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User Topic: Long Term Affair - Part 25
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 6:42 AM, May 28th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good luck strong

I'm sure your big boy will give you a strong shoulder to lean on.

Thinking of you....

Let him be your rock. He loves you and will appreciate the opportunity to be there for you as you have always been there for him.

love Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 6:56 AM, May 28th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

njgal480,

Do you believe this is truly the way she feels or does she just say dramatic things like this because she feels guilty and ashamed or is tired of peeling away the layers?

She said the statement about living alone, and then the IC telling her that is not what she really wanted to share a sort of epithany with herself. That if she really wanted that she would have left me, she is working hard, so she must want me. Still, a kind of back-handed compliment. Her statement about being alone with just friends and pets is consistent from her over the years. She asked me about my "fantasy future", and was suprised and a bit upset it was not like hers with me living alone somewhere free of responsibility. I told her I always envisioned us growing old, being doting grandparents, proud of our kids, and dying. Since the last few years, not just dday this has not been such a clear vision.

I told her that I stil struggle that feeling she is going to leave me. Not that I cannot be OK, but the shock of coming home some day and she will just be gone, or after DS15 graduates, she will leave, or after her father dies...

She has so much she is working on she just does not have the time or energy to reach out to me in my love language. I do not think it occurs to her very often. I hope for better in the future, but wonder if maybe this is as good as it might get. It certainly is better. Most of the negatives of being blamed, erratic outbursts are gone, it is just few positives (love, empathy, support) are in place.

This (married with children) is not the life she ever wanted for herself. She wants to want and appreciate it, but I wonder if she is asking too much of herself, is trying to hard to convince herself? I think the relationships with OM and bil were very comfortable for her. She controlled the level of intimacy, she could turn the relationship off or on as she chose. In fact her problem with the OM in the 1st lta was he was single and wanted more of her time, wanted her to move in with him. Last OM was a MOM, and he was happy to never have things go beyond AP. She was too.


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 8:16 AM, May 28th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ats.. After IC, does she tell you these things?

Not loads of the love of affirmation is it?

All you can do is let her know how you need to be loved and ask for change. Lover her the ways she needs it, and If she wants return the love to you that way you need it, then good. If not, you cannot control the feeling she has nor the non-change. You decide if this is the life you want to live and have the courage to change to achieve what you want and never let money stand in the way. That's my words.

For me ats, I think not being loved intimately is a boundary buster. My W paying too much attention to work is.. a deal buster. And me, yes, I pay a whole lotta attention to making sure I am intimate to my W. I make sure Work in not the priority in my life anymore. My W is my priority. Then my kids. With my efforts seem to be some happiness.

Have a great weekend everyone.

[This message edited by trynhard at 8:21 AM, May 28th (Saturday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 10:43 AM, May 28th (Saturday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

do not have much on time...needed to do a few shout outs though


strong: we are all with you in spirit....i think that he is not there is almost like a "it figures" kind of thing....if he could have been there he should have....just add to the list of who he is....


ats: i actually like that she wants to be alone in a perfect world...to get healthy we all need to be alone with ourselves...at some point in time facing who we are day in and day out....liking yourself enough to be alone.....i actually find it healthy...and then she also wants a happily ever after...ats..she is getting healthy...i hope you can recognise it....she still has a really long road, but she is on the road and she is making progress...


laura: of course he does not remember the date....more often then not the ws does not want to remember...they are really good at compartmentalizing....as for him going to the movies...i feel its a catch 22...he is with your kids...an important part of being a parent...spending quality time with your kids...and isnt that after all why you are there...???....go easy on that one....if he were with friends, or doing something selfish...but he is not....and if he really doesnt remember....i dont think you should take this one personally....ironic huh...taking shit from them personally...


i am so happy that emdr is working so well for you....


everyone else: enojy your time....have a great weekend...i know i am late and some of you are already gone....but better late then never...

allgood: praying that your trip is uneventful...4 little people in an amusement park...superwoman seems to fit here...next time get a teenager to take with you....they will keep the older ones happy and give you another set of hands and more importantly EYES...

gotta go get the plants planted...i hate gardening....i really do....at least the weather here is beautiful!!! FINALLY.....


((((tribe))))


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 12:31 AM, May 29th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

My weekend is going OK. She is not meeting my needs other than the big one, to work on her. Back in October I never really thought she would follow through. I have said some bluntly honest feelings this weekend. She has not shut down or withdrawn.

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 9:37 AM, May 29th (Sunday)]


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 10:10 AM, May 29th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was going to post y’day but got crashed after some little nasty downloaded itself – I am now done with photobucket, it’s the third time. At least I was able (finally) to sort it myself (fingers crossed)

Today her IC asked her to describe a perfect life. She told him a house alone doing art, dogs, and friends who stop by.
Ats, I was going to post a pic of a painting I have in my bedroom called “Wishful Thinking” but the click to resize brought my laptop crashing down. It’s a back view of a naked woman with a long blonde plait, sitting on a beach hugging one knee as she looks out to sea. It’s in Greece somewhere. In the distance is another shoreline backed with green hills. No one else is in the picture. I bought it from the artist in 1996, or rather H bought it for me. At the time, the boys were 12, 10, 8 & 2. That was my dreamy escape. I could look at that painting (and still do) and just feel alone. Just me, on a beach, no kids, no husband, no washing or bills to pay, the smell of warm sun on naked skin, just the sound of waves and peace. I saw the picture and said that’s me in years to come, when the kids have gone. The fact that the woman is in her late 20’s is irrelevant b/c it’s timeless to me. Okay, so that’s one.

The other is now. Not a painting, but a painting I go to in my head. Here I am on the English south coast in a white board cottage overlooking the sea. A small house with a cottage garden and hollyhocks outside the front door. A small but trendy car in the drive and a smallish dog to walk. I’d do Tai Chi Calendar Girls style with a group of local women. My kids would come see me, but not stay. Note: no husband or partner.

Something else I should say. I used to laughingly tell people that H wouldn’t want a divorce – I’d give him custody of all the kids and go off to ….. you guessed it, the beach or coast. What step-mother would want to take on our four? Hmm. Mrs Smug-Married.

It is my perfect existence in my fantasy. But if it came to reality? No. Leastways, not in the long term. I think it was the constant and never ending drain on me by others, so I think I saw it as a chance to recharge and to keep the energy for myself instead of having it drip out of me. Sometimes I found it hard being there for everyone 24/7, doing all the finance, sorting out H’s problems as well as the kids, much of the time I did feel a single parent who still had this man who expected from me but who didn’t really support me in what were supposed to be shared areas. Even though three of them have left home, I still have to do their UK banking, their criminal record applications, send them originals or copies of certificates or payslips or tax returns.

Don’t take what your wife says personally, at least she is telling you what she is thinking even if she hasn’t worked it all out. Perhaps she never will, but at least she’s trying and learning more about herself during this past year than she ever did before.

I told her I always envisioned us growing old, being doting grandparents, proud of our kids, and dying.
H bought me a couple of fridge magnets during his affair years. One said “Grow old with me, the best is yet to come” His ideal future would be for me to take up golf and go on golfing holidays like some of his golfing friends and their wives do. And generally just being together, doing stuff together, going places together. I don’t think that has changed for him, but I do wonder if the person he wanted to be with changed while he was with MOW. And knowing that means I still hold on to my possible different future.

Lastly, negotiate with the love languages and needs. Find the common ground you are both comfortable with. It’s a start that she doesn’t want to be without you. I forget the exact saying, but it involves: “I can imagine me with XXX in my life” and it moves on to “I can’t imagine my life without XXX in it” could this be what she is saying?


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
UKgirl
♀ Member
Member # 17062
Default  Posted: 10:29 AM, May 29th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Strong, sending you big hugs. For you and your boys. Let them be there for you and lean on each other. It’s going to be a tough time emotionally. (((((strong&boys)))))

Laura – Why would your H want to remember the date? And if he does, he’s not going to say anything unless you do. And if it passes by without reference, he can breathe a sigh of relief. And remember – he’s not a mind reader. If you want him to be aware of something or of how you feel, tell him. I agree with miracle – bit of a catch 22 going on.

Imagine this - I can now picture him in bed affectionately cuddling and talking "nice" to OW2 and feel NOTHING!!!!!!No hurt, no anger - NOTHING!!!! And my therapist has told me this is permanent!!! It truly is amazing.
Wow. I can’t imagine that. Sounds better than pinging the elastic band trick. I still reach for the off switch sometimes when certain love songs come on the radio. The one that did it the other day was Unintended by Muse. Aaaarrrgghhh! Another day, it can play almost to the end before I connect the painful memories. I’d like to enjoy the music as I used to, perhaps EMDR can work for that too.

Back to the gardening.... see you out there, Miracle.


D-Day: 30 July 2006 LTA: 5yrs
Me, BS, 56 y/o Him, WS, 57 y/o
MOW, pathetic ex-fiancee.
3 grown boys and one 18 y/o
I don't consider myself married anymore.
There are some words once spoken split the world in two. Before you say them and after.

Posts: 3328 | Registered: Nov 2007 | From: UK
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 11:04 PM, May 29th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hugs to you Strong, Laura, Ats, and Miracle. Allgood, I hope you are surviving!!

I have been reading, but can't really contribute today. Antianniversary this weekend for me too.

Really trying to work on triggers and not trying to think with "emotion mind" KWIM? Still so much to process. <sigh>


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 11:24 PM, May 29th (Sunday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((Honesttoafault))

sigh


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 7:10 AM, May 30th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

ats... I think you live life and try to live it with peace the best you can. Our wives made mistakes, and these mistakes turns their own lives into sadness for the pain they cause other. They dreamed, they fantasize, they wished, and they look back and no doubt about it, they did not live a life of peace. Running and hiding is a solution. It is called starting over.

Starting over is a choice, a decision. To do this is like quitting smoking cold turkey or making the decision not to be overweight any more. Sometimes the urges and self discipline are just mentally too hard. Why is it that some people are capable of overcoming this mental block, and some not? She cannot quit you just like you won’t ever stop smoking. Do you understand that feeling of unable to quit?


But today and today. Now is right now.


A mans need is to be loved in a physical way. I cannot explain it other than to say that this inner feeling says, hey, I find you cute, hot, and what you have makes me want to touch you. Heck, some men need this love so much they fake it by purchasing it because self love just doesn’t do it. It’s the ultimate affirmation. Your W needs to love you the way you need to be loved. Otherwise, it is not fair to you.

I know I show this over and over again. You can be happy again with your W. You won’t forget her infidelity, and it will hurt until the day you die, but the hurt fades everyday.


To do it, you must live what is known to be a successful marriage.

Studies that show what people in healthy marriages do:


- Shared Spirituality
- Have a support system of other couples who strongly believe in Marriage
- Frequently Affirm each other
- Spend quality and quantity time together
- Communicate and Listen easily and well
- Approach conflict constructively as a learning experience
- Have a mutually satisfying sexual relationship
- Are open to change
- Have s sense of commitment and faithfulness to one another
- Have unity based on shared values and goals
- Have a sense of Play and humor
- Have a deep sense of Trust
- continue to experience Forgiveness
- Value service to each other


The hardest part of marriage after infidelity from the betrayed point is forgiving.


I still practice forgiveness. It takes something within me everyday.


For example, last night my W and I rented the move Dilemma. It is a movie about infidelity. My W said she didn’t want to watch if it was going to upset me. Her statement was meant to say, she did not want to hurt me. Did this movie spark a feeling? Yes. I could “feel” the character of the movie. I think after some time after dday, we all have the ability to keep some feeling “in check.”


As far as keeping my feeling in check, I could have stomped out of the room to show my hurt and insisted more IC for her. I could have closed my eyes. I could have “insisted” she feel her A was not meaningful too. But the fact is, her A was meaningful to her. It made her feel extremely good, powerful, loved, etc. I cannot change what she did. It really is what it is. (BTW, what I have come to know is “acceptance”.)


My W does not need any more IC. She has the power within to make the decisions she is going to make from here out. If it’s going to be a bad one, it’s going to be a bad one. If it’s a re-commit to me, it is going to be to me and doing the things I tell her, I believe, I say about how I need to be loved.


Even more simply put, recommit to each other and act on, do, make every decision, every choice, toward doing nothing but those things that make a good healthy marriage. When you look at today after months post dday, it is about marriage training.

So to look at the above in a healthy marriage again.

- Approach conflict constructively as a learning experience.
Throw away the ego, and let her have a pass on her mistakes. The past is the past and she has been unable to tell you what she needed for a compete love. Your W needs some sort of love you was not providing. What was it? Your W needs some sort of power over men, what is it? You must ask. It’s hard to do this. I have figured this out with my wife by doing the Retrou method of intimate communication. Now I am capable of giving my W what she needs. But beware, it changes!

- Have a mutually satisfying sexual relationship. Your W needs to know, for men, sex leads to increased attachment, affirming, Period. For you woman, I can try to explain it in my own feelings in another post but you say No, a man will find it. He will find it in fantasy if you say no. Fantasy is porn, or massage parlors or affairs. Very few men I believe don’t want sex.

- continue to experience Forgiveness I stopped bring up her mistakes to her. I stopped keeping that record of wrong to her. If the subject comes up, I tell her that today I made the choice to love her. I show her I can watch a movie and not blow up. This if forgiving her. Sure, I have some memories, feelings over the violation of my security. But it’s OK today.


- Have unity based on shared values and goals
Yes, I gave my W last week this chance to again agree with me on values. I am not innocent to the world though. People are not always kind. I have the power in my soul to not be with someone who does not share my own values if fidelity. I have the power today to live a life of fidelity.


I really hope the things I share about me, my way of life, can also help others achieve some peace. Today is a day we can celebrate death and endings. The death someone made for us, so we can begin living life again or live on in peace. The death of that marriage of the past, and a new marriage or new way of life!

Peace be with you all today.

[This message edited by trynhard at 7:12 AM, May 30th (Monday)]


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 9:01 AM, May 30th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Good morning y'all!

So - I did it! I took the kids to a big amusement park, 2 days, didn't lose anyone, no one got sunburned & we all made our way back.

Whew!

Everyone had a great time. This was a really good weekend for me. This was me trying to prove something to myself: that I am going to be ok. I can do this.

I only drove 2 states away, but still a 4 hour trip one way. Driving & navigating in unfamiliar territory is not one of my strengths. Got a bit lost on the way there & pulled out of it with a little help from a gas attendant. Lol. I really need to replace my GPS asap.
It's a good feeling to stretch outside my comfort zone & get it done. Especially things that I relied upon my stbx for in some way - copilot or driver, helping pack/unpac the car, extra pair of hands at the park. But, I did it and the kids had a GREAT time. To me, this was more than just a fun weekend, it was something to give me confidence that me & my kids will be happy. I can do the things for them that their father & I would do with them.
This was good.

Other ephiphanies: I think I really miss the relationship, the marriage & the intact family more than I miss my stbx. Yes, I'm still terribly attracted to him, both physically & his humor, but I think what brings me the most sorrow is that he is the only person that can give me what's most important to me: a family with 2 parents for my children.
So, we will adjust.

Also, a lot of us talk about the experience of having felt like a single parent for many years. I think this goes hand & hand with our spouses having checked out of the marriage a long, long time ago. This is helpful to me because I can say Hey - I didn't make an awful choice as far as a spouse goes - he was everything I thought he was at the time, but as it turns out we are just not a good fit - either because we are just not that compatible or because marriage is really not something for him. He's not an awful person. He found himself unhappy and instead of leaving altogether, he kept one foot in each world, because ultimately, he loves the kids & wanted them to have an intact family. And, I know he wanted to be a part of that too, just not to the exclusion of other things.

This is what makes sense to me. Obviously, people are capable of change. But it's hard. It's nice to know that some of you have had spouses that are either in the process of or have used DDay as the impetus for real change.
Ok - lil diva is preventing me from finishing this thought. Hope everyone else had a good weekend.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 9:24 AM, May 30th (Monday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 10:28 AM, May 30th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn: Very good post. I copied and pasted a lot of it to reread and to remind myself that no matter what I do, I cannot do it alone. My marriage cannot be saved if WH is not committing to the M and me.

Allgood: I'm so happy that you had a good time. Yes, so many of us were really living as "single" parents in so many ways.
It's not so much as you are not a good "fit" with your WH as far as two people with your personalities and how you love each other as people, but his decision or inability to commit to M, per se, and not marriage to YOU is the problem. He wants his lifestyle of single but married. He doesn't know how to have a mature intimate relationship.

You can do it. I am so happy you had a great time. {{{{Allgood}}}}


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
njgal480
♀ Member
Member # 24938
Default  Posted: 12:29 PM, May 30th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood-
So good to hear that you got through the experience successfully! You can do this!
It reminded me of a last minute trip I took alone with my two children when they were about age 2 and 4. I was angry at my husband for staying out very late with his drinking buddies(surprise, surprise) and I loaded the kids into the car and drove to Pa. to Sesame Place!
I stayed overnight with them in a hotel too.
I managed to not lose anyone and a good time was had by all...but, I did feel like I wished my husband was there with us!

He was an adolescent throughout most of our marriage...he always wanted to have both...the marriage and family and also the freedom to have 'fun' with his drinking buddies. He knew that I was so...responsible and reliable that he never had to worry about a thing when it came to the kids.
It was a weird dynamic (looking back on it now) because he would come in and out of his responsible husband/father role. It was not that he was constantly screwing up...just some of the time.
He did have his moments- volunteering as a soccer coach etc. but his need for 'fun' that did not include me and the kids was something that I could not relate to.
My family was my world.... then again.. I was not an alcoholic and did not have an addictive personality...hardly ever drank at all. That was simply not my idea of fun-so, he had to look elsewhere for that.
Right after d-day my husband did say that he realizes now that he was always avoiding true intimacy with me.
To this day I do not know where he got that from...was it a book or article that he read or had the therapist said that to him during his initial phone interview...because the comment came a week or so after d-day..he had not started IC yet.

When he said it all hell was breaking lose in the NJ household... he was out and I was a wreck but months or maybe years later I thought of that comment and wanted to ask him about it but have decided that asking those questions now... so long after d-day is just ripping that band-aid off of a wound over and over again.

I see it in my husband's behavior, attitude, demeanour, everything is so different. He is totally devoted to me and our marriage and our children. It took him a very long time to get to this point but he finally did 'get it'.

I'm sorry that Mr. Nogood has not had that sort of ephiphany... maybe he will when the two of you are separated and he is on his own or maybe he will never 'get it'.

It's interesting to me that the MOW that my husband got involved with was guilty of the same thing. She had avoided true intimacy with her husband from the beginning of their marriage when she began her first LTA.
She was in the marriage and yet she was not... her needs, her fun, her extra curricular activities always took precedence and her husband was the one that picked up the slack at home. he was the reliable one that was home for the kids and the MOW was out partying after work with her co-workers or leaving for work trips to Las Vegas and Atlantic City....

Apparently, from what her ex husband has told me ...the MOW has yet to see the light.
She has no remorse for her choices and little understanding of all that she has lost.


Me- BS
Him- WH
Long term marriage
D-day- Jan. 2007
5 yr. LTA
Reconciled.


Posts: 3139 | Registered: Jul 2009 | From: NJ
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 10:16 PM, May 30th (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

allgood: i am so proud of you...and i knew you could do it....and i am sorry you had too....but happy that you gained so much confidence and independence....it really is a freeing feeling when you "know" you can as opposed to "think" you can...so bravo...


(((honest)))....yup...remembering shitty days suck..i hope next year you make some new wonderful memories to take the date back...


ukgirl: maybe you should try emdr....and as for the gardening...you can have at it...i hate it...and i hate that i could not finish...cause that means i have to do it again, not just water and reap...

aha moment... i dont like to sow or sew!!!! i am not a sow, sew woman!!!

nite all....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 5:27 AM, May 31st (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Allgood.. You are wise enough to see. Your husband did changed over the years. He changed to someone that stopped loving you. This is hard but in a short time, you will enjoy your freedom.

ats... just wondering, when does your W stop working on herself? Just seems to me that all these IC must have sunk home by now. Just seems you guys need a MC that willing to bring the M closer. Both choosing to start loving each other to the fullest.

honest.. I know you are in a different place. You need independence. It starts with financial independence. When you are ready, you will be ready. I wish I was a rich. I would give you million dollars.


Posts: 2636 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: Indiana
Laura28
♀ Member
Member # 28997
Default  Posted: 7:22 AM, May 31st (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn

I wish I was a rich. I would give you million dollars.

Many people might say this but when you do I know you mean it. And you would. You are such a good kind soul. I know you mean it.

Your wife is very lucky!!!

((((tryn))))

Laura


Married 30yrs Me BW 57Yrs Him FWH 59yrs
OWzero 1988 EA?/PA? Gaslighted.
Dday May 28 2010.
OW1 1994(6mths PA, EA til dday).
OW2 2002(8yrs PA).
OW3 2009(1Yr PA).
Others???? Status: Not Divorcing..but.."You can't unfuck the goat"

Posts: 2729 | Registered: Jul 2010 | From: Australia
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 7:35 AM, May 31st (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Tryn: Thank you so very, very much!!! That was such a wonderful, kind thing to say! That is worth more than any money!

{{{{{tryn}}}}


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 9:04 AM, May 31st (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

tryn:

you are such a sweetheart....


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 10:24 AM, May 31st (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

…just wondering, when does your W stop working on herself? Just seems to me that all these IC must have sunk home by now.

The quick answer is that she is not yet ready to be a full and equal partner in a M. She is in a better place than she was, but she is still not ready to advocate for herself, she is still co-dependent with my feelings.

Therefore, she is done with IC when she is done. The IC she is seeing has not been shy in the past with me or us in saying he thought he was done or reducing the frequency of sessions. Going back 6-8 months FWW would come out of a session feeling it at been a waste of time, and only finding value after processing the session. For the last 2 - 3 months, she has been very clear that they are helpful to her.

I really do think the sessions are helpful, to her. She has a lifetime of issues to resolve. What I told her a few weeks ago is that I do not see us doing better. She is no longer having an A, she does not blame me or others for her problems, but the things I have been very clear are important to me: physical touch, time together, and sex, are still after-thoughts or missed due to work or other disruptions. If I am fully honest, I am maybe seeing a small up-tick in focus on me the last couple of weeks. So we are better than we were when she was having her A’s and better than the time before that. I am trying to decide how high to set the bar for what I want. What is a reasonable expectation, and what is me being unreasonable in what I want from her?

She, I, and IC/MC have discussed having me rejoin the sessions for MC. For now, she still values the time alone, and I want to work out a few thinks in IC before jumping back into MC. The last few and next few weeks are hectic being the time of year I am traveling for meetings, conferences, training. In July when my schedule slows down, I will have an IC session or two, and see where we go from there. We actually just passed the 1 year anniversary of her giving me details that made clear the scope and depth of her A’s. October will be 2 years from the original dday for me. I am trying to be patient and in the moment.

I think I know what my issues are.

Trust: not so much about an A, although that pops up from time to time, but about what she is feeling, what she wants, being honest and authentic with me.

Intimacy: She still struggles with establishing emotional intimacy with me. I struggle with co-dependency when I drop barriers between her and me.

Sex: Quantity is an issue, I am a 1-2x a week person and she is apparently a 1-3x a month person. Quality has also become an issue for me. Knowing she does not enjoy sex as I do, knowing her SAb background, it has been a long time since I have really bonded and enjoyed sex with her. Our sex has been mechanical for a while now; I suspect this is how it has usually been for her.

Our Shared Story: I do not know what our shared story is. Her perceptions of our entire M are so very different then mine. She has shared a lot about her A’s, but much of that sharing was during time when she was not being honest, not sure she was staying in the M. How her family, our family, and I all fit together is still in limbo.

I suspect that we can get past the last 2 issues with MC and my continuing to process and heal. The trust issue will resolve with time and continuing trustful actions. It is only recently that I have felt she has been honest with feelings.

I know we are and can be great friends. I do not know if we can be M. I have shared over and over what my love language is, what I would like, and it rarely happens. In fact, she has expressed feeling controlled or constrained with having to plan to spend time with me. I have asked repeatedly, as has MC, how I can express love to her. She does not like hugs and she does not like gifts. For now, the best I have is acts of service, which can quickly become me doing most of the laundry, cleaning, household repairs.

--Ats


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
ImNellNow
♀ Member
Member # 28753
Default  Posted: 11:02 AM, May 31st (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Okay, ats, I'm going to give you the assignment that our MC gave me (just me, not me and WH... hm...): write down what you want out of A Marriage (not the marriage that you currently have, given your and your FWW's personalities, abilities, etc., but your ideal marriage). I thought about things like intimacy, sex, trust, philanthropy, spirituality, time together/time apart, living situation, hobbies/activities, travel, parenting/grandparenting, work, retirement... pretty much everything I could think of. Wrote down a blueprint, basically, of what my ideal marriage would be.

Then you take a cold, hard look at the marriage you want (deserve) and the marriage you have, and you decide what to do next.

But the floating around dodging the flotsam and jetsam of someone else's "issues" and deciding that it's unreasonable for you to expect to be happy because the other person is unable to provide what you need... that's not okay.

Allgood,
Hooray for you! I'm glad you had a good time and built up your confidence a bit.

UKgirl (and ats),
I think it's a pretty typical mom fantasy to go off somewhere and live alone, no responsibilities. It's because life for women with responsibilities is draining so the "fantasy" of having to not only DO nothing for anyone else, but also to have to THINK about no one else is a pretty strong fantasy. When I'm not doing, I'm thinking/planning. When I'm doing neither, chances are I'm asleep. Or in the middle of a nervous breakdown.

strong,
How did it go with the older DS?

Laura,
You're amazing.!

honest,
How was the weekend? What are you doing for yourself this week?

tryn,
You always express yourself so well...

miracle,
I love/hate gardening. I start pulling a weed and two hours later I'm knee-deep in the flower bed with scratches up and down my arms. I do find it cathartic, though, I must admit. Plus no one ever wants to help weed, so it's some nice alone time (just me and the dog).

I had a pretty decent weekend. Started off not so good but we ended up having a nice night on Saturday, then Sunday and Monday were spent working around the house. WH decided all by himself not to go to BFF's adults-only party yesterday; he was invited at the last minute and we could not have found a babysitter, so WH told him that he was spending the day with his family, thanks but no thanks.

We were listening to music this weekend and WH teared up when he heard Styx's "Babe." So I emailed him a youtube video of it and he teared up again. And said that he thinks of it as "our song." Sweet. But it's still a Styx song... think I'll keep looking. I'd tell him what I think of as "our song," but the ones I feel most connected to are about as far away from sappy love songs as you can get without venturing into gangsta rap.


BS & D
Drinking wine and thinking bliss is on the other side of this.

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