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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men - Part 10
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 3:31 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

64 and Razor, then I don't have anything to offer. Either your prepping to live or your prepping to die. To me, settling is dying or giving up. If I were in your shoes I would put together an exit plan and be working towards it, may take 5 years but its better than sitting in shit.

Complacency is a killer.


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 3:37 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

dupe! Duh

[This message edited by hardlessons at 3:37 PM, May 24th (Friday)]


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 4:02 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Happy potential 3 day weekend, men.

Per 64fleet:

She's immature emotionally [in my sitch, probably] due to sexual abuse at a young age, not my fault but my cross to bear.

My MC told me that she thinks that WW was sexually abused when young. My WW has no memory of anything. 64, based on what you have said, I think my WW is offering more to me than yours is to you. But, I get where you are coming from, and in contrast to HL's post, I think there is nothing wrong with staying for the kids as long as there is peace in the home. It is not sitting in shit if you are focusing on your kids and yourself, maximizing time with them. You are basically saying that you can be happy without a female relationship being a big priority. I think kids pick up on the presence of conflict more than the 'absence' of love.

So I will take up D-rage's observation:

It allows me to say something that I'm not willing to say directly to my WW

and scream why did you think that throwing me and the kids away to be the NPD OM's whore on call was a good idea?

Sal, nice comments.


--Jack


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 4:50 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think kids pick up on the presence of conflict more than the 'absence' of love.

MC have no problem with you going a different route than me, but I was raised in a family where there was an 'absence' of love. What I would tell my mother or father if A was the reason for that 'absence' of love, I would have said "don't bother, get off your cross of oh I am staying for the kids, I am just selfish that way or they need me bullshit". Let's be honest, if you want to be a good parent you have to model the behavior right? How do you model love in a loveless marriage? I think more often then not, when men say they are staying for the kids it has more to do with either them being lazy or sadistic in that they want to hang around and beat their wife up for as long as they can.

Do some states have some seriously fucked up laws? Definitely, but it is amazing what man can do if they put their minds to it.


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
DefiledRage
♂ Member
Member # 39292
Default  Posted: 5:22 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't think there is anything wrong with a man staying to make sure his kids are provided for. Let's face some of these WS are completely messed up. They can't take care of themselves let alone the children, and ain't a court in the land going to give a man full custody. In some cases, but the burden of prove is a joke. She can be a crack addicted half-dead whore, but you won't get full custody until she's in prison or dead.
Protecting your children has nothing to do with being lazy or sadistic. I'd jump in front of a bullet if it meant allowing my kids to go up and have kids of their own. For me not much of a stretch to stick around to try and stop the cycle of A's my WS's family seems to pass down the generations. I couldn't look in the mirror if I didn't give everything I had to stop that cycle. I NEVER want my children to feel this pain. Maybe if I show that my word is worth something, even if their mother's is not, then they will keep their commitments to their spouses in the future. Honor, now that is a model behavior that is worth passing on to me.
If I left, I would feel like I was abandoning them to the same bat-shit crazy mom my WS grew up with, and thus the same bullshit childhood.

[This message edited by DefiledRage at 5:26 PM, May 24th (Friday)]


Me:35 WW:34 M:13yrs
3 young children
Dday 1 EA 7/8/2010
Dday 2 PA 3/1/2013 same OMM for 4yrs

Mister rabbit says, "A moment of realization is worth a thousand prayers."


Posts: 426 | Registered: May 2013 | From: Two blocks from south shit and west hell
Sal1995
♂ Member
Member # 39099
Default  Posted: 5:43 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If I left, I would feel like I was abandoning them to the same bat-shit crazy mom my WS grew up with, and thus the same bullshit childhood.

Amen. And I would add to that the same bat-shit crazy men that paraded through my wife's childhood. The guy my wife betrayed me for is, objectively, a creep. If I had no notion that he screwed my wife, I'd still think that he was a dirtbag based on his appearance and lifestyle. So I just got a scary glimpse at the type of guy who'll raise my kids.

I'm not saying stick around in a marriage that is toxic and abusive just for the sake of the kids, but I think BHs in this situation need to give R every possible chance before pulling the plug. It may mean getting rid of the "dealbreaker" mentality, and I'm well aware how difficult that is. We need to keep in mind that we chose to marry a damaged woman (and honestly, how many of us didn't realize that before marriage?).

And if all else fails, file and fight like hell for primary custody.

[This message edited by Sal1995 at 12:06 AM, May 25th (Saturday)]


Me-45
WW-42
DDay 2/17/13, 10 month PA/EA
Final NC late Feb. '13
M - 18 years, together 19+
4 children

Reconciled


Posts: 1028 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
MC_Jack
♂ Member
Member # 35016
Default  Posted: 5:47 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

D-rage,

My BIL has that view that you expressed. He has decided that he is willing to make sacrifices so that his kids have a positive, emotionally healthy parent around all the time. His wife is crazier than my WW I think.


I am not a marriage counselor. I chose "MC Jack" in the spirit of a handle like "MC Hammer" or Young MC"...there is a lot of 'rapping' here, no? At the time I did not know what MC stood for on this site. Duh.

Posts: 792 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: West Coast of Hopa-hopa-land
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 6:56 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So there that bad that if you had proof of their shit and infidelity every guy is going to be denied at least 50% custody? That is just not true. For every horror story in custody there is the opposite, thing is you don't know till you at least start the process.

I think what I have issue with is that if you make that choice, climb up on that cross, then be like Heysus Christo and not complain about it. If we know the difference between healthy and unhealthy and choose to stay in it then so be it, I am not gonna spill some of my 40 oz for that. I have been that kid.... Thanks for nothing is what I'd tell my parents.


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 8:07 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'll give more later, but I got primary custody from the ExW(1st M). She didn't drink to excess, do drugs or beat the kids. She had a DD from her 1st M. The court gave me custody of my DS and actually split the siblings. She also had to pay me CS.

Think it's hard now? This was about 20 years ago. It's possible, just not easy or cheap.

Gotta fight for what you believe in.

Strength brothers


BH 50, WW 41
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 19(Hers),DS 8 Ours, DGS 2 1/2
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
“I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.”
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2068 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 8:09 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wow, the thread is taking an interesting turn.

a few observations:

but it is amazing what man can do if they put their minds to it.

I don't know if the "I can fix this" mentality got me anywhere near a good place, quite the opposite....

If I left, I would feel like I was abandoning them to the same bat-shit crazy mom my WS grew up with, and thus the same bullshit childhood.

amen to that. A's seem like a generational thing with WW's family /social construct. All my own bullshit notwithstanding; at the least, I'd like to be 1.) 'There'/around and involved with my kids (which is not a guarantee in any form of D/S situation - not at least in my sitch) and 2.) be able to model something better for my kids. I may be a colossal failure at it, but yet I have to try.

All said, these last few posts have been very useful in helping me explore my motivations and thoughts/confusion in limbo. I can honestly say it is not a sadistic 'make her pay' mindset. Wish it was, would've been well countered to her crazymaking ways, but it just isn't. What would i get out of revenge/making her suffer anyway? More turmoil and fuckedupness for my kids in the short AND long run.

But what do I know? I am still the puppet in this play...


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 10:08 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I don't know if the "I can fix this" mentality got me anywhere near a good place, quite the opposite....

Was not the direction I was going with that, you can't fix anything but yourself. I don't think I have ever alluded to fixing anyone or anything, just working on our choices and making healthy ones.

To throw up your hands without any effort to even see if you can overcome is a cop out to me. If you put the same effort into getting healthy and getting an exit plan instead of sitting in the shit you would be surprised what you can accomplish.


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
StillGoing
♂ Member
Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 11:44 PM, May 24th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

think what I have issue with is that if you make that choice, climb up on that cross, then be like Heysus Christo and not complain about it. If we know the difference between healthy and unhealthy and choose to stay in it then so be it, I am not gonna spill some of my 40 oz for that. I have been that kid.... Thanks for nothing is what I'd tell my parents.

D in NJ at least is a good chance at lifetime alimony if you are a guy. Infidelity is irrelevant in that equation. It's not an unreasonable consideration to be faced with indentured servitude while your ex wife fucks some other guy on your dime.

That aside, not all marriages that stay together for love are better than the ones that stay together for the kids. No, I don't think staying for the kids is the right thing on its own either, but I also think staying for love can be just as selfish. I honestly believe if I had got a D I would be better for our kids. I stayed because I wanted to, for me.

Taking that even further, my fucked up dysfunctional abusive parents definitely love each other. I despise them and the only thing I think about concerning their eventual demise is having to deal with the drama around that shit. Otherwise I'd be happy to never see them again. I'd have happily traded parents that loved each other for parents that weren't abusive, self absorbed assholes.

When I accepted that we were going to D, I accepted the reality I was not going to see my kids more than a couple days a week and whenever I was going to be a babysitter. It never came to that but I can absolutely understand not wanting to be separated from the babies you raised and protected and would go down into hell five times over for. Pretending that things are okay just to stay close to them aren't that unreasonable. We all hear how mommy would never betray her babies but we have a forum full of fathers who get shit for doing the same thing it's just assumed a woman would do naturally and is considered some kind of inhuman monster for what it's assumed a man would do naturally, abandon their kids to go off and fuck somebody. Things aren't so simple, they never are.


“Fate is a fickle bitch who dotes on irony.”

Posts: 7107 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
Tred
♂ Member
Member # 34086
Default  Posted: 6:01 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

We all hear how mommy would never betray her babies but we have a forum full of fathers who get shit for doing the same thing it's just assumed a woman would do naturally and is considered some kind of inhuman monster for what it's assumed a man would do naturally, abandon their kids to go off and fuck somebody. Things aren't so simple, they never are.

Excellent point SG.

Have a good weekend gents. I get the pleasure of spending the weekend at a bad trigger location. I could get out of it, but our son is looking forward to it - it's not giving up the rest of my life for him, but I completely understand sacrificing for your kids.

I'll just load up on the 1800 Silver and .9mm ammo, what could go wrong ? Hope everyone has a good Memorial Day.


Married: 16 years (14 @JFO)
D-Day: 11/09/11
"Ohhhhh...shut up Tred!" - NOT the official SI motto (DS)

Posts: 3303 | Registered: Dec 2011
Betrayed444
♂ Member
Member # 38389
Default  Posted: 9:05 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Happy Memorial Day. First I'd like to say thank you to our veterans that served.
Allow me to chime in a bit
I'd like to recognize sal for his prior contribution on page 9.
Yeah. I guess I've been angry. I'm in month 6 so it seems that I'm following the script. We're all different but the same in a way. I do love my WW. Who really doesn't?
This thread is BM and whether we're at the beginning, middle, complacent, or end stage, if there really is one besides D, we come in here to mingle with our tribe, our brothers, who know what it feels like to be betrayed. Who else in this world can understand our plight? Friends? Family? Co workers? Not really. Well get some pity, some sympathy, some hard lines.
No one really understands. But we, on this web site understand. I come here for solace. To compare notes. Let out my frustration. We have new guys and veterans discussing what is best for ourselves and our children. Shit I bet a few words here and there maybe saved a life or two. I'm sure there are those that hit rock bottom and discovered this web site and were pulled out of their hole. I'm sure a few came on to vent, got things out of their system instead of seriously hurting themselves or someone else. This is where we go. This is our rehab. This particular section has helped me understand my predicament and quagmire immensely and I am very grateful. WAL, 545,64,Sal, face punched , tred,jc, and many others contributed a lot of space and time.
I know several are immersed deeply in R and I apologize if I upset any of those warm fuzzies. I'm glad it's working for you and your advice on how you got there is valuable. Your blazing a path. Those going for D, also valuable advice. That trail is also something we need to know about. We all go about solving our problems differently and the many parts can truly make each man whole.


Posts: 494 | Registered: Feb 2013
Betrayed444
♂ Member
Member # 38389
Default  Posted: 9:45 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WW finally gave me her FB PW. I don't even know where to begin

Posts: 494 | Registered: Feb 2013
Sal1995
♂ Member
Member # 39099
Default  Posted: 9:50 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WW finally gave me her FB PW. I don't even know where to begin

That bad, huh? Sorry brother.


Me-45
WW-42
DDay 2/17/13, 10 month PA/EA
Final NC late Feb. '13
M - 18 years, together 19+
4 children

Reconciled


Posts: 1028 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Shit I bet a few words here and there maybe saved a life or two

I bet. I'm damn near sure this is the case. Enjoy your respective holidays, gentlemen. Purchase something that used to be alive, and subsequently eat it.


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1604 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
reallyscrewedup7
♂ Member
Member # 30825
Default  Posted: 10:01 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

B444

First, thank you and Tred (Go Navy)and all the other vets on the board!

Why the heck did she just give you her FB password? Did she spend all night scrubbing the messages?

If you are divorcing, I am not sure I would want to see what was in there. But that is just me. When I filed, I stopped ALL, and I mean ALL snooping/investigating/hunting to find answers or evidence or more infidelity. I did not see the purpose of finding more painful shit.

Now if you are thinking R, I would also be careful. She has had a lot of time to sanitize her shit...


Infidelity sucks shit

Posts: 879 | Registered: Jan 2011 | From: Finding my way
Sal1995
♂ Member
Member # 39099
Default  Posted: 10:07 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

First, thank you and Tred (Go Navy)and all the other vets on the board!

USAF vet here. All we need now is a Marine and Coast Guard vet.


Me-45
WW-42
DDay 2/17/13, 10 month PA/EA
Final NC late Feb. '13
M - 18 years, together 19+
4 children

Reconciled


Posts: 1028 | Registered: Apr 2013 | From: Texas
VD2012
♂ Member
Member # 36317
Default  Posted: 10:17 AM, May 25th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hardlessons,

This is exactly why I made the suggestion to have a BM thread where the whole intent was R. Some guys just don't want to have to yell I am ok and in R over the dine of whore of never forgive etc.

Just wanted to say I agree and wish that thread was made. If you look over those who agreed with your initial proposal there are plenty who wanted it yet are nowhere to be found here in the Betrayed Men thread, like myself. Why? The sentiment of "my wayward slut whore bitch who's a shit mother and will take me for everything I own and ain't worth forgiving and is only useful as my personal masturbation device" just gets tiring.

I quit posting in a previous BM thread due to getting jumped on by another member for actually having the audacity to say something positive about my wife while a "rah rah wayward sluts" session was going on.

I totally get the desire and even occasional need to vent. It can be healthy and cathartic, yet it can also lead to slowed healing, resentment and prolonged pain.

As someone with lifelong anger issues I've come to learn just how much anger, rage, fear and resentment can fester within you and rot you from the inside out. It sure makes you feel great and in control (which is what this is all about) while you rage and act vengeful. But it's at a cost of yourself. The bitterness grows, the resentment lingers, and that shit doesn't do a damn fucking thing to your wife or the guy(s) she fucked. It hurts you.

Not singling anyone out in particular, but look at yourself and how you're recovering from this. How much time is spent thinking about your wife, what she's doing, what she's not? You sit mistrusting, wanting to punish, being angry. Take that energy and turn it on yourself. I'll tell you, my wife isn't worth spending my life being angry over. That shit eats away and does no good. Every time you call your life a slut you're fuelling that internal fire. Every time you think of how shit she was during her affair you poke at that beast inside. Every time you wonder when she's going to fuck up again is furthering the problem. Stop worrying so much about your wives, if they fuck up again they do. If they don't they don't. In the meantime you're more important and need to realize that.

Focus on you. You'll be so much happier, at least with yourself. If I hadn't started changing my own shit a few years ago my wife would probably be baptized daily in the eternal nuclear fire of her own personal Armageddon that I'd have unleashed on her following D-Day. I'd have sworn bloody vengeance and set out to extract every fucking pound of flesh I could have, and then some. For what though? Really for what? Nothing of worth, at least not to me. I've thankfully realized that and I have a whole different approach to life anymore. It's hard but worth it.

A large majority of my threads on this site are about me not my wife. I spend a lot of time introspectively looking at myself and how to make my life better. I focus on me and I'm better off for it. Some of you guys should really listen to hardlessons. I hope he doesn't mind me saying this, but if you learn about his and tired girl's story you'll understand why he's here. Not entirely because of her. He didn't fix his shit and deal with things when he should have and fucked up in his own way. He's done a lot of work and learning since, he knows and has experienced what he's talking about.

So much time spent being pissed at your spouse is time not spent making yourself happy. Just think about it.


Me: 28 ~ Her (FR2012): 27
Together: 9 years, 2 children
D-Day: April 19, 2012

Surrender to the truth of life.


Posts: 466 | Registered: Jul 2012 | From: Traversing Dark Places With The Light of Truth
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