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User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts-11
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 8:14 PM, August 15th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This post is a general one. Partly hopeful, partly cautionary...It's long, skip if you want...

It has been pointed out to me that my "tone" is "lighter" and I think that we, my SAfWH and I have reached some kind of threshold. I think it may be useful to post about it, especially for some of the newbies.

D-day #1 for me was in fall of 2008. I found evidence of strip clubs. It was only the merest tip of the iceberg. I gradually uncovered evidence of compulsive strip club use, lap dances, porn use, EAs and PAS from years back and the eventual DX of SA. He began attendance at SAA in May 2009 and I at Sanon. His sobriety began then, although he had a few slips, one that I know of with porn, another with pseudo porn, looking at pictures of cheerleaders and 90 weeks ago, a slip with "scanning" pictures of female tennis players, no nudity, but it pissed me off.

We did an intensive sex addiction education program, he works with a CSAT and I with an addiction IC. I should mention that our pre disclosure marriage was dysfunctional, he was verbally abusive, dismissive and rejected me emotionally and sexually. We hadn't had a normal sex life for years. He became insulting and abusive if I dared ask about that or about anything "important," and taught me very early, not to expect any emotional support from him.

I should also mention that he was diagnosed as Bipolar 2 shortly after I found out. BPD is associated with hypersexuality.

Sobriety is NOT recovery. While he was sober almost immediately, I have never felt he was truly working the steps, never knew anything about sponsor work, never really felt comfortable that he was "in recovery."

Things have improved a bit recently. Not without additional drama. A recent counseling session with all of us, his CSAT, my IC and the two of us pointed out that he really hasn't worked the steps aggressively. He's procrastinated, made excuses, etc. His reason? That he simply wasn't ready to make the changes necessary to work the steps properly, and he is now. I don't LIKE this, but I accept it. And I believe it. SAs in general and my SAfWH IS emotionally stunted, at 62 years old, MAYBE really ready to grow up. That's a sad reality.

I have asked for a few things along the way, nothing difficult, mostly to be kept in the loop about where he is in recovery. He is now doing that through Milton Magness's FASST check in. We tried to do this a few years ago and it was a disaster. It's working now and is a great help to me.

My point in writing this post is to tell you how freaking LONG this has taken, to get to a point where I see ANY PROGRESS, and feel there is ANY HOPE at all.

I still have NO expectations for the future. I don't dare. But I find my present isn't as grey as it was a few months ago.

I don't know if it will take every SA as long as it has taken my SAfWH, I certainly hope not, for all your sakes. But I think the possibility exists that it will, especially if the behaviors are life long, and the habit of lying and hiding ingrained.

Feel free to PM me. I don't claim to be an expert, but I have lived this a long time and I am a good listener...

My religious belief talks of the LIGHT in all of us. A while back we started a symbol of support to hold each other in that *LIGHT*

Hugs and ******LIGHT****** to all of us.


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2904 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 1:34 AM, August 16th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Kat - beautiful post, and just what I needed right now. I am so FRUSTRATED with how SLOW my SAWH's progress is. He has been going to his CSAT for 2 months and I think they are still working on diagnosing him. He hasn't started group therapy; he is supposed to be working on his disclosure, but "isn't sure how to do it." What does he talk about with his CSAT then?!

At the same time, I understand that compassion is necessary; it took me over a year of twice a week therapy to get to the point where I had the strength to D him and I wouldn't have appreciated it if I had someone breathing down my neck telling me, "Why don't you D him already? What is taking so long?' So, I am trying to see it from that perspective, and, as I told my H tonight, I have been going through this bullshit with an unremoreseful spouse for 1.5 years and my patience has worn very thin. It also probably doesn't help that I am in an anger phase right now.

Anyway, Kat, when I see how many YEARS it has taken you, I feel embarassed at my complaining. I'll shut up now......

eyes - so glad (?) that I was able to help you get to this forum and get some help. Age is just a number; 50 is the new 30! Glad that you are seeing a good future for yourself, whatever shape that may take.

BTW, I LOVE your username - it has become my mantra "My eyes are now open." I just took a trip back home and it was unbelievable what I saw with what I thought was a "good" relationship with my dad now that "my eyes are open." Some comments my father made: "your legs are too white - you need to get some sun on them" WTF?! How rude, and why is that even something that he thinks about or would say anything about? He then called me over every time someone came to or left the party; I felt like a show horse and like I had to curtsy or something. I am 40 and can manage my own manners and relationships - this was so ridiculous. Not to mention his alcoholism; he gave me the 3rd degree when I was tending to my children (as a single parent - H wasn't there) and I was late for my turn in a game. A few minutes later, he was late, but God forbid if I say anything to him - I got tremendous push-back like I was being completely unreasonable - such a hypocrite! Later on, he tries to make it all better by saying (in his drunken stupor) "you know you're my honey, right?" Ugh, I can remember those words from when I was a child and I hate them. Like he can make all his abuse better with a few little words - spare me. And, my father is my "good" parent - my relationship with my NPD mom is almost non-existent - she is toxic to me, so I avoid her as much as possible. When I was telling my father about the D, he said, "SAWH is going to get screwed," meaning he felt sorry for him. He also tried to blame it on me (which I didn't allow), but then told me he supported me and would do whatever I needed. He also told me that "all men hide money in a D," which is what he did when he and my mother D'd and he thought it was ok that my SAWH did it - just something that I should accept. Whew, didn't realize that was going to all come out here...

outta - I get what eyes is saying - how you say that your H says that he wants a D, but then complains that it sounds like you want a D when it was his idea in the first place! It is mind-fucking when they are constantly changing their words - crazy-making!

I think that your seeing MC, IC, having your L on speed dial and consulting everyone about how to separate assets and talk about SA is a great plan. You have a great support team and you're getting great advice.

((((((SA spouses))))))

Edited for clarity.

[This message edited by numbandnauseous at 1:37 AM, August 16th (Friday)]


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
cds22
♀ Member
Member # 39083
Default  Posted: 9:10 AM, August 16th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Outta-ongoing support your way!

SK-I am so happy to read of this. I am so glad things are looking brighter!! What is Milton Magness's FASST by the way??

N&N: I don't really see how diagnosis would take two months?? My DH was diagnosed within a week. It was a long intake interview then a very extensive diagnostic test (he had to take it home, it was hundreds of questions). I can see it taking a few more weeks if they are screening for other disorders such as bipolar, NPD, etc. But two months seems very odd to me. Disclosure is a process that they prepare for in advance with CSAT for several weeks. We have had some confusion about our disclosure -- at first we thought it was going to be in July as the CSAT wanted to meet me and my H thought it was for disclosure. But she said they have to work further through the workbook when we asked and it will probably be late fall/early winter - - she likes to get entirely through a section on empathy and ideally have them in group therapy pre-disclosure. So that will be about 8 months from the start of therapy and from what I have gotten here and heard third-hand from the therapist via H, it is better to have the SA well into recovery in order to increase the likelihood of getting a complete disclosure.

Eyes--Your dad sounds like a real piece of work. Oy. I am sorry you have to be so tough.

Everyone else I hope things are improving! Things for me are really good over here - - I really feel like I have the man I married back.

[This message edited by cds22 at 9:12 AM, August 16th (Friday)]


Posts: 209 | Registered: Apr 2013
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 11:44 AM, August 16th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

FASTT is an acronym for a way for an SA to check in with a spouse to keep one apprised of the progress of recovery work. I can't remember exactly what the letters stand for.

Here is a link to a blog that includes a very good interview with Magness. I do like his philosophy, and his work is practical, although a bit too simplistic.


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2904 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
hathnofury
♀ Member
Member # 32550
Default  Posted: 12:14 PM, August 16th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Drive by post...family visiting...

but I wanted to say it did take a while for my SAWH to get diagnosed. He also took several incredibly long diagnostic tests, and the first CSAT took several interviews before I sat in one and basically wound up forcing the issue. I think the CSAT knew my SAWH was resistant to the label, was hearing what he wanted to hear, etc which is all textbook for many that have not hit bottom and not ready to admit the problem/enter into recovery. Probably also knew SAWH was a lying sack of shit. So he was easing into giving the diagnosis because it wouldn't have been well-received so quickly.

That being said, I didn't care for that particular CSAT, and he wound up switching to another one later that was a better fit. But that was after a four month intensive class, and when he was in a better state to receive the diagnosis. In all honestly he never really understood the scope of his issues until recently, two year later. So when you are dealing with an addict that hasn't hit rock bottom, it can take a while.

Also that being said, had you told my two years ago it would take this long for him to truly accept his diagnosis and embrace recovery, I would have filed for D the next day. But of course if I knew two years ago the scope of his problems was 10x what I knew, I would have also immediately filed for D. So no matter how you slice it, recovery is a really really long process that is only longer if you got a live one that is not truly ready to face the music.


BS 43, SAWH 38. M 15years, together 17. Body count in the triple digits. Both in recovery, trying to R.
Three kids under age 11.

Posts: 1402 | Registered: Jun 2011
outtanowhere
♀ Member
Member # 39001
Default  Posted: 2:44 PM, August 16th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So, Hath,
2 years later, do you regret not divorcing? My H accepts his diagnosis, going to meetings, IC, treating me better. I am pretty sure that he hasn't grasped the scope of what working the steps are intended to do. What I see right now is that since he is maintaining his sobriety he is content that what he has been doing is all that recovery entails. He is nowhere near being able to reconcile things in his past that may have been contributors to the addiction. If I understand this correctly, that's a dry drunk & as hard as I've tried, I can't articulate that concept to him.

We had a 911 with our MC last night regarding the separation. I didn't see it as particularly helpful and there has been no conversation between H & me since leaving the office. It's inconceivable to me how this can ever be resolved if H won't/can't share his struggle with me or at least give me some kind of insight into how he is progressing or, not. Just a constant whirlwind.

Yep, I'm scared!


BS - 57
SAWH - 60 multiple encounters with prostitutes and other sex workers
Married 36 years
Dday - 2/19/13 - found the emails
I'm not crazy I'm just a little unwell

Posts: 492 | Registered: Apr 2013
outtanowhere
♀ Member
Member # 39001
Default  Posted: 3:01 PM, August 16th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wanted to add that if you haven't read "Deceived" by Claudia Black, it should be your next book purchase! Well written & extremely thought provoking!


BS - 57
SAWH - 60 multiple encounters with prostitutes and other sex workers
Married 36 years
Dday - 2/19/13 - found the emails
I'm not crazy I'm just a little unwell

Posts: 492 | Registered: Apr 2013
eyesrnowopen
♀ Member
Member # 39055
Default  Posted: 1:43 PM, August 17th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am on the last page of SA -10. I feel like I am starting to get to know all of you.

Ok we were supposed to meet with his IC Monday to discuss the 4th option of regrouping with MC and him putting his check back in and us working on financially juggling a new living arrangement for him to leave his Mother's.

My weekend with the kids and he just walks into our house and tells me the kids texted him and asked them if he wants to do something. ( Teenagers don't do this: you have to drag them anywhere unless you are buying them something. ) sure enough, checking my son's phone, he told them he was coming up to take him to Best Buy.

He tells me his IC wants to meet with him alone first so we are off for Monday. In the meantime, he is not giving me $ until we meet with her. I don't react to him taking the kids and ask which bills he is paying, he says two mortgages, his car loan, our home equity loan and my sons tuition. I tell him the only bills that are due are car loan and home equity. The rest are not due until next month and my credit cards are due now and kids need uniforms and books.

He says well you can use the emergency money you took. I should just call my L on Monday and file.


This is the work within, having control over the outcome of our lives. Robert Bly refers to this as “Warrior work.” A warrior fights for a cause, something he believes in. As opposed to a soldier who merely fights for control – power or profit.

Posts: 82 | Registered: Apr 2013
Missymomma
♀ Member
Member # 36988
Default  Posted: 1:54 PM, August 17th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Eyes - I am sorry. He is not seeing a qualified therapist and will continue to manipulate and play the victim. My SAWH was the King of victimhood! Just stay centered in yourself, sounds like not reacting was a brilliant move! He will continue to play the games until he is really in recovery. You have to take car of yourself and those kids.


DDay - 6/15/11
R started - 7/1/11
False Discl- 9/27/12
Real Discl - 2/12/13
Poly - 3/1/13 Pass!
Me - BS (46)
WH - 52 (SA, NA, WA)
Kids: 2 littles and 1 grown
The road to recovery is long and hard. Some days I am up for it and others not!

Posts: 1084 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Texas
eyesrnowopen
♀ Member
Member # 39055
Default  Posted: 2:42 PM, August 17th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My L says that when I don't react to the bully tactics the bully tactics will escalate. I see that is what is happening.


This is the work within, having control over the outcome of our lives. Robert Bly refers to this as “Warrior work.” A warrior fights for a cause, something he believes in. As opposed to a soldier who merely fights for control – power or profit.

Posts: 82 | Registered: Apr 2013
BFFGone
♀ Member
Member # 38263
Default  Posted: 3:36 PM, August 17th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm looking into that "Deceived" book. I am so very very thankful for all the tips I get on here.
Having a rough weekend. Anniversary was last week, weird in that not celebrating felt odd...and so was acknowledging something broken.
Getting angry and triggering a lot again.
On the discussion of seeing other relationships in the "light" after many many years of being deceived....WOW...that's me to a T. I thought I had these amazing relationships with my parents/siblings...ends up they were all very dysfunctional.
As horrible as the last 7 months have been since my DDay, for the first time in my life, I'm looking at people for who they are, not with the rosy glasses I wore my entire life. The view isn't as pretty, but at least it's REAL :)


I choose to thrive. I choose to be happy.

That which doesn't kill me makes me stronger...but damn, aren't I strong enough yet???


Posts: 70 | Registered: Jan 2013
Compartmented
Member
Member # 29410
Default  Posted: 7:29 PM, August 17th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My L says that when I don't react to the bully tactics the bully tactics will escalate. I see that is what is happening.

That's what happened in my situation. On the one hand, you know you are getting to him by ignoring him, but on the other, if he controls the purse strings, things could get ugly. Mine denied me temporary support, and I ended up paying expenses for myself and my son on my credit card for months. X couldn't understand why I wasn't screaming about it. I had a big credit limit on one of my cards. I think I will save that piece of plastic.

He tried to bleed us out, to get me to settle. I was actually terrified to file for divorce, but then he exceeded my expectations in terms of how badly things went in the divorce process.

I hope things are not that bad for you....I probably belong on the NPD forum with these comments. But he definitely was SA as well. I'm just not sure which came first, the personality disorder or the addictions.


Posts: 1049 | Registered: Aug 2010
Compartmented
Member
Member # 29410
Default  Posted: 7:32 PM, August 17th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

for the first time in my life, I'm looking at people for who they are, not with the rosy glasses I wore my entire life. The view isn't as pretty, but at least it's REAL :)

A good friend and I agree, after surviving marriages to personality disordered men, that we can take a brutal reality, but we can't take any more murkiness. I'm all for reality!

{{{ BFFGone }}}


Posts: 1049 | Registered: Aug 2010
eyesrnowopen
♀ Member
Member # 39055
Default  Posted: 10:24 AM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Compartmented,

I too feel I should be on the NPD thread. The truth is NPD scares the hell out of me. At least SA has dedicated therapy and a formula for cure no matter how hard it is. How do you R with an NPD and an SA? I you don't in most cases. I have lost myself and my spirit in this M. I have been broken. I need to forget about D or M now and concentrate on finding me.

I have been so stuck in my fears that I have been immobilized from moving forward. Fear of what he will do if I file for D? What will he do if we R? Can he fix himself? As long as I hang onto this fear I will be stuck and
unable to move in any direction. I am learning to let go of fear so I can move forward. In order to let go of the fear I need to imagine the worst and have faith In myself that I can survive the worst of R or the worst of D in the process find myself again. Staying in this dysfunction will cause me more harm in loosing myself. I'm still not sure I will end up D or M but I know I need to stay S and work on letting go of the outcome and the fear. Does this make sense or am I rambling?


This is the work within, having control over the outcome of our lives. Robert Bly refers to this as “Warrior work.” A warrior fights for a cause, something he believes in. As opposed to a soldier who merely fights for control – power or profit.

Posts: 82 | Registered: Apr 2013
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 10:58 AM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Not only does it make sense but it is the only way to maintain your sanity... SAs ARE insane to some degree, as are all addicts. Reasoning with them is futile.
The 12 steps work for you, too. Even if you don't go to meetings I strongly encourage you to go to the Sanon.org website, read and reread the "problem" http://sanon.org/sanonproblem.html "keys" http://sanon.org/keys.html and other info there, including the steps. It helps with the necessary-no VITAL, detachment.
Hugs and LIGHT to you..SK.


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2904 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 11:47 AM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BFF - I'm totally with you re: seeing things without rose colored glasses. I just spent some time with my father, who I thought I had a "good" relationship with, and, boy, was I wrong! Much better to be in reality than fantasyland.

Edited for clarity.

[This message edited by numbandnauseous at 4:35 PM, August 18th (Sunday)]


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
sadone29
♀ Member
Member # 38597
Default  Posted: 3:53 PM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm finding it difficult to keep the attention completely on myself. When I read about how long healing takes for SA's, I have to admit, it brings me down.
H writes down everyday he loses his sobriety in his white book (still insists no porn, only masterbation). This week, every date is written down except one. You can't even call that breaking sobriety. It's no sobriety at all! It's difficult to not feel like our relationship comes second to his acting out..it always has. I don't know why I feel it would be different now. Maybe I expect too much. But really, how long do we live in limbo waiting to see if he can even start the road to recovery?
I really have been working on myself as well though. I've been getting healthier physically and I'm trying to stay optimistic that I can find a way to be financially independent. I also go to every s-anon meeting I can.

Anyway, it's nice to see all of the new faces around here. I wish I could respond to individual posts, but my kids are due back home any minute. Just sending strength and hugs to everyone here!


SAWH: working hard on all addictions
Out of limbo hell. R Feb. 15
Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding -proverbs 3:5

Posts: 444 | Registered: Mar 2013
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 4:45 PM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

eyes - you are making complete sense. Trying to wade through this is maddening. You are doing great. It's a (long) process, I am finding. One. day. at. a. time.

SK - thanks for the S-Anon info and thanks for dropping in when you are busy with company. I will check that out; I haven't been to the S-Anon site yet.

sadone - I am with you re: how long can you stay in limbo waiting for them to start recovery?


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 5:04 PM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I need advice. I am so angry right now and have been in an anger phase for a little bit.

Background: SAWH and I had a convo last night and he is still saying he is not SA; he just has a "porn problem." He claims he has not watched porn for one year and he thinks that this means that he doesn't have a problem anymore. I talked about the lack of emotional intimacy in our M and he agrees that is something he needs to work on. I mentioned his enmeshment with his mother and he says he will work on that as well, but he is not ready to do it now. Ok, so we have a porn habit, sexual anorexia, lack of emotional intimacy, mother enmeshment, in addition to a victim mentality..... Does this not scream SA to everyone out there?! SAWH has taken the 700 question test and I don't know the results. He has called to make an appt with a polygrapher per his CSAT's recommendation, but the polygrapher is booked out to the end of September. He is trying to get it done sooner. He says he is looking forward to taking the polygraph.

We are working on making a budget because money has gotten tight since my SAWH leased a condo for him to move into when I filed for D.

My H takes cash out of the ATM and this is how he accounts for it in Quicken, which is what we are using for budgeting purposes:

7/15: $150 counseling, $50 misc

7/23: $140 misc, $80 business expense, $80 travel vacation

7/31: $150 misc, $45.33 food, $17 transportation, $187.67 misc

Does this send you into a flying rage like it did me?! When you see "$50 misc," do you think "blow job?" When you see "$150 misc," do you think, "got laid by a prostitute?"

What should I do?

This is what I would like to do (bear with me because I am very angry right now):
Take a gun (don't worry, I have no access to guns and I am afraid of them), put it to his head and say, "What the fuck does 'misc" mean?" I want to go psycho on him and scare the fuck out of him because I am so tired of being lied to. I am angry that we are in the middle of a D and he has the audacity to not only take cash out of the ATM, but to label it as "misc." I'm sure I'm going completely overboard, but I am so tired ot this. He's still not being kind; was an asshole this morning and passive-agressively threatened to not go to church with us because I did something he didn't like (can't even remember what it was now, but it was minor). I am so tired of the abuse and assholeness. Why am I still here? I guess I am curious about the polygraph, but my nerves are threadbare.

Advice would be greatly appreciated - talk me off this ledge.


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
hathnofury
♀ Member
Member # 32550
Default  Posted: 6:56 PM, August 18th (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hiya folks. I am between visits from families and swamped, so I can't post much right now. However, Numb, I thought I would throw out there what SAWH and I do re: $ stuff. He has obviously no credibility with finances with me. So, every account we have is in Mint.com, so I know where every penny goes. He is not allowed to withdraw cash without clearing it with me, and he rarely carries more than $20. Every dollar is accounted for in Mint, because sadly not everything can be paid with CC or check. It sounds like a huge PITA but when you get used to it, it is not that bad and actually is a sort of Dave Ramsey-ish way to save money by being more accountable for your spending. And SAWH is happy to do it, wants any chance to prove he is worthy of some trust that can be quantifiably verified.

So I wouldn't go apeshit on him or anything, that's not productive. Just say money is super tight, and I need to be able to trust you. We need to account for every penny we spend going forward, and don't pay cash for things that we can use a debit card or credit card to track where the money went. All cash expenses must be itemized (in whatever way you want to do it). That you both have enough trust issues on the table, you don't need finances to be another log in the fire. Spin it so this is a way he can bring you comfort and establish trust, etc.

Then if he doesn't go for it, that's when you go apeshit on him.

Also, if you really do suspect he is spending cash on "services" then you might consider having some surveillance in place to see if he scrambles and tries to hide expenses, cancel "appointments" etc after you have this discussion.


BS 43, SAWH 38. M 15years, together 17. Body count in the triple digits. Both in recovery, trying to R.
Three kids under age 11.

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