Ats: I'm so sorry about your boat. I hope the insurance covers the loss.
I agree with the others, it will cause more problems than it's worth. You need to decide if you want to stay married, no half way. I truly understand about the financial situation, but what you are suggesting is just going to cause more heartache for both of you.
Open Marriage? The problem you will have is NO QUALITY woman will want to date, have sex, and have a good relationship with a married man. What you will begin is another relationship with an unhealthy woman. You’ve made that mistake once, don’t do it twice. Be wise brother and be the good quality man you are today. Your wife has made the choice not to live under her vows, not you. You cannot control what others decide to do.
I say you go ahead reach deep inside your soul and grab the greatest amount of courage you have and D your wife… May I suggest you find a roommate that will pay you rent to help pay the mortgage. I think you will find the change very rewarding.
Am I crazy to still be asking questions about the A still? I feel there are new questions on my mind every day. I picture them together and wonder how they were with each other, what they did and how they talked together. FWH says that this was an affair of convenience, an outlet from the everyday stresses, an escape. He also says that he never thinks about her unless I bring it up. How can this be? They were involved for 15 years! I can't help but doubt that this "total love and commitment" that he feels for me since d-day is possibly just more convenient now.
I hate these doubts. Some days I just can't stand the pain.
Repairing my boat is just money and time, and in the end she will be better than before. Too bad marriages are not like that.
A few years ago I had things stolen from my boat. There was much more damage done than what the stuff they took was worth. They cut up a pretty expensive boat cover to get in the boat, cut many wires that did not need to be cut while stealing the radio/cd and carried off a few bags of boating supplies. Tools, lights, towels etc. It cost me my deductible ($500) and much travel time and work. I rewired and installed the radio. They did not try to steal my engine. It is a inboard big block V-8. I guess they thought that would be too much work. You are right, time and money will fix the boat. When it is repaired you can kick back have a drink and grill something.
I do know why you are considering the open marrage but I agree with everybody else. The open marrage stuff would be bad. More trouble than it is worth. It might be fun for awhile but.......
For me, fWH couldn’t/wouldn’t tell me the truth (mostly he “couldn’t remember”) and one year after d-day, I met MOW and found out a load of other stuff. Stuff had been leaking out of the woodwork since d-day anyway with his lying and me finding writing he should have got rid of. In year two, I found SI and wrote to BH. Met him a couple of times which took me through to the end of year two – July 2008.
In March 2009 I found some of the writing had been written two years before the LTA, not as part of the LTA as he had said. That meant he had another affair. He denied and I had no other proof, although I suspected who it was with.
At the beginning of 2011, my spidey senses said there was some sort of contact. Nothing I could put my finger on, but this time I listened to my guts. He denied, but perhaps it was brief and non-sexual.
Later summer that year, I found a random “X” text on his phone and found out he had visited MOW’s town – it’s an ordinary market town, not a big thriving business centre. He made excuses about colleagues/suppliers and then I found out he had gone there within a week of starting the new job.
The latest is MOW has been stalking him on Linkedin. While he says he isn’t contacting her back, the fact is he is apathetic. He does nothing about it. He is unconcerned about doing anything to make me feel safe and loved. Oh yes, he SAYS the right things – that’s easy. He asks what he can do to make me happy (I’ve told him my happiness is down to me, but my unhappiness is caused by him – he doesn’t understand that idea) and then does nothing. He sits in the wings and waits for everything to be okay. the greatest rug-sweeper of them all.
So. How long is the length of a piece of string. Year two is often worse than year one. In year two, you realise this is your reality. This is it. You’ve had the shock, denial, MC and IC, finding the truth (or at least your truth) and things begin to settle. And you think “is this it? Is this how it goes from now on?” People have less sympathy, they think you should be over it now and that if you are going to stay together, you should “put it behind you and move on”. But it’s not that easy. You said this in BS questions for WS (sorry, I only skim read)
These things whirl around my thoughts almost every minute of every day. They have taken over my world. The OW has become my OW.
When I tell him this, he will say "You mustn't give her that much importance in your thoughts".
It is so important for the fWS to be the person he wants to be for you. You are still asking why, so this shows you are not ready to be over the sadness (or anger). And often there is no answer to the why, which makes it harder to understand. Sometimes they just do it because they want to and they can. And then it turns into a LTA because they can’t find a way out, so they compartmentalise and it becomes routine. They weave it into their everyday life and accommodate it until something happens.
But it does get better. It will never be the same again, but the hurting will ease.
It just gets to me the way he just didn’t tell me she was there. Why? He said because it wasn’t important and that telling me would only bring her back into our lives. I just don’t get his way of thinking. It’s classic conflict avoidance, isn’t it?
Oh well. My feelings do not have precedence over his desire to ignore events. That makes me feel he doesn’t care, although I know he does. I think I have to give it one last try. He goes to Europe for a few days and then I have to go to my Mum’s. It’s his birthday at the end of the month and I think he’s away for it – I haven’t planned anything. I’ll gather everything I want to say and sit down with him. I think his not reading the document I gave him has hurt the most.
Just getting my thoughts out.
Ats & Dip – let me know when you’re up for grilling again. I’ll bring the beer.
(((((cdmommy))))) Just get through the day.
[This message edited by UKgirl at 12:19 PM, October 10th (Wednesday)]
I just don't get it. 37years?? I can't get that out of my head. i don't think I will ever.
I know my wh expresses in MC how horrible he feels and is addressing all his issues now in counseling, which is great for him.
He also wishes that I loved him like I used to and that we had the M we had before. before what? It has all been a lie? All my memories
are tainted because all I see is this f**king ow lurking around.
someone by the way, that he says never mattered, it was just sex,
didn't really care for her. Really? then why keep this going for 37years?? Of course, this is the only one. He also had A with someone 24 years ago for 4 months and then when it was over they still kept in contact life good buddies and then 13 years ago he hired her to work in his office!! She is still there! the A was over 24 yrs ago for them but for me it is really new. I want her out but at this time he can't let her go. She knows I know and she of course feels horrible
(tough shit). This is a big subject in MC let me tell you.
Now, of course , there are others, for instance a retired escort that he "fell in love with" that he had a PA and EA with for 7 years. She has moved across country, so I'm not too worried about her. She didn't really care about him, she was a hooker what do you expect. Plus, I found out that the last time they were physically together he paid her!. God, is this my life?
Anyway, Will this ever get better? How can I get past this? Do I really want to R?
I've already been dealing with this for almost three years and I sure don't feel any better.
Dday#1 11/09, DDAy#2 and many since 10/11
PA's- too many to count
LTA's too many to count
Escorts etc- way too many to count
Broken heart- too many times to count.
Find your anger that will help a whole lot.
FightingBack -- 3 years if things go average to well. 5 years if they don't, unless you divorce, then it seems to be about 6 months to a year post divorce.
That would be my general guideline.
Today, I still think about infidelity everyday in some way. I will try and describe the feelings I once had about my marriage and wife. I once was rock solid with my feet in concrete type feeling. Maybe the word total innocents, total commitment, 100% pride, rock solid ego, with certainty, no fear, a power about me, I called it a peace about me, comfort like a wearing an old favorite t-shirt you had forever. Maybe like your earliest memory of childhood when you hung on to your mom, you knew who to go to, who was there.
I just don’t have those types of feelings any more.
But my feelings are gone like the ones I describe. I am OK with the feelings I have right now. Maybe it’s maturity. It’s who I am today.
All I can tell you that everything changes and ends. Even feelings you once had. People are not always loving or loyal. People can and do learn from mistakes. Some don’t. Nobody but myself can make me happy. It’s up to us to forgive and learn how to be better people. Being a better person mean many different things.
I am a better man today.. I am fully trained and fully understand what love is… Many LTA’s here helped me along the way. I am better at romancing my wife. I improved my masculinity. I am more compassionate toward other’s faults. I am better at communications. I do things that make me attractive to my wife. I have more courage. I learned to know how to forgive. My faith is stronger. I never accept bad behavior and I bring on conflict when it happens. And more…
To make an effort to change yourself is very satisfying and your heart will be filled with strength. That is my advice to you. You change.
[This message edited by trynhard at 4:57 PM, October 11th (Thursday)]
my battle and yours too...
Forgiving infidelity would mean sacrificing his dreams of the type of marriage he’d wanted. He’d never have the opportunity to brag to his children about the fidelity of their marriage. To stay meant sacrificing a marriage that was free from doubts. How could he ever again believe a word that she said if she’d been able to deceive him for 17 years? Staying meant the sacrificing of his dignity. He personally knew two of these men, and he now imagined how they’d seen him as the fool. To stay he’d have to sacrifice his rights. Didn’t he have the right to leave and find another who would be faithful to him? Staying and coping with infidelity meant sacrificing the ability to be honest with family. He couldn’t share his struggles, for fear of more complications. To stay would cost him pride. He’d always believed people who stayed were too weak to leave. To stay would cost his self-respect. He couldn’t believe things he’d said and done in his fits of rage. It would be so much easier to be away from her and not be triggered by her presence. To forgive seemed to make a mockery of all he’d sacrificed for the sake of their marriage. Instead of being proud of what he and Sandra had built, he now felt he’d been played the fool and taken advantage of.
To make an effort to change yourself is very satisfying and your heart will be filled with strength. That is my advice to you. You change.
Love this. That is when my healing started. When I changed.
I can truly relate. Since my FWH started his As 24 or was it 25? years ago, I think I have some sense of what you feel.
I also feel your despair at times.
Traditoperanni, I'm with you in that I feel the pain. I wish I had some insight to share, but as you, I think we have found the best place to find it.
I like Tryn's "Feelings" model as it accurately shows the great divergence of emotions, but also gives hope that after a bumpy ride, they can stabilize again.
I have changed too. I will never be the same. I need to look at this as a good thing in a way, a clearer perspective on life in general.
I know I am guilty of harbouring so many negative thoughts still, so I guess I need to change some more.
I am being very patient waiting for these things, and trying not to pressure him. Maybe I should let them go? I don't want to though, so perhaps I am holding us back by this.
So Nell says at least 2 years, and you say 3. Am I allowed to have an open marriage in the meantime?
Is LTA OW out of the picture yet? Reading back to pages 16 & 18, I recall that you had found out about the length of the affair and were trying to wrap your head around it. Seems you still are. I’m afraid that you are going to go through these hellish waves for a while yet. These are early days for such a monstrous discovery of overwhelming deceit.
But first, to get that blurb at the bottom so you don’t type/copy&paste every time, go to “My Profile” on the Forums page and write it in the box marked “Signature” Then it will come up on every post you do.
Okay. 37yrs. That is a long, long time. That is a way of life. It is for all LTA WS’s. They get away with it, and instead of coming clean early on, they hide it. As time goes on, it becomes bigger and the box they put it in gets bigger. But the thing is, they accept the box. All the crap, all the stuff they say and do with the AP, all the things that are connected to the affair (and for your WH, the SA stuff too), it all gets shoved in the box. And they leave it and do nothing and get on with the rest of their lives until it is time to open the box and squash more stuff in.
It was a box he created and it was nothing to do with you. He did nothing because he feared the consequences. It’s a dark and horrible place to be, a place like that. However he felt about it, he couldn’t tell you. To tell you would be to split his world and yours. After [X] number of years, he just dealt with it as routine, just like they all do. Yours went on longer than most that’s all. It doesn’t mean you are more stupid or more of a fool, it meant that he hid it well and had the lid on the box well locked down. His Pandora’s box where he kept all his dark secrets.
If you read my stuff here, you will read I am still dealing with this 6yrs later. Just know this: it is not your fault, know that the fault lay with your WH in abusing your love and trust. He is flawed, not you. But he gets to feel clean and new and you get to feel dirty and used. Don’t allow it. Do not allow his behaviour and his issues to taint all that you felt was true. Because you know what? YOU were authentic, YOU were true and his doing is HIS fakery and HIS loss. Shrug and say “you lost out mate, tough shit cos I got all the GOOD memories and you got the CRAP ones.” Took me a long while to get that to stick. About a year ago it finally stayed. I can look at myself in the mirror and know I am a good and kind and nice person. I look at him in the mirror next to me and think “you sad git”.
Keep posting. It does help.
Hugs - UKg