I totally agree with the others who are outraged that your SAWH IC said you shouldn't have made him tell his parents why you were divorcing. After DDay I made my SAWH tell his parents about all his As and acting out. I felt they should know what was going on so they wouldn't think I was being a cold bitch when I wasn't worshipping the ground he walked on anymore.
numbandnaseous and nightsky
Way to go both of you for standing up to your SAWHs and issuing them ultimatums. Stick to your guns and don't cave. Let them know you mean business.
Sending hugs and strength to everyone.
My best advice to the rest of you struggling right now is to listen to your gut. In my experience, a SA who is still lying and not taking responsibility is NOT going to get better. You can't trust them, and you can't control them. That was the hardest part for me. I can't be the engineer of his "rock bottom" or the catalyst of his recovery. Only he can. If he isn't willing, then it won't happen.
N&N - I just ordered Mending a Shattered Heart and Don't Call it Love.
The first time through we both read Not Just Friends. About a year ago we watched Fireproof (he actually cried).
The hardest part for me is I have no doubt he loves me and we actually have a lot of fun together.
Listening to what everyone else is going through and all the great wisdom is helping me a lot. THANK YOU ALL!
married 16 years, 2 kids: 11 DD, 13 DS
In process of R
I want off.
He was horrible to me in the weeks leading up to my dissertation defense. I dont even fully understand what his f'n problem was, but I kept asking gently if he had been speaking to his IC (he hadn't). Once he finally got a hold of the guy, he didn't like what the CSAT had to say, but he eventually digested it.
Now I see his issues as taking his stress out on me, which my CSAT said to watch for. My CSAT said a positive sign of growth in my SAWH/BH is when H does not take his anxiety about stuff out on me. Well, he did take it out on me, and demanded that I find his happy and fix him, essentially at my expense.
F THAT. I am finishing my degree and have had to fight his sabotage off every step of the way. It is increasingly clear to me that he will not support me AT ALL for my next degree which I begin in a few years. I cannot go another round of this. But holding back my career because he "doesn't like it" and "isn't happy" when I am in school?
Sorry. This is venty. I am so angry and am finally allowing it to come out. Need to get back to my CSAT, ASAP.
Nothingelsematters - My fWHSA does the same thing and the MC this week asked him if he was aware that that was a narcissistic trait. Something fWHSA father would do, who is a full blown narcissist. He acknowledged that he had narcissistic traits in other areas but hadn't thought of this as one. To him it just felt like he was overwhelmed, she said but it is all about you. You aren't even considering your partner or anyone else around you. Lightbulb moment. Now when he does it in little ways I am saying 'Honey, really?" He stops himself in his tracks. It is a crazy making, crappy feeling when they do that and has always caused huge fights for us. Hope your WHSA gets it. If he isn't going to meetings and seeing his CSAT, how does he expect to get better? Good for you for sticking up for yourself, F THAT is right!
numbandnauses - Great job! Holding to that deadline is going to be rough but you can do it! If he really wants to change, he'll do it. Otherwise, he can live his sick, twisted addiction on his own.
nightsky - Good that you stood up. His IC does not sound equipped to handle the situation. Hopefully, you can find an MC that is. Preferably a CSAT or someone with at least an addiction background.
beutifulness - I agree that if they are still lying a year or so into recovery that is a bad sign. Now 2 months in, they haven't usually reached full honesty. The way my therapist explained it was that stopping acting out was the 1st order of change. The change in thinking is the 2nd order of change. That takes years and there are small amounts of progress on that continually.
Things going ok for me right now. Feel like the MC is doing a great job. We are both working hard. I have to say some of the COSA meetings drive me nuts. Lots of thinking that just keepig your side of the street clean, i.e. not yelling and controlling but living and allowing the addict to live in their addiction and setting NO boundaries about it. I am just stunned at the amount of this going on.
HE CALLED THE CSAT!!!! HE CALLED THE CSAT!!!! HE CALLED THE CSAT!!!!!
This is after I told him 3 days ago that he would need to make an appt to see a CSAT in 2 weeks or I would be moving out of our M.
I am still in shock after all the BS he has put me through over these past 7 months: unremorseful, still focusing on himself, just told me a few days ago that "that's not how I want to spend my time" re: IC, etc. I also fully expected him to push the CSAT appt all the way to the 2 week mark and even beyond.
I called the CSAT yesterday to let him know that WH might be calling. CSAT called me back today to ask what WH's last name was bc someone called and left a message. We do not have the same last name, so CSAT wasn't sure if person who called was WH. When I said WH's last name, CSAT said, yep, that's him.
I know that this is just a very small first step and many things can go wrong from here, but I am shocked that the first step has been taken so quickly and that WH listened when I set my boundary.
Sending hope and strength to all SA spouses!
I have to say some of the COSA meetings drive me nuts. Lots of thinking that just keepig your side of the street clean, i.e. not yelling and controlling but living and allowing the addict to live in their addiction and setting NO boundaries about it. I am just stunned at the amount of this going on.
Yes. I remember this well. I also remember all the listless, slumped-over people who had been attending those meetings for years. There was no spark left in them at all.
As an aside, Missy Mommy, my STBX had a NPD mother. He always had N traits, but was so likable and NICE that we all ignored them. As the SA progressed, the NPD became full-blown. OR the NPD progressed, and the SA became full-blown. Not sure which. But either way, they are interlinked somehow.
And if you want to read more about his latest NPD stunt, I've posted the "Hold on to your seat" post on the S&D thread.
Also, I can relate to the SA taking their stress out on you. I was just talking to my IC about that - at the beginning of our relationship, we would be having these huge fights out of the blue and I had no idea why - it was awful and baffling. I finally started to link it to stress at work and got him to stop taking it out on me as much, but he still does it.
Update on my situation: he didn't tell me that he called CSAT when he got home tonight, he acted very tired and went downstairs to watch tv. I noticed that he looked up the SAST (screening test for SAs) on the computer today. I think he is depressed because he is starting to see that he is an SA.
Numb&Nauseous--My H had very mixed emotions on his diagnosis with SA. On one hand he was very depressed as he realized the mountain he was going to have to climb because otherwise I was walking. However, he said he also felt relieved because he could finally talk about all the things he kept hidden and was ashamed about.
I think I will go to the same group (they specialize in SA and infidelity) instead of my regular IC too.
This should be interesting!
on one hand he was very depressed as he realized the mountain he was going to have to climb
Then he seeks all kinds of reassurances from me. There is a void which he cannot fill that he is asking me to fill. And when I can't or refuse, he is beside himself.
Somehow now I am oddly calm.
Happy Friday, ladies.
He also called and set up an appointment with the MC that she recommended. My IC said that this person has extensive experience with couples therapy as well as infidelity - which this is.
WH was pissed when I said this, of course! Just showing me again - no remorse, no empathy for my feelings, more minimizing, making me the bad guy. We don't see him until next month but he did make both appointments.
For some reason the line from that old baseball poem popped into my head this morning - "there is no joy in Mudville tonight." That's where I'm at right now, there is not joy in our marriage. And we haven't even begun to address the SA issues.
DD 6/2012 –WH has been paying $$$ for online video sex chats and calls his favorite “my girlfriend.”
"Sometimes your only available transportation is a leap of faith" Margaret Shepard
sodeep - congrats on WH calling a CSAT - good luck with both of your appointments!
nightsky - congrats to you also for WH making IC and MC appointments. Are they CSATs?
Thanks to all for the support to stay strong. I feel I am starting to waver a bit, not sure how I should act towards him. He is being cold, kissing the kids goodbye in the mornings, but not me (and it is very obvious, because the kids are usually on my lap when he leaves). He barely talks to me and hasn't told me that he has spoken to the CSAT. Not sure what is going on in his head, but I guess it doesn't matter. He'll either step up or not.
I know that I am better off forcing the issue now and D'ing him if he doesn't see CSAT rather than continue to be abused, manipulated, betrayed for years to come. If I stay without him getting treatment, I will be a shell of the person I am now (and the person I am now could use some work!)
Need to stay strong, need to stay strong, don't engage, stay cool and indifferent - my stomach is in knots constantly and I hate this!
You have more strength and grace than you know, and someday you will be able to look back and know you were a fierce mama bear for your kids, not settling for unhealthy. Good for you!