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User Topic: Is this a sign we're doomed or is it normal?
Cyzygy
♀ New Member
Member # 39437
Default  Posted: 8:15 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was reading in The Healing Library about how there are only two kinds of WSs--those who are remorseful and those who essentially want to sweep everything under the rug.

I keep replaying D-day in my mind when, amongst all the steadfast denial, he kept saying, "Can we just drop it? Fine. I'm guilty of whatever...can we move on now?, etc" He would start out with great indignation and then would flip to pleading.

This was RIGHT when I confronted him so I'm thinking it was a gut reaction.

Do remorseful WS always cop to everything right away? Does this reaction mean R is off the table for us?

(He left for Annual Training shortly afterward so I haven't seen him and he isn't due home for another week so no actions to go by right now.)

[This message edited by Cyzygy at 8:23 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]


Me: 37, BS
Him: 39, WH
Married: 6 years, together for 9 years
2 boys, ages 3 & 4, he has a 15yo we never see
DDay: 5/21/13 (OW is a coworker at Walmart...he quit on Dday.)

Posts: 25 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Columbus, OH
RockyMtn
♀ Member
Member # 37043
Default  Posted: 8:27 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was reading in The Healing Library about how there are only two kinds of WSs--those who are remorseful and those who essentially want to sweep everything under the rug.

Hmmm, I don't know if I agree with that. There are some WS who don't necessarily rug sweep. They are willing to talk. They are willing to admit their wrongdoing and make a few amends. They may even work on some elements of themselves. But that doesn't equal remorse necessarily, but it isn't rugsweeping. My WH did this after D-Day 1. Be careful of this because sometimes we get deluded into think "not rugsweeping" is remorse. When "not rugsweeping" and being somewhat available is actually just half-assing it.

Do remorseful WS always cop to everything right away? Does this reaction mean R is off the table for us?

A truly remorseful spouse cops to everything.

Your WH was doing more than NOT copping to everything - he was also trying to invalidate the importance of the whole situation. Its magnitude.

Yes, R can still be possible. But he needs to find that remorse and willingness and full truth. There are plenty of solid WS out there who are scared and who don't do the right thing immediately or say all the right things out of the gate. But the sooner he gets there, the better for your R.


Me, BS, 30s
Him, WS, 30s, Steppenwolf
Kids: Yep
D-Day 1: September 2011, 6 week EA
D-Day 2: January 2013, discovered EA was a PA; there was another PA in 2010. All TT.
Goal = serenity.

Posts: 667 | Registered: Oct 2012
dameia
♀ Member
Member # 36072
Default  Posted: 8:28 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would say no, you're not doomed. His reaction is totally normal.

My WH lied and TT'd for the first month. I had to go snooping to find out that he had actually had sex with a howorker, after he got out of the military, something he conveniently forgot to tell me.

Your WH can change. He can become remorseful, but it takes hard work on his part. It's not going to be easy for him or comfortable. He has to confront what he did, and he has to realize what kind of person he truly is. Only then will R be successful.

My WH and I working on R right now. It's rough and not for the faint of heart. I hope that your WH comes around and is able to fully commit to fixing your M. But if he insists on rugsweeping, that just won't be possible.


Me: BS
D-Day: 7/7/12

Trust is like paper. Once it's crumpled it can never be perfect again.


Posts: 1171 | Registered: Jul 2012
Fighting2Survive
♀ Member
Member # 28410
Default  Posted: 8:41 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWH is extremely remorseful and we have R'd. But we didn't have an easy time of it. He denied the A for months and really wanted to rugsweep. Even when he finally admitted it, he TT'd for the first six months (some of that may not have been TT in its truest sense since he was denying to himself how emotionally involved he got with OW).

I've read stories of WS's who were immediately remorseful, but it seems rare. And immediate remorse doesn't guarantee a successful R any more than the typical slow-in-coming remorse.

That said, remorse rarely happens spontaneously. It usually happens as the result of the WS being hit hard (like, sledge-hammer hard) with the natural consequences of cheating. The BS setting boundaries, defining conditions for staying in the M to work on R, and refusing to rug sweep are things that can help.


Me: BW, 40.......Him: FWH, 40
D-day: 3-22-10
DS1: 11, DS2: crawling
Status: R going well

"When you can tell the story and it doesn't bring up any pain, you know it is healed." - Iyanla Vanzant, Broken Pieces


Posts: 7279 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: NC
Cyzygy
♀ New Member
Member # 39437
Default  Posted: 8:50 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What is TT? I didn't see it in the abbreviations list.


Me: 37, BS
Him: 39, WH
Married: 6 years, together for 9 years
2 boys, ages 3 & 4, he has a 15yo we never see
DDay: 5/21/13 (OW is a coworker at Walmart...he quit on Dday.)

Posts: 25 | Registered: Jun 2013 | From: Columbus, OH
Fighting2Survive
♀ Member
Member # 28410
Default  Posted: 8:55 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trickle truth.

It's when the WS lets just a little bit of new truth out over time- after telling you that you know everything. And it's kryptonite to R.


Me: BW, 40.......Him: FWH, 40
D-day: 3-22-10
DS1: 11, DS2: crawling
Status: R going well

"When you can tell the story and it doesn't bring up any pain, you know it is healed." - Iyanla Vanzant, Broken Pieces


Posts: 7279 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: NC
truthsetmefree
♀ Member
Member # 7168
Default  Posted: 8:58 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It took my husband years to show what I felt was true remorse. He has particular difficulty dealing with two things: someone angry with him and a deep sense of shame. Those two things were not in lack following the d-days - and his way of dealing with them were to avoid, deflect, and fire back.

I did much of my healing post D-day on my own. And most of my reasons for staying were purely logistical. So I made a conscious decision to make my own growth the priority - and to hell with his issues.

I didn't shield him from the fall-out. He knew my anger. He knew my hurt. But I stopped expecting him to heal me. I stopped expecting him to even fix the marriage.

And somewhere along the way, he found remorse.

Is your H. behavior normal? I cannot necessarily say that. But I can tell you defense mechanisms can be pretty tough walls to scale. Some get there sooner than others. Some don't even try. In my case, I did feel that my H. was trying - he just sucked at it. Without the logistical challenges, we probably wouldn't be together today - if for no other reason than the clock just ran out. But perhaps, too, my resignation maybe was the catalyst for his progress - the same as a divorce can shake the apple tree.

I know you want answers right now. It's normal to want to start picking up the pieces almost immediately - like we can somehow mitigate the damages if we just get it back together soon enough. But this is a long process...and even if you had an obviously remorseful WS, there are still many levels of grieving that you have to traverse. Sometimes you just have to make the decision for the next 24 hours - particularly when you are so early out. The one thing I can almost guarantee you is that the road you will travel cannot be mapped ahead of time.


Posts: 7682 | Registered: May 2005
catlover50
♀ Member
Member # 37154
Default  Posted: 9:01 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Trickle truth--only telling parts of the truth, or, commonly only what there is absolute proof for.

My fWH gave up the OW quickly and easily, but took many months to be honest, and then only with proof. I got a PI, phone records, even a polygraph. Then finally came the day when he said " no more lies" and then we started the healing process. Now he is beyond the husband of my dreams.

So no, you're not doomed. It depends on him. Perhaps he would benefit from SI?

Good luck.

[This message edited by catlover50 at 9:02 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]



Dday -9/24/2012
Reconciling

Posts: 1763 | Registered: Oct 2012 | From: northeast
NoraLee
♀ Member
Member # 37922
Default  Posted: 9:11 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think it often takes time for the fog to clear and the WS to see the full effect of their choices before they become truly remorseful. My H lied to himself for so long to justify the A ... It wasn't until he saw my devastation and we peeled away the justifications...for about a month he went on about how they were just friends - even though they both conspired to keep me in the dark, spend my money, lie to their respective SO's ... It was months before he realized they were NEVER friends. They used each other - friendship should never hurt others...

But H is extremely remorseful - fog is gone and all the glitter with it.


Me - BW - 44
Him - FWH - 42
Married 16 years
D day - 1/2 truth - July 2012
Full disclosure - August 2012
EA with skanky waitress coworker
3 kids - 14, 16, 21
In R

Posts: 791 | Registered: Dec 2012 | From: Canada
TXBW68
♀ Member
Member # 36456
Default  Posted: 9:32 PM, June 6th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No you're not doomed. We were separated for 10 months and our R is going well. My husband was not regretful, remorseful or any other term you want to insert. He was happy to be rid of his family...until the reality of a pending divorce and being a part time dad set in.

Now he is the definition of a remorseful wayward. He supports me, he reads, and he's doing the work on himself. He finally appreciates the life he almost lost.

You can do it if both of you want it and do the work.

Good luck!


Me (46) WH (42),2 boys 15 & 11
M 18yrs T 22yrs
Separated 10 months (4/12 to 2/13)
Final Total - #1/#2 ONS and #3/#4 EA/PA - left me for #4, didn't know about #2 and 3 until he moved back home
We are solidly in R now

Posts: 792 | Registered: Aug 2012 | From: Dallas, TX
lovehurtstomuch
♀ New Member
Member # 38836
Default  Posted: 12:17 PM, June 7th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Even though he admitted to the affair, he needs to figure out why he was able to cross the line. Even if he is remorseful and sees your pain. My WS was remorseful in the past, but it didn't last long before he was doing it again 3 years later. They need to dig deep within themselves and see what leads them to want to be with somebody else. Why do they turn to other people when things get tuff in the marriage. Why it was wrong.


BW-39
WH-39 Affair on & off for 5 yrs, plus a one night stand from dating web apps. My gut tells me there is more.
Married 17 yrs
DDay May 11, 2012 TT for months
Divorced Feb 20 but wking on R


Posts: 24 | Registered: Mar 2013 | From: TX
crazyblindsided
♀ Member
Member # 35215
Default  Posted: 12:54 PM, June 7th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He has particular difficulty dealing with two things: someone angry with him and a deep sense of shame. Those two things were not in lack following the d-days - and his way of dealing with them were to avoid, deflect, and fire back.

I did much of my healing post D-day on my own. And most of my reasons for staying were purely logistical. So I made a conscious decision to make my own growth the priority - and to hell with his issues.

I didn't shield him from the fall-out. He knew my anger. He knew my hurt. But I stopped expecting him to heal me. I stopped expecting him to even fix the marriage.

And somewhere along the way, he found remorse.

This is how it's gone for us. I have suffered multiple DDays and OW's, but have not seen my WH own anything or express remorse like he has until recently (we are 15 months out). He gets what he did. The part that is hard is whether he is strong enough to fix himself so that this will not happen to us again.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 12:55 PM, June 7th (Friday)]


BS/FWS (me):40 Madhatter
WS/BS:42 Serial Cheater
Together 18 years, Married 13
DD(10) DS(7)
DDay(s) 5/08, 5/09, 3/30/12
Final Dday 7/11/14 Affair never ended

Posts: 2266 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: California
Ladyogilvy
♀ Member
Member # 31558
Default  Posted: 2:06 PM, June 7th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's taken my WH 2 1/2 years to start getting it and showing some remorse. If I had known then what I know now, I would have invested more in designer bitch boots.


Me: BW a youthful 49
Him: alcoholic, sober now, WH 56
Married 19 years
Two sons, 16 & 17 years old
DD? He's still keeping secrets and only admits to what I have indisputable
evidence of... the $2000 earrings he bought her for x-mas.

Posts: 1536 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
Skan
♀ Member
Member # 35812
Default  Posted: 2:32 PM, June 7th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My FWH copped to everything on DDay. Even more than I had found proof for. But I have to say that this is VERY rare from what I read on these forums. Exceptionally rare. The TT he did was pretty minor and was mostly, I believe, stuff that he started remembering once his ADs kicked in and he was able to take a deep look into himself without mentally zoning out (he was deeply clinically depressed).

So I don't think that because your WH isn't telling you everything means that you're "doomed." But the sooner that he gets it through his head that being utterly truthful faster healing for you, the better.


Imagine a ship trying to set sail while towing an anchor. Cutting free is not a gift to the anchor. You must release that burden, not because the anchor is worthy, but because the ship is.

D-Day, June 10, 2012



Posts: 4943 | Registered: Jun 2012 | From: So California
Topic Posts: 14

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