - Aug 4, 2013
DD3 - Aug 27, 2013
Status - Legally separated; really wanted R but don't think that is possible anymore

Posts: 103 | Registered: Jul 2013 | From: Southern Indiana
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 2:10 PM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have been so incredibly busy, hope things slow down in a couple of weeks. I actually think things are going to get busier because sports haven't even started!

Phoenix - Oh, I am soo sorry! It is the sad reality of SA. They say they will stop and don't. When I discovered everything my SAWH acted out again a week later. Then he went immediately to a CSAT. I think it really shook him because he realized he couldn't stop on his own. Take care of you!

Hath - Very well put! You are always so eloquent. I think many spouses in early recovery get confused by the detaching. Detaching is NOT being without boundaries. There are some that are even far along in recovery that don't really believe in boundaries. That tends to show a little magical thinking and is actually a symptom of codependency. I think the SA makes it worse because they keep hearing in meetings that their spouses should detach. It wasn't until my SAWH went to treatment and started with this new CSAT, that they explained to him I absolutely had the right to expect that he be in a strong recovery to be willing to stay married to him.

Anyhow, things are pretty good here. SAWH apologized for being an ass while we were on vacation, and is working on taking better care of his health (including taking his antidepressants regularly).


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
UMBL
♀ Member
Member # 39605
Default  Posted: 2:28 PM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh phoenix!! I'm so sorry! and I'm also so incredibly proud of you. ((hugs)))


BW - UMBL "Unhappily Married But Looking". His most recent Yahoo chat group
WH - SA
Blended Family - 2nd Marriage
DDay #1 - Jan 2009
DDay #2 - June 2013

Posts: 57 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Alabama
hathnofury
♀ Member
Member # 32550
Default  Posted: 5:16 PM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Phoenix, I am so sorry. That had to be devastating. When SAWH started to turn a corner he told me that he tried to pay for services that way but rarely got any takers. He was trying to find some that would so he could use our reward points (which I never really tracked at the time) to redeem for restaurant GCs, so he could say the same thing if I ever caught on. Good for you for throwing him out. Take this time to take care of YOU, deal with the trauma. Do the L thing, the STD testing thing, find an IC thing, get meds for anxiety/depression/sleeping thing. We are here for you.


BS 43, SAWH 38. M 15years, together 17. Body count in the triple digits. Both in recovery, trying to R.
Three kids under age 11.

Posts: 1410 | Registered: Jun 2011
outtanowhere
♀ Member
Member # 39001
Default  Posted: 5:42 PM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Phoenix,
I'm so sad for the pain you must be going through right now but, I admire your courage & strength. Until 6 months ago, I always believed that it was a given that if I ever learned my H had sex with another woman it would be an automatic death nail to my marriage. Now here I am facing the reality that indeed he has done so with multiple women and I'm still here, for now. It's never as easy as one imagines even when the pain cuts so deep. That being said,I know that was a painfully difficult decision for you to have to make.

In reading today's posts I see that I still haven't heard all the tricks SA's use, no pun intended! I had not heard the gift card idea & now have a whole new set of questions for my H.

Seriously, do any of the rest of you ever wonder about your own sanity in choosing to stay with such shifty characters? Makes me even wonder if our church contributions are legit! Ugh!


BS - 57
SAWH - 60 multiple encounters with prostitutes and other sex workers
Married 36 years
Dday - 2/19/13 - found the emails
I'm not crazy I'm just a little unwell

Posts: 497 | Registered: Apr 2013
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 11:34 PM, August 28th (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

cds, wif and hath - thanks for the words of advice. hath, I am totally with you - I'm not trying to control him re: the money, just trying to set some boundaries so that I can feel safe. I'm going to post his "contract" that he gave me tonight in my next post.

Phoenix - so sorry. You are sounding strong. Take gentle care of yourself.

Missy - glad your H apologized and is taking his meds.


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
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