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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 6
Aubrie
♀ Member
Member # 33886
Default  Posted: 11:36 PM, January 22nd (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Confusedbeyond,

While I can't answer for every WS, I will say for me, its almost impossible to remember every single detail. I had an online EA/not yet PA. It lasted exactly a month. But it was all day every day. A minimum of 8 hours a day. On Dday, BH had me delete the email account associated with OM. All emails, links, photos, and hundreds of chat logs were gone. Later BH asked questions that I honestly could not answer. The whole month was and still is jumbled up. I cannot give exact days when things started. All I can say is, around week 3 I sent him pics. By the end of week 3 we webcammed. Just general time frames.

For my BH exact dates, times didn't matter. The point was, I chatted, emailed, webcammed, and sent pics to another man.


Me - FWW * Him - QuietStand

"Courage is being scared to death and saddling up anyway." - J. Wayne

"You can do it!" - R. Schneider


Posts: 5484 | Registered: Nov 2011
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:53 AM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Would you have stopped cheating if you never got caught?
I didn't get caught. And may confession came out first as an "I'm not happy and want a D" discussion first. A few months later, I finally confessed and all the pieces came together for my BW.

Is he still carrying on with the A? Is he NC? If you have all the evidence, and think that he is done with the OW, but is just being stubborn or is just scared to admit the truth to you and to himself, then maybe it is time to lay it all out there for him to see. At the same time, you will have your answer.

Right now you are saying "I know more than you think I do. All the bullshit you've been doing, it all has to end now." What would happen if you drew your line in the sand? Have you told him that his choice will determine whether you go or stay?

When you two talk, how does he handle the conversation? Does he get angry? or exasperated/defensive? Have you printed off the articles in the Healing Library and asked him to read them?

He may just be at that point where he thinks he is "protecting" you when really he is just trying to save his own ass. That doesn't work out so well for the WS in the long run, so it is only a matter of time.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6060 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 10:33 AM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ImGonnaMakeIt -

Would you have stopped cheating if you never got caught?

Yes.

Basically, what I've said is "I know more than you think I do. All the bullshit you've been doing, it all has to end now."

Or what? Don't make ultimatums that you will not follow through.


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 10:48 AM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Stillwaiting, you need to protect your children. It honestly doesn't matter what your WW is thinking or feeling. You're focused almost completely on her and if she's maybe waking up and seeming to ignore your son's slow spiral.

If he's not, please get him into counseling. He shouldn't have to be begging his mom to come home and see what she's doing.

He needs security and reassurance you all will be ok without her and you will.

I would draw clear boundaries with her and enforce them. Do you have a visitation schedule? If so stick to it. She shouldn't be popping in and out at her whim. That will keep the kids off balance and is not ok.

She made her choice. She needs to accept that choice. You needs to be active and protective of both you and your children.

Are you in touch with the school and working with your son? If so give her the information of his status and let it go. Just kids and finances.

She's left. Fog, no fog, she needs to not be your focus. You and your children.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
DixieD
♀ Member
Member # 33457
Default  Posted: 11:26 AM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

May be a crazy question --

What did the emotional part of your affair feel like? Feel like you were 'in love'?

I wrote in another area I'm not sure if I had an EA with a 'friend'. IC says inappropriate -- yes. EA -- probably not.

We were --
Reconnected old friends. Too much flirting goin on for damn sure. His side mainly. I didn't shut it down -- I minimized it.

He was interested in more than friendship at times. Romantic fantasy. I thought of him sexually and thought -- nah, Dixie, that's crazy. Good thing -- distance was on my side too. Glad I dodged that bullet.

Didn't think I was in 'luv'. Didn't feel I was in 'luv'. Loved him as a close life-long friend. Told him so.

Shock me up when he questioned where we were headed. Blast of cold water I needed.

Most of the friendship wasn't secret to Mr.DixieD. I'm pretty much an open book. The friendship that was too close for comfort though.

If NC would have been asked for I would of fought it. Would have held tight because of our history. We were just friends after all.

Since learning about EA's I've told my 'friend' to be friends now means new rules. It's a whole new ball game out there. His response -- he thinks we were lovers in a past life. Deeply connected. WHAT? Hell no. I never thought that.

That's why I didn't think I had an EA. Denial? If it's an EA w/o feeling love. I've had a few. Time invested in others instead of my spouse.

OTOH -- Mr.DixieD had a full-out affair. Daily contact. Lottsa sex. He was infatuated -- may be in 'luv' for a bit. When it was said he said it back. Wondered about chucking his life and starting over.

I can separate sex and love. Mr. DD -- not as much.

He tried on the new life and it didn't fit too well. Got out of it on his own. No withdrawal. May be cuz he chose to end it.

How was I the one with more emotional connection to my friend w/o sex and w/o feeling 'luv' and not thinking I was in an affair. while Mr. DD knew he was in one with all the fixins and gave not a **** about his AP after dday?

Seems everyone says if there is a emotional connection there is withdrawal. There wasn't. If you don't have that did you still have an EA or addiction? Or when you know you are done, you are done?


Growing forward

Posts: 1458 | Registered: Sep 2011
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 11:51 AM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dixie,

I think EA's can be one-sided, or at least lean toward one person or the other.

Since you are questioning it, I would say stop splitting hairs and just treat it as an EA. I would also suggest you do a lot of introspection about what was really going on with your emotions. I read what you wrote, and I think you are not delving deep enough. I think you are making light of it, regardless of what your H knew or didn't know. What is it inside of you that is making you question your own behaviors?

I had an EA, with only one text convo that remotely resembled a sexual interest, and that was all initiated by MOW. It didn't matter to me. The high of the EA was what kept me going.

I know you didn't intend it, but you are making a distinction between EA and PA. There isn't one when it comes to the damage and fallout.

You either had an EA or you were at the very least on a slippery slope that you maneuvered well on. Maybe you just didn't trip at the edge like a lot of us. Maybe it would have been different if you found yourself alone and drinking with this guy. He obviously wanted you. That is very flattering and intoxicating. Would it have been enough over time? Would you have begun flirting more?

IDK. Your call.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6060 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
DixieD
♀ Member
Member # 33457
Default  Posted: 12:59 PM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Baxter.

I bet I've minimized what happened. What was said. I don't know any more. My emotions have been wrapped up in other things IYKWIM. I never heard of EA till this year.

A BS and possibly a WS too -- it's a lot to take in. The thought of having to question it makes me feel sick.

I'm getting more introspective. Never been in-touch with my feelings before. No solid feelings meant no EA. I have work to do. Starting with boundaries where there have been none.

I know you didn't intend it, but you are making a distinction between EA and PA. There isn't one when it comes to the damage and fallout.

Mr.DixieD says if it was a EA -- he's not convinced it was -- it was like stubbing my toe when he chopped off his arm. I put on brakes -- he didn't reach for his.

He doesn't want me to have guilt on top of everything else. Says he has no right to say anything after what he did.

Remorseful WS think that after dday. All rights are gone. I disagree.

The EA part was most devastating about his affair.

In the end he had no withdrawal and little emotional connection to AP. He says I had more connection because we had a core friendship that was not completely based on lies and fantasy. May be. Doesn't make sense to me to think I had more connection when I didn't think I was in love.

About withdrawal -- Is it wrapped up with rejection? If a WS ends some thing are they less likely to feel withdrawal than those who were forced to end it (caught) or who had an AP end it?


Growing forward

Posts: 1458 | Registered: Sep 2011
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 1:11 PM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Dixie,

My BW believes that a WS is going to have the type of A that will be most hurtful to their BS. In my case, my BW knows that I said ILY to MOW. That just about kills her. You H can believe what he wants. I appreciate that you believe a WS hasn't lost all their rights. So maybe this is something you do for yourself, to heal yourself from both your H's A, and your own pushing of boundaries.

As far as I'm aware, the withdrawal is a real thing. There are things happening in our brains and bodies which can make an A very much like a drug addiction. So, the person who ends contact is possibly someone who wasn't as vested in the A. The one who is left is experiencing "cold turkey" withdrawal, which is probably the best, but it is painful.

Does your H know that the guy you were talking to wanted you sexually? Does he know this guy asked you where things were headed?


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6060 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
DixieD
♀ Member
Member # 33457
Default  Posted: 1:54 PM, January 23rd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Does your H know that the guy you were talking to wanted you sexually?

At the time he called him my 'boyfriend' and questioned if I was infatuated with him. I said -- don't be silly, he is just a friend. I KNOW! -- sounds terrible. I really believed it.

Honestly -- I was overly interested in him. Non-sexual so not to say infatuated.

I get obsessions of the week. People and their problems. Topics. Hobbies. Then it ends and I'm onto some thing else. Mr.DD knows this about me and thought this was like that. He trusted me. Still does.

Yup -- work to do!

He didn't know to what extent the guy wanted me sexually -- in another life time -- without risk to our friendship. Friendship was more important.

Yeah -- the guy was flattering. I told him he was crazy. I'm no catch. We would not be compatible that way.

Mr.DD says now if he'd known exactly what the guy said he would have been upset about it.

Does he know this guy asked you where things were headed?

I told him as soon as it happened. Ran to him and said -- he misunderstood my intentions.

He didn't seem to care.

My theory -- he checked out by then. Was hurt by this 'friendship'. Wouldn't express it to me. Another reason to detach further. .

Reading your profile was helpful Baxter.

[This message edited by DixieDevastated at 4:12 PM, January 23rd (Monday)]


Growing forward

Posts: 1458 | Registered: Sep 2011
Betrayed333
♀ Member
Member # 33660
Default  Posted: 12:22 PM, January 24th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm not sure if this is where I'm supposed to be posting this, so apologies in advance if I shouldn't be writing here. I was just wondering a few things. My WS seems like he doesn't want to do anything to fix this.He has posted twice on here, and that's all. He also told me that he thinks counselling won't help. He wants to just talk at home. And I know it's because he doesn't want someone to tell him he's wrong or broken.He won't talk to his family or friends and anytime I try and talk to him it turns into a huge fight with him telling me I'm pretty much not allowed to be angry at him. Does he really want to work things out?? Or am I just praying for something thats not gonna happen

Posts: 82 | Registered: Oct 2011
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 2:44 PM, January 24th (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Betrayed333,

You've been together approx. 2 years, and plan to marry in 2013... You have a 9 mth old child together and your boyfriend works away from home for weeks at a time...

And now you've learned that he has cheated on you.

You have a great window into your future....
Is this the future you want?

My guess is, as long as he has a job that takes him away from home, he will get lonely again and again. I would also suspect that he still has some contact with the OW in the other city and possibly others too...

Again, you have a window into your future here as you're not even married yet...

I'm sorry B333 but IMO you really deserve better than this.


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:47 AM, January 25th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Betrayed333,

No, he doesn't want to work things out, he wants you to forget all about it so he can go on living without consequences.

If he doesn't want to talk to anyone, fine. His choice. However, I don't think he has any choice regarding your anger. If he can't face it, that is his problem, not yours.

Him getting angry at you is his defense mechanism. If he gets angry, then that means you're wrong and the conversation ends. It works for him. He uses his trump card (anger) to shut you down. It's a fairly common tactic, not always just a WS thing, but common enough.

As Card points out, you need to think about where you are in life and where you want to be. You need to consider whether or not your BS has the ability to do the work to make your future M safe and to make you feel safe being with him.

The problem is, you can't make him want to change. He has to reach that point within himself where he is willing to let his guard down. Many WS never get there, or they get there too late and they have lost their chance to R.

Right now, he isn't getting it. So it's time for you to take the reigns of your own life and do what you need to do.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6060 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
uncertainone
♀ Member
Member # 28108
Default  Posted: 11:10 AM, January 25th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I never heard of EA till this year

I had never heard of it until SI. Dixie, I think it's really good you're looking at this.


Me: 37

'til the roof comes off. 'til the lights go out. 'til my legs give out, can't shut my mouth


Posts: 6795 | Registered: Mar 2010
Betrayed333
♀ Member
Member # 33660
Default  Posted: 9:40 PM, January 25th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I think he wants to change and fix this and work things out and that is also what he says, but I have this doubt in my mind. Last night we argued. He said to me, I hate that you're acting like I'm a monster for what I did. And I said yes I do feel that way. What you did was a pretty monstrous thing to do. Then I said I was concerned with him going away for work because he travels quite frequently. I said it will be easier this time around because everyone he works with knows he told me what hapened, so I feel they might just keep it a better secret next time. Then he said well why do you think there will be a next time....why would you think I would do that to you again?? And I said well I didn't think you would do it to begin with so now everything you say is taken with a grain of salt adn I have a hard time believing any of it. I'm scared. I know we can't get back what we had, but I want to get back to loving eachother and being happy. This sucks so bad.

Posts: 82 | Registered: Oct 2011
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:57 PM, January 25th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

If he wanted to work things out, he would stop saying things like this - I hate that you're acting like I'm a monster for what I did.

But, he didn't just stop there, he goes on to say - well why do you think there will be a next time....why would you think I would do that to you again??

I'm scared.
That is because he isn't doing what you need him to do to make you feel safe.

There are certain things that make the difference between a WS wanting to work things out and a WS wanting to rugsweep. Right now, your WS is wanting to fix things by rugsweeping.

Your best bet is to talk with the other BS's here on SI about how to respond when your WS says these things. The WS's here can generally smell the bullshit, but the BS's will help you to walk around it.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6060 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
Betrayed333
♀ Member
Member # 33660
Default  Posted: 7:21 AM, January 26th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I really did think he was ready to start R and everything as he has read a lot on here. But when I tell him he needs to talk to someone because tehre is a lot of stuff hes not telling anyone(because he wont talk to anyone) he says well why cant wwe just talk to eachother?? And two nights ago he said we need to be talking every night. And again that was two night ago and has he talked to me yet?? No....he didnt even talk to me the night he said we would start talking more. He just went 0on to say I need to stop acting like he's a monster.

Posts: 82 | Registered: Oct 2011
suckstobeme
♀ Member
Member # 30853
Default  Posted: 12:33 PM, January 26th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It struck me today that when exWH moved out (I didn't know about OW yet) that he took absolutely nothing to remind him of his married life. I offered a few pieces of furniture and he actually seemed pissy about that when he refused. There are no photos or sentimental reminders. I had to virtually force him to take what is a very unique and special gift that I got him for a big birthday several years ago.

I'm wondering - is this more evidence of his mindset in that he wants to erase me because it's too hard to face what he did. Or, does he really just despise me that much even though I had no clue that we were even in trouble?


BW - me
ExWH - "that one"
D - 2011
You get what you put in, and people get what they deserve.
Hard as it may be, try to never give the OP any of your power or head space.

Posts: 2508 | Registered: Jan 2011
gonogo1
♀ Member
Member # 25518
Default  Posted: 8:22 PM, January 26th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

STBXH says he wants to R , he has not made one single pass even when we were on our 1st R and we were naked in bed .I asked him about this and all I got back was "I'm delicate". I asked him what that meant and he just stared at me without a reply "dah" .Over xmass he had ample opportunity to try to have sex with me and he never did . Why would a WS ask to come home and not even try for sex ??? Anyway I told him I was as frustrated as hell and still no go. Sound like wanting to R to you men out there ???? Does not make sense to me.


Posts: 1608 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: East Coast
disgust
♀ Member
Member # 34200
Default  Posted: 8:25 AM, January 27th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Betrayed333 - Don't get married. He has issues he's not willing to address. I doubt the A is over and if it is it will happen again.

My WS had two affairs 11 years ago that I found about it. We swept the dirt under the rug and from then to now there were 4 more. The last one being a 3 year affair.

The only reason we are still together and attempting reconciliation is because he is doing the hard work now. IC, MC, SI and everything else required.

You deserve better.


Posts: 344 | Registered: Dec 2011
HoldingTogether
♂ Member
Member # 29429
Default  Posted: 9:08 AM, January 27th (Friday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

This might seem more like it belongs in the double betrayal thread, but I feel like I need WS input on this issue:

FWW's OM, his BW, his kids, the whole family were all good friends of our family. Holidays spent together, birthdays, vacations, you get the picture. And, while I am able to get my head around the idea of a WS compartmentalizing the affair, I struggle with understanding or believing it in a case like ours. I can certainly see how a person can live a double life and somehow keep the two separate in their heads. I can get how that could work. What I have trouble understanding is how FWW could keep shoving OM and I together. She literally went out of her way to arrange times when we would all be together. I realize know that what she really wanted was an excuse to be around him, I don't like it but I get that.

What I can't get is how she could live with the guilt she should have been feeling during all those times we were all together. How can someone compartmentalize a double life when those lives are constantly colliding? I simply cannot fathom how she was able to just blissfully continue without being entirely eaten up and destroyed with guilt..

The only thing that makes any sense is that she was so angry or disdainful of me that she really didn't give a shit about or even consider the effect all of this would have on me. She says that I paint her as some mustache twirling villain and she insists that that simply wasn't the case. But still, when I ask her to try and tell me how else I SHOULD be looking at it, she is unable to give me an answer I find acceptable.

So any helpful WS's out there willing to take a crack at that? How does someone compartmentalize two realities when both those realities keep overlapping and intersecting? How could a WS continually spend time together, over and over again with the AP and the BS at the same time, and not be consumed by the contradictions and guilt?

I am trying hard not to look at my FWW as a mustache twirling villain, really I am. But I am having a hard time understanding. And yes I know I am trying to make sence of a senseless act, an yes I know I should stop trying. But humor me this one time Ok?

HT

[This message edited by HoldingTogether at 9:15 AM, January 27th (Friday)]


Me:BH 41
Her:FWW40(Walkinoneggshellz)
2 Beautiful little girls 13&10
Dday: 7/24/10 1yr EA turned 5 monthPA
"I gotta hole in me now... I got a scar I can talk about."

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