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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Betrayed Men- Part 8
wert
♂ Member
Member # 34478
Default  Posted: 1:03 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tred -

Sorry man. I didn't have that exact problem but had concerns with my W not wanting me. Or that is what her A and actions post A made me feel like. On some level I can relate.

WH5 had some good questions for you.

Do you think she is working on her broken self? It can't happen over night, but I am starting to see progress.

If you believe she is and you believe this -

I believe that fww wouldn't have another A.

And you feel like this -

Knowing that she fucked OM for a long session (more than one time in a row) just kills me. She did things with him that she wouldn't do with me. It just hurts so bad to know that she gave him what I should have been getting all along.

Perhaps asking her for what you want is the way to go.

I can tell you what I did. I told my W, she is still working through stuff and it will take a long time, that I am willing to stay and see if she figures her stuff out. In the mean time I want her to be the one to initiate - and often.

If you want specifics, things she did for him or things you just want - tell her. Tell her why. This is not, IMO, manipulation, but instead her recognizing that some reckoning needs to take place, she needs to help you how you need to be helped while she is fixing herself and providing the answers you need.

Put bluntly, my W is enthusiastically "helping me out" while she figures it out. I see nothing wrong with that and expect it at this point.

Don't confuse sex with progress, but IMO, my W giving of herself pays some respect to what has transpired.

Opinions vary I am sure.



Posts: 1364 | Registered: Jan 2012
DontTreadOnMe
♂ Member
Member # 35240
Default  Posted: 1:21 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wert and WH5, thank you for responding.

Yes, Lost is working on herself. She is doing a lot of reading, journaling, and is in IC. That is why I am still here. If she wasn't doing the work, or stopped working, I would be gone.

I have asked her to initiate and to be more "pro-active". She has initiated more since then. (she initiated about 2% of the time pre-A, and rejected me about 95% of the time)

I'm having problems though when it is time to go to bed. My anxiety goes through the roof. Sometimes when she tries to initiate, I just can't. She'll do something that will trigger mind movies and it completely kills my mood. Sometimes she won't even do anything specific, and the mind movies will intrude into my thoughts.

I know her A isn't about me... But I can't help but think "she rejected me for years, then pursued, opened up, and did everything she could to please OM who is a POS convicted felon, no driver's license fkin loser". He treated her poorly and only answered her calls when he thought he was gonna get some. What the hell is wrong with her?

He knew she was married all along and never cared. fww even had strangers call her out. (at the bar, someone said "you're at this bar, in THAT shirt, and you're married? where is your husband?"

How can something like that not "snap you out of it"?

I was away at training for 8 weeks when all this went down. She and my brother's wife (SIL) met OM at the bar and they were wing-women for each other. SIL even went to OM's house w/ fww... ugh

Meanwhile, while I'm 1000 miles away, Lost starts telling me she is questioning the M, is not sexually attracted to me anymore, and asks if we can "see other people". I obviously said HELL NO and asked her if there was someone else. Of course she lied and said no. She f'ked him the weekend after Valentine's Day. I sent her a nice card a gift certificate to her favorite salon. How could she even accept that gift while in the middle of the A?

I just don't know if I can ever move past the betrayal, the lying, the sneakiness, and the fact that she gave him what belonged to me. She was so cruel.... So selfish and so entitled. Who the hell did I marry?


Me: WH/BH, 27 (addict in recovery)
Her: Lost333, BW/FWW, My DDay: 2/19/12, Hers: 9/29/12

Working on myself through IC, NA meetings, intensive outpatient program, and lots of digging. Praying for R.


Posts: 230 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Midwest
wifehad5
♂ Moderator
Member # 15162
Default  Posted: 1:33 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Triggers and mind movies really suck. The good thing is that they eventually fade.

I just don't know if I can ever move past the betrayal, the lying, the sneakiness, and the fact that she gave him what belonged to me. She was so cruel.... So selfish and so entitled. Who the hell did I marry?

The "good" thing here is that it seems that Lost seems to realize how horrible she was. That right there gives you a chance.


FBH - 42
FWW - 43 (BrokenRoad)
2 kids 7&12

The people you do your life with shape the life you live


Posts: 35315 | Registered: Jun 2007 | From: Michigan
hardlessons
♂ Member
Member # 35025
Default  Posted: 1:34 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DTOM, I had the same issues with mind movies and still do 2 years out.. It does get better, but a shit sandwhich is still shit no matter what condiments we use...

So one scenario is that you can't move past this, its a deal breaker. Thats ok. What then? Your by yourself or you move on to another relationship at some point. So how are YOU going to be in that case? Healing? Healed?

Can you agree that you are not the same before this horribile shit? Are you doing anything like IC or books? SI is great but is not the only forum for learning.

DTOM)))


Me WH
Wife Tired Girl
3 adult sons
"a wayward...annnnd just a tad betrayed."

Posts: 838 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Arizona
wert
♂ Member
Member # 34478
Default  Posted: 1:45 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Agreed with WH5 that if she truly realizes how cruel she was you have a chance.

she gave him what belonged to me

Gently - it was hers to give, not yours. The cruelty was she gave it to some puke like my W did.

The mind movies are your minds reaction to that cruelty. I say act with intent and don't react. Decide what you want and ask for it. That may have to do with your W and it may not. Your mind, mind movies and thoughts you think you can't control, is sending you signals to be afraid of your W. Don't just accept what your mind is telling you. When the movies comes tell it to get lost because you are going make decisions for yourself, not just let whatever crazy thought that pops in decide how you feel.

I would recommend ACT with Love for a book on mindfulness. It helped me a lot to understand how my brain was working and that I did not have to listen to it.

She was so cruel.... So selfish and so entitled. Who the hell did I marry?

You, like I, married a women who is capable of being cruel and has a sense of entitlement. I can say with confidence that if my W changes those things I am going to LOVE being M'd to her.

That's one of the reasons I stuck around.

take care man...



Posts: 1364 | Registered: Jan 2012
dday3302011
♂ Member
Member # 32043
Default  Posted: 4:55 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

DTOM, you are still really fucking pissed off about what happened. You have every right to be and you have every right to D your wife for what she did.

That isn't the point of what you're asking though is it? Your questions sound so much like many of the questions I asked last year. A lot of what you're dealing with (at least in my case it was) is the feeling that you've been emasculated by the your wife and the OM. Additionally you would normally feel superior to the OM, but your fucked up wife somehow, someway thought he was better than you and gave things to him or did things with him that she wouldn't with you and you're internalizing it. Am I close?

I've been there. Almost all of us here have been. I'll tell you some of my story that maybe you can relate to. I'm 6'8", 260 lbs, played division 1 college basketball, blah, blah, I'm a fucking stud, blah. OM is 10 inches shorter than me, 100 lbs lighter, scrawny. Think L.A hipster/Euro-trash type fuck-wad. He's a photographer too. One of those "artists" who thinks he's really deep and captions his photos with worthless, empty titles like "pills for sick horses" and "the edge of nature". Oh yeah and he fucks married women even though he's married and has a 8 year old daughter.

Anyway, my FWW gave this guy oral, anal, let him take nude pics of her while she was on business trips in California, all while I was home in Boston working and watching my kids. She gave him whatever he asked for, and he asked for a lot. She had Skype sex with the guy while I was out at a bar and my kids were sleeping in the next room.

Awful shit, agreed? I used to think about it all the time. How could she do that? Why would she do that? Who the fuck am I that my wife would do those things with a squid like him? How can I live with myself if I stay with a woman who's capable of such things?

But you know what? Over time it really started to hit me that I had nothing to do with it. It was all her. She was so sad, hopeless, and desperate for attention that she did those things. Did she enjoy the sex? I don't know, maybe I guess at the time she did. It would be pretty hard for her to look back on those acts now with good thoughts and lustful desire considering how much damage they've caused and how pathetic she knows she was.

Your wife didn't give a shit about you. She thought some filthy scumbag was so great that she immediately did sexual things with him that she wouldn't do with you. So what? We all have awful shit to deal with. I've told you some of mine. There are others that are worse, the non-sexual stuff. Putting Christmas presents from OM under our tree and watching me play with those presents with my kids. Wearing a ring from OM for 8 months, right in my face. It all hurts. None of it matters anymore. Not to my self-worth it doesn't.

Getting over your anger about her A is paramount to your personal recovery IMO. I was extremely angry and hostile until just a few months ago. Keep asking those same questions. I don't think you'll find many valuable answers from her, but I think you'll find out a lot about yourself in asking them, in thinking about them, and in discovering what you're capable of accepting (or not accepting) and living a healthy, happy life regardless of what two really fucked up people did to you.

Wert mentioned mindfulness practice. I read a book called "Full Catastrophe Living" and I found it very helpful in processing and overcoming my anger.

Search within yourself DTOM. You might find that your WW isn't a part of your future, and that's okay. But you're still here, she seems to be trying her ass off, and I'm hopeful for you.

Best of luck

[This message edited by dday3302011 at 4:59 PM, July 9th (Monday)]


BH-41 (me)
xWW-42
M 11yrs, together 14
DDay 3-30-2011
2 kids, 9 & 7
1 yr LTA w/MOM
Divorced 5-16-2013

Posts: 235 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Northeast
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 7:50 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sometimes,
sometimes I can't even see the keyboard through the tears
after all these years,
get through it (i can't get over it)
get through it
embrace it all
even if it means your weary heart's fall
even if it all means you finding you
get through it.

I want to delete this all, instead I stupidly hit submit.

This, coming from a guy...well, if she and I were at a partay, and someone said "a hoedown!"
She'd hit the floor.


Posts: 5997 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
bluecali
♂ Member
Member # 35135
Default  Posted: 9:26 PM, July 9th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Nicely said, DDay.


Me-BH
DDAY 12/1/11
Separated and uncertain

Posts: 398 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Elm Street
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 10:33 AM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

she gave him what I should have been getting all along.

...and I dont know the half of it.

P.S. nicely put jj.


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
StillGoing
♂ Member
Member # 28571
Default  Posted: 12:42 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Since jj started it.. i feel like i already posted this somewhere before but w/e. mind movies suck, but they do fade over time.

Bleak and broken, built to
house the roused bitter
spirit set to silent
pain, so plain this prison
ward, so wanting, withered
chill and still, thus withheld
hope of heaven, hells dread
sights my nights' refrain.


ďFate is a fickle bitch who dotes on irony.Ē

Posts: 7096 | Registered: May 2010 | From: USA
DontTreadOnMe
♂ Member
Member # 35240
Default  Posted: 2:48 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Who the fuck are you?
To do this to me
Thinking about yourself
So god damn selfishly
I wonder if you even know
How good you had it
How it would be now
If not for that piece of shit

You chose that worthless fuck
Without a second thought
How does it feel to know
It was a convicted felon you fucked
You could've stopped at any time
Or just never even started
But you felt so damn entitled
To do what you wanted

It's girls like you
And douchebags like him
That make it so scary
To go out on a limb
To love someone with your all
And truly let them in

I gave you everything
Yet you didn't give a fuck
You threw it all away
Can't chock it up to bad luck

Fuck being married
And fuck infidelity
Whatever happened to morals?
Thrown out the window; just like my sanity
I'd like to say thank you
For making me stronger
And thank you for showing me
Your true colors

You are broken inside
I understand that
But how can I help you
When all you did was act

I've been with you for 4 years
Yet never really knew you
Would I do it all again?
It's not worth the tears
That come everyday
Streaming down my face
How could you do me this way?

I know it was your shit
I've got no part in that
But to hurt me like you did
FUCK THAT


Me: WH/BH, 27 (addict in recovery)
Her: Lost333, BW/FWW, My DDay: 2/19/12, Hers: 9/29/12

Working on myself through IC, NA meetings, intensive outpatient program, and lots of digging. Praying for R.


Posts: 230 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Midwest
wincing_at_light
♂ Member
Member # 14393
Default  Posted: 3:18 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Seeing as we've reached the "Terrible Poetry Written in the Wake of D-Day"[1] portion of our program, I submit this:
-----------------------------

Day 1: I bought some arsenic. For the mice.

Day 3: My wife was screaming at me this morning. All she ever does is make me miserable. So I put some arsenic in her coffee. Not enough to hurt her, and besides, sheíll never know. I just need to take control of something in my life. I wonít do it again. It made me feel better.

Day 7: My wife and I donít connect like we used to. She seems distant and paranoid. I know I said I wouldnít do it again, but I put some arsenic in her coffee. When she felt sick the other day, she needed me. It made me feel better.

Day 10: My wife is feeling sick and needy. Itís stressing me out. Itís always about her. I just need a break from her constant whining. So I put some arsenic in her coffee. After she got sick, she went to lie down for awhile. It made me feel better.

Day 14: I donít know what I ever saw in my wife. Sheís lazy, sleeps all the time, never does her part around here, acts paranoid. Sheís pale, sickly, doesnít take care of herself. Sheís always ragging on me about something being wrong with her, or with us. Thinks itís maybe Carbon Monoxide. I told her Iíd get one of those sensors. Itís all too much pressure. So I put some arsenic in her coffee. It made me feel better.

Day 21: I deserve better than what I ended up married to. Thereís just no love here. All she ever does is harass and accuse me, and I can do better. So I put some arsenic in her coffee. It made me feel better.

Day 28: My wife doesnít meet my emotional needs. Itís all about her and *her* illness, her needs. Canít she see Iím dying here? I just need to feel loved. She canít even do that right. So I put some arsenic in her coffee. It made me feel better.

Day 35: My wife got all up in my face today. God, she is such a bitch. She deserves all of this. If sheíd treated me the way a wife was supposed to treat a husband from the beginning, this would never have happened. So I put two spoons of arsenic in her coffee. Serves her right for the way she treats me. It made me feel better.

Day 40: Today, my wife found the bottle of arsenic. She is pissed off. She says sheís going to call the cops. I canít believe she found where I hid it. I feel like shit.

Day 41: I used to be happy and my wife was a lot easier to deal with when I had the arsenic. I wish I had more, but she wonít let me go to the drug store.

Day 42: Took my wife to the doctor because sheís vomiting blood. She can barely stand, let alone walk. He said itís going to take 2-5 years for her to recover from arsenic poisoning, and even then, part of her brain was apparently destroyed. (From a little arsenic? Yeah, right! Fucking quack.) Sheíll never be the same again, he says, but will probably get most of her functions back if I take care of her. Canít they just pump her stomach or something? Now Iíll have to listen to her whine and watch her vomit for the next two years.

Day 45: I just wanted to feel better. Why canít she just get better so we can go back to the way things used to be? I know what I did was wrong, but I was stressed out and fucked up. What else could I have done? Iím not a bad person, and she *was* a bitch. Still, I didnít think this would happen, not just from a little arsenic. It just made things easier to cope with. She makes it sound like I tried to kill her. Like I was doing it on purpose. I was just trying to cope. Iím a good person.

-----------------------------

1. As an FYI, I think most poetry is horrible. I only write it when I've been shot in the gut, and most of the time, I burn it shortly after. The list of actual, human poets I'm willing to read is something less than five. Not a comment on the talent of poets, just on my interest in the genre. Sorry to the poets out there. I respect your work tremendously...I just probably won't read it.

[This message edited by wincing_at_light at 3:25 PM, July 10th (Tuesday)]


Machiavellian idiot savant

Posts: 6687 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: Indiana
DontTreadOnMe
♂ Member
Member # 35240
Default  Posted: 3:28 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's almost time to leave work...

Usually at this time I'm excited to get home. But when I walk in the door and see ww.... I usually just feel sad.

I wish I had room for a bed in the garage...


Me: WH/BH, 27 (addict in recovery)
Her: Lost333, BW/FWW, My DDay: 2/19/12, Hers: 9/29/12

Working on myself through IC, NA meetings, intensive outpatient program, and lots of digging. Praying for R.


Posts: 230 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Midwest
MediumRare
♂ Member
Member # 35128
Default  Posted: 3:50 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hey DTOM,
We're in the same boat but my treatment was a bit longer (~8 years).

What she was willing, eager and excited to bring to the OM in 8 minutes was more than she was ever willing to do for us in 8 years. Sick, to say the least.

Just seeing her also feels like she's rubbing it in my face since I'm still not feeling that same thing that she had for another guy. She can "fake" it for me, but it's not genuine and continues to stir me into anger and frustration.

I don't know if this will pass, but I do know I want my WS to make it up to me, fix her FOO issues, and be able to the deliver the goods here at home where they belonged. It doesn't speak much of my 8 years though, which pissed me off being "skipped over" so meaningfully while holding the suckworthy sex-life bag for so long... like an idiot while douche-bag, unemployed loser-boy got all the rewards/treasures for nothing more than being a major asshole.

My clock is ticking for when my WS makes it clear in words AND actions that dickhead isn't her #1, but alternatively that I am. If she can't bring that home in my timeline, she'll be gone. Simple as that.

Until then, I'm like you- every time I see it, I just suck it up but her image makes me want to punch a fucking wall and destroy things. Doubly so as I'm supposed to just be "patient" while she works it out...

Good luck man. Strength and peace to you.


BS (ME): 44
WS(HER): 42
9 years
OM#1- 20-something loser, stole bunch of my things after she had sex with him in our bed (no condoms, STDs)
OM#2- 24 year old, unemployed loser, lives with mom & dad
DDay 1/2012
NC 3/20/2012
SGASDay 4/1/2012

Posts: 700 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: California
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 6:12 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I remember the dread of having to walk in the door.
I used to work late to avoid it.
(can't avoid)

Must confront (myself and my fears)
though stealthily, managing the fallout, the repercussions to me (was my excuse).
My confrontation was elaborately planned, given what I sensed about her at the time - still, it was botched, though I got out of it safely...

Don't get me wrong, I like ass-saving excuses.

When her excuses exceeded my tolerance (low threshold, admittedly) for being a man I realized I had to broom her.

I'm glad I did. I feel at peace, though sometimes...your stories move me to tears and bad poetry.
(sorry WAL)


Posts: 5997 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
jjct
♂ Member
Member # 17484
Default  Posted: 6:21 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

PS
It was my bad poetry.
I loved every one of the rest. It was hard. I read it all through blurry eyes. I feel you.

Posts: 5997 | Registered: Dec 2007 | From: texas
wincing_at_light
♂ Member
Member # 14393
Default  Posted: 10:33 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Aw, shit, jj!

Don't apologize to me. I'm a cretin when it comes to poetry. Srsly.

I always confuse Emily Dickinson with Angie Dickinson.

I don't have the faculties for appreciating anything with sincere human emotion other than rage (and maybe lust). So if you're talking Howl, I can dig it...but even then, it's a creaky connection.

Please don't take my blather as any sort of an insult. If poetry speaks to you (or speaks FOR you), use it all you want.

I mean, unless you want to talk dirty limericks...then I'm right there.


Machiavellian idiot savant

Posts: 6687 | Registered: Apr 2007 | From: Indiana
KernalSandy
♂ Member
Member # 35610
Default  Posted: 10:37 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I, for one, am loving the bad poetry. Takes me back to a more innocent time--the 90s, to be exact--when I thought seeing my 8th grade crush kissing a guy who was in high school was the worst pain I would ever feel.

*reaches for guitar to turn your poems into cheap Nirvana rip-offs*


Posts: 71 | Registered: May 2012
3yrwait
♂ Member
Member # 29907
Default  Posted: 11:13 PM, July 10th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Who are Angie and Emily Dickinson? Were they WWs?


Me: BH (early 40s)
Her: WW (early 40s)
Married 15 years
1 daughter, under 10
DDay July 2007

Posts: 450 | Registered: Oct 2010 | From: 3yrwait
noescape
♂ Member
Member # 34888
Default  Posted: 8:32 AM, July 11th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I can appreciate poetry much unless theres a guitar solo in there somewhere, but WAL
I bought some arsenic. For the mice.

Is fucking awesome!!!


Posts: 739 | Registered: Feb 2012
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