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User Topic: fighting for it?
♀ Member
Member # 37362
Default  Posted: 1:20 PM, April 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You view self improvement as using another as a stepping stone.

Ok lets break it down. Because I really want to understand how its not.

There is nothing that can justify what I did. All I had to do was just talk to CL. I am sure he would have moved mountains to address my issues. So now I look in the mirror and say Oh I don’t like what I see and I would like to change. I did not like what I was doing before too. I just chose to deny. So now I am not denying and I have hurt him beyond imagination. I see him in pain, losing weight and unable to sleep.

He gets me out of fog (literally) and I say *NOW* I am looking in mirror and I don’t like it. Honestly its not as if I never knew I was doing something wrong. I knew better. All the help that I am getting now and all the material I am reading now was available before also.

Seeing CL so devastated horrified me. Me and my choices have brought us here. I dragged him in this mess. And now I just turn back and say “Sorry but I don’t like myself and I would like to improve”. Obvious reaction from anybody would be “whatever but why did you mess with my life?”. Realization of I need to improve need not come at somebody’s expense. And how is that not a stepping stone?

I honestly want to get past this point. Any attempts of improvements gets me in a momentum but all this guilt drags me right back to where I started. I know self-improvement is not linked to anybody else but is this situation how it is not?


Yes.. your posts have been really helpful. Thanks

WW: 28 (ME)
BH: 28 (SI profile: CrappyLife)
D-Day- 15/10/12

Posts: 334 | Registered: Nov 2012
tired girl
♀ Member
Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 1:30 PM, April 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Your right EF, it would have been better if you had realized BEFORE you did all of this that you had problems and fixed yourself and didn't drag CL into it. But that isn't what happened is it?

So you have this mess now, are you just going to sit in your shit and say I shouldn't fix this because if I do then it will be because of what I did? That is more of your faulty reasoning. The ONLY thing good that can come out of this mess is you fixing yourself. Period. You figuring out that you betrayed yourself and lost who YOU were in this mess and figuring out how to find her again is the only good that will come of this. And you are sitting here trying to be a martyr saying I won't fix myself because that will be making something good from this. That is fucked up thinking. Do you have a desire to remain this messed up person for the rest of your life? Get out of your pity party, put on your big girl pants and get to work.

Me45 Him 45 Hardlessons DS 25,23,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." Eleanor Roosevelt

Posts: 5079 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
♀ Member
Member # 37362
Default  Posted: 1:37 PM, April 11th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And you are sitting here trying to be a martyr saying I won't fix myself because that will be making something good from this. That is fucked up thinking.

Sigh!!1 you are right.

WW: 28 (ME)
BH: 28 (SI profile: CrappyLife)
D-Day- 15/10/12

Posts: 334 | Registered: Nov 2012
♂ Member
Member # 38287
Default  Posted: 4:04 PM, April 12th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am going to tell you, flat out, that there is such a huge emphasis here on abandoning codependency that I think many lose sight of the forest for the trees.

EF started this post out with this:

I am not getting a sense of “fight” to make him stay. (the way I did before) I am just working towards respecting his choice and not hurt him any further. And still that makes me feel like I am not fighting for him. I am not sure I am able to explain properly. I end up feeling very insecure because my focus is not to make him stay “at any cost”.

That’s the reason I look for assurance from him that he knows that I DO care and love him.

I completely understand this emphasis as codependency can be a marriage killer. There is no argument there.

But moving away from codependency does not mean that one has to ignore the fundamental goal - a better, happier marriage. That is the goal in this case, is it not? I get the feeling that, in the effort to move EF toward a healthier place, it is implied that it's irrelevant if the cost of moving in that direction is the loss of her marriage.

The only way THAT works out is if you don't care if you're single. It's great to say, "I'm healing myself and I don't need anyone" as your marriage goes in the shitter. But if you want your marriage to recover, on a very basic principle, it needs to be fought for by the WS, and it needs to be wanted by the BS. Overcoming codependency and fighting for a marriage are not mutually exclusive ideals. I'm not sure why this site seems to give the impression that they're one and the same.

When I said in my posts that she and her husband "need each other to recover" I wasn't referencing their personal mental health. They don't need each other to be healthy people. Obviously. But if they WANT THEIR MARRIAGE TO RECOVER, then they cannot abandon each other in the face of reconciliation.

This means that she needs to fight for him - not because it's good or bad for HER - but because without it he might not come back into the relationship. This means that HE needs to begin the process of moving back toward her - not because it's good or bad for HIM but because she needs it.

I recognize that some here are going to scream foul at the hint of codependency but I absolutely feel that in order for reconciliation to occur, at some point, people need to move back toward each other. There has to be a recognition that the other person in the marriage needs you - not in the psychobabble world of "needing" as a reflection of your psyche - but in the basic, fundamental element of relationships.

It appears, to me, that her SO - having had 6+ months to digest what happened - needs to move toward her. Or not. He doesn't have to forgive, forget, or make any long term promises. But at this point he needs to make a decision as to whether or not there is a future and just how bright that future might be.

She NEEDS that - again, not in a codependent way but in a basic, functional relationship way. She NEEDS to know - is he in or is he out? It's important for her own healing and so that she can move forward with her life, with him or without him.

I hope that every one of us "needs" our spouses. In a healthy, loving, passionate way. If not, if that's called codependency, well... I will simply disagree as a happily recovering BS.

EF, you asked what you need to do to "fight for it." You have gotten a lot of feedback in regard to how you can heal as a person. And I agree with almost all of it. But as it relates to your relationship, my opinion is that you both need to move back toward each other in a way that is loving and honest - even if that means a conscious, concerted effort on both your parts to move forward.

I'm sure I'll get a strong share of flames over this but that's my recommendation.

Best of luck to you.

"Pain is temporary. Quitting is forever."

Posts: 158 | Registered: Jan 2013
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