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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: BS Questions for WS's - Part 6
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 11:17 AM, December 30th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

teammom,

When you are dealing with a wayward, your gut should ALWAYS be trusted.

From what little you've described, he's in an active affair or he would have no problem ditchin' the OW.

Do you know who this OW is??
Is she married??
Does your H work with her??

It's important to find that out and then fight for your marriage with that information in hand.

The book, Surviving An Affair, lays out a plan for helping the affair to come to an end. It's a great plan if you'll follow it.


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
Marmalade
♀ New Member
Member # 34315
Default  Posted: 5:56 AM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a question for those who are married. It may seem an odd question. I've never seen a good example of marriage. Growing up my FOO was full of my dad cheating, mom staying etc. Then I saw divorces in extended family etc.

What I think i'm saying is, marriage to me is something to be avoided, it's like a prison. It hurts. People in marriage cheat and lie ... therefore I chose never to marry and became an AP.

I'm not justifying, I'm trying to reflect on what values I may have held that alowed me to be an OW.

So my quesion is (after much rambling):

What are the good things about marriage? Why is it worth fighting for?


Posts: 9 | Registered: Dec 2011
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 12:20 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a question for those who are married. It may seem an odd question. I've never seen a good example of marriage. Growing up my FOO was full of my dad cheating, mom staying etc. Then I saw divorces in extended family etc.
What I think i'm saying is, marriage to me is something to be avoided, it's like a prison. It hurts. People in marriage cheat and lie ... therefore I chose never to marry and became an AP.

I'm not justifying, I'm trying to reflect on what values I may have held that alowed me to be an OW.

So my quesion is (after much rambling):

What are the good things about marriage? Why is it worth fighting for?

Marmalade, this is not a forum for you, this is a forum for Betrayed Spouses to ask questions only. I would suggest you copy your post and move it to the "general" forum.


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
Marmalade
♀ New Member
Member # 34315
Default  Posted: 1:46 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Card, I have checked with the SI Staff before posting here and I was told I was allowed to post.

But if you want me to leave I will.

Happy New Year


Posts: 9 | Registered: Dec 2011
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 2:08 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

stillwaiting1963,

There are many things going on during an A. For the WS, an A can be a pretty incredible experience. It can feel absolutely right at the time, even though there is an understanding that cheating on your spouse is the wrong thing to do. So there is a constant push/pull battle going on inside the mind and heart of the WS. Since nobody wants to be convinced that what they are doing is the wrong thing, the WS will do whatever they can to convince themselves and others that what they are doing is the right thing for them, and also that it is somebody else's fault that they are cheating.

In your case, your BIL's support you, not her. Of course she is going to be pissed. She has failed to convince those she is closest to that she is the victim. That means that she has to face the reality that she made this situation. But in order for her to take responsibility, she has to admit that she is wrong. That is a difficult thing for many people to do, especially for a WS.

Also, her kids are refusing to accept her version of things. Your WW is standing all alone, possibly for the first time in her life. She is likely scared out of her mind. And her reaction, her coping skill, is to show anger. Anger is a defense against fear. So as long as she gets angry, she won't have to face her fears. As long as she gets angry, she won't stop the A.

I generally don't get angry, but my BW just pissed me off for the longest time when I was in my EA because she couldn't see my "logic" that this was the right path for me and that we would all be happier if she would just D me. Everytime I thought had the upper hand, the trump card, she would point out the flaws to my logic and I knew she was right. Man that pissed me off...but she was right. She was always right.

Stay the course with your 180. Be there for your kids. If your WW shows some signs of pulling her head out of her ass, be prepared to help her out, if that is the direction you want things to go.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 2:30 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hopin2Heal,

I agree with Card, that you might try Joseph's Letter. You may have to read it to him, or memorize it and recite it to him, keeping eye contact, boring into his soul. But, as leftoolate said, you can't force this. Or, put another way, he won't do anything if he isn't ready to face what he has done.

he says the best way to get past it is to never think about it again.
He says he doesn't need to read about affairs because he understands he takes things too far and won't anymore
So how is that workin' out for him?

The above quotes are utter bullshit. Your WH doesn't know what YOU need him to do, and his refusal to understand what YOU need is just a continued way for him to show you how much he disrespects you.

Oh, and there is no statute of limitations on his A's. Just read around for a while and you will see that many BS's here didn't find out until years after that their spouses cheated on them. It is a very real pain, and doesn't go away with time. It goes away once it is addressed in the way that YOU need to address it, not him.

If OW is prego, then he has a legal obligation to deal with OC. I would say that means that you have a say in how that is handled.

Right now you aren't in R.

You need to decide how much of this you are going to take from him. I will tell you now that I put my BW through 2 years of limbo, which is what you are in right now. She would not go through that experience again, so you might take a page from her book and put your foot down now. Decide to take care of yourself. Your WH can either keep up with you, or he can be left behind. Right now, it is about what YOU need. His thoughts and ideas have not worked in the past, there is no reason for you to believe they will work now. Now is the time to try your approach.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 2:48 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

teammom,

Have you let him know that his silence leads you to develop your own answers?

Another thing you can point out is that if he is just friends with her, then everything said between them should be able to be said in front of you. If he is saying things to her that he wouldn't say were you standing there with them, then whatever they are saying is inappropriate and she is not a friend of the marriage. Privacy is okay in a M, but not secrets. For instance, it's okay to wipe your butt in private, but it isn't a secret that you have to wipe your butt when you are through in the bathroom.

Right now your WH is fence-sitting. You might also have heard it referred to as cake-eating. So, it's time to push him off the fence or to close the bakery. He needs to realize that you aren't going to play his games anymore. So it comes down to you taking the steps you need in order to take care of yourself. This is where the BS's can help you out.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 3:47 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

25YearsLater,

I am wondering if any WS have taken so long to "figure" things out and for R to actually work?
It took me about two years to come around and stop trying to contact MOW. Then I put my BW through another 6 months of false-R. We have been in real R since May of 2010.

So, yes, it can take a while. I am still figuring things out. Not really worried about letting myself fall into another EA. PA was never an issue.

It really comes down to how long you are willing to wait and if you think your WH is actually going to do the work to help ensure he won't have another A.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
Deeply Scared
♀ Administrator
Member # 2
Red  Posted: 3:57 PM, December 31st (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Marmalade, this is not a forum for you, this is a forum for Betrayed Spouses to ask questions only. I would suggest you copy your post and move it to the "general" forum.


Card...

Please do not instruct any WS/OP to post on General. We've already taken care of the situation.

Furthermore...it's not up to you to delegate where a member should or shouldn't be posting.

[This message edited by Deeply Scared at 3:59 PM, December 31st (Saturday)]


"Don't give up, the beginning is always the hardest." My Mom:)

My tolerance for stupid shit is getting less and less.


Posts: 191867 | Registered: May 2002
RedTulip
♀ New Member
Member # 34361
Default  Posted: 10:07 AM, January 1st (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Are there any waywards out there who gave up their marriage and home to be with their AP only to realise they made a huge mistake ? How long until the realisation took hold?

Posts: 7 | Registered: Jan 2012 | From: UK
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 10:28 AM, January 1st (Sunday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Are there any waywards out there who gave up their marriage and home to be with their AP only to realise they made a huge mistake ? How long until the realisation took hold?

My wife kicked me out on D-Day, and allowed me to came home 30 days later. I Never really ender the affair, just went deeper only to repeat it all again 45 days later. I rented an apartment this time and it lasted for two more months before I awoke to the devestation I had been creating all along. I pray all waywards have the same eye opening I had, and fortunate enough to have a spouse still willing to try.

I nearly lost everything that mattered to me. My kids, our home, and my loving wife.


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
UnexpectedSong
♀ Member
Member # 21761
Default  Posted: 10:05 AM, January 2nd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Marmalade -

marriage to me is something to be avoided

Hi Marmalade! Instead of glorifying marriage to you, because you already know the answers, I'm going to ask for sone information instead.

Do you date single men? Or do you consistently seek out married men? What are your relationships like? Are they one-night stands?


WW(SA)
"Feedback is the breakfast of champions." - Boris Becker

Posts: 6046 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: California
gromit2011
♀ Member
Member # 33650
Default  Posted: 3:32 PM, January 2nd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a question for any WS. My H had a 6 week PA. He refers to the girl as a 'side salad' and she meant nothing to him but sex. He says he didn't want a relationship with her and it ended or 'fizzled out' as soon as they got busted.

However, he noe says he's not sure what he wants anymore and claims that the guilt he feels has overtaken the love he had for me. He said he never meant to end our marriage but that he has 'shut down' his feelings towards me. He is always v emotionally flat when we talk apart from being angry. Can anyone relate to this? I find it so hard to process that his affair means he doesn't love me anymore when she meant nothing.


Together 4 years
Married June 2011
DDay 8 October 2011
6 week PA
WH claims his 'affair' was nothing to do
with being unhappy in our relationship, it
was just the thrill of trying to lead a double life. Oh, but this means he doesn't

Posts: 124 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: UK
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 5:31 PM, January 2nd (Monday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

gromit2011,

Initially my thoughts tell me he is still in some sort of contact or has renewed his A.... Which could explain the emotional flatness you are experiencing.

I also wonder if he still working with this office girl? If he is, then he is triggering daily.

Have either of you considered a marital recovery program? I've personally worked "The Marriage Builders Program" with my wife and highly recommend it.


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
gromit2011
♀ Member
Member # 33650
Default  Posted: 3:03 AM, January 3rd (Tuesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi Card,

The girl got fired once their affair became common office knowledge. Well, she failed her 3 month probation which I'm told by a mutual friend who works at the same place never happens! It had caused a lot of bad feeling towards my H as most of his co-workers had come to our wedding and spent a fortune on the gift. I understand OW was furious at losing her job and blamed my H.

Since the affair got busted he's moved back in with his parents and spends all his time with them and his sister. He could still be in contact via text.

He speaks with very little respect for her. I don't know, maybe it was something more than a PA. He certainly acted like her boyfriend for 2 months. Took her on a weekend away and brought her $160 shoes for her birthday.


Together 4 years
Married June 2011
DDay 8 October 2011
6 week PA
WH claims his 'affair' was nothing to do
with being unhappy in our relationship, it
was just the thrill of trying to lead a double life. Oh, but this means he doesn't

Posts: 124 | Registered: Oct 2011 | From: UK
RS2731
♀ Member
Member # 33947
Default  Posted: 3:29 PM, January 4th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have a question that I'm hoping someone can help me with. My WH and I are almost 4 months from DDay. I find myself obsessing over things that I don't know. I want to read all of the text messages they sent back and forth and I want him to tell me every single detail of every single time they were together.

Now, I understand rationally that this is not helpful, especially as we are attempting R. I'm having a hard time getting that message through to the irrational side of me (which lately seems to be most of me).

My WH is extremely remorseful and has told me that he'll tell me anything that I want, but he's worried that details will just set back our recovery. He has answered what I've asked so far and, to be honest, the answers haven't made me feel any better.

So, anybody have any insights? Is it better to have ALL the details? Did your BS' benefit from knowing more or less?

I know this is sort of rambling, and I apologize for that. Sometimes it's hard to make sense of the thoughts in my head.


Me - BS, 36
Him - WH, 36
Married - 11 years
DS - 4
D-Day - September 2011
In process of R.

You are braver than you believe, stronger than you seem and smarter than you think.


Posts: 2213 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: CT
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 3:47 PM, January 4th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

RS2731,

The real question you need to ask yourself is; Can you recover without knowing the details of what he did with another woman? IMVHO, The answers will NOT make you feel better in any way, but they may allow you to have the necessary puzzle pieces of your marital history, that otherwise would drive you crazy to not know.

I would suggest at this point in recovery that you write your questions down and schedule a time, maybe one hour on Wednesday evening, to ask the questions that still seem relevant. My wife and I did something similar to what I'm suggesting. We agreed to a question and answer period that allowed both of us to feel safe. This time also needs to be followed up by doing something together, eating ice cream sundays, cuddling on the couch, etc.... Remember to thank him for his honesty and willingness to help you and then let the Affair questions wait until your next scheduled time. This allowed me to stop walking on egg shells all the time.... Which in turn helped me focus on caring for her in ways she liked.

I will admit there were times she blurted out a question aside from our scheduled time,, but I knew this must be very important for her to hear now, or she would have waited.....


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
RS2731
♀ Member
Member # 33947
Default  Posted: 3:57 PM, January 4th (Wednesday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Card -

Thank you so much for your response. It really helps to have a third party to ask.

I think for me, part of the problem is that I am an anal retentive control freak in my every day life .

So, not knowing all the details for me is more about control. Rationally, I understand and recognize that those details will probably not help me. I'm working on trying to keep the irrational side of me from obsessing over it.

I really like the approach you and your wife took. Thinking I might bring that up in our MC session on Friday.

Thanks again!


Me - BS, 36
Him - WH, 36
Married - 11 years
DS - 4
D-Day - September 2011
In process of R.

You are braver than you believe, stronger than you seem and smarter than you think.


Posts: 2213 | Registered: Nov 2011 | From: CT
nomoreplease
♂ Member
Member # 32755
Default  Posted: 12:05 PM, January 5th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My WW started IC about the same time as starting her A. I believe that she felt a huge amount of guilt and was really trying to fix herself during this time, but she was in the middle of her A. She was lying to the counselor (did tell about A until after d-day), to me, and to herself. Now she looks back at that time and talks about how much she grew during this time and how much better she is now. In her mind this is when she did most of the work to fix herself. I see this as an attempt at rug sweeping and feel she should be doing more, but wanted to get some WS perspectives on this.

Could you or did you do (some of) the work to fix yourself while in the middle of an A? How much healing can actually be done while lying to a counselor?


'one walks away saying "I fought to save God's ideal," and the other must always admit, "I fought to destroy God's ideal!"'

Posts: 343 | Registered: Jul 2011
Card
♂ Member
Member # 23667
Default  Posted: 2:45 PM, January 5th (Thursday), 2012View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

nomoreplease,

I did counseling during my A and lied to my counselor as well.

I did this so I could tell everyone, "look how hard I tried".

I was a complete train wreck! And ya, I thought I was a sparkling Cadillac!

How much healing can actually be done while lying to a counselor?

NONE!

The question is, did your marriage grow during this time? Of course not, how could it! She was a whacked out lying wayward! How she can proclaim she grew during that time is beyond me, unless she means she honed (grew) her lying and conning skills.


I take from your questions, an air of skepticism about her claims. Trust your instincts on this one, she is still really foggy!

[This message edited by Card at 2:47 PM, January 5th (Thursday)]


WH (me)
BS (her)

D-Days April - Oct. 2007 Recovery started Nov. 2007

"Found Myself", I was right there in my shoes all along!
Search for self called off!

Why Repentance Is Necessary? Because Undeserved Mercy Empowers Entitlement/Sin


Posts: 570 | Registered: Apr 2009
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