I hate how this horrible man created so much self-doubt in you. You are a good Mama Bear!
The only thing that comes to mind is a quote of Oprah's that has always stayed with me: WHEN YOU KNOW BETTER, YOU DO BETTER.
We cannot change the past, NG. You didn't have all the information. None of us did. Please forgive yourself.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't your children already in therapy? How about you, sweetie? You need all the support you can get.
Holding you in the light, **((NG))**. Sending you love, strength and prayers...
Ghost is right & I agree that the Oprah quote is right on. You're making things right *now*, you're helping them *now*. The past can't be changed, only accepted. I know that acceptance is a long time coming, at least for me anyway. And I've realized that I need to forgive *myself* so that I can reach acceptance.
It's a tough goal to attain.
NG, you've so much on your plate. Your precious ones are safe now and they're in therapy. It takes time, but they (and you) will come out much better than before. I honestly believe that.
"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow
"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."
When you know better, you do better.
I have been saying that to myself all morning. Thank you so much for that. I'm going to put it up on the refrigerator.
I do know better now. Honestly, though, I knew better back then. But more impactful than knowing better is that I've freed my soul enough from my past FOO bondage that now I can DO better. I still have a lot more work to do with my IC regarding FOO issues, but I've done enough already that I can make our lives better right now.
As a Paul Harvey "the rest of the story" FYI, when I discovered WH jacking off with one of the babies back then, I did immediately remove that baby from his arms and permanently "fired" him from all baby care duties forever. He never again was asked to change a diaper, feed a bottle, dress a baby or give me a break so I could go pee or take a nap.
During the disclosure I found out that he had been having phone sex and cybersex with a woman north of the border that he told me was a friend of his. He's had me sending holiday cards, we even invited her to our wedding all the while they've been having their fun off and on for years!! I'm in the mind set to contact her husband and fill him in on their little secret! Kills me!!
The other thing I find incredibly strange is how much I'm craving sex right now, not from my husband, no thank you! I don't think normal sex would even be enough for him since he's gone to such extremes!! I would like someone to desire me as much as he has desired all these women, do anything to be with me, have wild monkey sex. Crazy I know, but I think I've gone without for so damn long...without passion, love, and affection...just to have someone look at me like that. Who knows...
I'm getting over him, but I need his support and expertise right now. (He is an attorney). I think tomorrow I am getting fired from my job. Don't care -- it is another level of mega-stress I don't need right now. I may have an actionable lawsuit due to age discrimination. Just what I need - another fight on my hands, right?
SAWH said he'll take care of me. Damn right. I gave him forty years and the very best of me.
Damn, I am getting tired. I feel assaulted on every level of my life. This seems to be my only safe place.
Hang in there, Reality! This group of wonderful women will hold you up! Hugs to you, and all my sisters...
Mojo for Ghostie!
Mojo for Ghostie!
I also hope your son is doing okay. I've been thinking of him too.
You're an amazing mom. You did the best you could with the information you had at the time. You need to look forward now. In the past six months since I've been here you've done so many awe-inspiring things: you left the SA husband, you tried to get him some help on your way out, your got your children out as well, you got the children the psychological help they might need, you have carefully and thoughtfully come up with the best possible visitation plan under nearly impossible circumstances, you have monitored every possible interaction including phone calls, and you have stuck to it all. No backpedaling, no weakness, just lots and lots of courage.
I know that you would move mountains to protect your children. And that's why they will be okay in the end.
My Reality - welcome. I recently left my SA husband because he liked to do some of those things -or have those things done to him. And worse, way way worse. I know about it because I discovered 2000+ pages of sexts written by him and other women. (Is everyone here sick of how I have to write "2000+ pages of sexts" in every post here - sorry but it still makes me crazy.)
Anyhow, I've learned that it has NOTHING to do with me. I could have been the most perfect, brilliants, every-loving, sexy, gorgeous SI swimsuit model, and my H would have still found these other women. He just liked to have the "perfect" good wife at home - me - and then have a bunch of sick women do this other stuff with him. It's totally separate for him. So please remember, IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU. Have you read the whole "No Contact" thing yet here? It has literally saved me from going nuts.
Lastly, here's my complaint of the day. My brilliant, tough, feminist female attorney talked to my H for the first time today - he's been dodging her calls, but she got him today at 6am. And after speaking to him for an hour, and wrangling with him, and even laughing at him a bit with me, she literally told me, "He's very smart, very clever. Quick. I can see why he was very successful at [xxx career]." Then she said, "I actually liked him, very much, to be perfectly honest. He's very charming."
It's all so depressing. I felt like saying, "So you went to Harvard just to be bamboozled by a sex addict who likes to dress up in women's underwear and have men and women rape him while his wife and little kiddies are down the street?"
"He's very charming"
Why is it they are charming to every woman they meet and a$$holes to the women that treat them like gold?
Story of my life.
Ghost, this is the cloud with the silver lining. I truly believe that. You get UE money, sucks, but it will keep you going a bit, allow you time for your family issues, and you WILL win in a lawsuit.
Have a massage or a facial tomorrow.
To the rest of you dear friends, I am praying for all of you. PLEASE take time to nurture yourselves....
Hope ~ Your attorney's remark about Mr. Charm was extremely insensitive. UGGGGHHH. I am angry for you!!!
Off to work I go, wish me luck...
Mojo today for our Ghost. I hope things come out ok. Or at least as ok as possible.
MyReality- vent and share here, we've got your back.. and the others are right- what he did has nothing to do with you, even though we naturally take their behaviors personally.
As for me, I've really lost a lot of respect for my attorney. Hopefully she can get things done, however, quickly and efficiently.
Came out Sunday that WS is still looking at porn. Which deep down I knew.
He's still in denial. Back last fall he was in complete denial, said he didn't have a problem at all, he could stop on his own.
Now he says it is a problem, but not to the degree that I think.
He thinks, commnicating with me better, journaling, and me taking his internet access away will help. Oh and being more honest with our MC.
He's iffy on books. He's against SA groups and a CSAT.
Former 80s Icon wishful thinking
He wants to turn you into his Mommy or Parole Officer?
He is clearly showing you who he is & what he's about. Are you good with that?
10 minutes after receiving the news of his death, a HR "suit" and my manager show up with briefcases and ask me to sign a boatload of paperwork. They will NOT lay me off and let me collect unemployment. It appears they just want me to quit.
I was sobbing, and my co-worker said to them, "hold on there, her Stepdad just died". My bitch of a manager shrugged her shoulders and said, "we just need her to sign some paperwork and she can go."
I refused. I told the bitches I could not read or sign any paperwork under the circumstances. I couldn't think straight. I told them if they had any compassion in their hearts, they would give me time to collect myself before making any life-altering decisions. After a flurry of phone calls to upper brass, they agreed and let me leave.
Heartless bitches! So, my job is currently in limbo. 'Eff them! I have more important things to focus on right now. I have to plan a wake and a funeral for my wonderful Stepdad.
I need prayers for strength, my friends...
Just when I think I've already heard the worst human beings can be, I read another story...
There has to be a special place in Hell for such heartless pieces of shit.
And no, I'm not ok with it. I'm doing the 180. I found out late Sunday night. Monday he was at work all day and was texting me all day. I sent the kids to my inlaws and I made sure not to be home when he got home. Which freaked him out. Idid have to come back eventually to put up the chickens and goats though. At during that time he made promises, begged, blah blah, but he DOES NOT GET IT.
Tuesday morning this was the "plan" he wrote up, the night before...get this...while RAIDING on WORLD OF WARCRAFT.
(FYI Dawn is our Therapist)
"I have my wife and kids. I need to stop being an asshat and be more receptive to their feelings. I need to tell my wife how much I love and cherish her and how proud I am she is my wife. I need to actually think before acting and take others feelings into account. It is not always about me. I need to be more engaging in conversation with my wife as well. I need to be more honest and more open with my thoughts and emotions, no holding back. I need to be moreopen to Dawn about my issues and try to fix me and my emotions. I need to journal my thoughts about sex and get more control over it. I want my family and my wife more than anything. I need to show them. I need to be true to myself and admit when I am wrong. I can not blame Jamie for things she did not nor has any control over. It is NOT FAIR to her. I need to take the hard road and really get down and dirthy or I WILL lose every thing. I do NOT want to lose my wife and kids"
Oh and he came up with the please remove my WiFi on the nights I'm closing and you go to bed before I get home.
Yes, that's his plan.
I've been detaching/doing the 180 which he hates.
This is what I sent to him today (also note that 4 1/2 years ago after going through a horrible 5th pregnancy, gall bladder surgery during the pregancy that was botched and stuff left behind which they didn't find for 9 months and several hospitalizations, I developed an addiction to pain medication)
I'm still so absolutely very angry at you. Dissappointed. I'm hurt. Devistated. And I know you don't get it. At all. And I can't force you to get it, as much as I would like to.
I think you are placating me. Saying what you think I want to hear. I don't think that you understand the depth of your problem. If you did, you would make a solid plan of action of what you want to do to help yourself. You still think that you can fix this yourself. And that *I* can fix some of it for you. You won't admit it, but you rely on me to fix a lot of things for you. You let me do a lot of the work. I'm not trying to negate what you have done in some areas, but I still feel like you rely on me to put forth more effort. You're relying on me to turn off your internet access at night. Me to get you a journal. Me to still set up therapy sessions. Me to "possibly" order books, that you probably won't really read. You're not interested in meetings, or a therapist specializing in sex addiction, which tells me, that you're still in a level of denial. And I realize that I can't make you confront the issue until you are ready. But what worries me, is that by the time you DO realize how deep you're addiction level is, *I* may not be here still.
I do think that you are doing this for me, and not for you. I think you're doing it to appease me. I think you're hoping that if you put forth a minimal effort into addressing the addiction, rely on meds to supress some of the urges, that you'll be "cured". But that isn't how it works. There is no cure for addiction. It's a mountain to overcome and you have to deal with it DAILY. For the rest of your life. And I know you know that, but I don't think you grasp it.
I STILL crave pain meds. I still crave the high. The feeling of not caring. Not feeling stress. Not feeling anxiety. Not feeling ANYTHING except euphoria. Not having any problems. Being able to escape. But I can't give in to that feeling. I can't. But I want to. All the time. I see pain medication at other people's houses and I WANT them. I fantasize about stealing them. I fantasize about opening the bottle, taking a few and telling myself, they wouldn't notice. Just this Sunday at my mom's there was a bottle of pain medication for my Oma in the kitchen out in the open. I *WANTED* them so badly. They weren't even the good pain meds, and I still wanted them. Any time I have an ache or pain, or hurt myself, or a bad migraine, I think about going to the doctors and getting pain meds because I know I can. But I don't. Because I can't. Because I know I have too much to lose. I had to choose what was important to me.
I know how overwhelming it is. I had to walk into a therapists office by MYSELF. MYSELF. No one was with me. YOU have me by your side. *I* didn't have anyone. I was doing it alone. I walked in there alone to fill out paperwork to see a therapist and wrote down in black and white that I was addicted to pain medication. The front office lady looked at my paperwork, raised her eyes and said "Oh, wow, um, do you need to go to inpatient treatment?" That was humiliating. She wasn't even the therapist. My whole body was shaking. Then having to make the appointment with Dawn she asked me too if I needed inpatient treatment. I told her no, I wasn't going through withdrawls and I had taken the last of the medication THAT I HAD STOLEN FROM MY HUSBAND the day before. Then she asked me what was it that I was getting from the pain medication. I still remember the feeling of dread in my stomach. How bad I was shaking. Trying so hard to hold it together so I didn't cry. And I couldn't even get an appointment with her for a week, so I had to be alone for a week still. And then when I finally got to go, I was scared.to.death. Of judgment, that she wouldn't be able to help, that she wouldn't understand, that I wouldn't be able to be fixed.
Do you remember how angry you were when you found out? How you judged me??? How you asked me if I'd been using when we'd had sex? If I'd driven the kids around while using? How you called my mother to "tattle" on me??? How disgusted you were with me? I'm sure you don't remember, but I do. I remember how humiliated I felt. How I openly admitted everything to you. How I lied to a doctor after I'd stolen your medication and used them all. How though, initially it wasn't my fault for getting addicted, but it *was* my choice for continuing to use. I came clean to you. And how I fucked up our finances because when I was using I just didn't give a shit? How I got your check card turned off for 6 months? All because I couldn't be bothered with keeping things straight because when I was using I didn't care? And how FURIOUS you were with me? I was humiliated, ashamed and guilty.
I understand addiction. I DO. But you don't. I sought help, you still think you can do it alone. You can't. You think I can help you, I can't. But, you don't have to do it alone, like I did.
I feel like you take the easy way out, because you don't believe that I will eventually get fed up enough and leave. But I promise you, I will. Every time you lie, every time you hurt me, every time you do one more thing to me, another piece of me is destroyed and eventually there will be nothing left. Right now??? I'm back to being numb and detached. I feel nothing for you right now. Yes, I love you as a person. But I'm detached again. And our progress has been completely erased in our healing. I don't want to forget what you have done, but because you lied about something so big, it erased all the progress we made. Saying I love you the past two days is again just words. I lost that connection that I had with you. The one I worked SO hard to rebuild. And I'm livid that you did that to me. And you don't realize the magnitude of it. It's like you took all the work that I've done, that I put so much effort into, and you threw it on the ground, stepped on it repeatedly then thrust it back into my face while laughing at me. You expect me to fix myself, Dawn to help fix me, but you don't try to fix me. You just help break me. Repeatedly.
When you got on WoW the other night, that was so beyond disrespectful. You wrote your plan/letter while raiding. Do you really think you put 100% effort into me when writing that? I mean honestly. Did you put 100% effort into me while writing that and raiding at the same time? Because I know you didn't. You couldn't have. And that pisses me off. That WoW was more of a concern to you that me, or your marriage which is crumbling before you. If I'm gone, what good is your life? Do you think your WoW friends are going to put in as much effort into fulfilling your needs as I have? No. Do you think if I'm gone, and you find someone to replace me, that they will work as hard as I have? No. No one will take on your baggage like I have. And if you hide it from them, and when they find out (and they will find out, eventually) they will run, screaming. My point is, there is no one else that will love you like I do, and work as hard as I have at our marriage and keeping our family intact. But yet, you don't put forth that same effort. Not even a fraction of that effort. And I'm getting really tired of treading water pretty much alone. The only time you put forth a great amount of effort is for a short time after something huge, like this. Then slowly you slack off, you slide back into old habits. I try to encourage, prod, etc. but we eventually end up in the same place.
So what are YOU going to do to prove to me that you love and cherish me??? You need to think long and hard about that. Because I can't continue like this alone anymore. I appreciate the effort you have put in thus far. I do. But, you need to do so much more. You need to get honest with yourself AND me. You need to come to terms with the fact that you have a real addiction and you need more help that you can give yourself alone, and that I can do. I won't shoulder that responsibility.
I apologize if this is harsh. I'm just exhausted. I want my marriage back. I want to stop feeling like my husband is a stranger. I want to stop feeling like I love you, but I'm not IN love with you. I want to stop pretending to go through the motions. Because as of right now??? That's what you've got. A detached wife. I feel like cringing when you touch me or kiss me right now. Where as two weeks ago, I was crying because I was overwhelmed with so much emotion for you. And that's on you. And only you can fix that. But you have to come up with how. And you need to prove yourself to me.
I need you to come up with a real list of steps of how you want to address your addiction. If you want. If you want to take a tiny baby step into showing me that your ready. If your not ready, then fine. I'm not going to force you. You have to do this for you, not me. But just know, I can't sit here waiting forever. I won't. It's not fair to me. I'd rather be alone, then continually be disrespected. You say you *get* it more now. So prove it to me.
No DUH, you turkey! (that was meant for him, not you)
Please come up with your own list of boundaries & what you insist on getting from him. Don't leave it up to Mr. Wussy Words to give you a list of what he's going to do. You TELL him what has to happen! If he's not able, then he doesn't deserve you, and you sure as lleh don't deserve him.