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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men- Part 9
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 8:55 AM, March 8th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WAL, I nominate your post for the healing library. That's some amazing stuff.

Agreed, 1000x. This needs to happen. How do we nominate it/make it happen. Do we need a 3/5 vote? Do 2/3 of the states need to ratify it? Because it's wayyyy too good to sit down here with us dudes, as I feel that it's probably just as helpful for the ladies. I printed that shit out and I'm going to read it before each MC.

[This message edited by FacePunched at 8:56 AM, March 8th (Friday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 9:18 AM, March 8th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dave Chappelle said it best in his special "Killing 'Em Softly" (I believe).

He basically said that whenever his wife calls him over and says "Dave, we need to talk..." His gut says "Fuck! Because whenever *we* need to talk, it's always about some shit *I* need to do. It's never about some shit *she* needs to do, it's about some shit that *I* have to work on."


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 4:50 PM, March 8th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Count me in the nominating process!


BH 50, WW 41
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 19(Hers),DS 8 Ours, DGS 2 1/2
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
“I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.”
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2073 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
h0peless
♂ Member
Member # 36697
Default  Posted: 8:52 PM, March 8th (Friday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

That was one of the better posts I've read since I started lurking here in August. Definitely Healing Library material if it is edited to be non Gender specific.

Posts: 1323 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Arizona
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 8:17 AM, March 9th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hat was one of the better posts I've read since I started lurking here in August. Definitely Healing Library material if it is edited to be non Gender specific.

I'd even say not to edit it...just maybe make it clear that it's directed at men...because as he pointed out, when WW cheat, during the healing process there does seem to be a tendency to say "Oh, I was building all this up because of your failing, and finally just snapped...now fix these things about yourself and it'll never, ever happen again, promisepromise kisskiss..."...it's important for the ladies to know that sure, we'll 'fix' ourselves, but you better be ready to 'fix' yourself as well, and not just to the tune of fixing what made you seek out other dudes.

[This message edited by FacePunched at 8:18 AM, March 9th (Saturday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Cannon
♂ Member
Member # 32440
Default  Posted: 6:46 PM, March 9th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Guys...it's done. It's over.

STBXW moved today, and it's just me. Papers were signed last week, and it's going to be about a month until it's "official".

I can hardly believe it. My three year nightmare is over. This site, and the dudes on this thread, have been invaluable to me. I can't state that enough.

Now, let's celebrate. Everyone to the mosh pit!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dumRZ67Rlxw


Me - BH, 41
Her - Bi-polar WW, 41

Status: Divorced and relieved


Posts: 127 | Registered: Jun 2011 | From: .
5454real
♂ Member
Member # 37455
Default  Posted: 7:44 PM, March 9th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Awesomeness.

Free at last, free at last, thank the good lord you're free at last.

Just make sure you take the time to detoxify. I didn't after #3, and that got me #4 and #5!

Warning done! I'm gonna tip one in your honor.

Enjoy the good life.

eta grammar or spelin

[This message edited by 5454real at 7:46 PM, March 9th (Saturday)]


BH 50, WW 41
DS 23(Mine),SD 21,SS 19(Hers),DS 8 Ours, DGS 2 1/2
D=Day #1 5/04EA (Rugswept)
D-Day #2 3/10/12, TT til 3/13/12
Married 10yrs
“I have no love for a friend who loves in words alone.”
― Sophocles, Antigone

Posts: 2073 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: midwest
wincing_at_light
♂ Member
Member # 14393
Default  Posted: 8:01 PM, March 9th (Saturday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Congratulations, Cannon!

You've paid a high price to be able to say that you have your marriage every chance -- and you deserve all the things that come to good men in the next phase of your life.

I hope you stick around to advise other men in similar situations, because you've gained a wealth of wisdom and insight that guys walking the path behind you can benefit from.

I'm drinking Guinness right now, and I'm toasting your new life.


Machiavellian idiot savant

Posts: 6690 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: Indiana
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 6:13 AM, March 11th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Happy for you Cannon! You'll see - it'll be a relief and a GREAT LIFE without having to manage crazy.

wal, the internet called. They said to tell you to keep writing & fuck Google. Google don't know shiat.

& this:

whenever his wife calls him over and says "Dave, we need to talk..." His gut says "Fuck! Because whenever *we* need to talk, it's always about some shit *I* need to do. It's never about some shit *she* needs to do, it's about some shit that *I* have to work on."


Posts: 6027 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
Mypoorboys
♂ Member
Member # 33169
Default  Posted: 7:27 AM, March 11th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cannon,
Welcome to the,'Liberation Club'!
I remember your days of debate on this thread and no question, (at least in my mind), that the outcome was inevitable.
Everyone's PTSsyndrome is different, but I can promise that you will experience times; of joy, so cry to yourself, you deserve it, times of loneliness,(enjoy the solitude), recurring anger and bitterness, (ah, the legal system finally used to your advantage, file a motion), and tremendous uplifting, like a huge weight has been removed from your chest,(heart).
God intended for us to be, 'good people'. To enjoy life, but not abuse or misconstrue his precepts.
You are now, in control, of what, where and how you react to the world. No longer bound to some other person's mind control.
Congratulations and enjoy every day to the max and realize that there is a future. Don't forget the past, just leave it behind you and always, always try to be positive, enjoy your kids, set a good example. I know you will.
Also, do stay with us and keep us informed and yes, help with the newbies.
We are good people and the best is yet to come.

"Re-examine all you have been told...Dismiss what insults your soul". Walt Whitman!

God Bless,
MPBs


Posts: 176 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: New Brunswick, New Jersey
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, March 11th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

jjct-

Gllad you liked it. From the same special:

"Chivalry died when women started readin' the shit in all them magazines. They got too much advice about men from other women. And they don't know what the fuck they're talkin' about. I see them in the grocery store, says on the cover "100 Ways to Please Your Man" by some lady. Come on, man. Ain't no 100 ways. That list is four things long. Just suck his dick, play with his balls, fix him a sandwich, and don't talk so much and he'll be happy!" Not totally true, but not so totally off the mark, either.


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 11:54 AM, March 11th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Was sitting in the Social Security office today (getting a new card...annoying) when a strange and yet somehow comforting thought came to mind regarding getting even with the POSOM...he had to go see that last Twilight movie with WW...and I did not. If that's not a notch in the "W" column for this guy, then I don't know what is.

[This message edited by FacePunched at 12:36 PM, March 11th (Monday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 12:37 PM, March 12th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

...the one berated you in front of your buddies because you hadn't cleaned out the gutters after she told you it needed done *two days ago*...

This ^^^ intially...I didn't think it applied to me. I really didn't....I was thinking about it over the weekend and didn't think so. My last real relationship was with a woman who DID act like that, so when I started dating my WW, I was very, very clear about not accepting stuff like that. But you know what, it DOES apply to me, but not in the same way. My wife never reamed me in front of my friends, family, etc...but what she DID do was not defend me to others as a husband the way that you're supposed to when you're married. For example, if my WW did something I thought was dumb, I'd tell her in private, certainly. But woe befall the person who brought it up with me personally...I'd rip THEM a new one, whether it was a valid criticism or not. I just figured it was my job, both being the defender AND the only allowed critic of my wife.

But on the occasion that someone would say something bad about me, she never defended me, not in any kind of real manner. Unless it was regarding my abilities as a father...she grew up with no father, and this is one area where she would really jump to my defense vigorously. But when people at work (we work together) when comment about me being in a bad mood, or cranky, or whatever, her response would either be to deflect it (or later, near when the A started) say something to the effect of "I'm used to it." While it's not a direct criticism of me, when you don't defend me, or you accept criticism without defending me, it sends a certain type of message to the audience.

It's funny to me that I never considered this before...due to my past relationship, I was prepared for one kind of "little betrayal" but completely unprepared for the other kind.

[This message edited by FacePunched at 12:49 PM, March 12th (Tuesday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, March 12th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cannon, here is a great video of mosh pits if your so inclined!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7w7m4lb2ok

All set to some great music too


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
thyme2go
♂ Member
Member # 12908
Default  Posted: 7:07 PM, March 12th (Tuesday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

...he had to go see that last Twilight movie with WW...and I did not. If that's not a notch in the "W" column for this guy, then I don't know what is.

Touché!!!!


-t2g


BH - no longer 48
3 DD's - (27, 24 and 17)
Divorced on 8/6/09

Posts: 9145 | Registered: Dec 2006 | From: Eastern Washington
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:18 AM, March 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wincing_at_light

Most excellent post you made last page… Very good advice for the men here… The message of mutual expectations are that important.

I saw this though...

The biggest flaw I see in modern relationship counseling is this bullshit idea that when we identify a relationship problem (i.e., something my spouse is fucking up), that our sole responsibility is to bring that to their attention. Tell them you have a boundary and won't tolerate it any longer.
That's shit. It's a cop out. It's taking something I don't like and making the solution your problem. It takes the "problem" out of my basket and puts it into yours, so I get to blame you not only for the problem existing, but for any failure of the issue to get resolved if the future doesn't live up to my liking.
That quote? Did I miss something?

I’ve R’d.. A good R at that... One of the things I changed about me was exactly you say is a cop out. The man I am today… when my W crosses anything that is not good for my M, damn straight it is my responsibility to bring on a conflict. If I sit back and expect my W to fix this without my bring up the issue, How is she to know she needs to change her behavior? Why is this a flaw the modern IC tells us? And I have also tried hard to make my W feel safe to the point she is no longer afraid to point out my bad behaviors. Does that make sense?

This has worked very well for me.

Peace out.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 10:30 AM, March 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tryn, awesome point.

Identifying that your boundary has been crossed is not taking ownership of the problem. It is simply saying "that's unacceptable, try again". That's not a cop out, that is taking responsibility for your own self. Which is what we should do as grown ass men.

I would bet a few of us, myself included has said "I'm not a fucking mind reader!?" So, she is responsible for figuring out what is going on in my mind and I am supposed to do the same? No, that is a relationship mistake that most of us make on a daily basis and adds to the bullshit of marital issues. Marriage with or without an A isn't, you stay on your side and I'll stay on mine. It is from time to time for sanity reasons, but unless your spouse is a volleyball named Wilson it isn't going to last long.


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 10:36 AM, March 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

when my W crosses anything that is not good for my M, damn straight it is my responsibility to bring on a conflict. If I sit back and expect my W to fix this without my bring up the issue, How is she to know she needs to change her behavior? Why is this a flaw the modern IC tells us?

While WAL is certainly able to answer for himself, I believe that what he's saying is not that the entire idea of pointing out an issue to your spouse is a bullshit concept, but doing so without ALSO providing them a remedy that you'd be willing to live with is the bullshit part of it....unless I'm mistaken, which is entirely possible.
It'd be like bringing somebody a blank page from a coloring book and telling them that you don't like it how it is, but ALSO not telling them what color you would like it. Maybe any color would suffice, but if what you really want is it colored red, then you'd probably be better off telling them "I don't like this picture blank....please make it red." And if they really hate the color red, and they really like blue? Color that fucker purple, I guess, provided you can both live with purple. But when you provide a problem, and not any sort of solution, then the solution could be damn-near ANYTHING, including one of a million solutions you'd probably hate.

[This message edited by FacePunched at 10:49 AM, March 14th (Thursday)]


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
Ascendant
♂ Member
Member # 38303
Default  Posted: 10:48 AM, March 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would bet a few of us, myself included has said "I'm not a fucking mind reader!?"

Sweet Baby Jeebus, yes.

My WW was guilty of that in the past ALL THE TIME. With EVERYTHING that upset her that I did. Usually pretty quick to let me know when she had an issue with my actions, but was ready to provide me with an acceptable remedy say, oh, 0.00% of the time.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not advocating marital laziness per se. Some stuff is obvious. If the dishes/laundry/vacuuming/etc need to be done, these are probably not areas I should need pointed out to me. I'm an adult, if I walk into a sink full of dirty dishes, it should be obvious what needs to be done....we need a housekeeper. (Pysche!)

But if she wants to roll up on me and say things like "I'm not happy", well, I would love for you to be happy, but if the way I'm going about it right now isn't your preferred course of action, cool; let me know what IS your preferred course of action....so long as you're willing to also transform into my own personal Jessica Alba (sorry WAL, Amy Adams ain't doing it for me)....and be excited about it, too.


“Anyone who has a continuous smile on his face conceals a toughness that is almost frightening.”

Posts: 1616 | Registered: Jan 2013 | From: Illinois
StillGoing
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Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 10:59 AM, March 14th (Thursday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I would bet a few of us, myself included has said "I'm not a fucking mind reader!?"

This was a theme... very early on, in our first apartment as teenagers (yeah I had a full time job and had us in our own place at 19 or so), I don't even remember wtf the argument was about. I remember that there was a boot print on the door from her throwing a shoe at me, and my saying "I can't read your mind." A rational discussion later and she agreed.

A few years ago, during MC before the A was discovered, that came back around. Only it was more surreal. The MC told my wife she was setting me up to fail, that no matter what I did it couldn't be good enough. My wife told her that by now I should know exactly what she wants, how she wants it, etc, without having to communicate it to me. MC told her she expects me to read her mind - my wife angrily shouted yes.

It really is a way to set someone up to fail. The goal posts aren't just moving around, they're invisible and incorporeal. Expecting someone to know what you want, no matter how long you've been together, just means you can be right or wrong whenever you want. It gets really bad when someone actually believes that shit - back around to demonizing the BS.

My WW was guilty of that in the past ALL THE TIME. With EVERYTHING that upset her that I did. Usually pretty quick to let me know when she had an issue with my actions, but was ready to provide me with an acceptable remedy say, oh, 0.00% of the time.

I figured out, before the A, that this was a way abusers control a situation. If an argument or conflict comes up, then the laundry list comes out and whether or not its even relevant it puts the list holder in control of the situation, or at the very least distracts from the issue at hand. It sows enough confusion and doubt that after awhile, it's easy for the abuser to roll in the heavy guns and pound away while you're demoralized and confused and wondering how much this shit may really play in.


“Fate is a fickle bitch who dotes on irony.”

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