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User Topic: BS Questions for WS- Part 5
hopelessromantic
♀ Member
Member # 25415
Default  Posted: 7:36 AM, November 12th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Struggling today

It's been 19 months and my H has been a tremendous support in the aftermath of his A. My struggles are mine, I know, but perhaps a Wayward could help me.

I find myself, after all this time, still trying to make sense of it all. I know, I've read that it will never make sense, but for me, I feel like I *need* it to make sense for me to fully accept it.

In the week following D-day - we were both a mess, barely getting thru the days. I had so many questions and I fired them at him one after another without even giving him a chance to answer the first one. So when he first started spouting out his attempt to answer my questions I feel like he was giving me answers he *thought* I wanted to hear and not so much truthful answers. He was angry for getting caught, for being stupid in doing it in the first place, so his answers were projecting his feeling angry and stupid. So once he started to really face it and dig down to what was really going on with *him*. His answers started changing. According to him, the "real" truth then started coming out and the things he said in the week of D-day was so messed up he didn't know what he was saying, he was merely trying to tread water and survive.

So my question is, in the moments after D-day did you you simply try to appease your BS with minimal "truths" or give responses to questions with what *you* thought your BS wanted to hear?

I think I'm struggling to move forward because I'm trying to make EVERYTHING he has said/explained about the A fit into once nice neat little package and there are some things that just don't "fit" and the pieces that don't fit are the ones holding me back, making me paranoid.

Hope I made some kind of sense in my question. I tried not to write a book of what I'm feeling/thinking, but sometimes it's hard


BS-Me FWS-him (bigdog)
D-Day 5/3/09 TT til 6/22/09
Behind every woman scorned is a man who made her that way.

Posts: 2836 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Midwest
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 5:31 PM, November 12th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

A question about MC.

How long did you engage in it & what, in your opinion, did you get out of it?

Long story short, we are 14 months out. After a few stumbles, H has been accountable and has made changes to help me feel more secure. Problem is I'm still struggling to accept what happened - that he was able to not only have a physical, but also a deep emotional attachment to someone during the course of our marriage. I'm also feeling a lot like Plan B - I know how everyone says OW is really irrelevant to the whole thing - in thesense that it could've been anyone - nothing necessarily special about her - it's still hard for me to think I'm what he wants now or that I'm enough, when he's not running to the phone to call me every hour like he was with her.
Ok - so maybe it's not such a short history. Lol.
We went to mc for 4 weeks after DDay, then I stopped it when he broke NC & I thought we were going to be done. Scheduling issues made going back really hard.
Anyway, given our lack of progress, I've started up again, but my H is loathe to go - says it won't do anything. He is willing to go tho.
What did you get out of it & how often did you go? When did you feel like you didn't need to go anymore & did your opinion differ from your BS assessment?

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 5:32 PM, November 12th (Friday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
FmrLIer
♀ Member
Member # 29784
Default  Posted: 8:35 PM, November 12th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

@getting real,

Thank you so much for responding. I thought about letting him know how much I appreciate how transparent he his being but I don't want to be like, "hey, glad you left your cell phone number with the texts open on the bed all day for me to see", or "thanks for leaving your email open while you were away from your desk" because I feel like if I do then he'll stop. But, in retrospect, if I acknowledge it, he'll be more inclined to be more open and appreciate the fact that I noticed he's making the effort. Duh, common sense right?

You're right, the "us" time has made a huge different. Along with the simple day to day conversations.

Thanks again!


Me (BS)
Him (fSAH)
OA/PA

Ignorance was bliss but it wasn't the reality of my marriage...


Posts: 427 | Registered: Oct 2010
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 9:19 AM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hopelessromantic - I find myself, after all this time, still trying to make sense of it all. I know, I've read that it will never make sense, but for me, I feel like I *need* it to make sense for me to fully accept it. ... So my question is, in the moments after D-day did you simply try to appease your BS with minimal "truths" or give responses to questions with what *you* thought your BS wanted to hear?

While it might be easier on my self-image to be able to say that my responses to my wife in the earliest days after d-day were the truth and the whole truth from the first question onward, the reality is closer to what your own husband described.

Not unlike your H, my answers from the first days to now have changed somewhat.

I donít think that I tried to appease my wife with minimal truths. I tried to answer as well as I could but the answers were not full and complete due to a lack of self knowledge.

I donít think that I gave responses based on ďwhat I thoughtĒ my BS wanted to hear. I tried to answer as truthfully as possible but I had difficulty in articulating my thoughts and fears in those early days.

But the fact remains the reasons why are not simple to articulate. I think that for most of us, the saddest fact is that we just donít know the answer to the question why. We donít know the answer because we never looked at the question before hand.

Unknown Poster - The mind of a WS is a very sordid, confused place during the preamble, main body, and post mortem of an A. Don't give us too much credit for rational thought.

However in the days following the affair, there is a need to figure out why, not only to answer the question that the BS is asking but there is a more compelling need, for the remorseful WS and thatís to answer the question for themselves. Obviously we know the details of the affair but if you read the quote below, you will see it opens up a huge can of worms for the WS to figure out how and why they became this new and different person.

I think that there are different types of affairs and different types of people who have them. Whether itís a perfect storm affair or the very slippery road of validation, there truth is that quite often, the WS awakes one day to find his whole life in a shambles. The act of compartmentalization which so facilitates the ability to have an affair by allowing you to have two totally opposite points of view for your action comes crashing down.

HUFI - In recent weeks, I am starting to learn that my own heart and mind are not always my best friend either as I try to peel away the onion of intertwined thoughts, actions, emotions, fears, passions and destructive behaviours that brought me to this affair.

The fact is that my original answers were given by someone that simply did not have the answers within him yet becasue I had not done any real thinking beforehand.

I honestly think that I was trying to be open and honest with my replies but the fact remains that I had not yet done the hard work to dig down and come up with the reasons why. Why did I have the affair? Why did I let my actions disconnect from my moral point of view. What was within me that allowed me to say I love you to my wife one minute and then phone the AP in the next half hour and say I love you to her? What was it? What deep psychology was there? Well, those answers have come slowly over the past year as I asked myself those questions and as my BS has asked those questions.

And in the slow understanding of those reasons and those compulsions and those hidden thoughts and feelings, my answers have changed to an extent. Not changed insofar as a 100 percent change but rather they are deeper and more reflective answers.

I fear that the simple answer is that there is no simple answer for so many of us. Perhaps for those with a drunken ONS and a predatory AP, the answer can be easier to understand but for those of us who left apparently great marriages to have an affair, the truth is harder to know and understand. No simple answer and no simple process to deal with the betrayal.

It seems to me that to fully understand the how and why of the affair so you can make sense of it would require that you need to fully understand your WS and feel and understand his thoughts, feelings, motives, desires, wants and needs at that time.

But if we canít even understand what was happening in our hearts and our minds, it just might be too hard to explain it to our BSís.

I understand your need to ďmake senseĒ of it all but the sad truth is that not all of life can be reduced to a simple answer.

HUFI


Unknown Poster - For every lie I told her, I told two to myself.

[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 9:23 AM, November 15th (Monday)]


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3218 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
PrettyWings
♀ Member
Member # 25305
Question  Posted: 1:53 PM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

What did it take for you to move out of the self-loathing phase? When did you feel like you deserved the love that your BS was trying to give you? When did you accept that love?


Me - BGF - 30
Her - WGF - 30
D-Day - Apr. 28 2009; TT for months

Anyone can give up, it's the easiest thing in the world to do. But to hold it together when everyone else would understand if you fell apart, that's true strength.


Posts: 52 | Registered: Aug 2009 | From: California
Listeningclosely
♂ Member
Member # 16472
Default  Posted: 3:39 PM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

PrettyWings -

What did it take for you to move out of the self-loathing phase? When did you feel like you deserved the love that your BS was trying to give you? When did you accept that love?

For a FWS, that's kind of a loaded question. For me at least. Because I think you are looking at very different subjects.

The self loathing started to decrease when I allowed myself to believe that each day I had a new opportunity to make right choices. But it feels like it will be a never ending process. I will never stop hating the person I allowed myself to become. But there comes a point when you need to stop letting that hatred of who you were prevent you from becoming who you truly are. For me that probably happened around month 5 or 6, about the time I shook the fog off and started doing the real work of healing.

As for deserving the love my BW has given me, I'm not sure I'll ever feel I deserve love at that level. About a year or 18 months in I started to accept that I was worthy of being loved, and that when offered from my BW I should accept it gratefully. But the love she has shown me - to still accept me after all I did to her - still feels to me like more than anyone deserves. It's not so much about deserving anyway. More like honoring her gift by accepting it in return.

I think most of the time when FWS's are asked about self loathing and hatred, the question is there because the FWS is letting their hatred of themselves paralyze them in the darkness. The time frame on when they can emerge from that darkness will vary by FWS. But the critical elements are that the FWS continue staying dedicated to counseling until they can find the path toward moving forward and loving themselves enough to accept the love of others.


BW(her)- 45, FWH (me) 48
4 month Online EA
M 23 years, together for 28
4 Daughters - 21, 18, 14 and 12
d-day 6/2/07, in R
FORGIVENESS 1/1/2008!!!
"Action expresses priorities." -
Mohandas Gandhi

Posts: 4454 | Registered: Oct 2007 | From: One Particular Harbour
hopelessromantic
♀ Member
Member # 25415
Default  Posted: 7:25 PM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

thanks HUFI! I always find your words soothing - for whatever reason.

It's just hard some days to look at him and think about who he was during that time frame - because it truly was not *him* - it's not who he is in his soul. It just makes me so sad some days.


BS-Me FWS-him (bigdog)
D-Day 5/3/09 TT til 6/22/09
Behind every woman scorned is a man who made her that way.

Posts: 2836 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Midwest
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 9:48 PM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Hopelessromantic - It's just hard some days to look at him and think about who he was during that time frame - because it truly was not *him* - it's not who he is in his soul. It just makes me so sad some days.
I just wanted to touch on your statement of being sad because it truly was not *him*, itís not who he was in his soul.

I donít know your husband and canít speak for him but perhaps, if he feels remorse to any extent like I do for my actions, then perhaps we can share some similarities as to what we think and what we think about. That means that perhaps, even today, he also feels sad over the loss of his integrity and his soul and his honour during his affair, not unlike your own thoughts.

I posted once about the old HUFI, the one called Mushball by some of my friends. The guy that would have been described as the perfect husband, a great guy, the salt of the earth, honest and caring, a real stand-up guy, someone who always did the right thing. It might come across as boastful but those were the epitaphs that were bantered about.

I used to use the word honourable, now I am a two timing cheating bastard with no honour and no self respect. I used to get indignant over accusations of lying; now I know that Iím a lair. Worse yet, I lied to the one person who should have always seen honesty from me. I used to be secretly proud of being seen as the good guy, now I hide my secret shame. I used to be a knight in shining armour and now I know that Iím pond scum or worse - HUFI

The problem is that the good and loyal husband was not the real HUFI. Sadly enough, the real HUFI somehow cheated and lied to his wife. The real HUFI would daydream about another woman and wish that he had married her instead. HUFI was a cheater and a liar. So, the question to ask is this? Was the real me the person before the affair or the person during the affair? Is the real HUFI the one that is answering this post right now?

These questions are not easy ones to ask of oneís self in the aftermath of the affair. They raise the spectre of a failed man. A deceitful man. An adulterer. A man who had lost his morals or worse still, a man who had no morals to start with. Which was the real me and how do I find him again? If the real me always had the seeds of a cheater within, what do I do with the old HUFI now? Is that just one little sick part that I can cut out of my soul or has my actions tainted myself forever? The WSís use the phrase ďlooking in eh mirrorĒ quite often and that means, as you stare into the mirror while shaving, you have certain thoughts enter into your head.

The affair has changed me and I donít like what I see. I donít like the lesson that I have learned and I donít like how it came to be. The HUFI that stares at me in the mirror is not the same person that I used to see only a year ago. I see someone who cheated on his wife which means that I lost my integrity. I cheated and that meant that I hurt you - HUFI

Given your time here, your H may still be grieving the loss of his own image in the mirror even now. Your H probably still wonders how he went from there to here. Your husband may still be questioning the values and morals and guidelines in his heart and his head right now. Your husband may also be trying to figure out how he can make sure that the evil side never comes out again. Your husband is probably sad over the loss of the real ĎbigdogĒ too!

Somehow, I failed. The HUFI that I created was good but not good enough. Not good enough to have honour when I needed it. Not good enough to have integrity when it was demanded of me. Not good enough to stay faithful when the temptation was there. I have a whole HUFI to put back together again. I feel like Humpty Dumpty some days and I worry about ever being put back together - HUFI

The process of R is difficult for everyone involved and perhaps even more so on this issue as it touches onto the bedrock of integrity and honour that exists within the remorseful WS. I think it will be hard for you to share your thoughts with your husband. Itís easy to yell the words Ďyouíre a looser and you have no firkin moralsĒ in anger but harder to criticize in calm discussion. And the truth is that it can hurt like a knife to hear those words from your wife. But perhaps, if you share your thoughts on this, he can open up a bit on his despair and his worries and his internal struggle on this issue too.

That loss of yourself that comes from waking up one day and finding that you are capable of ripping the heart out of your wife is not easy to get over. Perhaps together, you can figure out a way to heal together.

HUFI

Unknown - Myths reveal how we wish to think of ourselves, how we would like to be, if only we had the courage.


[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 10:22 PM, November 15th (Monday)]


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3218 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 10:12 PM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((PrettyWings))

PrettyWings - What did it take for you to move out of the self-loathing phase?

I canít really answer this as Iím not out of the self loathing phase yet. Perhaps I am over the darkest parts but I canít be sure of that either. I am determined that my chance at R will not suffer from my depression over my actions. And trust me; I have hit the lows of despair quite often. But while it may subside, I am actually holding onto the feeling because it drives me to want to succeed at R. I think the feelings will subside as I get closer to self-forgiveness. And until I can figure out how I went from supposedly good guy to cheater in less than a week, I donít think that I can talk about forgiving my actions. And that means, without self-forgiveness, there will always be room for self-loathing.

PrettyWings - When did you feel like you deserved the love that your BS was trying to give you?

Iím different from Listeningclosely on this issue. To me, there is no such thing as ďdeserving loveĒ but rather itís a matter of accepting love. Love maybe shown by actions but itís driven by feelings and the love that my BS is giving me was hers to give, not mine to receive. Perhaps I am not articulating this well but I wanted and needed the love that my BS had already given me from when I first met her. For as much as I can say, her love has never faltered. She loves me regardless of my faults and I felt that love each and every day.

Is your WS stuck in the self-loathing game right now? Trust me; itís a very easy pit fall for the WS to fall into. If your spouse has any depression issues, then it will be even harder to climb out of the pit. If heís very guilty and very remorseful, then ditto the same remark. WS after WS struggles to see how the BS can still love them after the affair and it takes a whole lot of soul searching and counselling to get over this issue.

The post above this touches on the issue of self-forgiveness and on the demons that your WS is facing as he tries to make sense of the affair. Perhaps it might give you some answers.

HUFI

If you have lost hope, hold onto faith. When faith deserts you, hold onto sheer stubbornness and pigheadedness - HUFI


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3218 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
hopelessromantic
♀ Member
Member # 25415
Default  Posted: 10:13 PM, November 15th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Given your time here, your H may still be grieving the loss of his own image in the mirror even now. Your H probably still wonders how he went from there to here.

Sadly, this is all true. He failed, he sees himself as a failure, to me, to himself, to family. I'm certain the A was a "perfect storm" scenario. Yet to this day, I sit and ponder what *I* could have done differently to change the outcome of it all. I know the answer is "nothing" but I'm still left wondering "what if" and those are killers even 19 months later.

In my head, I can logically piece together his story and know that for the most part, it's all there. It's truth. Yet my heart says "really? He really did this to you?" It's not like I never shared this fear with him having been thru it before with my first H. Bigdog KNEW I couldn't fair well going thru this again and yet, he did it. That's so hard to swallow and perhaps that's where I'm stuck. He's wonderful. Has been. Even the months prior to his A and the short time of his A (it was only short because he got caught ) he was my "everything". He was my husband and thru surgery, cancer scare, all of it, I took care of him without even thinking. He felt worthless. I *knew* he was struggling, I tried to talk about it. He wouldn't open up. I trusted even though I saw the struggles he was having. I just didn't know what they were, but I still trusted him. I think that's what hurts so badly. Maybe that's why I play the "what if's" because my fears were there and I couldn't get him to trust *me* enough to tell me what was going on with him.

Now, he does, without fail. He's realized how easy it is, and when he does, he realizes that I still love him just the same. That thinking is foreign to me.


BS-Me FWS-him (bigdog)
D-Day 5/3/09 TT til 6/22/09
Behind every woman scorned is a man who made her that way.

Posts: 2836 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Midwest
ambivalent
♀ Member
Member # 30106
Default  Posted: 5:58 PM, November 16th (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I apologize if someone has already asked this question. I have read through a lot of posts of BS questions for WS and I can't seem to find anything that fits my particular question.

My WH engaged in a short term OA with a past co-worker. His story is that she came on to him and he went along for the ride. I don't know that I believe that totally but really that is not the issue. He insists to me that he had absolutely no feelings for her. He says it was a game. If he chatted with her great, if he wasn't he didn't think about it. Maybe it is because I a am woman but is it conceivable that it was just a game and the rush was what kept him coming back? I don't want to get too lengthy with this but I am sure that there was no PA. He is in Iraq. When he came home for leave he did text with her and saw her twice but I know the time lines of when they "bumped" into each other so I am satisfied that if there was anything physical it did not involve sex. He has repeatedly told me that he is horrified by his actions, he has agreed to and to my knowledge complied with every demand I placed on him. My brain just can't fathom graphic sex chats and no emotional attachment.


BW - me (46)
Fwh - him (45)
After 2 months TT final DD 17AUG10
R with more good days than bad

Paranoia? Hell, no. Heightened awareness is more like it.

Sometimes you're the bird, and sometimes you're the windshield.


Posts: 75 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: Michigan
Damaged2010
♀ Member
Member # 30085
Default  Posted: 9:54 PM, November 16th (Tuesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I need help from a wayward! I am wondering if a wayward out here who's affair was with a co-worker and still works with that person would be willing to pm me and answer a few questions roaming through my head. They are mostly general questions like how do you feel when you see that person, do you miss them when you see them, how did the attraction cease after being caught.....etc.

My husbands affair was with a co-worker who he still works with, not closely but still the same building. I'm trying very hard to understand and grasp that it is possible that he sees her and feels nothing. I am having a hard time understanding that he was so attracted to her then got caught and now she is unattractive, maybe you can make me understand since I am not angry with YOU and might actually listen. I know it's an odd request but it's worth a shot. Thanks!


Me (BS) - 36 Him (WS) - 35
Together 15 years, with four kids-14, 12 and 4 yr old twins.
D-Day-Oct.4th, 2010 FR discovered Oct.7th, 2011 A went on til Jan 2011
"The grass is NOT greener on the other side,its greener where you water it"

Posts: 158 | Registered: Nov 2010 | From: Illinois
fooledbyapilot
♀ Member
Member # 26349
Default  Posted: 10:19 AM, November 17th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have been really struggling the last couple of weeks as the one year anti-versary was yesterday so I haven't been the nicest person to be around.

Yesterday, (anti-versary) my WH left for work. I sent him the following text message prior to him catching his flight:

"I love you.....you have my heart in your hand, please don't break it again xxxx ooooo"

So I waited for a reply, none. 4 hours later he calls me to say he is back at his base and at the hotel. I waited to see if he would mention the text, nothing. I finally said, did you get the text? My phone was off, just got it. Nothing else said.

I send another text after call saying, some text messages need a reply. Reply received: Yes I love you.

Of course now I sit there and think why can't you respond to not breaking my heart which is in your hand.

Now go back and forth on text, then he calls. Still nothing about my heart breaking.

4 hours later, I basically tell him how I thought he would reply.

Of course I then get the reply that I wanted from the beginning.

So now I sit, thinking, why do I have to spoon feed him. Did he not reply specifically because he is going to break my heart again and doesn't want to say he won't????

I hate this roller coaster. How do I broach this with him without setting off an argument. Is this just a man vs woman thing?

Help.....


ME(BS):47 HIM (WS):50
WS Married 21 yrs together 33
dd#1- nov 16, 2009
DD#2-went out NYE 2009-found out Feb 2012
DD#2-Feb 5, 2010-date they had(found out Feb 2012)
dd#3 - June 16, 2010-broke NC
dd#4-Dec 31, 2010-broke contact
DD#5-Feb 21, 201

Posts: 186 | Registered: Nov 2009
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 12:13 PM, November 17th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Fooledbyapilot - I love you.....you have my heart in your hand, please don't break it again xxxx ooooo" ..... So I waited for a reply, none. .... Still nothing about my heart breaking ....

Yes, he sure wasn't being Mr. Sensitive. However, in his defence, the truth is that a lot of us men and that includes me, are not particular sensitive to the needs of women in general and sometimes, a BS in particular.

I know that the WS side is full of advice on how to become more sensitive to your BSís. How to read their moods and if in doubt, ask but you know what they say about advice. Easy to give and hard to follow.

Perhaps he saw your message as an admonition or a rule to follow and honestly felt that he was in fact following that instruction and felt no need to state the obvious. You know that you were reaching out for reassurance with that message but for an insensitive guy, it also could have simply been a straight forward statement of ďwomenís feelingsĒ and he simply didnít think it needed any special reaction.

Yes, I know ... he should have read in-between the lines and know what was in your heart but the truth is, not all husbands are mind readers and not all of us are emotionally clued in.

Fooledbyapilot - Why do I have to spoon feed him. Did he not reply specifically because he is going to break my heart again and doesn't want to say he won't????

I donít know the dynamics of your R but when I read this statement, I wonder if youíre not jumping to conclusions over his act of thoughtlessness. His failure to respond doesnít mean that he is going to break your heart. It might just mean that he is not the worlds most sensitive husband. Okay, maybe it means that heĎs the most insensitive husband. LOL

Seriously, I have to ask why you jumped to the worst case scenario. IS this your gut check telling you that R is not going well? Has he done or said other things that make you doubt his remorse and regret?

Perhaps his on-off pattern of NC and contact with the OW seems to indicate that he was in the fog for quite some time after D-day but I don't think that this one incident would be enough to suspect that he is back to his old tricks. Could it simply be that he is just struggling with ďgestures and words of affectionĒ in the aftermath of his affair?

I know that I struggle with these expressions myself because I feel that each time I do say them, that my wife is thinking, yeah, didnít he say those words to the AP too? That brings back feelings of shame and guilt and regret and sometimes, it means, that the words seem to stick in my throat. Perhaps your H was only going through this too? Sad to say but the only real way that you will know for sure is to ask him.

Fooledbyapilot - How do I broach this with him without setting off an argument? Is this just a man vs. woman thing?

There is no easy way to broach this. You will have to be fairly blunt (I donít do well with sly and clever innuendo either) and come right out and ask, could you not read that I was looking for reassurance and if so, why didnít you give it to me? Yes, asking this question may lead to an argument over the intent and how men read messages different from women but you will never know if you donít ask. BTW, do you share a common love language or are you different. If you arenít aware of this, then may I suggest that you read the book by Gary Chapman, Five Languages of Love. And if youíre asking about the difference between men and women, then the book Men Are From Mars, Women Are From Venus.

Best luck with your discussion with your H on this.

HUFI

DECIDE. CHOOSE. COMMIT. PERIOD.

[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 12:16 PM, November 17th (Wednesday)]


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3218 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
fooledbyapilot
♀ Member
Member # 26349
Default  Posted: 1:06 PM, November 17th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Thank you for your reply to my question.

I actually thought the same thing regarding jumping to the conclusion that he won't answer because he intends to break my heart.

I think I will bring it up when he gets home as we have had several discussions about making me feel "safe" and reassurance and I think he struggles with how to do this and perhaps this is why he didn't reply in the way I wanted. He just misses the point.

Man rule #1....."we are not mind readers"

Thanks again.


ME(BS):47 HIM (WS):50
WS Married 21 yrs together 33
dd#1- nov 16, 2009
DD#2-went out NYE 2009-found out Feb 2012
DD#2-Feb 5, 2010-date they had(found out Feb 2012)
dd#3 - June 16, 2010-broke NC
dd#4-Dec 31, 2010-broke contact
DD#5-Feb 21, 201

Posts: 186 | Registered: Nov 2009
RKT429SS
♂ Member
Member # 28883
Default  Posted: 2:00 PM, November 17th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Bump.

Man I would pay money for a WS who works with/near their AP to answer Damaged2010ís question. Because, her and I are in very similar circumstances with my WW working at same facility as her AP.

I need help from a wayward! I am wondering if a wayward out here who's affair was with a co-worker and still works with that person would be willing to pm me and answer a few questions roaming through my head. They are mostly general questions like how do you feel when you see that person, do you miss them when you see them, how did the attraction cease after being caught.....etc.
My husbands affair was with a co-worker who he still works with, not closely but still the same building. I'm trying very hard to understand and grasp that it is possible that he sees her and feels nothing. I am having a hard time understanding that he was so attracted to her then got caught and now she is unattractive, maybe you can make me understand since I am not angry with YOU and might actually listen. I know it's an odd request but it's worth a shot. Thanks!



Me - BS 38
Her - WS 37
MOM - coworker,with 2 kids, EA&PA approx. 6 mo
Us Married 10 yrs (together 15 yrs)
1 girl, 1 boy
DDay 3.15.2010
Working on R

Posts: 216 | Registered: Jun 2010
HUFI-PUFI
♂ Member
Member # 25460
Default  Posted: 3:52 PM, November 17th (Wednesday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

((( RKT429SS & Damaged2010 )))

I would like to answer your question but itís outside the realm of my experience. Thank God!

The questions are answered by WS on a rather ad hoc basis as time and energy permit. Tthat means that they don't always get a reply within the day however the good news is that someone usually comes along sooner rather than later.

HUFI

[This message edited by HUFI-PUFI at 3:53 PM, November 17th (Wednesday)]


Donít listen to your head, itís easily confused. Donít listen to your heart, its fickle. Listen to your soul, God doesn't steer you wrong.

Posts: 3218 | Registered: Sep 2009 | From: Azilda, Northern Ontario
hurting38
♀ Member
Member # 29829
Default  Posted: 3:22 PM, November 18th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hello all. I posted this also in R but I am thinking I may get some better feedback in a thread like this.

I hope I can articulate what I need here in a way that makes sense....
Recently, I have decided to get rid of my wedding band and basically converge my engagement ring and the diamonds on the wedding band together to form a new engagement ring. I have asked my WH to eventually buy me a new band and complete new vows to me.

I have been working on grieving the loss on our old marriage, an emotion I had really struggled with more than any other. IC has helped tremendously and as I work to accept our new marriage reality, having that wedding band on my finger seems like a lie to me and counterproductive to my healing. I added the diamonds from the old band to symbolize the "good parts" of our relationship and marriage from the past and the engagement diamond which symbolizes that he loves me above all others (this I do believe)and wants me as his wife( a promise to me he made good on).

I received my adjusted engagement ring back yesterday and I can tell my husband is hurt by it. We talked briefly about it and he stated he completely understands my rationale but for him, it is just a reminder of how he f---- up our marriage and it will never be the same.

I have come to recognize that his love language is gifts, so for him, this is especially painful. He is not an overly expressive man emotionally but he is sentimental about items. I also recognize that he is healing at a different rate as me on this issue and what I would like to do is to write him a note to help him here.

I guess what I need are words of wisdom to pass onto him in this letter that will hit home for him perhaps from you guys and gals that are WS's. What are the words as WS that you would like to here in this situation if you were him?

I want this to be an encouraging letter to help him look at the ring situation with a new perspective. I dont want to see him hurt over this plus knowing this hurts him to look at my rings will impact my healing on this issue. So for me I guess for my own selfish reasons, I want him emotionally on board with this.


DD#1-7/9/10 WH=32 Me=38
ONS(on 7/5/10) w/ stranger out of town. He confessed,I had no idea.
tt truth 3/22-3/28 true D day #2 3/28/11 cyber A spanning 2 1/2 yrs
3/11/11 d day #3-found texts/phone calls to "friend", its an exit affair.

Posts: 301 | Registered: Oct 2010 | From: ILLINOIS
hurting38
♀ Member
Member # 29829
Default  Posted: 3:25 PM, November 18th (Thursday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hufi-pufi, thank you for the response in R!


DD#1-7/9/10 WH=32 Me=38
ONS(on 7/5/10) w/ stranger out of town. He confessed,I had no idea.
tt truth 3/22-3/28 true D day #2 3/28/11 cyber A spanning 2 1/2 yrs
3/11/11 d day #3-found texts/phone calls to "friend", its an exit affair.

Posts: 301 | Registered: Oct 2010 | From: ILLINOIS
FmrLIer
♀ Member
Member # 29784
Default  Posted: 8:55 AM, November 20th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Any suggestions on how to lay out my boundries to fWH? He had an OA and a possible SA (porn). I want to express the importance of NO porn and obviously no OA but I want to make sure it's clear that if it happens, I want to know about it. From what I'm reading in Mending a Shattered Heart, he may relapse, so, how do I remain "strict" and "understanding"?


Me (BS)
Him (fSAH)
OA/PA

Ignorance was bliss but it wasn't the reality of my marriage...


Posts: 427 | Registered: Oct 2010
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