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User Topic: Long Term Affair - Part 26
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 7:57 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good morning (evening Laura)Tribe, a quick note to say Hi.

Honest, you appear to have turned a corner. I think that is a good thing. His behavior, so absurd, but then so was expecting you to accept and endorse separate families in separate countries.

Laura, the art cloud is great, and I am very happy to have my buddy Dip by my side in it. Thank you.

nofun, so sorry things are not working out for you, but it looks like you have a plan and are taking action.

0115

I'm trying to read your profiles and learn your stories and I notice that for some, your WS "got it" and it looked like things were going good only to take a different direction later on. Is this common/true? I just want see what your roads looked like...where the pitfalls came or didn't.

It took FWW nearly a year to “get it” and decide she wanted the M. For most of the first year after dday I got a lot of hurtful comments (“it is easy to look lovingly at someone who acts loving to you”, “orgasms so loud from oral he joked they could hear me at the (local business) across the street”) during those months, and a lot of TT and omissions about her A’s. To this day she has never really come fully clean, I just accept that I know enough. Four different men with 1+ year A, 2+ year A, ONSs, etc. During this first year we had the typical ups and downs, but it was not a true attempt at R on her behalf until about a year out. After that, things got much better for a while. She owned her crap, started working on her, and I felt like we were making progress. Then, about 4 months or so ago we hit a plateau. I began to feel were stopped making progress, and external stresses began to impact our M. Things are much better now than they were before dday, but by dday things were so bad, this is not saying much. I believe my FWW is doing the best she can, I just no longer think she has the ability to be fully involved in an intimate emotional relationship with me. I am torn, wanting to hope that if I give her more time we will do better, but it has been nearly 2 years at this point.

Me? I have found detachment. Last week, MC asked what it was I was hanging on to in the M, that there must be something. I have thought about it and what I was hanging onto was the M I wanted, but it is gone, was never there. I realized that if FWW and I D, nothing will change. How can we have any sort of relationship or M if D will not change anything? We will still not talk about the painful issues, she will still blame me when she is upset, I will still be responsible for all the bills, we will continue to not have sex and to have separate families, and the relationship will continue to be about her and how she feels and what others and I have done or not done to her. She is leaving tomorrow (our wedding anniversary) for a weeklong visit with her father, so the sense of detachment can only grow and strengthen.

This outcome is not a surprise to me. Last fall I warned that we had potentially difficult times coming, and that we needed to be able to work through them together. Then starting in January, her mother died, older DD’s graduation and ensuing trauma in March, her job loss in May, now her DD’s wedding. We are not/did not work through any of those things. For weeks in MC I have said that I am fine when I am focused on me when she is withdrawn and not talking, but that when I do this I feel the relationship drifting away. Sunday night she told me that the MC session last week had been a lot to process and she was not trying to avoid talking about it, but was not ready to. Last night she said she was ready to talk about last week’s MC session. I told her I was fine and had no need to process anything, but would be happy to listen if she did. She said that she did not know what to say.

I raised ducks years ago, so I should be able to get ducks in a row. She will be gone for a long week, then planning for the wedding after she gets back, then DS starting back to college. There will be plenty to keep us both busy in our own worlds for the next few weeks.

Hi fnf, we cross posted.

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 8:13 AM, July 26th (Tuesday)]


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
jollum
♂ Member
Member # 25152
Default  Posted: 8:37 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Greetings Tribe,

Miracle, I am so sorry for you and your family's loss. Many people have no idea how much someone impacts their life until that person isn't there anymore, and then sadly it's to late to say or do things to let them know how special they are to us. My prayers are with you and your family and the family of this young man.

Tribe, reading what so many of you are going through is sad to say the least but take comfort in knowing we are all there for each other. Laura's cloud is a great illustration of how we are intertwined.

Laura/Dip,
After seeing Dip's picture I am seriously thinking about giving up my man card and my grill....
talk about striking to close to home

[This message edited by jollum at 8:37 AM, July 26th (Tuesday)]


Posts: 269 | Registered: Aug 2009
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 9:44 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

strongish-
It is like a pendulum...I would be like that...swinging back and forth . I tend to be a worrier anyway...and post d-day I became obsessive about thinking about the affair and... trying to decide what to do.
Should I stay or should I go?
I would have these very convincing arguments in my head....and these could go both ways...one minute I'm conviced that I should pack my bags and leave and the next day I'm convinced that reconciling is the best thing possible.

Many BS go through this...even with a very remorseful spouse doing all he or she can to make amends...

I think for me part of it was the disbelief that it had happened..
that my husband was that toxic of a human being...and I didn't realize it
and..
here I am reconciling with him and trusting him again...

another reason that I would freak out is that I had always been a very black and white/right and wrong person...very much the good citizen..and in my mind I had an idea of how I would deal with infidelity.

And reconciling would not be it.

I assumed that if the WS was involved in an affair..especially a LTA then that means that they want out of the marriage so..when the affair is exposed the WS leaves the marriage and hooks up with the affair partner.

Wrong.

I never realized that a WS could be remorseful and plead to stay in the marriage.

I never realized that so many people have affairs just for the thrill of it and that there are no real emotions involved..no real love (sorry Tryin but..Bill Clinton was not in 'luv' with Monica Lewinsky..not for an instant..he was 'in luv' with his private parts and wanted them to be adored).

The affair for so many married people is an escape from reality...a chance to be someone that they are not.

That's why so many of the women (and men) with engage in sexual behaviors during the affair that they would never do in their marriage.

Because in the marriage they would be embarassed if the wanted to indulge in something bizarre...like sniffing panties...LOL...but, they set up these weird 'rules' or begin a different routine in the LTA and thats what they act out in it.

In my husband's case the MOW was a veteran of many affairs so she knew the drill...right off the bat ..she invented all kinds of nicknames for each other...you see..then it's not John and Mary that are having the affair it's Rod (Stewart) and Juicy Jane...

boy..did I go off on a tangent here...LOL

but, my point is that I would agonize over the meaning of the affair and my decision to reconcile because I would obsess over what the affair
'meant'.

And, I've come to the conclusion that in order to reconcile we need to focus on what our lives are like now.
Our spouses had all kinds of toxic thinking going on during the affair years and maybe even before.

But, if d-day becomes a catalyst for change then reconciliation is possible.

Like FNF says...the WS has to make dramatic changes in themselves..they have to figure out how they lost their moral compass and why they behaved in such selfish and destructive ways...and then..they have to change those behaviors and work on those character flaws.

Ending the cheating is not enough.

There has to be ongoing work on themselves.

I was lucky in a way that my husband had the alcoholism to deal with because these are the kinds of things that they work on in the 12 step programs.
So, I do recommend that if your WS could go to a 12 step program for addiction..whether its AA or SA..they would get a lot out of it.

Every meeting discusses topics like selfishness, toxic thinking, character flaws, making amends to other, taking responsibility for your actions, the need to become more spiritual. Basically, they talk about how they can overcome their character flaws to become better people.

One of my friends husband had a LTA and also had some issues with porn. They are R but in the last yr he had a set back...a little glitch..he wandered into a porn flick on TV..etc. and she found out.

She decided to demand that he go to a SA mtg. She had worried about that label before and worried about the kind of people he would encounter at the meeting.
But, this time he went...and you know what? She says its been a God-send. A year later he leads the discussion groups. She said the meeting is filled with lots of people that have had LTAs etc. and he has changed for the better since getting involved in the program.

sorry for the long post....I'm rambling today.

allgood- thinking of you.

miracle-so sorry for all of the losses that your family has had to endure this summer. So sad for the parents ...tragic.

ats- in your post...did you misspeak when you said that you think you would be living the same kind of disconnected life if you D so you may as well stay?
I'm sorry that your summer is not going better-you deserve more.
Your wife's timing stinks too- being away on your anniversary...not the most sensitive thing to do ...all things considered.

I feel like she needs an intervention..someone to sit down and talk turkey with her..



Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:58 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So? LTA Cheaters have character flaws? I'll give you a list to pick from.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 10:12 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

*This message needs a much bigger font... but I'm bolding because ya gotta work with watcha got.*

Oh. My. Head.
That, tryn, is hands down the absolute pinnacle of lists. I love it so much that I am going to make 40,000 copies of it and wallpaper my living room with it!


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 10:13 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ats- in your post...did you misspeak when you said that you think you would be living the same kind of disconnected life if you D so you may as well stay?

njgal, sorry that I was not clear. What I meant to convey is that there is no M now. I would think that if there were any part of a M left getting a D would change something, but for me nothing. So why stay married on paper if there is no M relationship?

My wife can be a really fun, nice person, but I do not want to be with someone who perceives me as selfish, domineering, unloving, a poor parent, and oversexed. If this is who I am, she really deserves better. I do not think this is the case, but this is pretty consistent from her whenever we get into a difficult discussion.

I like FWW, I am not angry much anymore, but they fact she avoids dealing with me and my feelings, does not give me any hope for our future together.


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
broken&lonely
♀ Member
Member # 31503
Default  Posted: 10:28 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello everyone. This is my first post here. I started lurking here about a month or so ago. I've started to post more on the other boards and was hoping to get some advice/support from you all since you seem to be in situations more similar to mine.

Here's my situation....my WH had a 2-3yr A with an old friend. He said he broke it off last summer because he felt so badly about what he was doing, guilt, shame, loved me, etc. To get over the heartache of losing that relationship he followed it up with a 1 yr A with another old friend. There was still some contact with the first one during this time as well. There was also at least one ONS in there too somewhere.

When I found out earlier this year, I threw him out of the house and filed for D. I had suspected for a long time (I'm too ashamed to say how long) but did nothing. He was gone for 2-3 months and then I let him come back and we are attempting to R. In the 3-4 months he's been back (I can't believe how unsure I am about this timeline) I got mostly TT until about 2 months ago and we are now in IC/MC.

I believe his remorse is genuine. I believe he loves me and our daughter. I see him trying to change. He's falling all over himself to make me happy and to make it up to me but I can't make myself accept his efforts.

Here are my issues right now....
- I'm terrified to take a chance on him again. To put myself out there and risk being hurt again. At this point I know it's critical for us to talk to each other but I can't get myself to open up to him. I'm afraid that if he knows true depth of the darkness inside me and the horrible, hateful things I think and feel sometimes, he'll leave.

- I got pregnant and had a baby during his As and have huge, huge, huge resentment for his lack of involvment with her/us during that time, the way he treated me when he wasn't ignoring me, how he watched me struggle and turned his back on me.

- I'm not in love with him anymore. I feel love for him as the father of my child and as someone I have shared a lot of experiences with but I don't love him romantically or passionately anymore. He killed that uncomplicated, limitless, whole hearted love that I had for him and I miss that feeling very much. I'm angry that he stole it from me and that I am so broken from it now that I'll probably never be able to love that way again, with him or anyone else.

- I don't trust him or believe much of what he says to me because of all the lies during and after the As. I have pages and pages of questions I want to ask about the As but I don't feel confident he will answer truthfully or completely so they remain unanswered and nag at me constantly. Because I don't have answers, I imagine horrible things all the time. I didn't know I was even capable of such thoughts. I don't sleep much because it's all I see when I close my eyes. I'm tired and cranky from lack of sleep which makes everything so much worse.

- My daughter has a broken down mother now instead of the whole one she deserves. I feel like I’m failing her every day. I don’t know that I’ll be able to teach her how to trust, to be strong, to be giving and kind and to love with her whole heart. These are things that are learned by example and I did them freely before but I don’t now. I’m scared she’ll grow up with no empathy for other people and be what she sees in me now, fearful and weak, cold and untrusting and with no love in her heart. I'm so, so angry at him for this.

Wow, I've never typed all that out before. I guess anger and fear are my big issues in a nutshell. I do want R to work but I don't know if I can do it. I worry so much about him not sticking it out and quitting on me but I'm really the one on the verge of leaving.

I have a thousand more things I'd like to say but if I keep rambling you may not want me to come back. I'll try to keep up with the board, it moves really fast. Any advice is always welcome, gentle or not, even if it's not what I probably want to hear.


Me - BS (37) - Stronger & Wiser, Cautiously off the fence
Him - WH (38) - Earning his F
Daughter (2) - Light of our lives
Together 12yrs, Married 10, Friends for 20+
D-day 2.5.11
Attempting to find each other again

Posts: 381 | Registered: Mar 2011
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 11:04 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Welcome, b&l. Your issues... I for one share each one of them. The road here is slightly different, but here we all are. Again, welcome. I would suggest IC for you to work through your issues... not for your WH or even for your M, but for you. To make you feel better about you. (((hugs)))

ats,
I'm so sorry about your feelings. I must say that when I saw you posting your feelings, I had an impending doom-ish feeling in my gut. Are you in a low spot at the moment or has it come to the "when you know, you know" place?

Also, I'm glad you like your WW (because of the kiddo) but I don't see anything "nice" or "fun" about any of her actions. And I can see why you're at a low point, or ready to give up. Because honestly (Mrs. ats), what motivation are you giving ats to continue to support you? Your recent actions smack of disloyalty, selfishness and immaturity. Stop it!!! Just fucking stop it already. Pie Jesu.

Okay. I just edited that about a kabillion times to tone it down. Can you imagine what I had in there before?

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Miracle,
Your neighbors are in my thoughts. What a tragedy for all.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

I'm tapped out. BBL


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

Posts: 2370 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Baby steps on my new path
awakenedbytruth
♀ Member
Member # 29435
Default  Posted: 11:10 AM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Broken&lonely - all the feelings you mentioned are normal and valid. The situation you have been placed in is horrible in many ways, of course you have a wide range of feelings! You have to just take one moment at a time and walk through the process. No one gets to shortcut the recovery to this hell. So keep posting....hugs to you, you are in the right place.

Tribe, just reading a bit on my phone to keep caught up so although I have so much to share, I can't yet. Get back home on Friday, tell kids about S on Saturday. The conversation fills my dreams. In addition to that my mother lashed out to me about a writing I did and for the first time I stood up. I told her when she can address me with compassion and unconditional love we can talk again....so yep, taking a break from both of the controlling avoiders in my life at the same time.

In the meantime, I'm vacationing at the happiest place on earth, acting like a happy family....crazy....details later. One step at a time. Heck, I'm at one breath at a time.


“Courage is the power to let go of the familiar.” - Raymond Linquist
Me BS-39
Him WH-41
Married 18yrs 2 Kids 11-9
DDay#1-July 5, 2010 (LTA 2 Years with CoW in corporate office)
Separating - 8/11

Posts: 118 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: West but my heart belongs to the South
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 12:16 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

broken&lonely-
hopefully now that your FWH seems to 'get it' you can begin to try to heal from the damage that a LTA causes.
I know it sounds like a cliche but..it's true..time does heal.
But, only if your FWS is genuinely remorseful and is willing to dig in his heels for the fight of his life.
And..it is a battle.
The WS needs to be patient and transparent and loving and kind...and willing to wait for the BS to recover.
Everything that you are experiencing is normal...
Are you in IC? is he?


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 12:28 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryin-
love your chart! where do you find these? will have to print it out as well.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 12:58 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hello, tribe!

Have been lurking off and on as usual.

The very first thing I must comment on is Tryn's chart. It is PERFECT! Could you please possibly post this chart in General for everyone to see, I think so many could be helped by this, seriously. What a wake up call.

Laura ~ your art work, once again, is outstanding! You are very talented.

miracle ~ your post about your neighbors son has prompted me to post today. I am so very sorry for your loss. It is heartbreaking.

I have been having a tough couple of weeks. Last week I started a thread in General called "His Justification" and the link is http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/print.asp?tid=417664 . This is very much related to how I am feeling about death of children and the infidelity, and my thinking/feeling.

This past weekend was the 5th anniversary of the death of my nephew who was 21 years, 1 month, and 1 day old when he died of an accidental fatal combination of drugs. After his mother was killed when he was 12, I raised this troubled boy. My FWH used this boy as his justification to ramp up the EA to PA.

Then, someone started a thread in JFO called "The death of a child...." and most posters felt that the pain of the infidelity was greater than the death of a child. I am truly baffled by this. Really, I don't even think it should be compared.

The pain from my FWH's infidelity is boundless and real. Now I'm thinking I'm effed up because the pain of losing my nephew (and my sister) is greater than the infidelity. Meaning, if I had a choice between losing my loved ones or my FWH's infidelity, I would choose the infidelity. Am I effed up in my thinking? Am I not feeling the real pain of my FWH's infidelity? Are people who think infidelity is greater pain than loss of a child (some of these people did lose children!!!) effed up in their thinking? I know everyone is entitled to their feelings, but this really has me concerned. I am truly confused, like I am missing something.

Would so appreciate everyone's POV on this.



BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
vulnerable
♀ New Member
Member # 32658
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi sistermilkshake,

I'm a newbie, and young, and I know you don't know me, so maybe I'm not very qualified to give my views, but just wanted to say...

I've never lost a child (never had a child), but I lost my Dad when I was 20 (he was 48), and the pain that I felt then was much much greater than what I'm feeling now. I'm only a month or so out from dday, and maybe I don't know what I'm feeling, but I would agree with you, the pain I feel now is awful and real, but nothing like what it felt to lose my Dad.

I'm sorry for the loss of your nephew.

V

[This message edited by vulnerable at 1:07 PM, July 26th (Tuesday)]


Me: 26 BS
Him: 26 WS
Dday: 21/06/11

Posts: 38 | Registered: Jul 2011 | From: UK
SisterMilkshake
♀ Member
Member # 30024
Default  Posted: 1:16 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm a newbie, and young, and I know you don't know me, so maybe I'm not very qualified to give my views, but just wanted to say...
Hi, v. I appreciate your POV. Pleased to meet you, but sorry it is here at SI.

Yes, you are very young, but I am so blown away by the wisdom so many 20 and 30 somethings have. Self awareness doesn't necessarily come with age, as demonstrated by most WS's, and self awareness can start at a very young age.

I am so very sorry for the loss of your Dad (((vulnerable))).


BW (me) 50ish FWH 50ish
Married 34 years, 3 children
d-day 3/10 LTA (4 yrs./fucking & flirting)

"Oh, why do my actions have consequences?" ~ Homer Simpson
"She knew my one weakness: That I'm weak!" ~ Homer Simpson


Posts: 8975 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: The Great White North USA
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 2:21 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

have not got a lot of time..

broken and lost..

welcome to our little corner of si..if you have not already done so, go to the healing library and read it all...i mean all...

it will give you lots of insight as to why you feel the way you do and what the ws should be doin to help


do not ever feel afraid to ramble here, we have all been guilty of it, it is what this site is here for....so ramble away


as for giving him a chance....maybe a spin on the perspective might help..

instead of viewing it as giving him a chance..how about one of these

1..giving my daughters father every opportunity to stay in her life

2..giving my family every opportunity to remain as so

3..giving my marriage every opportunity that presents itself

following your path of least regret is never an easy road, it is often filled with many obstacles, many difficulties and downright craziness....but at the end, how you can ever regret giving it your all....the opposite is a major regret...the never knowing if it could have been...especially when you will have to face your child someday and she will ask you...why did you daddy give up on each other...??


now this does not mean that you put up with shit forever and/or indefinitely...it means you try and if you cannot do it, you end with peace of mind that you DID try

here on si the standard is 6 months before you make any decisions...here at lta we tend to say you may need longer then that depending on your sich...mostly because the amount of information to process is overwhelming at best...however if you are one of those people that emphatically knows that this is a dealbreaker and there are many who feel that way...then there will be no regrets in that either...but if youhave any doubts which i believe you do, give yourself time...

you will need to process all of it,
grieve for the marriage you thought you had,
grieve for the loss of trust,
process all the anger and then

if your ws is doing it all right...work on reconcilliation...its not reconcilliation until your ws is doin it all....


sistermilkshake...i read your post...

ok, maybe a different spin on this might help...tell him well...you were the one who said you wanted a divorce if i brought him home, that meant you were the one to take that choice you claimed you were making and do it...by not acting upon it meaning doing a divorce, you actions spoke louder then your words...you said one thing and did another...

while i can understand your anger over the sich, choosing to have an a was not my doing but your own...for which you need to accept full responsibility for....

that was then and this is now...what are you doing now to show me that you want the marriage...

actions will always speak louder then any words every spoken....

as for the pain of loss...

i lost my dad 5 years ago or so...this was worse...

i have never lost a child...and i cannot compare, but i cannot fathom that ever being worse...after learning of this second death of someone young i cant help but be grateful for my issues of infidelity over the loss of a child...

to lose your child at 22 years old....my god i cannot fathom that....i dont think there is any greater loss and i pray to god every day that i never find out


thanks all for your prayers for this family....keep praying for them...


vulnerable...you are young, you are also not married that long....for you the loss of your dad would be greater i would think....had you dad been older, maybe ill, if you were married for years and years and had children...who knows....

but it does not matter,...what does matter is that you at least know profound loss and this to you is loss but not as profound...something to think about and hold onto i would think....

only you can determine what you path of least regret is, you are the one who would have to live with whatever consequences your actions bring....

when you choose the behavior, you choose the consequence....and sometimes good behavior begets good consequence...sometimes it does not matter...like for all of us here, the bs's...none of us chose infidelity and all of us have the consequence...we were faithful in our marriages, our choice of spouse....NOT....but we did nothing wrong here..no matter what kind of spouse we were, choosing to cheat as opposed to leaving is just wrong...there is no justification....none

gotta go...

(((tribe)))



i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
jollum
♂ Member
Member # 25152
Default  Posted: 2:34 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

SisterMilkshake,

Please never, ever let anyone tell you your pain isn't valid or that one type of pain is worse than another. No one can know what anyone else feels in the way of loss, or grief. We all know the general pain we share from infidelity but we all handle grieving and loss inside at our own level. I really hate when people try the "my pain is worse than your pain" comparison game. It's an attention getting tool and nothing else. Trust me. If they really are in as much pain as they profess then they would be anything but worried about whose is worse. If you have been through these losses you know that comparisons are a bunch of crap. Someone who has been through great pain is one who helps another through that pain and doesn't try to draw attention to themselves.

This is why I love being on this thread. Each of us here have suffered great pain from any number of things as well as infidelity but the people on this thread aren't worried about themselves. When someone else needs an emotional boost watch how quickly the compassion flows from those here.

Your pain is your pain. I am so sorry for the loss of your nephew. I can never know the many ways he touched your heart or what he meant to you but I know you loved him and that is all that matters.

Blessings,
jollum


Posts: 269 | Registered: Aug 2009
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 3:56 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi all

Little time and haven't had time to read all.

Welcome newbies - stay with us. We will help you. The tribe is so supportive of each other. Lurkers -nice to hear from you.

Dream cloud is made online with a program called "Wordle". Thanks for all the compliments but I am really not artistic. Just a little tech savvy. Play with it sometime it is lots of fun.

Tryn

LOOOOOOOVED the table. Loved it so much I had to do this.

Gotta run. Bosses are away and I am running the show. 600 students and 50 staff - scary stuff

Love to all

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 4:10 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Beautiful Laura.
It's amazing isn't it? But.. many of the characteristics in the first cloud represent my husband during the LTA and luckily for me many of the characteristics in the second cloud represent my 'new' husband.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 4:18 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sistermilkshake-
So sorry for your loss.
The heartbreak of losing a child has to be unbelievable.
Please do not feel that you or anyone has to 'compare' pain.

What I have come to realize as I grow older is how much pain we all have to endure during our lifetimes. How unfair life can be.

But... we do have to keep moving through it all.
Hopefully, we will survive this pain and heartbreak and even thrive.
There was a book that I read titled: Living Through Personal Crisis and it offered some good insights into this topic.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
old dipstick
♂ Member
Member # 25598
Default  Posted: 4:42 PM, July 26th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ats.

Your W is just painting you black when she is saying those things. It is consistant when you are having a difficult discussion because she is deflecting the serious issues away from her. This is as natural to her as breathing. My W does much of the same but says different things than your W. It is a learned pattern that is deeply ingrained in them.
Thanks for being happy I was by you in Laura's art. Apparently you did not see the picture Laura made of me before you made that statement.

Laura.

That picture of me is not very accurate. There must be some sort of mixup. I am much better looking than that.

miracle.

Sorry about that young man. 22 is way to young. Parents really should not have to bury a child. Long ago I heard a man make that statement. He was 70s, his son 50s. It is true for all ages.

Sister.

I have seen this debate many times on SI. I have never experienced the death of a child. I have experienced the death of many people close to me. Some when I was young. The reaction to infidelity and death can be very similar. Shock, disbelief, anger and sadness to name a few. In most cases, one thing that death and infidelity do not have in common, is betrayal. Betrayal is a real tough thing to get over. Usually death is not something that the deceased does to you on purpose. The A is something that the BS sees as a thing that is done to them. In secret and well planned.

I can see why people want to compare the pain. We are always looking for answers about things. I really think that death is much worse. I also think the infidelity is harder to get over. We are taught by experience from a young age about death. It is very public. Most often when there is a death in your family there are many people to share the grief. With the A you are kind of on your own.

B&L

Welcome. You have come to a good place to get help with a bd situation. You will get much helpful advice from this bunch.

tryn.

Good chart. I got part way through it and got car sick. I may need to change my reading glasses.

Hugs to the tribe.


Her WW 60
Me BH 60
M 36 yr
D-day#1 fall of 76 OM#1 2NS
D-day#2 summer of 89 OM#2 LTA 8 yrs OM#3 Short Term A


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