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User Topic: Long Term Affair - Part 26
SI Staff
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Member # 10
Default  Posted: 7:29 AM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage


Posts: 10000 | Registered: May 2002
Allgoodnamesgone
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Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 7:30 AM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wooooooohooooooo!
I'm #1!!!
(Mod doesn't count, of course.)

Honest: I'm glad that you have had your "A-ha" moment. Now, run with it.

Spent the entire day at the in-laws' block party. Actually had a great time with my daughter - dancing for hours & just having fun.

Stbx & I largely avoided each other the whole time, but he did do a few things that were considerate.

Argued on the way home about a kid issue, actually, he rambled like he had too much to drink & I remained calm.

When we got home, he was sorta slumped over on the couch, while I put my daughter in her crib, etc. I went to check on him, seemed ok.

I go back 10 minutes later & he's gone. Left the back door unlocked in so doing. I instantly new he had joined my neighbor's party that was ongoing. So, I called him to confirm, then questioned why he didn't tell me he was going. He pointed out that "nothing was going to happen with us" (meaning he wasn't going to get any) & we had no future together (meaning I've lost the privilige of reprimanding him.) I told him while that was true, he was also not just a boarder here & he should've just said something & locked the damn door (something he has resisted the entire time we've been married. )

And, that was that. I then had the luxury of listening to my stbx at the party, as it was loud & right next door, while I was trying to sleep/fight the thoughts of wanting to choke him.

He returned a few hours later.
It's just so frustrating.

Earlier in the day I brought up the conversation as to when we would have him move out, etc. & he responded he never wanted to move out. I told him that was his doing, by failing to do basic shit. He disagreed. I was very proud that I left it at "We've been through this before" and walked away.

Now, the challenge of dealing with today - supposed to go to another family event, that I have "zero" interest in. I need to find a way to find some balance between what my kids want (not that ALL of them want to go, of course) and what I want.

Ok. Peace out.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 7:42 AM, July 4th (Monday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 8:05 AM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Happy 4th to all today. Grill'n ribs.

Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
old dipstick
♂ Member
Member # 25598
Default  Posted: 9:34 AM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood.

I am glad that you are #1. Good job.

Your H is just a child. It is good that you did not argue with him. He just does not understand adult logic. My W is the same way.

tryn.

Pork chops will be my grilling today.

Happy 4th to all.


Her WW 60
Me BH 60
M 36 yr
D-day#1 fall of 76 OM#1 2NS
D-day#2 summer of 89 OM#2 LTA 8 yrs OM#3 Short Term A


Posts: 751 | Registered: Sep 2009
strongish
♀ Member
Member # 29259
Default  Posted: 11:22 AM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Part 26!! The Tribe rocks!!

Allgood - I agree with Dip that it's good you didn't engage in arguing with Mr. Nogood. Having said that, I let myself get engaged in a "discussion" that led to an argument with FWH. E-mail invite came to me several weeks ago about a celebration at a friends house last night. This is a group of friends who came together as our sons all play sports together, hang together at school, etc., they're just a close group of boys (about 7 of them) and the moms really enjoy each other's company as well. I'm not a huge socializer, in fact I tend to isolate when I'm sad/depressed, but this group of women have quietly supported me this past year. We do some girl's happy hours, but also socialize as couples. I would say about 75% of the time I'm with this group alone as FWH has two full-time jobs that travel. It never really bothered me before, but I knew last night would be the first time following our S. So, when the invite came I did not forward it to FWH, I just "assumed" that he would not go. He has never been close with this group, it's always been more my friends and he goes along with what we plan. I don't EVER remember FWH calling up any of the other husbands to get together for anything. So, FWH was in town, at his parents yesterday and heard that we (Me, DD22, DS17) we going to the group party. This morning he e-mailed me wanting to know who made the decision not to invite him. I picked up the phone so that we could "talk" instead of e-mailing back and forth. He tells me that he wants to be honest with his feelings that it hurt him that he was excluded. I told him that I was the one that had to take responsibility for that as I would have been uncomfortable with him there. The talk disintegrated into my saying that he had never made socializing with this group a priority over being with his GF before and now he wants to be all friendly with them. Low blow...I don't know...what I do know is that instead of being gracious and recognizing that this would be a healing event for me, surrounded by my friends, he had to make a fuss about why he wasn't specifically invited.

Maybe I was just being pissy when I didn't forward the e-mail to him, but I told him that if he had wanted to go, I would not have gone. It's too soon for me to have to be putting on the game face in social situations. I did that for a YEAR! I'm sick and tired of doing it.

Thanks for letting me get that off my chest. I'm thinking more and more of the dreams that I started to have. Dreams like Laura talks about....having my own little place, small but cosy. No landscaping or pool maintenance, just peace and quiet. Laura, I thought about going to Paris to live for a few months, but don't know how I'd afford it. I dream of being with a man that cherishes me, instead of putting me on the defensive. Mornings like this make me think that despite his remorse, FWH is not the man I want to spend the rest of this life with. It must be me....I want him to take care of this house, bills, etc., but I don't want to have to deal with him. Pretty selfish, isn't it?

Anyway, That's my rant this morning. Sorry to have it be such a downer. Hope everyone's BBQ turns out to be the best ever!


Posts: 490 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
Allgoodnamesgone
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Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 12:03 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

It's too soon for me to have to be putting on the game face in social situations. I did that for a YEAR! I'm sick and tired of doing it.

Totally understand.

I had thought that we shouldn't tell family about the s, given the fact that we told the kids we were still trying, but I am not going to this family event today. Yesterday was easy because of the nature of the event, the block party, to get away from everyone, quite frankly, and just spend the time with the kids.
Today, not so much.
So, do I make an excuse about why I'm not there or have stbx tell them?
Idk, but either way I'm spending the day alone & I'm totally fine with that.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 12:40 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

strongish- it sounds to me like your FWH does not want the marriage to end.
Eventhough he may have not gone to these events in the past-he could have gone KWIM?
And now... he realizes that he cannot. He is being excluded not the other way around.
People tend to be like that...they want what they cannot have.
MY FWH said after d-day that he took me for granted and did not appreciate me in the past, did not appreciate his children etc.
It wasn't until after d-day and after the separation that he totally 'woke up' and realized what was important to him.
He realized how he had taken all that was truly important to him for granted and had spent so much of his time pursuing toxic friendships, relationships and behaviors.

Could that be what is going on with your husband?
In the past...when he was 'expected' to attend family events he felt trapped and instead just wanted to do what he wanted to do...and that meant a more 'single' 'fun' lifestyle as opposed to boring neighborhood barbecues?
and now...he's beginning to see the light?
he's beginning to realize that his selfish behavior could eventually lead to him missing out on many family events?


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
strongish
♀ Member
Member # 29259
Default  Posted: 4:05 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

njgal - I think that FWH has always been okay with me doing something "fun" as long as it wasn't something that he was interested in doing or as long as he had his own "fun" thing to do. You are exactly right....now that he's not the one in control of whether he goes to an event or not, he suddenly doesn't like that he wasn't invited by me. It has been amazing to me that he can talk to me about how "hurt" he feels that I didn't include him in something (like this event invite) or that I'm keeping my thoughts to myself or any other number of things. But he doesn't see that he had been doing that, and much worse to me by having a GF for 4 years!! This morning he kept insisting that he didn't put his LTA before me and his kids as he only saw OW when he was on a trip! Of course he missed countless concerts, games, dances, birthdays, anniversaries, etc. for "work." He forgets that he made the decision to fly to S. America, where the LTA took place and OW lives, despite the family's schedule. There may have been many months when he could have flown a different schedule that would have allowed him to attend some of these things, but he was set on only flying to S. America. I'll never know if/when he ever made the decision to fly a trip that coincided with his being with OW, but in 4 years I'm betting that that happened more than once.

So, I've got my panties in a wad and am feeling angry and pissed off. I'm sick of this crap. Really sick of it. We've been S less than 2 weeks and he's already pushing me to re-engage with him. He didn't see anything wrong with his being at the BBQ last night. And I guess he's right. Maybe what I'm really pissed at is that I feel like he keeps putting me in the position to have to push him away. I don't want to hurt him and I know that every time I push him away he is "hurt." He has texted, e-mailed, called or had to stop by every day since he moved out. He's always apologetic, but it's like he can't help himself. I feel like a toy that he has suddenly decided that he wants even though he tossed it to the side before. He now wants me because he can't have me. I'm tired of it. Tired of all of it.


Posts: 490 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
deeppurple
♂ Member
Member # 28757
Default  Posted: 4:19 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Strong - there is always going to be a period of re-adjustment & I feel that is what he is experiencing plus probably some co-dependancy issues.
If he had really wanted to save the marriage & put you first then he would have done so by now. He is trying to make himself the victim - the usual WS defence mechanism.

You made the decision that is best for you - hopefully in the long run he will accept it & respect it.

Take care

Cant believe its room 26 already!


Me - BS 49
Her - WS 43
Married 16 yrs (together 17 yrs)
DD13 DS10 DS8 DS6
DDay 1 6.4.2010 dday 2 7.25.2010
Heading for divorce.
"Never look down on someone unless you are helping them up"

Posts: 522 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Where the sun is shining & the surf is pumping
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 4:28 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi all

Today's anecdotes and reflections really got me thinking. I know all of this will sound ridiculously obvious but bear with me.

Our FWSs lived a double life. In their double life they chose who to be with, when, all to suit them. The BS did not make the same kind of choices. Mostly we made choices around what we thought would make everyone happy. We balanced our own needs with those of others in the family and for many of us our own needs came last quite often. The reality was that for us we were happy if everyone else was happy!

For the WS their APs were their attempt to fill some sort of gap in their lives. Whether they thought their Ss didn't talk to them enough, care about them enough, give them enough affection, sex, whatever. So they used their Ss, families or APs to fill their needs. Their choices were based on what THEY felt they wanted at any particular time.

So there were often times when they chose to go with the AP rather than their S and/or family because they thought they would feel "happier". It was never about making someone else happy. It was about making themselves happy.

So dday comes and the choices at any given time are taken from them. They HAVE to choose one or the other ALL the time. They can no longer pick and choose as it suits them.

I need to find a way to find some balance between what my kids want (not that ALL of them want to go, of course) and what I want.

This mindset or worldview is so different. For the BS trying to hold together a shattered M everything is still about balancing everyone's needs (eg all the BSs worrying about the impact on their kids). For the (F)WS it is still about what they see as what THEY deserve in life.

So allgood's H chose to go to the neighbours because

"nothing was going to happen with us" (meaning he wasn't going to get any) & we had no future together
and left the door unlocked because it was of no consequence to him. Strong's H suddenly wants to be with people he has shown no interest in before because now he wants "IN" the marriage.

what I do know is that instead of being gracious and recognizing that this would be a healing event for me, surrounded by my friends, he had to make a fuss about why he wasn't specifically invited.

Maybe this is the difference. Maybe true R begins to happen when the FWS finally puts the BS's needs first even if it hurts him/her.

I think that in the early days of R the only way a BS can start to feel safer is when the FWS focusses totally on what the BS needs and puts their needs aside. So R can begin.

As the BS starts to see the huge effort made by the FWS they begin to feel safer and more trusting and then become more sympathetic to the FWS's needs.

So R can progress and a new partnership begins.

Yep sounds obvious but sometimes in our pain we don't SEE the obvious.

Strong

he e-mailed me wanting to know who made the decision not to invite him

How would you have felt if instead of this he had emailed saying something like "I heard you are doing X today. I'm a little disappointed I won't be there to have fun with you but realise you need some space at present. Hope you have a lovely day."

This way he could have shared his feelings honestly without that ME ME ME approach.

In my own sich, it wasn't until FWH got past his FD obsession that I could begin to feel safe. In those first few months when he should have been focussing on me he instead used every waking moment focussing on FDs. I suppose I subconsciously knew this. I really didn't give a shit about whether or not he played with his FDs. It was about where his head was.

Just some early morning thoughts tribe.

Hope you all had a great 4th of July.

Love

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 4:38 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Strong

He forgets that he made the decision to fly to S. America, where the LTA took place and OW lives, despite the family's schedule. There may have been many months when he could have flown a different schedule that would have allowed him to attend some of these things, but he was set on only flying to S. America.

Exactly!!!! We cross posted honey. In my sich FWH chose to work more evening shifts (by swapping with colleagues) so he could screw his OWs in the mornings when the kids and I were at school. (No doubt his OWs did the same). So the kids and I were home alone most evenings and I did all the kid chores - homework, sport, dancing medical appointments etc. I didn't complain (even though I hated feeling like a single mum) as I thought it wasn't his "fault".

So yep honey I get it!

HUGS

Laura

[This message edited by Laura28 at 4:42 PM, July 4th (Monday)]


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
deeppurple
♂ Member
Member # 28757
Default  Posted: 4:45 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wanted to share the thought of the day on my desk calendar.

"Nothing is more difficult, and therefore more precious, than to be able to decide"
Napoleon


Me - BS 49
Her - WS 43
Married 16 yrs (together 17 yrs)
DD13 DS10 DS8 DS6
DDay 1 6.4.2010 dday 2 7.25.2010
Heading for divorce.
"Never look down on someone unless you are helping them up"

Posts: 522 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Where the sun is shining & the surf is pumping
strongish
♀ Member
Member # 29259
Default  Posted: 5:51 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

How would you have felt if instead of this he had emailed saying something like "I heard you are doing X today. I'm a little disappointed I won't be there to have fun with you but realise you need some space at present. Hope you have a lovely day."
Writing this would have made all the difference. I would feel like he was respecting my boundries, my need for some fun without the "drama" of having our M on display. And I do know that given time, FWH will most likely come to the conclusion himself that this would have been a more successful response. Plus, I don't discount that he's new at this "feeling" thing and at having to talk about how he feels. But remember, I'm one year down the road from him. I'm not new at sharing my feelings or at learning what I need to do to heal myself since FWH was so blind to my pain for so long. Maybe he will "get it" and maybe this was just some backsliding from the way he handled DDay with me, but why does it take for me to be beat down for him to see ME and how I am still aching and in pain...every day. I truly doubt that FWH and I will ever be able to be happy/comfortable with each other again. I just don't trust him to keep his word....not that he might have another A, honestly it's not that, but that he can't or won't respect ME and put what I need before what he sees as his need. Of course, he'll say that he moved out because that's what I wanted, not what he wanted...so we're back to square one.

Laura, you have a good perspective and I value your advice. Thanks for chiming in.

And please, feel free to 2x4 me is anyone feels like I need it.


Posts: 490 | Registered: Aug 2010 | From: Texas
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 6:16 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Strong

BOYS COVER YOUR EARS!!!

I truly believe that MOST men are crap at expressing their feelings. By agreeing to move out he has tried to put your needs first. He is still trying. In his own hamfisted dumb way he is showing he wants you. I know it's still all about him but he does want you.

There have been many times since dday when FWH has said the "wrong" thing. And my claws have come out and I have beaten him down. He often claimed that he "didn't mean it the way it sounded" and sometimes I don't think he did. Other times I know it was the ME ME coming out.

This morning he kept insisting that he didn't put his LTA before me and his kids as he only saw OW when he was on a trip!

I think you know that deep down this is self protection. What would you have said if he agreed? How would you have felt? You've split. He's trying to do the right thing. To agree with this (even though you both know it's true) is too hard for him at present.

One thing I've noticed with FWH is that the story has changed a little recently. He has admitted to some things he denied before. That's hard for me but I know why. He feels safer now to be honest. I KNOW he should have done it before and so does he but ... at least it's happening now.


I don't want to hurt him and I know that every time I push him away he is "hurt." He has texted, e-mailed, called or had to stop by every day since he moved out. He's always apologetic, but it's like he can't help himself.

Like us in the early days after dday he's flailing around trying to work out the "right" thing to do.
You have nothing to lose by telling him. Why not email him and explain. What's the worst that can happen? Tell him what you would have preferred him to say. Tell him why. What harm can it do? If he comes back with something selfish then you have a clearer picture of where his head is at. If he responds by agreeing then you have set things up for a better response from him in a similar sich in future.

IMHO you two want to be together but YOU are exhausted from constantly trying to get him to wake up and HE is clutching at straws trying to get you to see he wants you by describing his own pain but putting his foot in it too often.

While you are having time out I think you need to keep the communication lines clear. If he stuffs up or has what we Aussies call "foot in mouth disease" then tell him. Quietly and if possible without the claws.

HUGS honey

I know this is such a tough time for you

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
deeppurple
♂ Member
Member # 28757
Default  Posted: 6:25 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura -YES I am crap at expressing my feelings. Ive learnt much from this A experience in being able to express them more openly (not enough to the tribe at times) - I just find now the person who needs to hear my feelings is deaf & living in their own world - isolating themselves from a loving husband & family.


Me - BS 49
Her - WS 43
Married 16 yrs (together 17 yrs)
DD13 DS10 DS8 DS6
DDay 1 6.4.2010 dday 2 7.25.2010
Heading for divorce.
"Never look down on someone unless you are helping them up"

Posts: 522 | Registered: Jun 2010 | From: Where the sun is shining & the surf is pumping
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 6:25 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura: spot on analysis! It all comes down to selfishness.

As far as I'm concerned, the WS is "high risk" & for the BS to genuintely invest anything further in the M he had to show the BS that it's family first 24/7, meaning that he considers how we are impacted by everything he does BEFORE doing it.

Strongish: hang in there. I had no idea you were having so much contact with him still. I get the adjustment period, tho. Would you seriously be ok if he madd absolutely no attempts to breack NC with you? Wouldn't that just scream "I don't care"? (I mean- I get it would also mean he's respecting your wishes, but stil...)

Ok. Got to go.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 6:38 PM, July 4th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood

WS is "high risk" & for the BS to genuintely invest anything further in the M he had to show the BS that it's family first 24/7, meaning that he considers how we are impacted by everything he does BEFORE doing it.

EXACTLY
EXACTLY
EXACTLY

And you know the thing is that if we saw this happening we wouldn't care if on SOME occasions they DID put themselves first if the fallout for the rest of us wasn't huge. It's the consistent ME ME ME approach that destroys the M.

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 6:48 AM, July 5th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Laura28... I think your post about "why", some people cheat is correct with every cheater. You have figured it out. It is absolutely critical a BS understand and believe the reasons.

Selfishness and greed to want more and more.

This ends up placing them in living double lives as you say.

IMO, I say that most people in general don't know how to express feelings. It is really not limited to any male or female. I was horrible at expressing my feelings before my W’s A. My W was not good at communicating her feeling to me before her A. For a long time, she tried to tell me, but I know it did not register. My W needed attention, affirmation, and more quality time with me! The way she was telling me was said like this, “You have a life, I don’t”. I feel good about myself that I did many things to try and make her fulfilling but I can admit falling in to the same ole M behaviors we all fall into that lead to misery.

Another factor today about me and post dday is I am more aware, I listen better when she is trying to have a discussion about her feelings. I will carry this behavior into every relationship I now have and do. I am teaching my kids this now too even though they are over 18.

OK this seems like a good time to describe my own feelings right now… I am now 34 months post dday.

When I am physically with my W, I feel like I am the 3rd grade teacher with the student paying attention to me. My W pays attention to me. She is loving me. The feeling you might have when you are buying Ice cream with a friend in comfort. It’s like taking a walk, holding hands with someone you care about. It feels good. A peace is with me like reading a good book or watching a good movie. It is freedom for most hours of my day.

But everyday and a few times a week, I have this other side of me too. I yearn for more sexiness and more touch, not initiated by me. I am sometime like a dry sponge wanting more of her water, I just want my W to make that effort to dip me in her water so I can absorb that water and make me heavy. I dip myself often and feel full in my water. But my water is familiar as in the past, it's always me. I am living in confusion, I question myself if I will ever feel completely saturated. Am I missing her flirt as she claims that makes me dip myself. Am I missing something in my life now. My fear, my senses, say to me, the sponge is not suppose to be wet all the time, it should be OK just to be soaked no matter who dips it. Or am I being dipped not knowing it's me or her.

And the “reminders”. The remiders are like a sand crab on a beach. As you relax on the beach all day, you see the crap pop up. You lunge at the crab to catch it, but he scampers back into that hole. You cover it with sand, and maybe hours later, you see the crap uncover the sand again. Sometimes you do catch the crap and you feel the pinch, and you shake your hand in a fearful, hurting, thrust. Sometimes you just allow the pinching crap to hold on but only feel a slight touch. Sometime that sharp pin claw is piercing. You put that crap back on the sand and the crap scampers and digs back into the sand to hide again. I know that crap is under the sand somewhere and he will peak his head through it again and again. I notice the pinch is less with slow time. I once overlooked those sand crabs at the beach. But today, I just cannot avoid seeing them. It is nature.

OK what about your feelings LTA folks?

[This message edited by trynhard at 7:30 AM, July 5th (Tuesday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
m334455
♀ Member
Member # 26893
Default  Posted: 7:46 AM, July 5th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

IMO, I say that most people in general don't know how to express feelings. It is really not limited to any male or female.

Agreed. Heck -- I don't even know what my feelings ARE half of the time! I'm there two weeks ago crying on the kitchen floor and it takes me half an hour to figure out it's because the painters are coming the next day which means I really am selling my house / I've lost my home / all because of the man who was supposed to protect and cherish me ... good reason to cry, but REALLY? Takes me 30 mintues to figure that out?

What are my feelings? Let's go with "either your WS is a jackass or they are not." The've behaved like one either way -- but some are able to "wake up" and choose to be a reasonably moral and desirable person and others are JACKASSES right to their core. Those are my feelings.

WH's parents and oldest nephew were in town for the weekend. WH and FIL and nephew were drunk most of the time. WH set off fireworks last night -- they were awesome, but he burned up the patio of the house we're about to sell. Sun. night WH and FIL and nephew were talking about how they need to get other nephew a hooker because his GF won't sleep with him anymore since he lied about graduating from college, getting a job, etc. and he STILL isn't supporting her or their 4 year old daughter (which is why she's GF and not wife, as she won't marry him...) but just for bonus points they were talking about this in front of the 9 year old Pharoah.

So... very desirable? NOT. They really are a bunch of winners, no?

Pdoc agreed with my that WH's comment about how no one would respect me because I have no negotiating power since I'm rational and would never do anything batshit crazy pretty much means I need to do something batshit crazy. Which I can do. No sweat...

If I could sell this manure I'd make a fortune. Ugh.


BW 38, 5 kids
Dday Dec. 2009

Posts: 4034 | Registered: Dec 2009
jollum
♂ Member
Member # 25152
Default  Posted: 8:45 AM, July 5th (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Excellent analysis Laura28 as well as all of you. There is only one thing I take exception with. When you say Men don't communicate their feelings. They do but in actuality as Tryn said we really don't know how to listen. Men express things in an entirely different format than Women normally comprehend and vice versa. It's part of the whole difference in men's and women's brains and how they function. I really believe if we learned each others languages there would be a lot less strife in many marriages.

Example, If FWW ask me if I want to go somewhere and I say "I don't care" that means I don't care not some deeper psychological meaning. If I ask FWW if she want's to go somewhere and she says "I don't care", I am supposed to draw some hidden meaning from this that she really doesn't want to go because of some other reason that I'm supposed to realize. To me it really is a basic understanding of how men and women function emotionally.

On the other hand when in my sich, you have a FWW who doesn't share any feelings but expects you to know them well then you're just out of luck.


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