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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 7
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:13 PM, October 24th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stung - it probably hasn't hit him yet. How else is he behaving? Is he answering questions? Supporting you? Trying to figure out why? Letting you know where he is at all times?


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 8:15 PM, October 24th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Rbecke -

most WS seem to choose an AP that is much less then their current H/W

Search for "they always affair down" in General and Just Found Out for exhaustive analyses on this topic.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
stungbytravel
♀ Member
Member # 37225
Default  Posted: 8:22 PM, October 24th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stung - it probably hasn't hit him yet. How else is he behaving? Is he answering questions? Supporting you? Trying to figure out why? Letting you know where he is at all times?

He's on business travel. He has answered question but doesn't always like to. I don't feel supported at all. I hope he is trying to figure out why - I am afraid he is saying goodbye. Did any of you WS that actually left mourn the relationship before you left it?


Not sure DD 10/6/2012
No doubt in my mind DD 04/2013
Sleeping in Separate Bedrooms 12/2012
Formal Separation 6/2013
Divorce Final 12/2013

Posts: 226 | Registered: Oct 2012
UnexpectedSong
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Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 10:12 PM, October 25th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stung -

Did any of you WS that actually left mourn the relationship before you left it?

Most of us on this website stayed.

Read up on the 180 to learn to be strong by yourself and decide what you will do if he does not change. You either accept it or you leave. It is your prerogative. Your gift to him if you try to reconcile.

Watch his actions. And decide.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
HolyMoly
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Member # 36884
Default  Posted: 1:12 AM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Okay, well here goes. I am at a tremendous fork in the road, if you will.

My H is a jerk, not because he is a WH, but because, to me, he is just mean and insensitive.

I am a little over 3 yrs. out. He lied and TT'd me for over a year (by his own admission) and after a year, and the "last" lie he admitted to, said that was all.

Now I know my H is stubborn, it seems to be a family trait, but I had him take a poly, which he failed, miserably, his stories don't add up and he has continued to be caught in many, many lies. Not all infidelity related.

EVERY day he approaches me and tells me he doesn't want to lose me, but that I am searching for something that isn't there. Now, if I were to go through the exhaustive list that makes me believe otherwise, I think that you all would see that nothing, and I do mean nothing he says adds up.

In the meantime, he is angry, constantly angry at me! He has been angry from the time I found out and looking back through time, he was always angry, anytime he was doing anything he should not have been doing. He was angry at getting caught!

My question is, we have to live under the same roof at this time due to finances. I do not have any family left to help me and he comes from a large family that pretty much will support him, no matter what, including if he buried me six feet deep in the backyard!

How do I get him to leave me alone? I do the 180 and that seems to spur him on. Like I am a conquest. I ask him to leave me alone, to let it go, but he grabs at me, says crude things and refuses to leave me alone.

He has a room off the kitchen (makes it sound bad...has a bed and the best flat-screen in the house) and everytime I go to the kitchen, it's one snide remark after another. I don't know what to say to get him to stop. Most of the time I say nothing, but once in awhile I respond, I tell him to stop, that he is being abusive.

At least every other day he asks me "so, are we done or what?" I tell him the same thing, yes, we are done, please leave me alone. he gets mad and tells me, "so start making some money already!"

I am tryng, desperately trying to make it in a new career. I've been a SAHM for 13 years and I am trying to get a professional license that could potentially allow me to be free of him financially. he seems to want to sabotage that at every turn. Interrupts me when I am studying, etc.

Seriously, is there something, some magic something I can do, say, that will make him leave me alone? I know he will never tell me the truth, I know every time we talk, it will be me that destroyed this marriage, but honestly, my sanity is at a critical level.

Any advice? I don't know if this is an extreme Wayward behavior, but if it is, how do I deal with it?

I have read so many stories about someone actually "getting it", and how it takes a long time for some, but seriously, over 3 yrs?

Oh, and he doesn't want to join SI, won't go to counseling, MC or IC. As he says "They're just a bunch of quacks anyway, who are more screwed up than me!"

I am going crazy, seriously.

Please give me ideas on what to do.


Posts: 112 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: California
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:08 AM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HolyMoly,

I don't have any advice on this one. Some WS's really never get it. Of course SI is useless to him as are IC/MC. Of course it'll all be your fault. And of course it's your fault for being a SAHM for the last 13 years. As long as he continues to say those things he can continue to not take any responsibility for what he's done.

I know you know you aren't to blame in this. Sometimes the path out of destruction is harder for some than others. But you are making it. You are doing it now.

How much longer until you get your license? Is there some way you can do your studying in a library? Do you have kids to factor into this equation?

Sorry you're going through this.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
HolyMoly
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Member # 36884
Default  Posted: 10:36 AM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BaxtersBFF, thanks for the reply.

I guess I know all of this, it's just hard to process. Part of the problem for those of us with a spouse who refuses to do the work involved, is that we read how others fixed the problems within themselves and we know it's possible.

Unfortunately, I know it will never happen for me.

Thanks again for your reply.


Posts: 112 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: California
DWBH
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Member # 35512
Default  Posted: 2:44 PM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I see a lot of comments from WS' regarding their thoughts during the A: how they knew what they were doing was wrong, and they felt "horrible", but kept doing it. Or how some felt so bad after 1 or 2 physical encounters, they stopped, and confessed.

My question is: Are there any WS' who did NOT feel any remorse/regret during the A? Did you just compartmentalize so well, that you did not realize, at the time, that what you were doing was so very wrong and hurtful? Or perhaps just didn't care (i.e. exit affair)?


Me: BH, 43
Her: FWW, 41 (ThornyRose)
M: 16 years, together 19
2 Daughters: 14 and 12
D Day: 9/25/2011; Lies & TT to 5/4/2012
~Double betrayal; caught them in the act~

Posts: 729 | Registered: May 2012 | From: WI
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 3:00 PM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DWBH, yes. I didn't. I felt my honesty would protect my integrity. Nope. Not even close. It wasn't until I joined SI and had some amazing members help me sort through the stupid ( ) that I was able to focus on my thought processes, actions, and what they did to me.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 3:43 PM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HolyMoly -

My H is a jerk, not because he is a WH, but because, to me, he is just mean and insensitive.

He has always been this way. Why are you surprised? He has always made comments about you, always lied to you, always sabotaged you.

The only two questions you need to figure out are:

(1) Why have you put up with it, even in the beginning? What is it about your childhood that let you think this is love?

(2) Since he will never change, how will you live with it for the next year, 5 years, 20 years?


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
brybry75
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Member # 36686
Default  Posted: 10:41 PM, October 26th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WW after 1.5yr A with my XBF is going to IC and we are doing MC. I was upset one day and she didn't know what to say. I asked her to say that she was sorry and tell me how she feels: she replied with she can't keep saying sorry - she can by her actions but not say it.

We are four months out from DDay...she is also saying she is "no longer attracted to me".

WS...what is going on here? Obviously we aren't in R...can someone explain? Did any of you experience this?


Posts: 40 | Registered: Sep 2012 | From: Australia
WalkinOnEggshelz
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Member # 29447
Default  Posted: 5:34 PM, October 28th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

brybry,

At 4 months I said the words "I'm sorry" too many times to count, but honestly looking back I really didn't know all of the things I was sorry for. I knew I was sorry that I had F'd up my life in a colossal way. I was sorry that my BH was so distraught by it. But because I didn't "get it" I felt like I was running out of things to apologize for.

I remember complaining to my BH that if I were to apologize daily it would no longer sound sincere. I felt like I was going to sound like a broken record. I knew he wanted heart felt apologies from me but I was struggling to find them at the time. It's not that I didn't want to give them, lord knows I would lay in bed at night searching for the words that matched the heartache only to come up empty.

I feel for me, it took time on the apologies because I really needed to feel and understand what I was apologizing for. Each time my BH was able to open himself up to me and explain to me how he felt by my actions, I gained a bit more empathy. With that empathy came the remorse.

There have also been plenty of times that I have remained silent during opportune times out of fear of bringing "it" up, out of fear of "ruining a moment". I realize now that if something makes me think of it, undoubtedly he is as well so why not bring it up? But initiating A conversations has not been my strong suit.

The more I worked on me and my own issues as well as BH opening up to me, the more I was able to provide him with heartfelt apologies.

Do you feel her actions show remorse? I'm guessing not if she states she is no longer attracted to you. Did she tell you that while you were angry? I tried to pull that one on my BH as well once. In a normal situation I feel it is difficult to feel attracted to someone that is so angry at you a great deal of the time, but these are not normal circumstances are they? When you are angry and upset is when you need her the most. I am the type that has always needed someone to show me the olive branch. I didn't want to put myself out there only to risk rejection. So when my BH was angry it was very hard for me to reach out to him. One day my IC told me that I just had to start trying. It still doesn't come naturally, but I have to say that it usually goes well when I do. So it could be that your wife is having a hard time being vulnerable with you.

The more she digs into her own issues, the more she can own things for what they are.


Me: WS 41
Him: BH 42 (holdingtogether)
M: 17 years, together 21
2 Daughters: 12 and 9
D Day: 7/24/2010; TT to 10/17/10
If you keep asking people to give you the benefit of the doubt, they will eventually start to doubt your benefit.

Posts: 494 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
Cannaman
♂ Member
Member # 33834
Default  Posted: 7:46 PM, October 28th (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

WW had a five month A. Mostly texting and sexting, and WW claims only one physical sexual encounter. What I can't get my head around is this; she was friends with this guy through work for a decade, when they started texting, they went right into around 1000 texts to and from each other 2000 total a month. WW claims she never felt that their friendship became anything more than it had been, never felt any emotional connection to him, never felt what they had was anything special or unique and yet was willing to be sexual to keep it. She claims she didn't want the sexual aspect.
So my question would be this, is it possible that she is being honest?

And specifically for women FWS, could you talk privately, that much, for that long (5 months) and not feel any kind of special feeling toward the person you are talking with, especially with the conversation having sexual undertones and turning into sexting 98 % of the time?


m BS/ FWBF/ F pill addict binge drinker 33 h FWW/ BGF 34
d 5 s 3
My A: ONS 2003 other inappropriate behavior/ poor boundaries
Her A: 5 month EA/PA 2011
DDay 8/30/11 (I caught her and confessed to mine)
married 3 years, together 15 working on R/

Posts: 397 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: right behind you
WalkinOnEggshelz
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Member # 29447
Default  Posted: 2:20 PM, October 29th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Cannaman,

I know some people can separate sex and emotion, however I am not one of them. In fact, I had to go completely the opposite direction and convince myself that I had feelings that weren't really there to justify my behavior.

WW claims she never felt that their friendship became anything more than it had been, never felt any emotional connection to him, never felt what they had was anything special or unique and yet was willing to be sexual to keep it.

Honestly, this doesn't even make sense to me. If she never felt their friendship became anymore than it had been, does that mean her boundaries are so loose that she is sexual with all her friends? Obviously somewhere along the way it had to become more. Either by physical attraction or emotional. If there was no emotional connection, then why so many texts? What was it they were talking about? Why would she keep coming back for more? Validation is an emotional need. Maybe not a healthy one, but emotional none the less. If she wasn't getting these things from him then the next assumption was that it was purely a sexual arrangement. However, you say she was "willing to be sexual to keep it". Are these her words or yours? It's important because it might help break down what is really going on here.

I understand we don't all function with the same operating system. I personally don't feel that you can have a LTA and not have some sort of emotional connection. Heck, I have emotional connections with my friends. That's why they are my friends and not acquaintances. I had to get the point where I realized there wasn't an emotional connection. That there wasn't anything special or unique. I had to break it down and look at how sad and pathetic it all was. Otherwise why would I have given so much up?

Which leads me to believe a few things. One, she is smart and has been reading here, two, she is trying to tell you what she thinks you want to hear because she is afraid to lose you, or three she has already worked out enough to realize it herself. I doubt it's the last one.

Good luck to you.
WOES

[This message edited by WalkinOnEggshelz at 4:25 PM, October 29th (Monday)]


Me: WS 41
Him: BH 42 (holdingtogether)
M: 17 years, together 21
2 Daughters: 12 and 9
D Day: 7/24/2010; TT to 10/17/10
If you keep asking people to give you the benefit of the doubt, they will eventually start to doubt your benefit.

Posts: 494 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
DWBH
♂ Member
Member # 35512
Default  Posted: 8:33 AM, October 30th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

After reading LonelyHusband's and Oktobermest's updates on their Year 1 antiversary, I found myself quite surprised at LH's thoughts, and a few BS' who agreed with him... that if turning back the clock was an option, he'd go all the way back and never marry at all to avoid this trauma. I have to admit that thought has never crossed my mind; I would not give up my life with my W, or my marriage to her, given the A. I do know for a fact our M would never survive another one, but I can't say I'd turn the clock back 17 years, and never be with her.

My question is, for those WS' who have R'd, or are trying to R, did you ever feel the same way? That you would have turned back the clock and never married your spouse? Did you regret the decision to be with your spouse to the point you wished it'd never have happened?


Me: BH, 43
Her: FWW, 41 (ThornyRose)
M: 16 years, together 19
2 Daughters: 14 and 12
D Day: 9/25/2011; Lies & TT to 5/4/2012
~Double betrayal; caught them in the act~

Posts: 729 | Registered: May 2012 | From: WI
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 8:51 AM, October 30th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DWBH, I did try to reconcile prior to joining here even the first few months here. No, I'd never go back. Then again, I wouldn't for any of my life's experiences. I gained to much from working through those.

I find it interesting that was posted, considering, but like many people pain is relative until its yours.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 9:40 AM, October 30th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

And specifically for women FWS, could you talk privately, that much, for that long (5 months) and not feel any kind of special feeling toward the person you are talking with, especially with the conversation having sexual undertones and turning into sexting 98 % of the time?

You just described my marriage. Yes, I can. Can she? You'd have to ask her...and believe her, something you don't do.

Even if 90% of WW's said no if she felt that way it'd be 100% for her.

Cannaman, do you not think its possible she has similar doubts and resentments towards you for your years of addiction? Your choices of a substance over her and the family? Is it really tough for you to draw a parallel or because it was a thing not a person it's totally different.

I've got news. Sadly, people can be viewed as things too.

Hope she gets the help she needs to dig and you both can start healing.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
tired girl
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Member # 28053
Default  Posted: 10:12 AM, October 30th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DWBH,

No, I have never felt that way. That would mean not having my children. Our M has not been all bad. We love each other very much, and I would not miss out on all it has brought me.

In the end, all of these experiences have brought changes to him and I that both of us needed. My life is richer for having him in it.


Me43 Him 43 Hardlessons DS 24,22,20
D Day 1/18/10 his 3/8/2012 mine
Fear is a natural reaction to moving closer to the truth”
― Pema Chödrön

Posts: 3663 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: az
DWBH
♂ Member
Member # 35512
Default  Posted: 10:36 AM, October 30th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

UO and TG, thanks for responding.

No, I have never felt that way. That would mean not having my children. Our M has not been all bad. We love each other very much, and I would not miss out on all it has brought me.

In the end, all of these experiences have brought changes to him and I that both of us needed. My life is richer for having him in it.


I feel exactly the same way; I'm sure having children has a lot to do with it.

I find it interesting that was posted, considering, but like many people pain is relative until its yours.
I asked my W this morning, and she said she doesn't recall specifically, but wouldn't be surprised at all if the thought went through her mind during or before the A. I was just curious if it was a common WS thought/feeling, especially during an A, if you thought you'd have been better off never meeting or marrying your spouse.


Me: BH, 43
Her: FWW, 41 (ThornyRose)
M: 16 years, together 19
2 Daughters: 14 and 12
D Day: 9/25/2011; Lies & TT to 5/4/2012
~Double betrayal; caught them in the act~

Posts: 729 | Registered: May 2012 | From: WI
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 10:57 AM, October 30th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DWBH, nope. Not during the A. Of course that brings up a linear thought process some may not care to engage.

Would waywards wish they never met their affair partner? What if they were an affair partner when they met their current wayward? Gets kinda dicey right?

We know bad marriages aren't the cause of cheating. We know a spouse's/partner's actions and behaviors isn't a cause of cheating so if the wayward didn't meet the affair partner would they be considered faithful even though those thought processes and coping skills where lurking all the time?

Would some here be in their old marriages?

Bottom line is what we have now is what we have. Getting healthy is the answer to all questions, I'd guess.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
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