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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts-10
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 3:05 PM, March 31st (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Me, I hear EVERY ugly, nasty, insult and demeaning phrase he threw at me, see every scornful, disgusted look, every eyeroll, every long suffering sigh that let me know he was just putting up with my necessary presence in his life. I just don't know how to un-hear, un-see and un-feel that reality.

***(((Kat)))***


Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 3:17 PM, March 31st (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

He claims he just wanted to be humiliated and used by her. That's his 'thing': being humiliated. He's addicted to porn where men are shamed and humiliated. His parents are a bit controlling but nice folks. I keep wondering what the hell happened to him to make him this way.

(((SadOne))) I'm sorry you've found yourself here, and I'm sorry you're dealing with this particular problem - my STBX is obsessed with the same thing. I'm sorry to tell you that this is a very difficult thing for him to overcome, and yes, it may come from some terrible trauma that occurred in his childhood. That's what most CSATs and books would tell you.

There are also experts who will tell you that human sexuality is a diverse spectrum, and some people may be hardwired since birth to prefer this sort of sex.

I don't think that anyone REALLY knows for sure. So the most important thing for you to do is to take care of yourself and build a support network in real life: family, friends, and a very good psychologist.

I'll let the others give you advice about what your H needs to do. But the only thing that set me free was telling people the truth about what STBX had done, and talking to several great, compassionate psychologists.

Please keep posting. There's lots of support here. (((HUGS)))


Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
Nature_Girl
♀ Member
Member # 32554
Default  Posted: 7:01 PM, March 31st (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

But the only thing that set me free was telling people the truth about what STBX had done, and talking to several great, compassionate psychologists

This is powerful. Please, everyone here please read this & take it to heart. The only thing that's helped me is telling the truth about what was happening and getting some good counseling.

You must tell. Keeping this kind of secret will literally kill you.


Me = BS (Stay-at-home-mom)
Him = EX-d out (abusive troglodyte NPD SA)
3 elementary school-aged kids
Together 20 years
D-Day: Memorial Weekend 2011
2013 - I DIVORCED HIM, I'M FREE!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBOJpIwF47Y

Posts: 8792 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: USA
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 10:47 PM, March 31st (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

sadone - sorry you are here, but you have found a wonderful support group who understand what you are going through. You sound strong. Are you in IC? Have you seen a CSAT or hooked up with a COSA group? Read any books on SA? Any of those would be a good place to start. sexhelp.com is a good website and you can find if there is a CSAT near you on there.

You say that his parents are controlling, but otherwise ok; there may be MUCH more there. My SAWH's parents look very normal from the outside: married 50 years, held good jobs, etc., but probe a little deeper and you will see that his mom is NPD, passive-aggressive and enmeshed with my SAWH. Mother enmeshment can be a contributing factor (not sure if that is the exact correct phrase) to SA. Not sure if I am explaining this correctly, but from what I understand, the enmeshment causes them to not detatch from their mother, so they cannot truly connect with you. If they do connect with you, they feel like they are betraying their mother. It is also called emotional incest. Porn is okay because it is not a real woman and therefore (in their mind), they are not betraying their mother. I found that I thought SAWH's family was normal, but the more I looked, got counseling, discovered my own issues, the more I saw, like peeling layers of an onion - there's always another layer underneath what you "see" at first.

Sorry for the long tangent and hope that is in someway helpful to someone.

Kat - so sorry for what you are going through. Remembering all the cruel things he has said/done must be torture. Is it troublesome to you to remember because it brings your self-esteem down, because you are pissed that he was such an asshole to you and now gets a free pass for it and is doing great in recovery, both, or something else? I don't exactly know what EMDR is, but I've heard people talk about it (and you may have even already done it), but is that something that could be useful to you?

Choosing and NG - thanks for the advice on telling. Who did you tell, when, etc.? I haven't told many people, mostly because I am laying low right now. I've thought about telling my friends at the kids' school because I am so tired of putting up the happy facade, but it hasn't felt quite right to do that yet.


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 11:15 PM, March 31st (Sunday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My SAWH's parents look very normal from the outside: married 50 years, held good jobs, etc., but probe a little deeper and you will see that his mom is NPD, passive-aggressive and enmeshed with my SAWH.

This is sort of true in my situation too. MIL is a highly functioning, domineering NPD who is very passive-aggressive. STBX is an only child.

Numb, I didn't actually tell anyone until after the big D-Day. So I need to clarify. I had several D-Days. The first one, I was pregnant. And I did not tell ANYONE except a therapist what STBX had done (S&M affairs). I knew that I wouldn't be able to find one family member or friend who wouldn't insist that I move out of our home immediately. I also felt debilitating shame. (I still struggle with this.)

So I hobbled along, going to therapists with STBX, and fighting with him, and snooping, and hoping that he had finally "gotten better." It wasn't until the big D-Day in 2011 that I started telling some people. I told my father, which was a blessing. He never once judged me (which was my secret fear all along). My best friends from childhood never blinked, never judged me, and sent me money. I went to a wonderful CSAT who guided me through the PTSD and told me it wasn't my fault. Then I went to a wonderful, compassionate psychologist who specializes in divorce, and she has been there for me throughout this whole awful journey.

When I told these people, not only did I give myself permission to break down and admit I had problems. Big Problems. I allowed them to see me as a flawed, vulnerable person. They accepted me anyhow. And then I could start learning from each of them - how to feel better, how to find a lawyer, how to take care of myself, what to tell my children, how to pay my taxes, how to understand what had happened to me, etc. etc. Before that, it was like I was living in a tunnel.

Telling the truth is scary. But if you can't overcome the shame, you can't be fully human or alive. My only caveat is that I will only tell people that I trust fully for now. I can not have moms in my neighborhood walking around talking about "Choosing Hope's sex addict husband." I can not go that far. It would hurt me, and it would hurt my children.

I watched this tonight - for probably the third or fourth time. I think it ties into the wives of SAs. I'm still struggling with all these issues.

http://www.ted.com/talks/brene_brown_on_vulnerability.html



Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 12:31 AM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks, Choosing. So after your clarification, I guess I have told people: my IC, CSAT, SA spouses group that I go to, my SIL, an SA spouse friend that I met on SI, my best friend from childhood.

Thanks for sharing the Brene Brown TED talk - really good and I can see why you have watched it 3 or 4 times - some really deep concepts in there. I have never watched her before, but she is an excellent speaker - very funny.

Hugs to all SA spouses this Easter Sunday...


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 11:00 AM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I guess I have told people: my IC, CSAT, SA spouses group that I go to, my SIL, an SA spouse friend that I met on SI, my best friend from childhood.

I think this is a good list. So when you go out with friends and they talk happily about their husbands, what do you do?

Are you just silent, or do you pretend that nothing's wrong with your marriage?

I did both, and I remember that it made me feel awful - like a freak who was different from everyone else. I believed that if anyone knew the truth about STBX an what he did, they would never speak to me again. It's shame, of course. I still struggle with this every day. In fact, I still haven't told some people I'm getting divorced. And say that there are children involved, so I am not sharing any divorce details. But really, it's to hide the truth.

It makes me wonder how long it takes to really recover from the shock, betrayal, and manipulation - even when we get away from the marriage/addict?

I guess I'm just a work in progress. I'm really struggling with these issues.


Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
torn2bits
♀ Member
Member # 28376
Default  Posted: 12:01 PM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello all. Big hugs to everyone who is facing the aftermath of all this junk.

I have a question: How do they get to the point where they will disclose/did disclose to you? Did you give them an ultimatum? Did you force them into a planned disclsoure session with the CSAT or therapist?

My WH seems to be avoiding full blown session with a therapist. I think it is because he doesn't want to slip up.

Also, is there any way to know what kinds of rituals they have. My SAWH offers to do stuff for me. This is how I know he has done something, but I don't know if its that he looked at porn or he was sexting the OW.


Me: 44/WH (SA): 49
M: 24 years 3 kids over 10 yrs old
EA/ PA Dec. 2009 -Divorce pending

Posts: 1240 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: Midwest
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 2:13 PM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Is it troublesome to you to remember because it brings your self-esteem down, because you are pissed that he was such an asshole to you and now gets a free pass for it and is doing great in recovery, both, or something else?

Yep. All of the above. And I so mourn all the wasted years. The years I WAITED for him to a) snap out of his depression b) figure out why he had ED (Ha!) c) come home from his "boat." I was the perfect head-in-the-sand SA keep myself too busy to think, wife.

As far as who knows...very few. He has offered to tell whoever I think should know but I think it would be awkward. My Sanon friends, my kids. My IC, our MC. I don't think telling anyone else would help me. But I can see where if could help others.

Hardly anyone I know happily talks about their husbands! We are all married forever, hang out in the same forever group and know each other and the husbands pretty well. Well, except for all the secrets...


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
CheaterMagnet
♀ Member
Member # 33581
Default  Posted: 2:32 PM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Well THAT backfired on me.

I left this thread open on SAWH's laptop hoping that he would read it and gain some further insight into his lack of motivation to work a program and maybe even into what his behavior is doing to me.

Nope.

What I got was a HUGE shit-ton of anger. What he got out of this was "that the husbands are all assholes and fuck that guys." That's it. That's ALL he got from this thread.

I pointed out that the vast majority of women who post on this thread are STAYING with their SAWH's. And after experiencing way worse stuff than I have. He seemed shocked.

Anyway, long story short is that if we just had sex twice a week he wouldn't have had the need to look at porn and therefore wouldn't have escalated his behavior to the point of anonymous hookups with men and transexuals from CL or entered into an EA/PA with his ex-wife. *facepalm*

So, his addiction is my fault and all we need to do to cure him is to have sex twice a week. I asked him what would happen if I were to become ill to the point where sex wasn't an option. What then?? *crickets*

I told him I am done. He's been in AA for damn near 22 years. He KNOWS better for Christ's sake!!!

It's in-house separation for us until I can move out. The worst part is going to be having to decide who gets the furbabies.

I'm strangely calm. Not sure if it's relief or shock. We shall see.

Thanks for reading. I know I don't post often but I do read and I think of you all and pray for you all daily. I'm sorry I'm not giving more but I am so grateful for all you give me.


If Happy Ever After did exist, I would still be holding you like this.
All those fairly tales are full of shit.
One more fucking love song I'll be sick. ~ Maroon 5

Posts: 925 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Kailua-Kona, HI
torn2bits
♀ Member
Member # 28376
Default  Posted: 8:25 PM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sk_we are listening. It doesn't make it hurt less that we see a future with a SA, but we hear you.

I am sorry about all those years. I recently went out with 2 women your age and they are alone wishing they could find a man to be with and go on vacation with.

I don't know which side of the fence is worse. I am crying tonite because my 24yr anniversary is in May. Never thought I would be here.


Me: 44/WH (SA): 49
M: 24 years 3 kids over 10 yrs old
EA/ PA Dec. 2009 -Divorce pending

Posts: 1240 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: Midwest
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 11:58 PM, April 1st (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Anyway, long story short is that if we just had sex twice a week he wouldn't have had the need to look at porn and therefore wouldn't have escalated his behavior to the point of anonymous hookups with men and transexuals from CL or entered into an EA/PA with his ex-wife. *facepalm*

So, his addiction is my fault and all we need to do to cure him is to have sex twice a week. I asked him what would happen if I were to become ill to the point where sex wasn't an option. What then?? *crickets*

First, my STBX did similar things.

Second, a very wise CSAT told me that every single married SA who came into his office blamed his wife. One told him that if his wife went to more parties, he wouldn't need to hire prostitutes four nights a week.


Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
numbandnauseous
♀ Member
Member # 34525
Default  Posted: 1:00 AM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So much to post. Hope everyone is doing ok today.

Choosing - when I am out with friends who are talking about how great their M is, I have done both - stayed silent and tried to act like my M is good also. For me, this hasn't been as bad as trying to act like your H wants sex all the time like all your friends' husbands. In reality, we were having sex twice a year. For me, it was difficult to keep up that facade. I am ready to tell everyone about SAWH; I don't feel like it's my problem, but his. I am laying low for now, so I will not tell anyone yet. But, I don't feel like it will be that big of a deal when I tell people. Maybe I am being naive. I am a "sharer," though - don't mind sharing my struggles with others and have often gotten much support and sympathy during tough times in the past. I am sorry that you are struggling, Choosing.

torn - disclosure and "forced" or "ultimatum" don't go together. From what I've seen with other SA spouses, disclosure is something that takes months to years of therapy with a CSAT to accomplish and it is a goal of therapy. With our CSAT, the process goes like this: the SA works on disclosure and it is a pretty formal process which is done with the CSAT present. The SA's spouse then is able to formulate an impact statement in which she relates the impact of disclosure on her and asks any questions she may have. The SA then gives a clarification statement. All of this can take months to years to occur, as it is a pretty emotional, intense process. The reason I said that disclosure and forced don't go together is that disclosure should come from a place of the SA wanting to come clean to you. If it is forced, it will be a lie or not the whole truth and you will not really be in recovery. I forced my SAWH to go to a CSAT and he lied, denied, minimized through it all. So we wasted 3 months of money and time and accomplished nothing. Until he SA hits their rock bottom (if they ever do), forcing them to do anything will be fruitless.

torn - I think your question is interesting about rituals. I don't know the answer, but I do know that SAWH took me to a very fancy dinner and overnight for our anniversary a week or two after he had been with the OW in Las Vegas. I can see where that would be a pattern of doing things for you to assuage their guilt.

sK - I get the regretting of wasted years. I was in my 20s and 30s and my SAWH was neglecting me sexually - I had no idea why. I am so angry that I wasted my youth on a sexless M (when I didn't want it to be that way). Now my body is stretched and sagging from childbearing. I could have given my youthful body to someone who would have appreciated it, but instead I was left to rot. i regret wasting my time (20 years) in an emotionally desolate relationship. I regret meeting him, marrying him, having kids with him (don't regret my kids, of course, just regret that I chose him to be the sperm donor). I regret that I chose so poorly for a mate.

sK - I wish you and your long-married friends would talk about the secrets...

CM - I can't believe he is trying to blame you for his sex addiction. I am so glad that you see right through it. Don't think that your plan backfired; it let you see who he really is and where he is in terms of "recovery." (i.e., he hasn't even started) Hugs to you, CM. And, don't ever apologize; I feel that way too (re: would like to give more) and we understand. This is such an exhausting, traumatic addiction to deal with and we all understand that many days it's all you can do to breathe and get through the day.

torn - I am so sorry for the pain you are going through re: your upcoming 24th anniversary. I waited until I was 30 to get M and I thought I was insulating my M against D by waiting until I was older. Ha! It is so difficult to let go of the "intact family, M forever, grow old together" dream that we have.

Edited for clarity.

[This message edited by numbandnauseous at 1:03 AM, April 2nd (Tuesday)]


BS (me) - 41
WH - 48, EA with HS GF x 2
M: 10 years, T: 20
2 small children
DDay#1 - Christmas 2011 (OW#1)
Confronted - 4/6/12
DDay#2 - July 9, 2012 (OW#2)
He is an SA (Oct 2012)
Divorcing

Posts: 827 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: the other side
sadone29
♀ Member
Member # 38597
Default  Posted: 11:11 AM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you everyone for your kindness and support. I'm usually too scared to ask for help, but I keep making myself do it this time. I don't see any other way I'll survive and thrive from this.
I've been watching the Brene Brown talks: I love her! As vulnerable as I am right now (I feel like a walking open wound), I do recognize the huge potential for growth from all this.


SAWH: working hard on all addictions
Out of limbo hell. R Feb. 15
Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding -proverbs 3:5

Posts: 456 | Registered: Mar 2013
sadone29
♀ Member
Member # 38597
Default  Posted: 12:47 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wanted to add:

My emotions have been so all over the place. For a few days I was so down. Today I feel almost happy and relieved. I know that at some point in the future, I will be free of this situation! I will no longer wonder or care if he chatting with someone or watching porn or talking to some 'friend' he's trying to sleep with. He'll just be the father of my kids. It's scary to think about being alone, but also exciting sometimes. :)


SAWH: working hard on all addictions
Out of limbo hell. R Feb. 15
Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding -proverbs 3:5

Posts: 456 | Registered: Mar 2013
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 4:25 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am sorry about all those years. I recently went out with 2 women your age and they are alone wishing they could find a man to be with and go on vacation with.

^^^^^^^this.

And I know you are listening.

And I am done whining for awhile... You women are the BEST listeners, and only YOU get it.

I do love my friends, but I DON'T want to infuse those friendships with this shit. I just don't. That is my time to "go" somewhere else. It is a different part of my life, an escape part. I truly don't know if it is healthy or not, but I know I enjoy their company without the added drama this would bring to the table. I know they would love me and HIM and support whatever happened in my life, and that is where I want it to be...

You are all the best, and I wish we could have a good old fashioned sleep over!


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
CheaterMagnet
♀ Member
Member # 33581
Default  Posted: 5:37 PM, April 2nd (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm in 180 mode and he doesn't even seem to notice. We have to carpool at the moment because 2 of our cars are out of commission. And we had to go to Costco together yesterday. I don't initiate conversation with him and only give very minimal responses when he asks questions. I don't engage or prolong conversations.

Last night I slept in the guest room. When he figured out I wasn't in our bed he asked me, "are you sleeping in there tonight?" I said, "Yes." That was it. I slept like crap.

He had told me just 2 nights ago that he had a nightmare that I was leaving him. He said he felt pure panic and held me tight all night long. Hmmmm. No panic now. Funny how the dream scared him but the reality is just fine.

FTG


If Happy Ever After did exist, I would still be holding you like this.
All those fairly tales are full of shit.
One more fucking love song I'll be sick. ~ Maroon 5

Posts: 925 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: Kailua-Kona, HI
sadone29
♀ Member
Member # 38597
Default  Posted: 10:09 AM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm really loving the work of Dr. Barbara Steffens. At first, I thought ptsd? I couldn't have that. But when I read the symptoms, it describes my life since DDay so perfectly. I'm really not crazy for feeling so crazy.


SAWH: working hard on all addictions
Out of limbo hell. R Feb. 15
Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding -proverbs 3:5

Posts: 456 | Registered: Mar 2013
scaredyKat
♀ Member
Member # 25560
Default  Posted: 6:47 PM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Barbara Steffens work was the early research that suggested that spouses of SAs don't fit the mold of other "anon" groups, that is, the co-dep, and co-addict role doesn't fit to a tee. It made so much sense to me, too. Especially since I knew nothing about what he was up to.
The newest version of Mending a Shattered Heart discussed the trauma model in some detail.


Me-BS-59
HIM-SAFWH-63
Damn autocorrect is responsible for the silly errors, sorry!

Posts: 2933 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: In my head
ChoosingHope
♀ Member
Member # 33606
Default  Posted: 7:21 PM, April 3rd (Wednesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I relate to Barbara Steffens too.

Posts: 1434 | Registered: Oct 2011
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