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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 6
mistyalone
♀ New Member
Member # 35031
Default  Posted: 7:32 PM, June 22nd (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WH has six female friends and one male friend that all helped him cover up the EA and supported it. MC says to stop talking to them so we can work this out. He feels it is me telling him what to do and that is why he is having trouble commiting to R. So my question to the WS's is;
Is it necessary for the cheating spouse to cut off friendships with people who supported the affair? Especially if the WS and these female friends have no boundries in conversation and I as the BS need these people out of his life to begin to heal.
I felt this was the only fair way to find out if I am asking too much.
Thank you to all the WS for posting here and helping all of us understand and heal.


Me BW 40 Him WS 44 Kids 15, 16
M 19 Together 21
Said he wants D 1/?/12
D-Day of EA 2/17/12 & 2006 ONS
Admit 3/15/12 5/21/12 Out of fog. FalseR. R 6/15/3/12. NC sent. Not sure what we are now... 6/22/12 wasted time? 8/14/12
9/08/12 R maybe

Posts: 24 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: mistyalone
Lost333
♀ Member
Member # 35182
Default  Posted: 7:46 PM, June 22nd (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Arais-

I have said some of the same things to my BH and I don't think it is all bullshit. Although, I do understand why you feel it might be. How could things suddenly be different? I know for me there was a sense of fear (and still is) after Dday when I confessed to my H. However, I don't think fear by itself necessarily means we are not in it for the right reasons. Fear is a basic human emotion that signals danger and WS's are in extreme danger of losing our BS's. Fear can motivate us to change and can be healthy to an extent. However, if he continues to be motivated only by fear and not by an internal desire to become a better person than there may be a problem. For me, realizing that I have destroyed my BH and my M (and my own life) really caused to me break down the walls I had built to "protect myself". I realized that I could no longer live the way that I was living and that I needed to make a change NOW. Although, realizing that and backing it up with actions are two different things. I feel I am also taking action steps to show my H that I am remorseful and am commited to doing what it takes to support his healing and become a better person. I have realized that a key factor in giving him the love he deserves is learning to love myself as well. I know that prior to the A I never felt worthwhile and I engaged in self-destructive behaviors because I did not value myself.

I do not see my M as exciting and new because we are in so much pain most of the time. I see our M as something that I destroyed and that will need to be rebuilt after we each work on healing ourselves. Your WH may feel closer because in his own process he has let down his walls? Realized what is important to him? I would make sure what he says matches what he does. And in regards to talking about the A this should be something he does to help you heal even if it is uncomfortable for him. He may also be sincere if he is really working on himself (IC, reflecting on his whys, reading, etc).

Hope this helps.


Me:29,WS/BS Him:27, BS/WS (DontTreadOnMe) His Dday 2/19/12. My Dday 9/29/12
Married: 2 yrs, together 4 1/2

"And the day came when the risk it took to remain tight inside the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom" Anais Nin


Posts: 689 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Midwest
Lost333
♀ Member
Member # 35182
Default  Posted: 8:00 PM, June 22nd (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mistyalone- I do not feel you are asking too much at all.

In fact even if there had not been an affair I would question the friendships with the female friends especially since you stated they have no boundaries in conversations. IMO no boundaries between opposite sex friends is what can lead to a slippery slope. This can even happen with same sex friends as I found out when my SIL encouraged and condoned my A. Now I do not tell my girlfriends "secrets". I do not share anything with a girlfriend that I could not share with my H (not that he would necessarily want to know all my girl talk but in the event he overheard me he would be okay with what I am saying). This may be too extreme for some people and that is okay, but it is what my H and I have agreed to.

Frankly, I think your WH stating that he feels like you are telling him what to do and it is why he is having trouble commiting to R is a way to blameshift, try to control the situation and is very selfish.

In the beginning, I believe R is about what the BS needs in order to heal. If he is truly remorseful and commited to R than he should be willing to comply with what you need to heal.

I had to go NC with my SIL and also stopped contacting a friend who knew pieces of the affair. MY BH didn't ask me to stop contacting the second friend but I thought it the healthiest option. I want to be a healthier person and so I want to surround myself with people who are not only friends of the marriage but who have good values, morals, and are living with integrity.



Me:29,WS/BS Him:27, BS/WS (DontTreadOnMe) His Dday 2/19/12. My Dday 9/29/12
Married: 2 yrs, together 4 1/2

"And the day came when the risk it took to remain tight inside the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom" Anais Nin


Posts: 689 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: Midwest
mistyalone
♀ New Member
Member # 35031
Default  Posted: 8:50 PM, June 22nd (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost -
Thanks for the answer, I am glad to hear that you took it upon yourself to do something that your H needed, especially since so many of us are scared to really ask for what we need to heal.
Good luck to you both!


Me BW 40 Him WS 44 Kids 15, 16
M 19 Together 21
Said he wants D 1/?/12
D-Day of EA 2/17/12 & 2006 ONS
Admit 3/15/12 5/21/12 Out of fog. FalseR. R 6/15/3/12. NC sent. Not sure what we are now... 6/22/12 wasted time? 8/14/12
9/08/12 R maybe

Posts: 24 | Registered: Mar 2012 | From: mistyalone
heartbroken0903
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Member # 27879
Default  Posted: 4:03 PM, June 25th (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Mistyalone

I too agree that your WS needs to lose these "friends." I had so-called "friends" who knew about my affair and didn't tell me to get my head out of my ass. I was told by one, "You need to do what makes you happy, even if it means hurting others." That, to me, is the same as enabling/facilitating the affair. They are no longer my friends.

I am sure your WS doesn't like being "told what to do" and doesn't want to give up his friends. I lost every friend I had on D-day; the affair enablers because it was wrong to stay friendly with them, the others because they didn't want anything to do with me. It is hard to lose friends. But friends are (IMO) no match for the life partner that one takes vows with. Your WS needs to decide what matters more, keeping crappy non-friends around (I say that because real friends wouldn't have enabled his A) or keeping his WIFE around. Easy choice, IMO.

You are not wrong at all.


Me: WS, 30s
XH: BS, 40s
No kids

Married 2.5 years
D-day 3/6/10
Divorced 5/14/10

Reconciling after divorce


Posts: 1916 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: the cat's meow
brokensmile322
♀ Member
Member # 35758
Default  Posted: 10:20 AM, June 26th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a question about R'ing-

Why would a WS do everything right for R-total transparency, allow me to have access to passwords, emails, texts, money expenditures, MC etc.. and still possibly be underground? I mean, why bother? And how do you know it's for real? I don't want to have to look and check and spy? I guess I just feel like if you don't want me, let me know, cause there is someone out there who I know will want me and what I have to offer...
Any insight?


Me BS 42
Him WS 44
OW Coworker
DDay April 7, 2012
EA on a slippery slope...

When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves. ~Viktor Frankl


Posts: 1298 | Registered: Jun 2012
Want To Wake Up
♀ Member
Member # 31583
Default  Posted: 9:58 PM, June 26th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hoping for some insight.

Is "I was selfish" enough of a "root cause"?

I kind of think it's a given... is it a "root cause"?

WH has always been on the selfish side (only now able to admit that to himself, he'd always thought of himself as very generous) he was virtually raised as an only child but never had a lot of positive parental attention (e.g. he was never "good enough" for his sperm donor of a father... even in adulthood, never "succesful enough" in terms of money and career) he was always volunteering to 'do' for others because then everyone said what a 'great guy' he was (external validation much?)


I think the "I was selfish" is a start... but only a start. I feel deeper digging is required by him for him to understand why he was so selfish and why/how that lead him to be unfaithful... am I asking the impossible?

Should I be content with the "I was selfish" and just let it go at that?

(he is 'working' on being less selfish btw)


Me 50+
WH 50+ (SlowUptake)
DDay '09
"He didn't cheat because I wasn't enough, he cheated because HE wasn't enough"

"Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."


Posts: 455 | Registered: Mar 2011
stilllovinghim
♀ Member
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 11:41 PM, June 26th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

brokensmile,
Is this a gut feeling, do you have "proof"? I'm not trying to say that in a sarcastic tone, either. I know a BS will have suspicions for a very long time and there's nothing wrong with that. As a matter-of-fact just the other day my H was talking to the bank about a possible cc fraud and they said someone tried to use his card # at a hotel. His heart went to his feet. Keep in mind, we're R'd but he still went directly to that reaction. Why? Protection. The hotel was several states away and I've got TONS of proof I haven't done ANYTHING CLOSE and I know if I ever even considered it for a nanosecond what the results would be.

Anyway, I hope I didn't confuse you with my answer. As a side-note, you mentioned you have someone in mind who you know will want you. This worries me. Keep those boundaries up tight, now more than ever! I know you could be saying this out of hurt, but the fact that you mentioned it means you've entertained the thought....please don't act on it. Hope that helped!


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1933 | Registered: Oct 2010
stilllovinghim
♀ Member
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 11:47 PM, June 26th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wantowakeup-
Being selfish is a good answer but not a ROOT. Why was he selfish? What made it ok? There's plenty of selfish people out there who have never conducted in an A. There are some very giving and loving people who have been involved in an A. See what I'm saying? I've donated clothes, money, books and my own blood and hair (Locks of Love) to various charities throughout the years and I had an A. There's something much deeper that he needs to get to the root of.

Is his answer enough for you? It doesn't sound like it is because it isn't. Finding his "WHY" is crucial to R and to his soul. It's great to admit he was selfish. But he needs to know WHY. What made it ok to betray himself and you? You can tell him that's enough of an answer, but I think it'll keep nagging at you because it's rugsweeping. His Why, when he eventually finds it, is his why. Don't expect it to make a lot of sense because it never will.

[This message edited by stilllovinghim at 11:50 PM, June 26th (Tuesday)]


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1933 | Registered: Oct 2010
brokensmile322
♀ Member
Member # 35758
Default  Posted: 6:54 AM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Still loving him,
Thanks for the reply. The 'someone' I am referring to is 'someone else' as in the general sense. I mean that as in that I am worthy of being loved and if he doesn't love me, I know I will not be alone forever, if that makes sense...

Anyway, my WS was in a EA with coworker. He admits no PA and really calls what happened a slippery slope that was possibly headed somewhere worse. I cannot find any proof of anything else, but they work together and travel together. The opportunity was/is there and the company pays for it. So I would never be able to find anything charged on our personal bills etc...

My question is really that he is trying. He has cut as much contact with this bimbo as he can. He gave me access to everything etc..., but I keep reading about WS with other phones, going underground. My question really is hypothetical... why would WS bother to do all these things, allow access to everything and try, but go underground? Why not just let the BS move on?


Me BS 42
Him WS 44
OW Coworker
DDay April 7, 2012
EA on a slippery slope...

When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves. ~Viktor Frankl


Posts: 1298 | Registered: Jun 2012
stilllovinghim
♀ Member
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 7:25 AM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Broken-
ok I gotcha! you are worthy of being loved. I think if a WS takes the A underground but seem outwardly to be in R, then that right there shows you who they are. They're cake-eating and even worse, putting the BS through even more pain. How would you ever be able to trust them again and at that point, it was a false R. The BS has to decide if that's where they draw the line. There's no one who can decide for you but you, kwim?

As far as your H working with the AP, even tho there's minimal contact and its professional -according to him- it's still contact. Is there any way your H could transfer to another department or better yet, another job?


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1933 | Registered: Oct 2010
brokensmile322
♀ Member
Member # 35758
Default  Posted: 7:52 AM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

No. Not at this time. There are layoffs galore right now. In fact, the company is in a crunch situation and those not performing will be sacked at the end of this fiscal year. He is worried. The economy is not good at the moment. He says that nothing happened physically. He claims that he was texting too much (which was 98% business with a bit of kidding banter mixed in) These things I saw but became upset by them. At that time, he felt I didn't understand that he could have a working relationship like this and thought I was being ridiculous because he knew nothing was going on, so he began to hide some of these texts or that he had dinner with her say. Things he would have told me before. When I discovered these things, I flipped because I believed there was more. I have looked and cannot find anything. I have even listened to deleted voicemails back to November. All business..would think that there would have been some cutesy stuff in there if it had crossed into PA. Anyway, when I brought up to him moving jobs etc.. he says that he would absolutely do that IF he had done something. After I discovered the lying, I had showed him a blog on EA's. In there is talks about how EA's start with the people not even realizing what they are doing. Then they listed the steps. He said that this was his AHA moment because he saw that he was doing the first three. Talking more than he should be, 98% business mixed in with funny banter, then starting to conceal. He said it never moved to anything personal or intimate discussions and nothing physical. He said that article showed how that could progress and he was done. He doesn't want that for our family, for us. Who knows? Do I believe him? I don't know. But for it to be continuing now, he'd have to be very sneaky.
If he is this sneaky, I will have to play PI and I really don't want to. Part of me thinks that since I feel like I have to be the PI, I am done. It's a deal breaker. I am worth more than being someone's mother who is constantly checking up on them. Does this make sense?


Me BS 42
Him WS 44
OW Coworker
DDay April 7, 2012
EA on a slippery slope...

When we are no longer able to change a situation, we are challenged to change ourselves. ~Viktor Frankl


Posts: 1298 | Registered: Jun 2012
DWBH
♂ Member
Member # 35512
Default  Posted: 8:32 AM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I tried to post this as a new thread in General, but was directed to here... I hope this doesn't get lost in the shuffle of this monstrous thread. Two questions for WS:

1) Did you do things sexually with/for your AP, that you did NOT do with your S? If so, why?

2) Was your AP "in your league", physically? Were they more, less, or about the same, in terms of attractiveness, compared to your S?


ThornyRose & I have discussed these topics pertaining to our situation, but I'm wondering if there are common themes here. Here are my interpretations of her answers to these:

1) Yes... because their relationship was all about 'having fun'. They only shared the 'fun' side of each other, everything was rainbows and unicorns... she wanted the OM to know her as the Party Girl, willing to do whatever... so she did.

2) She never found the OM attractive in the 10+ years before, until they got emotionally involved, and then somehow her perception shifted, and she started finding him attractive. They even talked about it, and he made comments about being less attractive than me. He also offended her greatly one time by saying something like "I better get what I can from you, before you move on to a younger, better looking guy". But, basically, the A did not happen for sex or the PA, but primarily it was a very deep emotional bond they built. One built on fantasy, but at the time, real.

Thanks for any feedback, really interested in others responses.


Me: BH, 43
Her: FWW, 41 (ThornyRose)
M: 16 years, together 19
2 Daughters: 14 and 12
D Day: 9/25/2011; Lies & TT to 5/4/2012
~Double betrayal; caught them in the act~

Posts: 729 | Registered: May 2012 | From: WI
heartbroken0903
♀ Member
Member # 27879
Default  Posted: 11:22 AM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1) Did you do things sexually with/for your AP, that you did NOT do with your S? If so, why?

No. Anything I did with the AP I had also done with my XH.

2) Was your AP "in your league", physically?

I'd say so.

Were they more, less, or about the same, in terms of attractiveness, compared to your S?

My XH and the AP are about as different, physically/looks-wise, as two men can be. Hair color, eye color, bone structure, body type/build...totally different. Completely objectively speaking, if both men were put side-by-side and a poll was taken, AP would probably be considered "better-looking" because his type of looks are more on the "conventionally attractive" side. But I would say---again, as objectively speaking as I can---that despite their differences they are about equal in attractiveness.

Subjectively speaking, from my biased viewpoint , I think my XH is more attractive. I won't say he's the handsomest man I've ever seen---Harrison Ford from the 80s/early 90s holds that honor ---but he is so very attractive to me.

I do think there is a lot to the thought that "beauty is in the eye of the beholder," and that the closer you are to someone emotionally, the more physically attractive that person becomes to you. It has happened to me over the years. I have dated some objectively UNattractive men, but when I was involved with them and mentally/emotionally attracted to them, their physical attractiveness "rose" in my eyes to match that view.

Hope that helps.


Me: WS, 30s
XH: BS, 40s
No kids

Married 2.5 years
D-day 3/6/10
Divorced 5/14/10

Reconciling after divorce


Posts: 1916 | Registered: Mar 2010 | From: the cat's meow
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 12:20 PM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

1) Did you do things sexually with/for your AP, that you did NOT do with your S? If so, why?

Sorta, kinda, in a way. (Internet affair) But yes, I did things "for" the AP that I hadn't previously done for BH. Why? Currency. To keep AP happy so that he would continue to pamper and praise me. It's a shallow and pathetic reason, but true none the less.

2) Was your AP "in your league", physically?

Yes.

Were they more, less, or about the same, in terms of attractiveness, compared to your S?

They were physically different. No similarities. In terms of attractiveness, they were about the same.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne

"You can do it!" - R. Schneider


Posts: 5456 | Registered: Nov 2011
NowWhat106
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Member # 35497
Default  Posted: 1:10 PM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BS here with a question that I hope will make sense.

We all struggle constantly with the Why did you do this? question. All of the answers seem to come back to things that really could be said of a lot of people. We're all selfish sometimes although, of course, there are degrees of selfish behavior, but selfishness exists in all of us. Most of us have FOO issues--I certainly do. Most of us like to hear others tell us we're great, etc. I think that probably the potential to be tempted to enter a relationship with another person who finds us appealing is always there. All marriages/relationships go through difficult or down times, someone gets sick, children require extra attention, a problem arises at work, etc. Everyone goes through times when they are simply NOT going to be the center of the universe for everyone around them.

So here's my question: Why didn't you NOT do it?

Did you consider yourself a person with integrity? Did you consider yourself committed to your spouse, your family? Did you think that you were a loyal and honorable person in general? Were you religious?

In short, where were all the checks and balances in your mind that might have stopped you when you decided to have an affair? Did you struggle with yourself? Did your integrity or commitment to your family ever come into your mind?

What happened in your head to all of those things when you decided to have an A?

Please understand that I'm not indicting anyone. This has just become as big a question to me as the Why did you DO it? question. For me, the Why didn't you NOT do it? question may be even more important. Anyone can have a moment of temptation, but if there aren't any balancing factors, then it begins to seem like the A was inevitable because there was nothing inside to stop it.

If anyone has insight into what happened to their internal values when they decided to have an A, I'd be most appreciative for your perspective.

Thanks for participating in this thread! It's so helpful that you're willing to share your thoughts.


Me BS
Him WS
LTEA with old HS GF from 25+ years ago
DD #1: 10/6/2011
DD #2: 10/21/2011
2DS under18
Status: We'll see.

Posts: 262 | Registered: May 2012
stilllovinghim
♀ Member
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 11:11 PM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Broken-
It does make sense. In all honesty, it sounds like your WS IS being honest with you. I know you don't want to play Columbo with him but do what makes you feel safe. Are you guys in counseling?


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1933 | Registered: Oct 2010
stilllovinghim
♀ Member
Member # 29971
Default  Posted: 11:21 PM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

NowWhat-
You are right in that we all experience stress and bad days most of us have FOO etc. However, not all of us cope the same way. 2 kids could come from the same abusive, broken home and one could end up an addict and the other a senator.
Same thing if those same 2 kids grew up in a loving home. It's the choices you make, taking responsibility for your actions, being authentic and how you cope.

I've tried to find the link that makes WS's who they are and, I never was able to discover something solid. Plenty of BS's went through a lot of crap in their lives and they chose not to cheat. Some WS's may have an unknown or unaddressed mental issues (not an excuse for the A)along with whatever else is going on. I gave up. I felt like I did everything and gave everything and was ran over and taken advantage of (I'm not speaking solely on how I felt my H treated me but everyone else in my life as well.) etc, etc and I simply gave up. Still doesn't excuse what I did, but that's where I "snapped".

I had had people in the past try to make a pass at me and I stood firmly on my beliefs against A's and thought about my H. However, I just ended up breaking. The cracks in the wall were there for a long, long time, I just dismissed them or ignored them until the dam broke. Hope that made some sense?

[This message edited by stilllovinghim at 11:24 PM, June 27th (Wednesday)]


“You have a choice. Live or die.Every breath is a choice. Every minute is a choice. Every time you don't throw yourself down the stairs, that's a choice. Every time you don't crash your car, you re-enlist.”
― Chuck Palahniuk, Survivor

Posts: 1933 | Registered: Oct 2010
Want To Wake Up
♀ Member
Member # 31583
Default  Posted: 11:49 PM, June 27th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks SLH

Finding his "WHY" is crucial to R and to his soul. It's great to admit he was selfish. But he needs to know WHY. What made it ok to betray himself and you?

I feel he needs to look deeper too but he's satisfied with "I was selfish" as his "why" (which leaves me feeling like saying... "thank you, Captain Obvious!")


WH refuses point blank to go to IC (thinks it's a load of poppycock) so I guess that leaves me... nowhere in terms of understanding.


Me 50+
WH 50+ (SlowUptake)
DDay '09
"He didn't cheat because I wasn't enough, he cheated because HE wasn't enough"

"Unhappy marriages don't cause infidelity. Being unfaithful causes infidelity."


Posts: 455 | Registered: Mar 2011
wolf_heart
♀ Member
Member # 35262
Default  Posted: 5:55 AM, June 28th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have another question for you all. Thank you so much for all the responses to my last set of questions!

If you had a delay in answering your spouses questions regarding the A why?

My WH has me ask my questions via e-mails so he can think about his answers and try to be as truthful as possible. He is a busy man and I understand that. However, when he had several hours of on-line time and didn't answer my questions several times it gets me to thinking. I don't know if it is he is still thinking and trying to remember or if he is still hiding stuff. I get the feeling this time he is hiding something and avoiding answering my questions. Either that or I am so hyper sensitive person now who gets impatient after a few days.
Thank you ahead of time for answering. It is nice to know you all scan the messages looking for our questions and answer them. It helps hearing the different perspectives too!


Married 26 years
BW: Me, 47
WH: 47
DDay#2: March 8th, 2012, with one of my good friends.
DDay#1: Oct. 20th 1992, 2 years post PA
Attempting R
Without honesty, loyalty, and commitment; saying you love someone, simply means nothing.

Posts: 227 | Registered: Apr 2012 | From: Southwestern Area of USA
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