Hello to all the new folks here. It's sad to have to be here, but you can't find a better place to be.
I have to read and catch up on everyone's stories! Betrayed Angel, it sounds like an OC situation to me, but I'm going to read a little more. Contact or No Contact, you can get good advice and get good information here. Some of us have C, some of us do not.
Chat with everyone later.
Just an update
Quit letting MOW have such destructive power over two families. WH needs to determine his legal rights and proceed that way. If he can't legally petition the courts for a DNA test, then he can try to pursue a test with MOW approval. If she doesn't approve, then he needs to go NC and assume that the child isn't his.
It seems as if my SAWH has decided that NC is the best. Our IC/MC seems to think that reality is starting to sink for him and that he is starting to see just how controlled and manipulated he has been by MOW. It's so glaringly obvious to EVERYONE else (both of our families are aware of whats been happening).
It's sad that either one of them (SAWH and MOW) would use a baby to keep an A going. As Dr. Phil says, "No baby should be born into this world with a job." (Except for Jesus but, He rocks!)
As for me, I need to keep working on detaching from their chaos and concentrate on me and my babies (they rock too!).
Prayers to all of you wonderful people dealing with A's, OC's, OW/OM's, ect.
We will survive...(cue music)
I can do all things through Christ who gives me strength!
It's been eerily quiet on the cOW front lately...I'm sure that means something big is coming. But we are trying to enjoy life as much as we can. We had an amazing weekend and we are planning an awesome week (I'm off this week). I'm hoping the cOW made a New Year's resolution this year to leave us the hell alone, and that she's sticking to it! It could make for a nice, quiet year!
We are trying to find out if she is working though, to get the CS lowered. Chances are she isn't; she hasn't since 2008 so why start now?! But she might and keeping under the radar to avoid the CS getting lowered. Not like she will report herself. We shall see. Doing some investigative work.
Otherwise, I hope everyone has a good week. I will make an effort to come on more and be more supportive. Work has been crazy lately and I've been going thru a bit of a funk lately. I seem to have my highs and my lows. I'm hoping to make this week a good, high week with our family!
I was watching MobWives and heard Renee's story; she too has an OW/OC situation! Except the OC is already older. Looks like they did NC. It's sad how "common" this whole OW/OC crap seems to be.
Hugs to all of us!
He's right. It's just we went SO long with NC, and I know it will never be 100% NC, but man did it feel GREAT to not hear from her. I just feel so...violated(?) because she had the nerve to ask about us. It just pissed me off so bad--I know I shouldn't let it get to me. I hope she falls of the damn radar again for another 4-6 months.
[This message edited by IslandWahine at 8:15 PM, February 29th (Wednesday)]
The only time my FWH has contact is CS hearings, which are conducted over the phone in our state.
I can't imagine not knowing if and when Ow will contact us. I hope, HOPE for you that like our OW, she finds someone else to occupy her time, and fades away.
We haven't talked about it. I know we should, but I also know that the guilt is there for both of us because we have NC with OC. The movie just made it SO much about being a deadbeat in God's eyes :(
I can't do it and I'm now feeling like WH thinks I'm choosing his eternal damnation over contact with OC. Ugh.
I feel awful about OC. ESP because like so many of you, Ow is a disgusting person.
But, I can't let that into mine or my kids' lives...
How do we do this? How do we deal with the guilt?
We've been lucky and haven't heard from OW in months and although she's still single, I think she's figured out that WH isnt leaving me for her.
I honestly hope she finds someone who wants to marry her and adopt OC, but. Expect it won't actually happen.
My fwh had wanted to change his number and I talked him out of it because of how muuch $ it was going to cost, and I refused to have any additional $ leave this house because of the cOW. But we just may. We also tried to have all the mail go elsewhere, although the cOW is more about sending annoying ass texts (that we print out and save). We told the cOW to only contact my fwh through his attorney, but she doesn't listen and unless we have a court order there's not much we can do. He doesn't want to go back to court or anything like that because he deosn't want to see her--I WISH like hell they did the phone thing here. It's not even an option here, which is way too bad. I hate knowing she will just pop up whenever she feels like it.
Debi9, I'm so sorry for your confusion. It's where I was last year, with the guilt. My fwh wants nothing to do with the OC so it made my guilt feel even worse for being with someone who would think that way (until he fully explained it to me in MC--still not sure if I agree with him but I totally understand). I had to really just let it go. Trust me, my dream come true is for the cOW to find her own man and they all live happily ever after, but I know that will never happen because she's so toxic. Have you 2 been able to have a good, solid sit-down, try to figure out where you both are and what you both want? Let me know if there is antying I can do to help.
(((rayofhope))) Sorry you are here, but this can be the best place to get support. Did you happen to look through the OC handbook posted in the beginning of this thread? Transparency is 100% necessary to deal with the betrayal. With an OC situation, the betrayal never really fully goes away. The OC will always remain a trigger (albiet an innocent one, but a trigger nonetheless). What I know I try to do is remind myself that while I cannot control the situation, I can be made aware of the situation at all times, and all decisions that we make in regards to OUR family/COM are made together. I made my fwh aware that I was ok with C or NC and I was going to support either decision he made--but everything in regards to the cOW/OC had to be made together since those decisions have a direct impact on OUR family. You will find everyone here does things a little differently, based on their own situations. We don't judge here! If your fwh wants C with the OC, he should realize that he needs to take your feelings into consideration and he has to try to find a medium. Especially if he wants R.
I can say for myself, time has made everything "better". However I still have not seen the cOW or OC up close in real life yet, so I know that there will be phases/layers to my healing. The healing takes time and energy, expect ups and downs. Open communication is what will work the best. My fwh and I are still working through the beast of communication, and I had some serious downs (which is part of why I was M.I.A.).
Hugs to us all.
Wouldn't it be interesting if these OW had to put their portion of the support payment into an account that could then only be used for the OC. If she couldn't come up with the money or used it inappropriately, she would risk jail just like the WH. These women really have no idea what it's like having support payments over their heads. It's not a debt you can just declare bankrucy over and walk away like so many others. There is no out even if money gets tight. These women are so callus about the emotional and physical effect of this type of legal arrangement that is just waiting to make the WH out to be the bad guy even throw them in jail if they get behind as if the OW isn't equally responsible for the situation. If there was some equal accountability for the OW (or the custodial parent), there would probably be fewer people having babies they can't afford.
[This message edited by disrespected666 at 11:30 PM, February 22nd (Wednesday)]
Wouldn't it be interesting if these OW had to put their portion of the support payment into an account that could then only be used for the OC. If she couldn't come up with the money or used it inappropriately, she would risk jail just like the WH. These women really have no idea what it's like having support payments over their heads and are so callus about the emotional and physical effect of this type of legal arrangement that is just waiting to make the WH out to be the bad guy even throw them in jail if they get behind as if the OW isn't equally responsible for the situation. If there was some equal accountability for the OW (or the custodial parent), there would probably be fewer people having babies they can't afford.
For the ones that are $ hungry, it's a sense of enttitlement. I have your child = I have your wallet. I told y'all the cOW in my sitch went after MY income 3X!!! The cOW in our sitch didn't even show any shame, talking about what she was entitled to and what she expects and fairness. For those who don't know my story, I work and make almost as much $ as my fwh, therefore our combined income is pretty decent, vs. the cOW who hasn't worked since 2008 and is only living off of the CS and whatever assistance she qualifies for. Her last argument for more $ was that our COM live a more lavish lifestyle than the OC, and it's not fair that the OC doesn't get to enjoy the "comfortable" lifestyle that our COM do, therefore the CS should have gone up because of that. Luckily the judge read right thru that mess and denied it. We had wanted the additional suppport my fwh pays to go into a trust or something, but it was an after thought that hopefully our new lawyer can bring up at the future remod hearing (which I am 1000% certain the cOW already has that date penciled in).
(((rayofhope))) What does the court order say about visitation? Look it over as well as the guidelines for your state (I practically have our guidelines memorized)--the OW may be on the hook for either helping pay for travel or have to agree to meet halfway/etc. OR you can request your CS get reduced due to the excessive cost of travel--some states will take that into consideration when doing calculations. Good to get that in writing now because as the OC gets older, there may be more travel, including travel to your home (obviously without the OW).
I remember asking my fwh if he wanted to get the OC a gift for bdays/christmas--i told him that if he does it needs to be something we look at together. Perhaps in the future; right now my fwh won't send anything; his reasoning is that he pays a LOT of CS plus the cOW lied about the arrears that built up while we were waiting for paternity--to the tune of $1000, therefore that's bdays/christmas for awhile. AGain, not something I exactly agree with, but in our sitch we are dealing with the "give a mouse a cookie they ask for the whole damn grocery store" mess.
I wish the cOW was reasonable, because I think things would've/could've gone over better for everyone. But she's a nutcase and we're stuck with her! Rayofhope, I'm so sorry about the multi-level betrayal. Your son must be confused and pissed--who could blame him.
The trust takes a LONG time to build up, and your fwh should be active in making sure you are set. No more lies, keeping things, etc. Remind him that building trust is like building a bank account (LOL I'm so obsessed with money--it's because I've worked too long and hard to watch it slip away). The more he puts in, the larger the account grows. But when he keeps things from you, lies, etc., he is making withdrawals that he will now have to work at rebuilding. Which means more work for him to catch-up/get ahead. Remind him that this affects YOUR household, therefore anything additional other than CS needs to be discussed. And again, know your guidelines--gifts cannot count as anything other than gifts, and you don't want the OW to be aware that there is ANY additional $, because guaranteed she will go after that anything she gets mad. Especially if she is already going after more $. Finances need to be kept extra tight and private. Trust me, we learned the hard way. The betrayal is enough; the money part is total icing on the cake...
[This message edited by IslandWahine at 8:17 PM, February 29th (Wednesday)]
Even if it's difficult for you, it sounds like being there for the visits is less tramatic and damaging to you then not being there. I think that will get better with time too as you learn to deal with all the emotions that will bombard you during the encounters. I never thought I would ever be able to deal with this situation but while I still get angry and anxious every time we have to discuss the OW or respond to her, I find myself a little less sick to my stomach and a little quicker to get over the renewed invasion each time it happens. My husband and I have established ground rules and each time he meets them, I feel more like the situation is under control and I am empowered. I know things will come along that will knock me back but those experiences will
eventually add to my growing strength until she gets shoved back into a proper perspective. That's the thoughts that give me strength to stay in these horrible mess. what I can live with.
The COW sent a picture of the baby the other day and it makes me feel good knowing that little baby is not a cute baby at all He looks just like her! She's not even supposed to be in contact with WS, but this is her way of staying in touch, sending pictures. And of course, HE still won't give me access to his email.
Life is so hard sometimes.
Here's hoping I can think about something besides money for the next two weeks...
If possible, you CAN try to "work it out" with the OW, try to offer straight cash for less vs. having it added to what the CS is...the cOW didn't give us the chance to do that although she most likely would've rejected the offer. SHE has the power to not go after the arrears, although they almost always do mostly for revenge. If anything, start putting some $ aside to prepare for the arrears. If you haven't yet, find a lawyer who either has experience with this type of situation or a lawyer who is a father's rights advocate. IT's the HUGEST mistake we made; my fwh found the first lawyer with his pre-paid legal who was completely lost, and we are paying dearly for it. A lawyer's retainer sucks, but I can say it pays off in the long run. Our new lawyer is AMAZING, she is a father's rights advocate and her clientele are almost all fathers (and some non-custodial mothers). However, there's not much we can change to the court order until we get a remod. A family friend of ours is also going thru an OC situation, and the husband is now paying for college expenses plus CS for a 19-going on 20 year old OC! They live in VA.
Not trying to scare you! There are so many things we learned AFTER the fact. Like asking for joint legal off the bat vs. waiting until later.
Read over the guidelines, and make sure you understand them all. Be prepared for a vengeful cOW going after EVERYTHING she possibly can. IF she can't have your H, she will try to get your H's money. Remember, the child should be supported by BOTH parents, so if the OW in your sitch isn't working, PUSH for income to be imputed. THe lawyer in our sitch didn't do that, and her income is calculated at ZERO! Check how long you have to dispute the order after it is written; in our state it's 10 days and our old lawyer screwed it up! We found out so much the hard way, I hope and pray at remod time (every 3 years here) we can fix all of his mistakes. But be prepared for the judge to favor the OW. We found that out the hard way, it was almost like he was trying to punish my fwh (and he did).
(((hugs))) to us all.
[This message edited by IslandWahine at 8:19 PM, February 29th (Wednesday)]
thanks for the advice, we have put away some money in anticipation of the arrers, but the more I read about what COULD be included as possible CS obligations, the more nervous I get.
I just realized that I keep referring to "our" obligation when it was certinly not "our" decision for him to have an affair. Nothing like money troubles to stir up some anger.