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User Topic: BS Questions for WS- Part 5
Merlin
♂ Member
Member # 30221
Default  Posted: 6:55 AM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BaxtersBFF,

This is the way my XW did everything having to do with the end of our marriage and family. She wouldn't do ANY
THING. So I filed, did all the documentation for both sides of the divorce.

She has her lawyer do EVERYTHING too. Even though the divorce was final in January, yesterday I met with her lawyer and mine over the sale of the house and tidying up details from the divorce. She wasn't even there.

I'm having my skin peeled off in all this. She gets big (permanent) alimony and way more than half of everything else. But others have to do it. She's too busy falling off barstools and acting like a slut to get involved.


"I never saw a wild thing sorry for itself. A bird will fall frozen dead from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself." D. H. Lawrence

Her: WW/56 Me: BS/62, 24yrs M
3 great kids, now 22, 20, 17 b,b,g
D-Day 8/14/08, D 1/13/11


Posts: 1106 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: East Coast
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 6:57 AM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

browniegirl,

How many of you eventually figured out that your affair happened because you were looking for something that might make you ahhpy and later found out that you were suffering from depression? How common is depression in WS? Have any of you considered that depression might be the real reason you were unhappy and sought out external validation
The search for happiness...happiness with the OP. Sure, that was part of it, but we all know the reality is that happiness with the OP is short-lived and does not fix inside of us that which is broken.

Depression played a role, and probably clinical depression too. I went on AD's right after my EA started. I stayed on them for a couple months and it was horrible. I think my problems are deeper than depression. Either that or I don't understand depression in its entirety.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:06 AM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

suckstobeme,

I don't have the experience of having D papers handed to me. However, I am a guy, sooo....

The blaze of glory thing might fit in this case. He may have been unwilling to be a man and file himself, so he let you do it for him. He then gets to avoid responsibility for the D itself by passive aggressively being lackadaisical about the whole process. He can take that kind of hit because he knows deep down that he is giving you what you want - a reason to D. I know that it appears he wants the D, and he thinks he does, but he doesn't appear to have the balls to do it himself.

There is a chance that he is being P/A in order to make it more expensive for you. Since he is representing himself, then it isn't costing him the same amount as you, who has hired the best ($$$).


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:12 AM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

wounded heart,

This question is for FWHs who have had problems getting the OW to leave them alone. Suggestions?
I didn't have this problem. In fact, sad to admit, I was this problem. I was thrown under the bus and then became the fisher for a relatively brief period. Part of what stopped it for me was no response from OW.

Block her, report her, tell her BH everytime it happens. Take heart that your WH is turning to you and not hiding these attempts at breaking NC from OW. As long as you present that united front, you can make it through this.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 7:19 AM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Merlin,

I hope you aren't in New Jersey. From what I have read here that state is horrible for BH's when it comes to D.

When I was trying to find a way to D my BW, it was weird because I was willing to live with being the bad guy, but I had talked myself into believing that I was being the good guy by letting her make that decision to D.

I think there are plenty of situations where the BS should file. But sometimes it isn't just a willy-nilly WS who is irresponsible and unable to file for D. Sometimes it is a very calculated move. After all, we had an A...how much worse is it to be the bad guy and do everything to get our BS to file?

Such messed up thinking...


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
betrayedmomof3
♀ Member
Member # 32093
Default  Posted: 2:45 PM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

BaxtersBFF - First thank you as well as the others on this thread for all of the insight. It really is a gift to confused BSs. I have a question about your previous post. You said you did everything you could to get your BS to file. Did she come out and ask you if you wanted D? If so, did you tell her no? Did you continue to tell her that you loved her and wanted to be with her? You said you had false R... why pretend to R when you were calculating D?

The way my WH has been acting has me very confused. He continues to say all of these things and that he feels for me how he did when we met, etc. But he refuses to even admit anything. He apologizes for "all that went wrong" instead of what he did (which was bring a MOW into my home, my bedroom when I was 8 months pregnant, with our young children in the house). Just for a little more background, I did leave immediately following dday. I did not do the 180 as I had no intentions of R. But I did continue to express my emotions to him (anger, hate, sadness, etc.) and he always listened. For the past 3 months I have had other things to deal with (newborn son being at the top of that list) but I think I was wavering on that decision. I recently discovered sex toys purchased by him 2 months ago. I have said goodbye but we have three children so there is no real closure. I am just wondering if that's what he is trying to do? Is he trying to make me go through the filing because he's too lazy/cheap?


Together 12 yrs, married 6
Dday from Hell 2/6/11
3 kids under 5
I would do anything to have my family in one piece but I know its shattered...

Posts: 108 | Registered: May 2011 | From: betrayedmomof3
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 4:24 PM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

betrayedmomof3,

Did she come out and ask you if you wanted D?
My memory is sort of fuzzy, but I think she did ask if I wanted to D.
If so, did you tell her no?
I told her that I didn't want to be married, but at the same time, I couldn't/wouldn't do it. I was a coward.
Did you continue to tell her that you loved her and wanted to be with her?
This is a major problem for me. I had stopped loving BW before the A. It was the wrong move for obvious reasons, but one that was made without ever having been involved in an A before. But once I did it, the damage was done and I have had a very hard time repairing that in myself. I believe I feel love toward my BW, but in the past four years I have only told BW that I love her maybe 6 or 7 times. And, I didn't tell her I wanted to be with her, I believe I said that I didn't want to hurt her. Obviously, I hurt her a lot by my words and actions.
You said you had false R... why pretend to R when you were calculating D?
False R was keeping photos and the original emails from OW hidden on my work computer. During this time, I was not actively seeking D or saying that I didn't want to be M. I had committed to R, and gotten rid of everything. Then I stumbled across those photos and emails and I kept them and didn't tell BW. That was what the false R was about.
I am just wondering if that's what he is trying to do? Is he trying to make me go through the filing because he's too lazy/cheap?
It can be multiple things, and only you will really know. It can be cheap and lazy. It can be scared to death and wanting to rugsweep. It can be loss of balls/cowardice. It can be the warped thinking that you are doing it for your BS. I think ultimately, it comes down to fear. If you boil everything down, even the cheap/lazy, it is because the WS is afraid to face their fears, admit they are wrong, so they forge ahead with what they think is the right decision at the time, but they don't realize they aren't thinking clearly in the first place and they just dig themselves in deeper and deeper.

[This message edited by BaxtersBFF at 4:47 PM, May 25th (Wednesday)]


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
betrayedmomof3
♀ Member
Member # 32093
Default  Posted: 5:43 PM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thanks for replying so quickly. I really have not been able to understand his POV at all.

I have another question... does the WS who wants to rugsweep ever R?


Together 12 yrs, married 6
Dday from Hell 2/6/11
3 kids under 5
I would do anything to have my family in one piece but I know its shattered...

Posts: 108 | Registered: May 2011 | From: betrayedmomof3
mostlymine
♀ Member
Member # 31511
Default  Posted: 6:11 PM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

For any of you that worked with the OP. Were you able to still work with them without continuing the affair? Did you slip and start up the affair again or were you able to keep your resolve about R?


BS- me (30ish)
See profile for details
Getting divorced... Wh is addicted to MOW
I edit because of typos...auto corrects stinks!

Posts: 830 | Registered: Mar 2011 | From: Texas
suckstobeme
♀ Member
Member # 30853
Default  Posted: 7:12 PM, May 25th (Wednesday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Baxters -

Yep. I believe that there is a massive amount of cowardice going on here. He did virtually nothing to move things forward. He said he didn't want to be married, but then it was like pulling teeth to get him to leave. He had to "process" all of his feelings. When he finally said he was leaving, he didn't do it quickly. I practically had to find the apartment for him. It was crazy.

I do think that there are a lot of other emotional issues going on inside of him. He's extremely conflict avoidant; he's got an addictive tendency; he's definitely depressed and has this grandois idea of what his life should be like.

I guess my next question then is whether the fact that his left us to go be with this OW who is a well known party girl and who likes the same kind of music as he does and who apparently sees her own children as often (not) as WH sees his own kids is a sign that he really didn't leave me, per se, but that he left this lifestyle. He did not want to be a father, a husband and a partner anymore and he dumped us for this grandois idea of what his life should be like - camping, following these stupid bands around the country, drinking and going to the local casinos. It's like he's reverted into a juvenile delinquent and is hell bent on convincing himself that this is his way to happiness.

If I think this way, am I just blowing sunshine up my own ass or is there really something to this attitude??????


BW - me
ExWH - "that one"
D - 2011
You get what you put in, and people get what they deserve.
Hard as it may be, try to never give the OP any of your power or head space.

Posts: 2506 | Registered: Jan 2011
shiloe
♀ Member
Member # 1224
Default  Posted: 4:46 AM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I was hoping one of the male WS could tell me why some WS get so very angry when caught. My WH got so angry, even though he kept denying everything, he was so angry, it was scary. Any insight you can tell me on this?


But remember, good love is hard to find . . -Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers
BS - 54
Cheater -54
Married 26 yrs
DD - 21 DD -19 DS-17
A#1 2000 with married ho-worker/neighbor ow#1
A#2 2007-? OW#2 LTA with married ho-worker. Kicked him out, he filed

Posts: 491 | Registered: Mar 2003
MRSery
♀ Member
Member # 32195
Default  Posted: 4:30 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I'm a BS and would love feedback from any WS willing to help.

I've been trying to read all the replies, there's so many and I have had some of my questions answered but I still have some confusion.

My H & I have had our share of problems over 11 yrs, communication being a big one. In Dec 2010 I finally had it and blew up told him to get out of the house. We had been silently battling our problems. After separation I found out about the A, which he said he was going to tell me about but still hadn't after 2 months of being with OW. He's still with the OW and I haven't really confronted him about it much, just told him to get his things out of the house. Almost 6 months later he still has yet to move anything out, he has not done anything legally speaking. ( We are common law, do not require divorce, only legal proceedures for debt, property and children)
I know about the OW, we do not talk about it and on Mother's Day I finally gave him the line in the sand.
I will look past the A if he goes to MC with me, along with some guidelines...NO DUE DATE. It's been almost 3 weeks and he hasn't said a thing to me. He is snooping in my room, he still comes to the house everyday, since he's paying the mortgage, he does everything like normal but sleep here. I have put a locking door knob on, I have tried to put in boundaries to no avail. He is a cake eater I know but what is my next step?. I have been doing 180 for sometime already.

Do I need to draw that line a little deeper for him to get it?
Is my H still in the fog/sitting on the fence?
Is he hoping I get tired of waiting & wants me to follow through with finalizing things?


Actions speak louder then words..

Posts: 68 | Registered: May 2011 | From: Vancouver, Canada
momoffive
♀ Member
Member # 27352
Default  Posted: 7:14 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Situation:

WH is now seeing a CSAT, beginning his 90 day celibacy, attending SA group, but still not communicating with me, doesn't share anything, doesn't acknowledge my feelings, comes across with the philosophy that if he doesn't talk about it, doesn't have to deal with me.Also told me just the other week that he doesn't feel remorse for me.

Question:

As a WH/SAWH with the possibility of losing "everything", why wouldn't you tryto make an effort for your devastated and hurt BW?


BW 44, SAWH 45(sorry1)
M24 yrs
DD 23,16,13 DS 21, 18
Dday1-7/3/09 EA OW4
Dday2-9/1/09 PA OW4
Dday3 3/14/10 Farmville sexting, OW3
Dday4 3/13/11 Secret texting, would be OW5-she said no
Dday5 8/2/11 PA 10 years ago OW1, kissing 4 years ago OW2

Posts: 1123 | Registered: Jan 2010 | From: Pennsylvania
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:07 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

betrayedmomof3,

does the WS who wants to rugsweep ever R?
Some do, some don't. I sort of think most WS want to rugsweep at some point. Whether they can overcome that want/need/urge to rugsweep is going to depend on whether they can face their own fears that have are hidden. Meaning, most of our problems seem to boil down to fear of some sort. But we are really good at hiding from those fears, because we have been doing that for most of our lives.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:10 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

mostlymine,

For any of you that worked with the OP. Were you able to still work with them without continuing the affair? Did you slip and start up the affair again or were you able to keep your resolve about R?
I didn't work with OP. But I can't imagine working with OP after an A. I would have gone nuts or had a heart attack by now. I would have slipped up and I would be D if I worked with OP.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:10 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Double post...

[This message edited by BaxtersBFF at 9:11 PM, May 26th (Thursday)]


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:30 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

suckstobeme,

He had to "process" all of his feelings.
I said the same thing...pretty embarrassed about that now.

I do think that there are a lot of other emotional issues going on inside of him. He's extremely conflict avoidant; he's got an addictive tendency; he's definitely depressed and has this grandois idea of what his life should be like.
I told my BW over and over that "this wasn't the life that I might have had had I known different", which was just me being whiny because I had talked myself into believing that OW and I were meant to be together since we were BF-GF during the summer after we graduated HS. Again...pathetic...

I always have figured that the BS knows that their WS has the potential to be aware of their own emotions like you do your WH, but it is a question of whether their WS can overcome all of their learned behaviours which they have developed over the years and which have allowed them to hide from those emotions for so long.

If I think this way, am I just blowing sunshine up my own ass or is there really something to this attitude??????
I think there are a couple things going on.

First, he is in an A, which means he is feeling really good, literally feeling high. How can something that makes you feel that way be bad?

Second, although he is on this high, he is probably aware of what he would have to face if he were to stop the A and try to R. It probably scares the shit out of him, so he is going to go with what feels good.

So really, it isn't about you. And it isn't about him not wanting the life he has as a husband and father. It's that he is just scared to look in the mirror and to deal with those things that are broken within himself.

From how you describe him (being full of emotion, but adept at conflict avoidance), he is a master at making things fit for himself. This isn't necessarily a selfish things going on with him, it is a self-preservation thing. We (the collective SI we) know that what he is experiencing right now won't last forever. When it starts crashing down, or coming apart, he will realize what he lost, but it is still going to be only up to him as to whether he will be able to change himself to fix what is wrong. It takes a lot of courage to do that. Hopefully he can find it before it is too late.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:40 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

shiloe,

I was hoping one of the male WS could tell me why some WS get so very angry when caught. My WH got so angry, even though he kept denying everything, he was so angry, it was scary. Any insight you can tell me on this?
I think part of the anger has to do with being wrong. When the A is happening, everything just seems to feel right (some more than others) so it just keeps going and it feels even more right. Then, for those WS who get caught especially, they have to immediately face that they were wrong, whereas those WS who confess sort of have time to realize eventually that they were wrong.

How many of us like being told we are wrong? Doesn't matter, WS or BS, some of us just absolutely hate being wrong, and with A's, there is no right.

The other dynamic is that there is some conflict with where that anger should be directed and where it ends up. What I mean is that the WS is really angry at themselves. But to be angry at themselves is to admit they are wrong, but the anger is still there, so it is directed at the BS.

Think about it, as sad as it is, how many of us have gotten mad at our kids when really we are just angry with ourselves, yet we take it out on our kids.

For some WS, that anger may pass eventually and they may start to see what is going on. For others, they might dig in their heels and hang onto that anger so that they will never have to admit they are wrong.

Is any of that close?


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 9:54 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

MRSery,

I am being a total post whore, and I don't usually point out my own posts...but I had a few at the top of this page and on the previous page explaining how some WS won't do anything and leave all the work to the BS thinking that they are giving their BS a valid reason to be the one to leave. It is a very manipulative way of doing things as a WS who is not working on R.

Given that there is no due date, he still comes to the house and is still seeing OW, your WH is definitely a cake-eater. Tell me you aren't sleeping with him.

Your choices are to start the process of making your separation permanent, set dates with definite boundaries, force the issue everytime you see him, or turn up the heat on the 180. I think the BS's here would have a better idea of which way you should go, but it is your decision. Whatever that decision is, it should put you first in the equation.

Him going through your things is normal. He's probably talked himself into believing you are cheating on him which would justify what he is doing to you.

From what I have read here, the idea is that he needs to be knocked off the fence. It isn't necessarily your responsibility, but there are things you can do. Who all knows about his A? What can you do legally that might make an impact on his life/pocketbook? I don't know...I think you should ask the BS's.

What does he think about counseling? What does he think about the communication issues?


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
BaxtersBFF
♂ Member
Member # 26859
Default  Posted: 10:04 PM, May 26th (Thursday), 2011View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

momoffive,

I just looked at sorry1's last post on SI which reads

sorry1 - I wrote letters to all of my children to let them know that even though I did the family wrong, I was still there father and I was not going to leave them. They all read their letters but non of them talked to me about it.
It seems poignant (is that the right word?) that he made the effort to talk to each of his kids but they didn't talk to him. Is this a pattern in his life?

I wonder if he feels like the victim here. Not the victim role that we read here as it relates to a WS in an A, but a victim as in he has tried to communicate in his own way but feels that noone has ever appreciated that. I can understand that feeling/mindset. It hurts. It is the one thing for which my skin is paper thin, and one event can slice me to the core, so my reaction is to do it back, to hurt them back for hurting me.

That was my standard MO. It has changed because I am more aware of it now, but it still happens from time to time.

This may not be an A related thing to him. There's the A, then there is the rest of the problems in his life that he has to face.


WH - 44
BW - gerrygirl

Posts: 6048 | Registered: Dec 2009 | From: Boise
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