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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men - Part 10
Betrayed444
♂ Member
Member # 38389
Default  Posted: 1:01 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The funny thing is that his father came to graduation. I will never forget standing in the day room when a Drill came through saying "guess whose dad locked his keys in his car?"

That's great. The apple didn't fall far from the tree. We All had our Gomer Pyles.
SSI
She's going to do what she's going to do. Don't beg, plead or cry.
I for one can say it but its harder to do it.
Detach. Go to the gym. Turn your frustration into strength, sweat, and muscle. Take this opportunity to become a hard core sonofabitch.
Fight the vag. Increase your standing in the world. Show indifference. Be more confident. Time for a nut check.
We do have relapses. Well take a few steps foward and backwards.
I know I do often but we push on.
We're all here to help each other out of this combat zone.
You'll have epiphanies, then triggers
New analyzations will appear in your head. You'll pick this situation up and look at it from all different perspectives. Just be true to yourself. Don't compromise your beliefs and expectations.
Sure you can work on being a better person, husband, or whatever but don't do it for her.
Hooah

Posts: 494 | Registered: Feb 2013
ReunitePangea
♂ Member
Member # 37529
Default  Posted: 1:11 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Any of you guys dealing with a LTA that went from an EA to a PA towards the end? WW said it went PA only for a short period of time (3 months) before I blew it up.

She won't talk about anything outside that forum, won't admit to anything outside of what I have already proven.

ssi - I do not know your story but I would be skeptical that it only went PA towards the end. Are you sure of this or did you only have evidence of the PA near the end? Trying to minimize the A even when the story is all out is a typical play from the WS handbook.

My WW had an LTA for 12 years so I am familar with this type of A. The fact she will only talk about it in MC sounds like a defense technique to prevent more of the truth from getting out.



BS - Me 38
WS - Wife 39
D-Day - Oct 12
Married 10 years
OM1 - 12-year LTA
OM2 - 9 month A turned into open relationship with couple for another 1 1/2 years

Posts: 406 | Registered: Nov 2012
Sal1995
♂ Member
Member # 39099
Default  Posted: 1:20 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fight the vag.

Good advice, B444. But don't underestimate the vag, she's a tough opponent. Try an easier, warm-up opponent first. Like nuclear radiation or the Chinese Army.


Me-45
WW-42
DDay 2/17/13, 10 month PA/EA
Final NC late Feb. '13
M - 18 years, together 19+
4 children

Reconciled


Posts: 1035 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
thinkingclear
♂ Member
Member # 38884
Default  Posted: 1:22 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SSI

I agree completely with Betrayed444. You cannot know what she is thinking or planning and it doesn't matter. Well, of course it matters but as she has already displayed, what you want and your feelings are not important to her. You have to detach. Work on making a better you for you.

Ultimately you "put up" with this limbo as long as you chose to do so. Mine is still there after 18 months. Spend the time determining what it is that you want and need to reconcile. She has to figure herself out if you have any chance at a meaningful marriage.


BS - Me
WW - Her
10 month EA/PA

Posts: 211 | Registered: Apr 2013
Betrayed444
♂ Member
Member # 38389
Default  Posted: 1:23 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

LOL SAL
The Vag is my kryptonite, you know that. I get weak
I don't care what I could be arguing about. When the vag comes out I'm like ok, you win
The world is flat, whatever

[This message edited by Betrayed444 at 1:25 PM, June 10th (Monday)]


Posts: 494 | Registered: Feb 2013
Betrayed444
♂ Member
Member # 38389
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I agree completely with Betrayed444. You cannot know what she is thinking or planning and it doesn't matter. Well, of course it matters but as she has already displayed, what you want and your feelings are not important to her. You have to detach. Work on making a better you for you.

Ultimately you "put up" with this limbo as long as you chose to do so. Mine is still there after 18 months. Spend the time determining what it is that you want and need to reconcile. She has to figure herself out if you have any chance at a meaningful marriage.


Of course I have learned that by working on yourself you become more attractive. Mentally, spiritually, and emotionally. Get a few drinks with friends. Go to the movies etc.
just that alone can make WW jealous beyond belief and fight for you.
They are selfish like that
Remember...your not doing it for her

Posts: 494 | Registered: Feb 2013
DefiledRage
♂ Member
Member # 39292
Default  Posted: 1:42 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fight the vag.

Lost cause here


Me:35 WW:34 M:13yrs
3 young children
Dday 1 EA 7/8/2010
Dday 2 PA 3/1/2013 same OMM for 4yrs

Mister rabbit says, "A moment of realization is worth a thousand prayers."


Posts: 429 | Registered: May 2013 | From: Two blocks from south shit and west hell
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 1:43 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Oh yeah, they hold up the D card and wave it on your face - usually a tactic to get you back in line. See, once they notice that soon after DDay they aren't discarded and we (whether through instinct, honour, male pride, p$$y whipped or just plain coda attachment) suddenly get clingy and try to "follow the program" - I.e read and try to implement all that marriage advise, go to MC obediently, don't ask for much change in them, are easily controlled and manipulated by the flow of information (TT anyone?), cry and feel disorientated and disjointed from everything around us except for the sole purpose of "saving this M", it becomes an empowering moment for them. As WAL mentioned a few posts ago, if she's remorseless, her only gambit is to get you back in the cage she wants you in; follow the script she has laid out for you.

i read somewhere that most WWs (excluding the 'former' ones here) had "already decided to leave the M", now that YOU are holding on to it; they get this sudden feeling of having power over you. It's not to say any of them would've left; heck there'd be NO affair of she's left the M (i.e a proper D) and gone and ridden a few hundred strange cocks after the paperwork was done. Fact is she didn't; cake eating at its finest. She wants you for the chores, bills and kids and fantasy cock for the shits and giggles. And how dare you bust that high???? Or make her feel bad about it?

Getting back to a healthy lesson from all this; what B444 said. Be a healthier you and start being sure of yourself. T'was jj who said to me in these here forums almost a year ago "think of the INcome rather than focusing on the OUTcome" (or something along those lines). What it meant to me was let go of "what's going to happen to this M or my relationship or my family?", focus on "how do I ultimately win in this situation?". Jj can chime in and clarify for my lack of retention and comprehension.

I admit the D card had me in a tailspin and unwilling to face the possible destruction of my children's home. Yes, I've been weak and ineffectual. I used to beat myself up for months on end about being so weak. It was here that I found confidence that we all bumble somewhere along the way, we all screw up on the 180, the detachment, the consequences etc etc... And we (hopefully) keep learning and growing. Regardless of whether there is a wonderful R waiting for us at the end or a wonderfully awesome post D sitch (nod at jj and all the hotties he poses with), what's important is using this 'opportunity' to redefine our role in the story of OUR lives. If you go back a few pages, there's some great soliloquies from WAL about whether we'd like to be known for our role as husband or is there really more to us than that... Fact is, there is. We use M as the crutch when in fact we walked fine without it in the first place.

[This message edited by noescape at 1:47 PM, June 10th (Monday)]


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
thinkingclear
♂ Member
Member # 38884
Default  Posted: 1:46 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fight the vag.

Definitely their not-so-secret weapon. But doesn't it suck that even that is tainted now.


BS - Me
WW - Her
10 month EA/PA

Posts: 211 | Registered: Apr 2013
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 1:50 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It being tainted is a blessing in disguise. Suddenly opens up a whole new world of untainted vags if you catch my drift... Not condoning RA or other maladaptive behaviour, just sayin that's a distinct possibility if D happens.

And if R happens and she's awesome about it, I guess (and this is just presumption on my part) the vag is now gold... nay, titanium plated...


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
ssi0318
♂ New Member
Member # 39225
Default  Posted: 1:53 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

B444 - thanks. I did all my begging as she was detaching before I figured out what was going on. Since DDay, I've made it clear that I want to keep my family together, but I haven't broken down. I've gotten pretty damn upset at her, but no more begging, pleading, etc. I've been working on getting out more often, it's tough with three little(r) kids, especially when I have the "afternoon shift".

ReunitePangea - Do I know for sure it went PA only at the end? Nope, that's all she's admitted to and all I have proof of. Her behavior changed so dramatically at the end that it seems likely, but who the hell knows. The fact that she will only talk about anything marriage related in MC drives me up the freaking wall, and I agree it's a defensive strategy. She's definitely not showing any remorse, only regret that she got caught. Well, I take that back, she did say she was sorry for fucking everything up and sorry that she made a mess of everything. I want to hear an apology every day, and she is way too proud to do something like that. The other part that is bugging me now is that the only time MC fits into our schedules is Tuesday nights, and she's got business commitments for the next two weeks, and last week our MC was away, so that'll be three weeks straight of no MC. It's my main pressure relief valve when it comes to the stress of this whole fucking mess. I guess I'll have to go back to the gym. I had been running a 5k over lunch with an eye towards working up to a marathon, but I stopped going when the shit hit the fan. I've lost about 20lbs from the stress of it all, somim thinking that if I do go back and hit the weights, I may actually have a chance to be a lean mean fill in the blank machine.

Thinking clear - so how are you handling the limbo?


Me-BS
Her-WW - probable NPD
M 11 years, T 14 years
3 kids, all under 10
DDay 3/18/13
I'm not happy - Nov-12

Posts: 32 | Registered: May 2013
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 2:02 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ssi, my 2 cents; I think MC is pretty useless if all that you're getting out of it is more remorseless behaviour, her not taking ownership of her fuck ups (I.e the affair). If you're not feeling authentic remorse and complete honesty within and outside of MC, it's probably regret and guilt, not remorse. The difference being that regret (being caught) and guilt (with shame-of doing something wrong) are both INWARD looking; I.e. still all about her; rather than remorse where she addresses/ feels sorry for the hurt inflicted on you and her family.

Is she in IC or doing any reading on her own to find out her 'whys' for her A?


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
Stillkicking
♂ Member
Member # 38246
Default  Posted: 2:09 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


"The Vag is my kryptonite, you know that. I get weak
I don't care what I could be arguing about. When the vag comes out I'm like ok, you win
The world is flat, whatever"

Got a good ol' laugh outta this one
Thanks 444 I needed one lol


You'll never learn to fly
until your standing at the cliff

I reserve my right to feel uncomfortable reserve my right to be afraid.
I make mistakes and I am humbled every step of the way.


Posts: 126 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Canada
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 2:11 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Here's a few words to add to your arsenal if you're going to talk in front of the MC;

Contrition; for betraying you and her vows and inflicting this sort of pain upon you and visiting such a horror on her children's home and family (I.e. the well being of those who depend upon and love you)

Volunteering information (goes with transparency); being up front and honest about her A(s) without you having to ask. About her feelings then and now, about what she's thinking and what she's doing to fix her shit.

Healthy boundaries (including NC in mind and heart); ensuring she is keeping the marriage safe for you, keeping you in the loop rather than discussing any intimate details with anyone outside the marriage.

Those are just starters without which I would consider MC to be a massive fail.


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
thinkingclear
♂ Member
Member # 38884
Default  Posted: 2:12 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I want to hear an apology every day, and she is way too proud to do something like that.

My wife's attitude as well. She is full of pride and a little shame and guilt. No remorse and only halfhearted apologies most of which were negated when she chose to break NC. She still doesn't respect you or your feelings. Part of the demonizing approach I think.

The other part that is bugging me now is that the only time MC fits into our schedules is Tuesday nights, and she's got business commitments for the next two weeks, and last week our MC was away, so that'll be three weeks straight of no MC. It's my main pressure relief valve when it comes to the stress of this whole fucking mess. I guess I'll have to go back to the gym.

I understand. I still can't get enough talking in and she would be happy if we never brought up her A ever again. Just keep working on it. I have turned to the gym myself. Love it. Can't get enough. I've turned my obsessive thoughts towards something of value. I strive to hit a new PR. Love doing Olympic and Power lifts. Gotta find an outlet for your stress somewhere.

Thinking clear - so how are you handling the limbo?

That usually depends on the day. It has taken me awhile to get a clear definition in my head of what I truly want. I had to grieve the loss of the marriage that I thought I had. I've just become comfortable with being where I am for the time being. I so badly wanted a quick resolution. I wanted the pain to go away; to wake up from my nightmare. Once I had accepted the reality of the situation and defined my priorities: being with my kids as much as possible, giving our marriage opportunity for reconciliation, letting myself off the hook for the whole mess (taking responsibility for 50% of our marriage issues but allowing her to carry 100% responsibility for her A), setting boundaries that I needed to move forward things started to get easier. I have detached enough to know my future looks good either way. I know she has a lot of introspection and hard work ahead of her. As long as I feel she is working towards things as I feel she should and NC is NOT broken, I have decided I'm willing to wait things out. I know what it will take to keep me in the M long term. The question remains is if she is able to meet those needs. Time will tell, but for the moment she is doing the things I ask of her (although usually with reluctance).


[This message edited by thinkingclear at 2:14 PM, June 10th (Monday)]


BS - Me
WW - Her
10 month EA/PA

Posts: 211 | Registered: Apr 2013
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fight the vag:

http://www.ridelust.com/wp-content/uploads/sparta.jpg


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Ugh, double
Post and I can't seem to get the image directly imbedded in the post...

[This message edited by noescape at 2:22 PM, June 10th (Monday)]


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
ssi0318
♂ New Member
Member # 39225
Default  Posted: 2:28 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Noescape - thanks for the thoughtful posts. Definitely going to talk about volunteering information & boundaries. While I'm not happy with how things have gone thus far, I was even more unhappy before going, so I feel this is an improvement, shitty though it may be.

Thinkingclear - thanks for your perspective as well.

I gotta say, as much as I hate this whole celibate BS I'm dealing with right now, I know the that if we were having sex on a regular basis, I'd probably be more likely to rugsweep, so I guess that is a positive.


Me-BS
Her-WW - probable NPD
M 11 years, T 14 years
3 kids, all under 10
DDay 3/18/13
I'm not happy - Nov-12

Posts: 32 | Registered: May 2013
Sal1995
♂ Member
Member # 39099
Default  Posted: 2:31 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

When the vag comes out I'm like ok, you win
The world is flat, whatever

Don't ever change, B444. At the risk of getting my ass kicked by a former DI at jjct's NO MA'AM summit next year, I have to say: I love you, man. But only in the "Band-of-Brothers-we're-in-this-shit-together" way, of course. Let's have a beer.


Me-45
WW-42
DDay 2/17/13, 10 month PA/EA
Final NC late Feb. '13
M - 18 years, together 19+
4 children

Reconciled


Posts: 1035 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
thinkingclear
♂ Member
Member # 38884
Default  Posted: 2:46 PM, June 10th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Contrition; for betraying you and her vows and inflicting this sort of pain upon you and visiting such a horror on her children's home and family (I.e. the well being of those who depend upon and love you)

Volunteering information (goes with transparency); being up front and honest about her A(s) without you having to ask. About her feelings then and now, about what she's thinking and what she's doing to fix her shit.

Healthy boundaries (including NC in mind and heart); ensuring she is keeping the marriage safe for you, keeping you in the loop rather than discussing any intimate details with anyone outside the marriage.

Those are just starters without which I would consider MC to be a massive fail.

Fantastic words of wisdom that make up the "needs" WW has to meet if R is possible. My only hesitation is that the route each WW takes to get there (if ever) is different. I am in IC with a psychiatrist and it has been terribly helpful for me. I have discussed the "plan" of getting WW to seeing remorse. Obviously it isn't possible to "make" someone change, but it still feels like doing sometime proactive discussing things in MC. I agree it is useless until they "get it", but a good MC that holds the WW feet to the fire is better than no one doing so. Ultimately, IC is likely in the future of my WW with or without me in her life. My hope and the recommendation by my IC is to continue with MC. Her brokenness will display itself and a good MC will identify it and recommend IC for her. At least that is the "plan".

Ultimately, I agree that you have to detach yourself from the outcome. I struggle with it myself.


BS - Me
WW - Her
10 month EA/PA

Posts: 211 | Registered: Apr 2013
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