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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 7
Unagie
♀ Member
Member # 37091
Default  Posted: 1:57 AM, December 22nd (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

H&C so this is what I think, she is ashamed of what she's done and doesn't know how to handle it. When there's a moment of normalcy she panics. I know I do so maybe I'm projecting. When things are normal or feel good and normal and I'm happy I panic. My heart runs a mile a minute and I feel horrible waves of guilt and shame. It makes me look at him like I don't deserve him or happiness. It makes me want to cry and wail and collapse. She may be feeling all this. Maybe she doesn't know how to handle it so she backs away.


Heartbroken madhatter trying to rebuild

No longer together

Do not let others be your reference for who you see in the mirror.

Stop allowing people to hurt you, because you don't love you enough to walk away.


Posts: 2378 | Registered: Oct 2012
beach
♀ Member
Member # 7533
Default  Posted: 7:48 PM, December 22nd (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hopeandchange,

She got a pained / anguish look on her face and told me she was "uncomfortable".

The next evening she told me she had no "feelings" towards me and I would be better off without her.

I understand that her A was long term A. Is xOM is out of the picture?

Has she been openbook and transparent with you? Do you have full access to her e-mails, cellphone.....?


If you don't find peace with yourself, you cannot find anywhere else.
Appreciate and cherish what I have.

Posts: 8680 | Registered: Jul 2005 | From: midwest
1000wind
♀ New Member
Member # 37647
Default  Posted: 9:42 PM, December 22nd (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

@ disgrace...again thank you for your reply. I have been quiet for a while thinking what I want to do for my future. I guess i am not fully satisfied with my WH's action. I am still watching what he does. I am still waiting for that moment to be able to feel "YES, he understand my pain and know how to help me!" unfortunately that moment is not here yet and getting tired of waiting. but intention is there and i can see he regret his errors in his life. He is trying to change and I encourage him to do so, I am so proud of what he is doing as a third person totally but I can not forgive and forget then move on with him as WS. It hurts so much because I love him and he loves me. nothing is logical in this at all. what he did although he always loved me and me not wanting to forgive and try although i still love him... sea of sadness is so dark. I will keep swimming, too. i wish you will get to shore someday. You are doing your best and i see it. maybe your wife will see it someday. I still believe it is not possible to stay sad or mad forever as long as there is something happening, some change in you that she can see.. please don't give up. you are helping many other WS here. your post helped me so much..she must be able to see your remorse someday. best wish to you and your wife on this holiday season.
@hopeandchange,
I do that, too. there is 50 / 50 of double me inside. the half of me want to get rid of my WH so bad because he deceived me so badly. I want to wrap him up in fancy package and drop him off at OW's door and tell her "here, you can have it since you two wanted to be together so bad, I don't want it"..the other half of me want to be with him so badly. Now he is sorry and want to change, he is showing incredible amount of affection and tenderness, I just want to enjoy being with him and receive his love 100%..but can't. OW and my WH pop up in my head and i panic. i back away. it is twisted and i am not getting any satisfaction or happiness or anything from this. hopefully i can get myself out of this unproductive way of living and change for myself soon. any advise?


me: BW 43
WH 41 4 affairs in our 15yrs marriage
together for 18yrs
2 beautiful children : 14 DD & 10 DS they are my life

Posts: 16 | Registered: Nov 2012 | From: Canada
hopeandchange
♂ Member
Member # 33287
Default  Posted: 11:05 AM, December 24th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Unagie and Beach.. thank you both for your replies

Yes, my WW became transparent on DDay2 giving me her personal email password, her work email password, her cell phone password, etc. Over the next three months she answered all my questions about her A.

However, she was defensive about her actions during the A telling me this was because I threw them in her face. IMO she still struggles to look at herself and the sources of her unhappiness.

h&c


BH (me, 50)
WS (her, 48)
Divorced!
3 wonderful teens
Heading for Happiness

Posts: 401 | Registered: Sep 2011
Phoenix519
♀ Member
Member # 26186
Default  Posted: 8:26 AM, December 26th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

my question: How do you explain the love you feel for your betrayed spouse after the affair has been discovered?

I'm several years out from d-day and I still struggle with this. I just don't believe my FWS could have loved me AND cheated. But yet, he's worked pretty hard to get our marriage back on track and seems to be crazy in love with me "now". Why now??

I'm the same person I always was...


Posts: 581 | Registered: Nov 2009
She-Ra
♀ Member
Member # 36033
Default  Posted: 5:52 PM, December 28th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Phoenix,

That's a tough question and I've seen this a lot on SI. I know it is hard to fathom as a BS that your WS could still love you while cheating.. Most WS will say, yes we did love our BS.

I did indeed love my BH while I cheated. In fact, in my own screwed up mind, I loved him MORE than he loved me. I was convinced that he didn't love me the way I did and it hurt me really bad. I had felt neglected and dismissed emotionally. Once I found that other men were happy to feed my ego, I was in my glory. I loved every minute of it and even decided to seek it out further. Some WH feel neglected and dismissed sexually which makes them feel "justified" to cheat. They may love their wives but resent their alleged lack of sex or just simply want that ego boost for whatever their broken-ness is craving.

Yes you are the same person but we now see our BSs in a new light. It is hard to explain but I couldn't believe how wonderful my BH was after I had confessed. He really did love me?!? How could that be, I thought. All the reasons I fell in love with him in the first place came rushing back to me. We both have worked hard at R and we both love each other more than ever...

He has his dark moments where he says.. You didn't love me.. You aren't sorry.. You might do it again... All I can do is keep trying, keep showing loving actions and reassuring him.

As a WS, we have to keep working hard to show our BS love. Maybe we come on too strong sometimes but we are wanting to prove that we ARE worthy, we do love our BSs very much and the gift of R is valued by us.


FWW 33 BH 33
Met 8 yrs ago, together for 6, married for 3
Dday Aug 10, 2012
Beautiful baby daughter born June 2013
Now in limbo.. I'm allowed to have deal breakers too

The WW formerly known as messedupchick


Posts: 736 | Registered: Jul 2012
Want To Wake Up
♀ Member
Member # 31583
Default  Posted: 6:38 AM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Am I expecting too much that on the antiversary of DDay (3 years ago today... my world imploded ) that my WH acknowledge the pain he has caused and say something comforting to me?

That he ask what he could perhaps do to help me through this day... that he show me he cares about my pain... that he actually REMEMBER it!

Is it me?

Am I asking too much?

I have had the conversation with him about his learning my 'triggery' dates and acting accordingly (as recently as the 21st of this month-another 'triggery' date for me when he did nothing) but each time... he "forgets".


It feels like rugsweeping to me, if we don't talk about it... it didn't happen IYKWIM


Me 50+
WH 50+ (SlowUptake)
DDay '09
"He didn't cheat because I wasn't enough, he cheated because HE wasn't enough"

"Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."


Posts: 455 | Registered: Mar 2011
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 10:00 AM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Want - Does he remember dates in general? Have you told him what you want him to do on trigger dates?


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Want To Wake Up
♀ Member
Member # 31583
Default  Posted: 1:28 PM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No US, he is a shocker at remembering dates when it comes to anniversaries, birthdays etc. but somehow he can remember dates from history just fine IYKWIM it's just dates of personal significance that he "can't remember" (and yes, part of that IS my fault, always the one to remind him of his mother's birthday etc.)

**edited to add**
Yes US, I have told him what I want from him on my triggery dates, for him to ackowledge them, address my pain and ask if there is anything he can do to ease it.
***

This has been a bone of contention for our entire marriage and it is one of the changes I need to see in him. He could write a note, put a reminder in his phone, something, anything to help him remember these important dates... but he doesn't put in the effort... and in this case it feels as though I'm not worth the effort IYKWIM


I could understand if I'd never mentioned that this is important to me (his remembering my triggery dates) but boy, oh boy, have I ever made it clear that it's important to me. It's a change I need to see in him because without it I am left feeling hurt... and worse still... that he just doesn't care (truthfully, I feel like a piece of shit on his shoe right now)


He laments that he doesn't understand why I am so affected by certain dates... but I don't need him to understand why, just acknowledge that I am and act accordingly. The fact that it's important to me should be enough IMO


I guess it comes down to the simple fact that this is another thing I've asked for from him in order to help me heal that he isn't prepared to put any effort into giving me.


One of the reasons this sticks in my craw so very much is that for years I got the excuse that he has a 'bad memory' about such things (even to remebering to set up reminders) and I just had to accept that, it was 'who he is'... yet he had one OW's birthday marked on the calendar in his phone to remind him of her birthday and he'd only known her one month!... and he can't do the same for his wife of over 30 years that he's betrayed!

[This message edited by Want To Wake Up at 1:29 PM, December 29th (Saturday)]


Me 50+
WH 50+ (SlowUptake)
DDay '09
"He didn't cheat because I wasn't enough, he cheated because HE wasn't enough"

"Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."


Posts: 455 | Registered: Mar 2011
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 2:34 PM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

he is a shocker at remembering dates when it comes to anniversaries, birthdays etc. but somehow he can remember dates from history just fine

Historical dates are entirely different from personal dates. Sometimes people are just that way. My H remembers his siblings's and his parents' birthdays, but he usually misses mine. He sometimes remembers the date, but since he doesn't know what day of the week it is, he still misses events.

I have accepted it. He has always been this way.

yet he had one OW's birthday marked on the calendar in his phone to remind him of her birthday and he'd only known her one month!

This is awful... but it is part of the courtship dance.

Did he remember your birthday in the early days?

If he does not change, if he does not acknowledge your trigger dates, can you live with it?


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Want To Wake Up
♀ Member
Member # 31583
Default  Posted: 3:15 PM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This is awful... but it is part of the courtship dance.

Yes I know US... and I want to be courted now. It hurts that he would make that effort with her... but he won't with me.


Did he remember your birthday in the early days?

Geez, I'd have to go back over 30 years (yikes!) but I'd have to say yes, in the very early days he did remember my birthday but since we married... nope, rarely.


If he does not change, if he does not acknowledge your trigger dates, can you live with it?


He doesn't believe that ackowledging trigger dates is "healthy" or helpful to my recovery despite the fact that I have told him it would mean the world to me for him to acknowledge and be PROactive on these dates. He said that DDay is such a horrible day why would anyone in their right mind want to be reminded of it?... I have tried to explain that I have no choice in that, his acknowledging it will not "remind" me, the date is forever burned into my memory and his ignoring/forgetting it leaves me feeling that my pain doesn't matter. He refuses to bring up anything A related for discussion (and I think he feels to acknowledge my trigger dates would equate to that) He'll talk about it... only if I start the conversation... and that feels like if he just ignores it it will all go away IYKWIM


We just had a conversation and he's countered with I should "love him just the way he is" and not ask for him to change Yeah... I did that for over 30yrs and while it irked me I eventually accepted that that was "just the way he was"... now, after his betrayals, I will no longer accept that. I need to feel that MY feelings take precedent over his on this IYKWIM

Oh, and thanks so much for responding US♥


Me 50+
WH 50+ (SlowUptake)
DDay '09
"He didn't cheat because I wasn't enough, he cheated because HE wasn't enough"

"Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."


Posts: 455 | Registered: Mar 2011
Phoenix519
♀ Member
Member # 26186
Default  Posted: 5:44 PM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Messedupchick

Thank you for the thought you put into your response to my question. I connected to what you said and I'm keeping this post to read whenever those thoughts cross my mind.


Posts: 581 | Registered: Nov 2009
EZ24get
♀ Member
Member # 29752
Question  Posted: 7:51 PM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I wonder if anyone would, please, give their own understanding of what " everything " means,.. as in, when the BS needs/wants to be told everything.

Thanks, in advance, for any and all insight. It is greatly appreciated.


Told my request was one so unlike being you. Then, was punished for asking, by watching you become all that I needed, for someone new.
...so,..he traded my heart,for a hard-on.

BW~ me 37
CH~ he 37
20 years on 12/12/12, 2 kiddos 14&17
D-day 1


Posts: 66 | Registered: Oct 2010 | From: here
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:20 PM, December 29th (Saturday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Want -

he's countered with I should "love him just the way he is" and not ask for him to

You cannot change him. You can only decide whether you can spend the next 30 years like this. It doesn't matter who is "right". It only matters that you have laid out a requirement and he refuses to meet it.

Can you live with this?


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
Want To Wake Up
♀ Member
Member # 31583
Default  Posted: 12:37 PM, December 30th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

You cannot change him.

No I can't... but I can hope that by explaining how this affects me (especially post A when I think almost all WS's -those who do want R- are asked to make some changes in their behaviours) he could put in some effort to spare me further hurt.


You can only decide whether you can spend the next 30 years like this.

I can't. If to R I have to accept and learn to live with all he has done then, yes, I "expect" him to "sweeten the deal" a little IYKWIM There are behaviours that I tolerated before DDay that I will no longer tolerate, this hurtful "forgetting" is one such.


It doesn't matter who is "right"

I guess not but it matters to me whether or not he is prepared to do "right" by me now.


It only matters that you have laid out a requirement and he refuses to meet it.

Amoung the many that he's refused to met citing the I should "love him the way he is" line but it all feels like so much bs to me IYKWIM Constantly hearing "that's just not who I am" as an excuse for not meeting one of my needs is tiresome and frustrating... it wasn't "who he was" to cheat yet he "changed" himself enough to do that.

***edited to add***
sorry, upon rereading the above paragraph it comes across as snarky at the end and I didn't mean it to sound that way, my apologies if I offended anyone with my tone
***


Can you live with this?

What he's done, yes, I can learn to live with it, what I am asking of him is to make it a little easier to bear... if he can't do that... then no.

[This message edited by Want To Wake Up at 12:41 PM, December 30th (Sunday)]


Me 50+
WH 50+ (SlowUptake)
DDay '09
"He didn't cheat because I wasn't enough, he cheated because HE wasn't enough"

"Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."


Posts: 455 | Registered: Mar 2011
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 12:51 AM, December 31st (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What he's done, yes, I can learn to live with it, what I am asking of him is to make it a little easier to bear... if he can't do that... then no.

I hope he comes through.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
fireguy87
♂ New Member
Member # 36992
Default  Posted: 7:16 AM, December 31st (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

oops

[This message edited by fireguy87 at 11:32 AM, December 31st (Monday)]


Me - FBH
Happened many years ago
Reconciled

Posts: 40 | Registered: Sep 2012
Deeply Scared
♀ Administrator
Member # 2
Red  Posted: 7:42 AM, December 31st (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

fireguy87...

This thread is strictly for WS's to answer questions to help the BS's better understand things.

Please use the other forums that suit your situation to share your thoughts and feelings.

Thank you.


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 192025 | Registered: May 2002
Grownup2010
♀ New Member
Member # 31955
Default  Posted: 6:00 AM, January 7th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Former Wayward Husbands, do you have similar experience of what I describe below? I know BWs will say my WH is in a fog and rewriting history (I want to believe that too). But I need to know, has any former wayward husbands have similar sex suppression/blockage stories they tell their BS or themselves, but realize it was not really true AFTER they come out of the fog? Is it really a fog-talk?

2011-Dec while R: WH told me that he had "recovered" a "suppressed" memory while talking to his counselor. That the first time he kissed me back in 2003, he was surprised that he didn't feel the physical excitement from his head to toes that he was looking for compare to his kisses with his previous girlfriends. He said he did not found me sexually exciting/attractive then. He claimed that because, other than this sexually non-attractive problem, I was everything he has been looking for in his life, and that he had courted me for over half a year and he thinks he really loves me, so he "suppressed" this memory and continue the relationship with me. We had sex since 2003 and for what I remember, he couldn't get enough of me then. He proposed to me in 2006, we got married in 2007. We continue to have sex with no problem (as least I think so) until about a year before he left me. By then sex was infrequent to an extent that it's once every 2-3 months, it was always initiated by me and he often found various reasons from religion to his mother to whatever to not have sex with me. I sense something was wrong and even suggested we go for counseling but he strongly refused and also refused to talk about it. Then soon after that, he abandoned me and ran off with an OW.

He said he told me about this "rediscovered" "suppressed memory" now as we're reconciliating, because he believes it is "the root cause" for why he left me in 2010 and went off with the OW (who is 10 years younger than him, he was 33 then). Because, according to him, he and the OW had various problems but sex is not one of them. He said he had great sex with the OW, but comparatively sex with me is "take a lot of effort to focus", "laborious" and even "disgusting" because he felt like he's having sex with a close family such as his sister. And that he told me about this so that he is truly honest with me and that this is "our" problem now.

Any FWH sharing would be greatly appreciated! Thank you!!


Me: 41
WH: 35
Married: 2007 (together since 2003)
DD and separated since 2010
R on and off
~Still believe WH will grow up and be a responsible person one day.
~Still believe what brought us together into the marriage is still there.

Posts: 20 | Registered: Apr 2011
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:57 AM, January 7th (Monday), 2013View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Grownup2010,

I would say your WH is full of shit.

Have you been able to determine if the OW was around when the frequency of sex in your M started to decrease? It sounds like that is what you are implying.

All of the reasons your WH is now using to explain things is allowing him to blame you for the A. Hopefully his IC will help him to see the truth, that it isn't a suppressed memory at all, that it is really a way for your WH to not accept that he is to blame. Keep digging. Challenge him. Remind him, in the form of digging in your heels, that he couldn't get enough of you early on, and that his attitude changed only after the OW entered the picture.

If the IC says differently, then he needs a new IC. Have you considered going to one of his sessions with IC? Could you present some of the truth? I had an IC for over a year who was good, but also allowed me to become stuck. I don't think it was her "fault", but rather that she wasn't equipped to deal with me. I finally hit pay dirt on the third IC. I also changed may attitude that the IC was going to help me get where I wanted to be, where I knew I should be going, instead of me looking to the IC to tell me where I should be going. In other words, your WH should be driving the bus with IC.

You have an entire website here who will tell you your WH is full of shit and that there are certain things that are truths in almost every situation. And that truth is that your WH is entirely responsible for his decision to have sex with a 23yo woman. If it weren't for his choice to cheat, he wouldn't be trying to come up with excuses like suppressed memories of sex with you not being good. You know the truth. You have those memories. If your WH can't accept that, then you need to rock his boat a bit.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6047 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
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