I haved gained so much knowledge from this site, touched me more than any IC ever could.
my DD was 8/05/07, WH diagnoised SA in Jan. 2008.
I tried so hard, i really did, for all of us, kids, him & I, I just couldn't get past all of the trauma. It nearly killed me.
I divorced him 1 1/2 yrs ago, devastating for all of us. Somehow we have a decent relationship now. We can spend time together and actually have a decent time. Absolutely no sex involved.
Which brings up what another poster said. They (WH'S) deserve to have a good life with someone who trusts them. I agree, but I deserve the same.
How do you ever totally give up and let them go. I'm really having a hard time with this. He keeps wanting this to work, then tells me he's on dating sites loooking,he's lonely, blah, blah, blah. I hate that he still has just a tiny peice of my heart and brain.
I guess I need to head back to IC so I can learn to get my Shit together and move on.
Sorry for the rambling, I'm just so lost right now, not in a very good place. I hate that, I've come so very,very far.
I wish all of you stregnth, this is so tough, I just couldn't do it, and now I just feel lost. I'm sure all of you understand.
Blessings to all of you strong ladies,
We are now living apart and I am trying mightily to detach from him. I love him, but I do recognize I can't live with him.
I hope you find the peace you are looking for. Going back to IC is probably a good idea, hon. Wishing you all the best -- big big hugs to you...
Yesterday I took the kids on a mini-vacation to a hotel two hours away that has an indoor water park.. just to get away from this mess for a day or two. Of course this mess followed me there, with intrusive thoughts, mind movies, blah blah blah.
I joined the "Recovery Nation" website and started doing the workshop.
I'm still trying to figure out what I want to do, whether it's better to separate or not. How do I detach if we're still living together? How does he find motivation to change if he hasn't 'hit rock bottom'?
Raidra, IMHO, they aren't as motivated (and maybe not at all) if they haven't hit true rock bottom. I often wonder where WH and I would be if I had tossed him out like I initially wanted to. I was not in the best legal and financial position to do so when DDay happened. Basically, I needed him to sign a postnup giving me full custody (as well as spousal support, but the custody was critical to me), and I was afraid if I kicked him out he wouldn't. I had just moved 1000 miles away from family and friends, had no support, and the lawyers told me if I took the kids back to my home state I could be arrested for felony kidnapping.
So my WH is in IC, has made some strides, but IMHO not anywhere near where he should be 8 months out and not in true full active recovery. He's white knuckling and doing the minimum to get by in recovery. I'm going to have to push back hard to see any change, and I might have to leave anyway.
So every day I wonder how it would have been different if I had kicked him out and forced him to take full responsibility for his own recovery. If you have the opportunity to do it, especially amicably, I would. It will give you the time to focus on your own healing and for him to take responsibility for his actions and his therapy, and the onus of the possibility of R is on him totally.
Just my two cents.
But my main concern is the kids. It's not a bad environment right now, and they will be devastated if he moves out. I don't want to put them through that if the goal is for him to come back in a few months. But if he doesn't leave now, am I just setting us all up for a messier situation down the line?
Yes, IMHO, it will make it worse if he has to leave later. I don't know that for a fact or have any experience, I just know it's harder to enforce things later than sooner. It's great you can agree on a settlement, and to get that official ASAP (by means of post nup or starting D) would be great if you can financially swing it, and to at least start using it in practice if not.
Is it possible that your WH can live somewhere else now? Or with someone else for now, house sit, anything? I think it would make a very strong statement how dire the situation is if you made him leave, and it would give you some space to focus on you and your healing. Don't discount how tremendously devastating and traumatic this is for you. This is a time you need to be focused on your care, not his. You have more than enough on your plate than to babysit him now.
One of the things my WH "demanded" when I said I wanted a post nup and started laying out my boundaries is to set up a budget of everything I'd need if we separated. To stay in the house we are now, and to move somewhere more cost-effective. He wasn't being manipulative, he wanted me to see what it would take and he wanted to know what he had to pay to do it. It prepared me for worst case scenario (to see what it would cost me to set up a separate household under duress without his assistance, should he get fired or whatever for his acting out) and it also showed him that I would NOT be living high on the hog off his income only to do it, in either scenario significant cuts and sacrifices were made. It made my case for what state mandated child support covers would not be enough, and that I not only deserved spousal support but *needed* it. Not ONCE did I ever figure out what his costs would be, other than after all minimum payments made would there be enough left for me and the kids to receive X. That's HIS problem.
Hislies, raidra, goldenrule... Just want to say hi *waves*. Sorry you have to be here. But glad you found us.
So many of you are in such a tough situation right now, raidra, ghost, naturegirl, wisa..... know I am thinking of you all.
Im doing okay most days. Still have not gone ahead with polygraph and forensics, but I probably still will, Im a terrible procrastinator.
I didnt seem to have a focus in IC, so we started doing MC with her. Strangely going to the appts brought out a lot of anger and anxiety for me at first but the last few sessions have been positive.
Im also in her weekly group with other spouses of sa. We are entering a chapter that I dont identify with in the least. Want to write more on that when I get time.
Still want to chime in on the co-dep talk! My h and I are coming to realize that he may the one who is co-dep. Is it common for addicts to be?
Last night as I tucked my children into bed, I had a conversation with one of my daughters about Big Feelings. Earlier in the day she'd had a crying session, missing her Daddy. So I thought we should talk about feelings in the quiet moments before Mr. Sandman found her, as this seems to be when my kids really start to open up.
So, we talked about missing Dad and how our lives are different. That's when she said something which just alternately affirmed that I made the right decision in throwing him out of the house & divorcing him, but at the same time broke my heart that she even has to think this way at such a young age. She said, "I really do miss Dad, but I feel like I'm opened up to the whole world now. I feel like I was in a cage before, and now I'm out and can see what the world is all about."
I kicked SAWH out one month ago, but the collateral damage to my family continues. My adult diabetic son lives with me. He lost his job two months ago. He despises his father and I thought things would improve once WH was gone. Wrong!
My son is an alcoholic. It grieves me to even type these words, but he is. He tried to stop drinking and spent three days going through horrible withdrawal symptoms. He vomited non-stop for three days, but would not go to an ER, despite my pleas. He is currently without health insurance, but I didn't care, I would find some way to pay for it.
I went to bed last night confident he was getting better. He was able to hold down soup and sports drinks with electrolytes. His blood sugar was stable. When I got up this morning for work, it was apparent he was drunk again. He drank during the night while I was asleep!
I called work this morning and took the day off -- watching over him and begging him to agree to rehab. He won't go. He blames his father and me for screwing him up. We probably did! What do I do???
Kat, I need you. I know you've gone through this with your own son and I'd appreciate your opinion. I feel so hopeless and afraid. Please pray for us, my dear sisters...
A few responses to questions asked:
DrivingPast - the therapist at Keystone thought my WS had several codependent tendencies. I don't know if it is common for addicts to also be codependent, but my WS has been diagnosed with some of those traits. Of note, he grew up in a home where addiction and codependency were both modeled.
Raidra - I can honestly say that separation has been a good thing in my case. It has really pushed WS to be responsible for his own recovery and me to stay out of it and to care for myself. But you have kids...and you're right, that certainly complicates things. I defer to the wisdom of the many mothers on this website.
Nature Girl - So glad you are having heart-to-hearts with the young ones. Sounds like wisdom runs in the genes
Ghost - Praying for you and for your son. Wishing you strength and peace.
HOWEVER, it is very early (90 days past dday), and if there's one thing I've learned in all this...it's that WS can lie to me all day long, and I cannot tell the difference. So I will be cautiously optimistic...but dare I admit it, I am optimistic.
So for right now, at least with WS, things seem okay.
Community/school on the other hand, still in tatters, although we did have class today. A little humor for you - an actual conversation from my class:
Kid #1: Ms. [my name], why did the tornado hit our community?
Kid #2: Because it's the apoc-o-lypse! Jesus is coming back as a raptor!
Kid #3: No, that's not true. No one knows when Jesus is coming.
Kid #4: The axis of the earth changed, and now we are getting the weather from the northeast, and they are getting our weather.
Kid #5: Yup, we're going to have to return to the old ways, hunting and fishing and burning firewood.
Kid #6: My cousin found a three-legged cat. We named him Pod.
In honor of the things I've learned about trauma response, we did a little art therapy today, lol. Some interesting conversations to say the least, haha.
@ Ghost- I'm so, so sorry about your son. It must be incredibly heartbreaking to have to watch him. I'm terrified our children will show up with addictions too.
I have confirmed he took the SA behaviors to his work computer & is even further compartmentalizing his life. He seems to be willing to do whatever it takes to keep the status quo since it's working to his advantage. The SA rollercoaster is whirling me pretty hard this last week or so. Diving and spinning and triggering like mad. I still haven't had time alone to work through the bank statements or make an appointment with legal aid. *sigh* I'm procrastinating terribly. I'm so tired though. So very very tired.
"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow
"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."
Sabrina, I am so sorry for your ongoing turmoil. It is so difficult to move forward when each new horrible discovery is paralyzing. I totally get it.
Thanks for the hugs, sweetie. Right back at you. Praying we all find the strength to do what we need to do, no matter how difficult...
(((Ghost))) I hope last night was peaceful in your home and that your son was okay.
I'm off to see a new lawyer in an hour. Please say a prayer for me. Tomorrow, March 14, is officially my six-month mark and I can file for D anytime now. STBX continues to act out and post S&M ads for men, women, and couples on Craigs List. He lives with the OW and her child. I think the OW's H has moved out and they are divorcing. Our 2011 taxes are due in a month, and STBX has no money to pay them. I am a SAHM.
That's it in a nutshell. Not an easy story to tell a lawyer/stranger. I'm already a wreck. I keep thinking that everything hinges on this divorce settlement - esp. keeping my children protected.
Good luck, sweetie! Let us know how it goes...
[This message edited by Ghostwalker at 11:33 AM, March 13th (Tuesday)]
You are carrying a lot of weight on your shoulders right now. Thinking of you and sending you lots of strength and peace. And lots of love!!!
I'm feeling so much anxiety this week. I keep forgetting things; I'm late to everything; I missed school events and messed up my children's after-school sports schedules. I think I need to start taking care of myself a bit more. I'm cutting out all wine at night (frankly, it's about time I did this), trying to get to sleep at a decent hour, and eating better. (Since D-Day I've been eating handfuls of junk food instead of meals. I do cook for my children, so I should at the very least be eating healthy food when they're around.)
I just can't go on like this without taking better care of myself.
I hope everyone's doing okay this week. It's so hot where I live. Everyone but me seems to love it. But I did go out for a walk with a friend, followed by a short run. I feel a little less anxiety after the run.
As for me, SAWH has lied to the kids, lied to the court and we are still ironing out the divorce details.
I have been out of the house for a few months and he is still emotionally abusing me.
Anyway, I want to say that most of the time I am at peace because me and my children are no longer living under his roof everyday. It would have been much worse if I stayed.
He is in a dark place, compartmentalizing, lies to himself and ofcorse blames me for it all.
Anyway, stay true to your boundaries and steadfast to the path for YOUR life and that of your kids.
Hugs and much peace to you, torn
I'm sorry to hear that he's still emotionally abusive. I hate him for that. He'll probably never change, but as you move forward towards the divorce, I hope and pray he has less and less contact with you. And then he'll have to find someone else to blame. (Also, if it makes you feel better my STBX blames me for everything too, including his addiction. The CSAT told me that most active SAs blame their wives in some way.)