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I Can Relate     Print Topic    
User Topic: Spouses/Partners of Sex Addicts 6
HereIAmAgain22
♂ New Member
Member # 32987
Default  Posted: 6:17 AM, August 22nd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Years for recovery? Ouch. This past Thursday circumstances were that she was found out visiting a guy for sex. This has been out about three weeks and she admitted to at least three times since then. Per her pattern the guy (kid) is 25. She is 42 and attractive. She had told me with the initial discovery that there was one guy she was still in contact with. And I found indirectly that she thought she would "have a hard time" letting this guy go. Of course she tells me that it's just sex they don't even talk deeply. Then I talk to her dad last night who talked to her since and he is telling me out of love that I may need to move on. Her Dad sexually molested two grandaughters about ten years ago, spent time in jail, has gone through 12 step and done everything right in his life to make amends and God bless him. I love him and he loves me. He knows about addiction. This chit runs downhill I'm certain. After the recent discovery my wife and I had counseling that day (her, then me and her, then me) and this is being called a "relapse". She won't delete the phone number(s) because she's "not ready for that yet". She obviously hasn't hit bottom, doesn't want to go there because she's afraid she'll get depressed and really act out. Sounds like an excuse or stalling to me! Anyway, this has torn me up pretty hard. Her stated goal is to recover and get healthy, keep the family together and work towards a happy marriage with me. I'm trying to move on emotionally and making progress but she kind of "keeps me on the line" I think. I'm probably addicted to her at this point because when she shows interest or supports me through conversation then I feel better. Should I be trying to emotionally isolate myself as much as possible or accept whatever support she tries to give me? I have a great career and we have assets so money isn't that large an issue other than the fact that if we divorce my early retirement plans are dead. I should have mentioned first the 5 kids! 15, 12, 10, 8 and 4. Our counselor for the first time said that maybe she is going to need more intense therapy to get out of this. I'm all for that! I'm in tremendous pain right now. Want to hold out for a few months to allow her to recover or not and then divorce her if not. Should I just pull the plug and file now? Pretty sure it won't have an effect on her. She says her goal is to keep our family together and have a happy marriage with me. The actions of the addict are just the opposite. Any input is greatly appreciated I'm afraid I'm going into depression over this (again) and I need to function well to be successful. She has been with neighbors down the road in a temporary situation. Now one of our rentals is opening up in a week for her to move into. It's a few miles away. That's all OK other than now she has that freedom she's always craved. This doesn't seem like it's going the right direction.....



ME BS Male - 47
WS - 42
5 kids ages 4-16
3 D-Days
God help us.

Posts: 12 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: USA
Notmetoo2011
♀ Member
Member # 32912
Default  Posted: 9:00 AM, August 22nd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sager

Hope you are staying strong and making progress. My heart goes out to you. I am just at the beginning of the recovery road with my SAWH and my biggest fear is investing more time in the relationship to have it all fall apart again down the road. Like you my WH is a loving good man most of the time who I enjoy being with and I don't want to divorce.


Me-BW 47
SAWH 48
Married 25 years.
4 children
D-Day 26/07/11
Multiple PAs, ONS,

Posts: 262 | Registered: Jul 2011
bent44
♀ Member
Member # 31386
Default  Posted: 4:11 PM, August 22nd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HereIAmAgain,

I am so sorry for your dilemna. Addiction is just such a da**ing situation. My XWS is "poly"-addicted, and I am fortunate enough to have 23 years of sobriety in AA under my belt. Recovery is possible. Unfortunately, XWS is still in active addiction. It is unbearably painful to watch.

Please do not take this as a 2*4, but may I gently remind you that cheaters/addicts lie. We need to believe nothing that comes out of their mouths. The only things you can trust are their actions, and even then, only the ones you can verify.

Please write what she says in one column and what she does in the other. The first can be labeled fantasy, and the latter reality.

To backtrack on that, my XWS, at times, did say he wanted his family back. I cannot label that as an out and out lie. It is just that he was utterly incapable of doing what was necessary to make that happen. I think some of the things they say that are contrary to their actions may be true for them...in the moment.

Please let me be clear, I am not saying this is what your WW is doing. I just wanted to share my experience in hopes it helps in some way.

As devastating as it is, I cannot live on moments of truth, especially when they are not followed by action.

I truly wish the best for both of you, and hope she is able to find her way before you find your way away from her.


"If you marry a chicken, don't expect an eagle."


I don't know if my chicken will ever become an eagle. But rest assured, I'm going to be a phoenix. Nevermind that I am still in the ashes stage of the process.


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
HereIAmAgain22
♂ New Member
Member # 32987
Default  Posted: 5:46 PM, August 22nd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks Bent44 for your comments. I'd suggested that she or I live in the basement and maintain minimal contact as opposed to her moving into our rental, and she got somewhat angry and adament that "she thought we should separate a long time ago" and that she was doing it. The separation was my emotional reaction to the partial DDay3 3 weeks ago but it seems to me she is "running with it". Now I do have codepedent aspects so I can see where that is just driving her away so I've got stuff to work on for sure. I don't track her around or monitor her phone. I could get into the records and find out who these guys are but why. It's more trying to manage the recovery or at least have input. I'm working real hard to not do that and I think I've been successful so far. However, the biggest thing from the Carnes book is that I have seen sex as a primary sign of love. If we had sex I thought things were OK and have always been that way. I knew that before but now I'm seeing that as an issue. After all love is "patient, kind, slow to anger, always trusts...." So with all this in mind I asked her if her desire to move to the duplex was someone who was in recovery and wanting to work it or an addict that doesn't want to face me because it makes her feel bad and just wants the freedom....yeah probably not the best thing to say. She welled up.


ME BS Male - 47
WS - 42
5 kids ages 4-16
3 D-Days
God help us.

Posts: 12 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: USA
bent44
♀ Member
Member # 31386
Default  Posted: 6:01 PM, August 22nd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

....yeah probably not the best thing to say. She welled up.

Then maybe it was exactly the best thing to say. Addicts need black and white questions.

To this day, I have a hard time with the grey.


"If you marry a chicken, don't expect an eagle."


I don't know if my chicken will ever become an eagle. But rest assured, I'm going to be a phoenix. Nevermind that I am still in the ashes stage of the process.


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
MySonshine
♀ Member
Member # 32252
Default  Posted: 7:37 PM, August 22nd (Monday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am so sorry that you all are having hard times. Hugs to everyone of you. My oldest has been sick for a week and I'm about ready to go crazy staying home all the time! Anyways, just wanted to let you all know that I'm still here and thinking about you all.


BS-me 28
WH-28
Too many DDs to count.

Posts: 87 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Colorado
SabinatheOwl
♀ Member
Member # 30023
Default  Posted: 12:03 AM, August 23rd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

So with all this in mind I asked her if her desire to move to the duplex was someone who was in recovery and wanting to work it or an addict that doesn't want to face me because it makes her feel bad and just wants the freedom....yeah probably not the best thing to say. She welled up.

Excellent question to ask. Now watch what she does with it, not what she says. Heaven knows it's painful. Seperation into the basement may be best in terms of helping you start to get your head straight.

~ Sabina


Details & story in profile

"Live a life not an apology." Edward R.Murrow

"I can be changed by what happens to me but I refuse to be reduced by it."

Maya Angelou


Posts: 1350 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: Metro DC
HereIAmAgain22
♂ New Member
Member # 32987
Default  Posted: 6:40 AM, August 23rd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

The separation was my emotional reaction to what happened. You saw that. That being said there is no doubt I need to emotionally separate from her and I'm committed to that because my value is to not allow myself to be as vulnerable as I have with someone who is not or cannot be honest with me.

So the question becomes. Our rental or one of us in the basement with minimal contact? She is adament about the rental but I don't get her logic. Her statements "I've been wanting a separation for a long time" and "I cannot get healthy being around you" do not make sense to me. Her getting healthy has less to do about our marriage and more to do with her doing what she needs to do to get healthy. Whether I'm there physically or not she will have to deal with her feelings about me to get healthy. In terms of her getting healthy I can see that a co-dependency from me could affect that. She uses that as a reason and is quick to point that out whenever the sledding gets tough. I'm not tracking her, I don't check her email or phone records, I have had too much of a role (or trying to have a role) in managing her recovery in the past. This time I'm doing much, much better. The other co-dependent from reading the books is that I've viewed sex as a primary sign of love. If we had sex I thought things were OK and have always been that way. I knew I had that view before but now see that as an issue Ineed to work. After all love is "patient, kind, slow to anger, always trusts...".

So with all this in mind I asked her if her desire to move to the duplex was someone who was in recovery and wanting to work it or an addict that doesn't want to face me because it makes her feel bad and just wants the freedom....yeah probably not the best thing to say. She didn't take that question very well.

This gets into the practical, too. Most of the people I read about in recovery on the forum live at home because they can't afford not to do so. There are tons of examples of successful recovery there.

Basement:
Pros: $$$ ($1500-2000 per month minimum), both parents more available to the kids, easier to coordinate with each other, and probably an environment with less opportunity to act out.
Cons: More difficult to give her the emotional space she needs to get healthy (i.e. codependence could affect that negatively). Does not fit into "her vision" of what it will take to get healthy.
Rental:
Pros: More of a separation for her and me.
Cons: More complicated. More expensive and considerations about $$$, a budget, what she pays for, what she doesn't. Less access for the kids to their parents. Easier for her to do things "in secret".

If she is insistent now about moving to the rental then from my view I'd rather take the money and send her to a treatment center, then decide. If it still makes sense for the rental after that then fine we go do that. Is it fair for me to push for this and the thinking above? Am I just being "co-dependent"?

Thanks.

Appendix A. I left the 25-yr old a phone message. Leslie asked about it I wasn't going to mention it. I told her what I said and she said that she thought that should "take care of it". She also said she was kind of glad that I did that because it may help to reduce the temptations. Of course this got me to thinking more about the basement thing.

Appendix B. Money things to consider for duplex separation:
Monthly Budget from our joint accounts. I suggest she open another account.
Expenses for her to budget (or not)
No rent or ins we will call it "covered".
Utilities
Gas
Food
Spending money
Health Insurance
Gym fee
Internet
Phone
Other


ME BS Male - 47
WS - 42
5 kids ages 4-16
3 D-Days
God help us.

Posts: 12 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: USA
sager
♀ Member
Member # 173
Default  Posted: 7:22 PM, August 23rd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hereIam... my experience is that when my SAH moved out, he went on the binge to end all binges. Most of his really, really bad acting out happened during that time. He came to understand that he needs the accountability, structure and love that his family gives him.

Unfortunately, this is your wife's decision. Maybe you could share with her your concern about what she could do with that kind of freedom and ask that she seriously discuss the basement option with her sponsor, her therapist and her 12 step group.

Sager


married 21 yr.
d-day #1 8/17/01
d-day #2 7/9/11
3 children - 20, 18, and 16
H in addiction recovery
"Well-behaved women do not make history."

Posts: 1192 | Registered: Jun 2002 | From: Upstate NY
sager
♀ Member
Member # 173
Default  Posted: 7:42 PM, August 23rd (Tuesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hi eveyone,
So I'm still know of numb and sad. We had a real blow out at MC on Monday (was that really only yesterday.) As planned i told him that I was serious about divorcing him if i ever found a porn site on my computer again. The therapist really pushed him on what that might mean to him (no job, no place to live, no family, loss of respect from his children, etc.). And I kept saying that those consequences are not my problem and it was up to him to decide if he ended up that way.

I said that I was pretty fed up waiting for him to get serious.... that I now saw 2 ways to get out of this stuck place that I'm in... either he gets well and we go on to our happy life or that he keeps acting out and I leave him and go on to a happy life. Either way, I'm going to have a happy life... it was him to decide what he wanted.

He tried to blame shift. He tried the "she is unsupportive and judgemental." PLLLLEEEEEAAASSSSEEEE! I have put up with his shananagons for 10 years!!! Interestingly, he was not able to recall a single incident when I was unsupportive or judgemental. NOT ONE.

So yesterday after I got home from work we talked a little more. This time he was more forth coming. Discussed his feelings and how scared he was. I explained that being able to not work while he is in early recovery is a luxury and an opportunity to put his all into it. And if he was working the program 100% I wouldn't even mind if he didn't look for a job for a while. But he is squandering the opportunity and i'm resentful. So maybe that does make me judgemental..... I guess I'm just tired of being the only adult in our family.


On a brighter note, my H is leading a meeting tonight and at dinner he shared that he was not feeling prepared. My son said, "Well, Dad, is there anything I can do to help you?" And my daughter said he could practice what he was going to say while he was driving to the meeting. I'm really proud of my kids. Maybe because that all have learning disabilities (and my daughter has CP also) they seem to accept that Dad has a disability (sickness, disease or whatever) too. They are very supportive and yet understand that it is up to him to make his life work. We've gotten to the point that we discuss recovery like we discuss the weather. It's much better than when we were hiding it. My son also said that they knew much more than we thought they did. He said that once they learned to read it was pretty easy to read "Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous"..... Damn that school for teaching them to read

Sager


married 21 yr.
d-day #1 8/17/01
d-day #2 7/9/11
3 children - 20, 18, and 16
H in addiction recovery
"Well-behaved women do not make history."

Posts: 1192 | Registered: Jun 2002 | From: Upstate NY
bent44
♀ Member
Member # 31386
Default  Posted: 12:05 AM, August 24th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hereIam... my experience is that when my SAH moved out, he went on the binge to end all binges. Most of his really, really bad acting out happened during that time. He came to understand that he needs the accountability, structure and love that his family gives him.

My story is very similiar, sort of. Unfortunately, my SA XWS has not chosen to return to the fold of his family. His life is a disaster.

Don't give these folks rope unless you are ready for the very real possibility they will hang themselves.

JMHO.


"If you marry a chicken, don't expect an eagle."


I don't know if my chicken will ever become an eagle. But rest assured, I'm going to be a phoenix. Nevermind that I am still in the ashes stage of the process.


Posts: 626 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: California
too trusting BW
♀ Member
Member # 15459
Default  Posted: 7:44 AM, August 24th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HereIam,

Something that just jumps out at me in your lists of pros and cons, is a lack of pros and cons for YOU.
You mention her acting out, her emotional space, her "vision, but nothing of how does this help ME become healthy or not?

Maybe you can go back and reframe your list only from a POV for your healing and see how these change.


Me 39
SA-FWH 44
11yrs M
In R-maybe
3 DC from Marriage #1
1 DS together
at least 4 d-days

Posts: 1300 | Registered: Jul 2007 | From: Kansas
KickedintheGut
♀ Member
Member # 30086
Default  Posted: 11:27 AM, August 24th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

In the same vein of not checking up - because I truly do not want any free energy I might have sucked away into that vortex - here's where my sticking point is.

I had no idea he had unprotected sex and he never would have told me. I don't want to be sick or die from something he contracted from someone else.

I have gotten to the point where I can let go of checking in and monitoring him. I still get triggery, but that's for me to work through and I am. It's the moments of "Oh my God, this man could expose me to something and in his attempt to protect himself never tell me and I could get sick and die." Then I bounce back to checking. I can't tell when he's lying any more.

Does that resonate with anyone else?


Me - BW (38) Him (calcitro) - SAWH (38)
2 Kids Working on R
DDay#1 - 11/9/10 - 2 year EA/PA
DDay #2 - 12/9/10
Disclosure - 4/8/11
Timeline - 5/9/11

Posts: 492 | Registered: Nov 2010
torn2bits
♀ Member
Member # 28376
Default  Posted: 9:21 PM, August 24th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

HereIAm: I know where you are. I actually have filed and he is still here in the house. Tootrusting is right. You need to be thinking about YOU and YOUR life. I know its so hard. This is NOT where we want to be but its happening.

KickedinGut: I can relate to you. I told SAWH recently and reminded him that we are clean. Me and the kids. I don't want him kissing them because he may have something that he is giving them and me. Ya know what he started doing? Trying to kiss me. I guess to show me that he is no longer with OW.

We are in limbo right now as I am seeing my life raising 3 kids as a single parent. On the good side, he is very much changed. Probably due to weekly IC. He still does all kinds of things for me. I think its guilt but I still have him do stuff for me.

Let us all remember that we need to do whats best for us and for OUR lives. Peace to all.


Me: 44/WH (SA): 49
M: 24 years 3 kids over 10 yrs old
EA/ PA Dec. 2009 -Divorce pending

Posts: 1240 | Registered: Apr 2010 | From: Midwest
HereIAmAgain22
♂ New Member
Member # 32987
Default  Posted: 10:26 PM, August 24th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Wow! Thank you for all of your responses. I totally relate to the philosophies on the co-dependent label and that it isn't an automatic just because you are spouse to an SA. It took a little strength, but I didn't even walk around the trees to see if her car was in front of the neighbor's tonight when out with the kids. Even though she was very upset when I got home and she was on her way out almost in tears. She said it wasn't me and then I talked to her sister - her sisters and mom have a trip to Vegas every September and her sisters are telling her essentially that they don't want her going. It's too early, it won't be fun for them or anyone else, she needs to get healthy, etc. Consequences! - and not from me who is really powerless to dole them out.

OK I'm not really happy that she us so troubled but she seems to not have hit bottom and realize the consequences of all this yet. The counselor conveyed just that and told her and so did her dad, my dad, my sister, my friends, etc.......Scary that it seems she will act out again (or how many times) before coming up above water but what else could one expect? That being said I am getting closer to my limit and she is flirting (OMG that is a bad choice of words) with major consequences if she doesn't get on the right side of recovery pretty soon. I really feel as though I'm in the last 6 months of a 5 year race and slowly but surely getting the urge to move on.

Of course I do want to keep my family together and raise these kids in the best situation - a healthy mom is always a plus - so I must give it this last round. I'm really feeling like if she gets - or can be - honest with herself that she will go to the basement. If she goes on a sexual binge or bender I'm not sure I can go on with this. Should I tell her this or just let it play out? As you can tell I'm getting much closer to being on the fence with this woman.

Thank you again for your support.



ME BS Male - 47
WS - 42
5 kids ages 4-16
3 D-Days
God help us.

Posts: 12 | Registered: Aug 2011 | From: USA
sager
♀ Member
Member # 173
Default  Posted: 5:17 PM, August 25th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

so, i finally installed netnanny on my computer. What took me so long????


married 21 yr.
d-day #1 8/17/01
d-day #2 7/9/11
3 children - 20, 18, and 16
H in addiction recovery
"Well-behaved women do not make history."

Posts: 1192 | Registered: Jun 2002 | From: Upstate NY
MySonshine
♀ Member
Member # 32252
Default  Posted: 10:45 PM, August 25th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

OK all I need some opinions. I am doing really well with my Al-anon and SAWH seems to be on the right track with his recovery. Full disclosure is scheduled for the first Tuesday in September. However right now I am feeling like I want to move back in our bed. I have been bouncing between the couch and my youngest's room since May. I told SAWH I would never sleep in "our" bed again because I didn't know if he had had sex on it with someone else. He still swears nobody ever came to our house and I am starting to believe him. I am doing really well on managing my triggers and the triggers I had for the bed are pretty much gone. My concerns are 1- I would be going back on my word that I wouldn't sleep on that bed ever again. 2- that he might get the wrong idea and try and start something physical which I am SOOOOO not ready for. I am just now getting used to him standing close to me, much less touching, kissing, or anything else. Anyways so what do you all think? Advice or points of views? Thanks!


BS-me 28
WH-28
Too many DDs to count.

Posts: 87 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Colorado
Notmetoo2011
♀ Member
Member # 32912
Default  Posted: 7:52 AM, August 26th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Sager

Hi again. Are you having success with Net Nanny? My WH has been all for installing software to prevent access to porn sites. We even had someone from a local computer company come in to try and set up parental controls but then we found we couldn't access lots of harmless sites also. We currently have a trial version of net nanny but although it blocks access to blatant porn sites it was still allowing access to other sites that he had used to fuel his addiction. For some reason it wouldnt let us add sites to the 'always block' list. I guess we are going to try calling their tech support line to see if they can help.

Thanks for the other advice you gave me in the PM. It helps to know how others handle these situations.


Me-BW 47
SAWH 48
Married 25 years.
4 children
D-Day 26/07/11
Multiple PAs, ONS,

Posts: 262 | Registered: Jul 2011
Mamato3
♀ Member
Member # 29624
Default  Posted: 11:40 AM, August 26th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

MySonshine:
Well, my FWH did have sex with his "girlfriend" in our bed. That very first night that he finally disclosed that to me, I was so angry and thought the same thing -- that I would NEVER sleep in that bed again. But I love my bed. I picked it out, it's the most comfortable bed in the world, etc.

So that first night, I put fresh sheets on it. And some close friends bought me brand new sheets the following day. I told my FWH that the bed was MY bed and that I might allow him to sleep in it.

Having new, fresh sheets made me feel a bit renewed about the bed. It may help you as well. It might seem simple or silly, but honestly, it helped me cleanse the bed a bit of OW.

And just making the statement to FWH that the bed was MINE helped keep things very clear as to some of my boundaries, ya know? I would say you could just tell your DH that you want your bed back and lay it all out on the line as to what you expect that to mean. You have the power to say no too as far as whether he gets to stay there and whether he's allowed to be intimate with you.

Those are just my thoughts. Hope that helped a bit.


Me - BW - 38
Him - FWH (and SA) - 39
2DDs (8&1), 2DSs (6&3)
1st D-day: 09.13.10 (admitted to EA)
2nd D-day: 01.31.11 (admitted to PA; almost two years with CW)
3rd D-day: 02.01.11 (admitted to more)
Working our SA/SAnon program

Posts: 64 | Registered: Sep 2010
sager
♀ Member
Member # 173
Default  Posted: 1:18 PM, August 26th (Friday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mysonshine,
I also flipped my mattress
Sager


married 21 yr.
d-day #1 8/17/01
d-day #2 7/9/11
3 children - 20, 18, and 16
H in addiction recovery
"Well-behaved women do not make history."

Posts: 1192 | Registered: Jun 2002 | From: Upstate NY
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