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User Topic: Long Term Affair... Part 18
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 11:15 PM, June 25th (Friday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

i am a proud mommy today...my dd17 went to prom,..took her to get her nails done, toes and fingers, and the hair which she cut off last week for locks for love got an updo...well she looked amazing...so damned sexy in her gown, and she is truly a beautiful girl...and its not just because i am her mom...it was a busy busy day...happy busy...and of course pfm is still doing some little fuck ups in between...since such a long time has passed since he was at family therapy and was told to repriorize, he called the house and left a message for my boys who were out that he had a job for them to do...even i almost didnt return the phone call when i heard the message, but that little voice in my head said to call and so i did...that little job was to recharge the battery in the camera so we could take pix of our dd for prom...which he was supposed to do last nite....i only reminded him over and over again...so he just left the message for the "job" he needs done...he's not getting it...and i think soon i will step back completely and permanently..as much as i want my kids to have a real "dad", there is only so much i can do, and they need a mom whose somewhat sane...and dealing with this shit all the time does not make me sane...and of course i forgot to add when i did talk to him about it, i admit, i just wanted to tell him my perspective and then let it drop and sit in his brain...but the idiot started to question me about it, not the questions i want to hear, so i shut him down immediately letting him know that this gift is in danger of death...that i would not be telling him anymore what our perspective is....and he will have to live with his actions which so far have been working so damned well for him...aaarrrggghhh...i know i am leaving some stuff out...i just don't want to talk about it anymore...i had some mudslides tonite with a friend and just want to enjoy the slight buzz...so i am buzzing off now...

nite, nite


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
Lost Heart2
♀ Member
Member # 21793
Default  Posted: 2:27 AM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle,
Re IC for your DD - I am in 2 minds over this. On one hand, it sounds like she does not want collude with her parents anymore that she has to in keeping that elephant invisible. I know what it feels like when I was in that position growing up - at first you feel a little chuffed that you know something adult that the other kids dont; and then it wears you out trying to keep it quiet. Every glance, word, gesture between my parents meant different things to me than it did to my sisters who didnt know about my F's LTA. I envied them their carefree lives and the burden of the secret weighed heavy on my shoulders. And I colluded with them in maintaining our 'happy family' image. I think if it had been suggested that I went to IC to help me deal with their crap, it would have increased my burden even more, KWIM? Somehow it would have felt like I am the problem...

On the other hand, I think IC for your DD is a fantastic idea if thats what SHE wants..someone to talk to/vent. Theres prob not another adult IRL she can share her worries with.

What does she think of IC?

And Miracle, whilst I do understand that many of our Hs are clueless about parenting, you cant fix every mistake he makes. You are going to run yourself ragged. My H didnt even know much about our chn before dday. After my S attempt, I realised that if anything did happen to me, that they would be left in his care and THAT scared the crap out of me! I then embarked in a 'gettoknowyourchn' programme. At first he was v resistant, esp as they kept rebuffing his weak attempts. I got him to see that he needs to meet them on THEIR turf when THEY are ready. It was/is a long process but I guess as they are younger, it was easier. And hats off to him, he still plodded even when they are openly resistant. He still doesnt get it that if you are mean to someone today that they just wont get over it by tomorrow without you making amends. I have to push him towards making peace - for my chns sakes - and sometimes he just plain refuses to.

I have backed off alot in the last year, and only step in when things get too hairy,and he has a better relationship with all of them than he himself ever thought possible. I know he still resents my relationship with them but like I tell him,I have been their parent since they were born...

So what I have been tryin to demonstrate Miracle, in my roundabout way, was that whilst I applaud your endeavours to teach your H how to parent, it is evident that it is costing you more than you can afford right now..and your decision to step back now is fully understandable!

***
Ats,
I am glad that you and W have made up.
I know that when peace reigns again, we are reluctant to bring up the issues that led up to the break up. Enjoy the errr 'benefits' of the peace ( )but dont let the issues slide.

And just because some of our WSs are more challenging than yours, doesnt mean you can not complain, ok?

***
Dip,
Oh, is that what chasing aligators meant!
I did picture a Steve Irwin kinda sport and wondered why on earth anyone would want to do that. Thank you for putting me straight.

I think its so exciting that you are planning this new business and that your W is on board - I wish you all the best in it. Have fun!!!

***
(((((((Honest)))))))

***
Allgood,
I am going to scold you now (after I enjoyed your 'beneath'comment ).

The OW in your sitch DOES NOT belong in your M; she never did and never will. By following her antics, you are holding onto her, KWIM? Whatever negative energy she is putting out to the universe, you are going to be affected by some of that. Please lose her. Let her go. She is not welcome in your life.(((((Allgood))))

***
Miracle,
Re my DS angel - we did everything the chn wanted. The balloon and letter; the money to charity and we planted a magnolia so that he will always have a physical place in our house.
He would have been 12 years old this year. Time really flies, doesnt it?

***
Today are spending the day togethe as the chn are going on a sleepover to my sisters. We are spending the afternoon at the Southbank and then off to dinner and a comedy club. I am hoping that the angst of recent weeks abates a little so that we can both enjoy this time.

***
(((((((Tribe)))))))


LTA BS

Dday#1 02.06.06
Dday#2 28.11.06


Mind what you love. Mind how you are loved.


Posts: 471 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: London, UK
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 6:08 AM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lostheart: You sound fantastic by your post, but I always worry when I see the middle of the night postings, but maybe it wasn't middle of the night by you when you posted. Hope all is well.

I almost posted my comment on OW's facebook knowing it would then terminate this source because I really think it is causing me unnecessary unhappiness by looking at her page everyday. On the other hand, when I get concerned about where H may be - her page, along with their mutual friend's pages give me a lot of info about what is going on at their workplace - social events, ot, etc. For example, just yesterday my H tells me he's working overnight on Sunday - so now I will monitor her page to see if she is working it too. (She transferred locations but is still "next door" and for the assignment my H will be on it will pull in police officers from anywhere in NYC.)
So, for now, I like that I have this surveillance even though it's keeping the wound open.
And, I had the same picture in my head about the alligators. Now that I know the meaning of it, I'm going to use it when I'm stressed out & overwhelmed. Between that and my now frequent use of "y'all", people are going to wonder what is going on with me.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 10:37 AM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle: I'm glad you enjoyed your daughter's special day despite your disappointment with pfm.

Honest: Hopin you are ok...

As for me - I'm pleased because my H seemed to take my accusation this morning in stride. (I really need to give myself 5 uniterrupted minutes without kids to analyze something before confronting because if I had, I would've seen that I was wrong from the get-go...) O well - a lesson learned.


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
nofun
♀ Member
Member # 24546
Default  Posted: 11:17 AM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

OMG - It took me so long to read everyone's posts and by the time I get to the end I forget what everone has said. Is there a better way to remember? I guess I can't stay away for that long but I've had a horrendous couple of days.

M33 - I am the boss, so I can't lighten my work load. I am so far behind right now it is giving me anxiety. I can't focus because so much is going on in my personal life.

To those of you who commented about H's work place, I believe this is what is causing a huge amount of problems. There are a number of co-workers that either had A's or are in the midst of their A's. The woman who I reached out to with the intention of support was grateful. But when her H found out he blamed my H for me emailing her. He thinks my H divulged his secret A. This was not the case.

Then another co-worker became paranoid that I would send his wife an email and divulge his A. Oh it's a complete mess.

My H came home from work and screamed at me to the point that I had never heard him that mad and it kind of scared me. He told me to mind my own business.

All I did was offer my support to this woman, gave her the SI web site, and copied her some info from the healing library. She was so grateful. We do share a common bond, have socialized together and even vacationed together. Geesh!!

I think they are all paranoid that I am going to spill the beans on their little "club." I've been sick over all of this.

I just feel such a disconnection from my H.


BS (me) 56
WH 61
M 36 yrs
OW - 55 - Howdy Doody Look Alike
3 Awesome Adult C
DD 6/7/09
LTA 12 years.
Confused: D or R???

Posts: 987 | Registered: Jun 2009
forgivenotforget
♀ Member
Member # 11053
Default  Posted: 12:53 PM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle - I loved those times when my girls were going off to their proms. It was always so much fun and to see them looking so beautiful and happy filled me with pride. I know just how you were feeling.
I'm sorry that pfm let you down again. It seems that lately you are getting more frustrated by his actions or inactions. If it's ok to ask, is it just the stress of living with it every day or is something else contributing to your mounting anger??? I am worried about you and maybe what your C said the other day, about this not being the best situation for you, may be something you need to look at. Do you see her by yourself?? Can she help you to find a way to make living with your current situation easier? How can we help you??
I loved LH's post to you. She has had a similar situation to you I think and is probably the best one to help you with yours. You can't keep letting pfm's behavior eat away at you like this. It will eventually cause you physical symptoms if it isn't already. I really do agree with your C that you need to think about what you need to do in order to live a more peaceful, satisfying life. (((Miracle)))

LH - great post. I really think you could be a big help to Miracle right now. Maybe some ideas of how you dealt with your H when he was particularly frustrating or difficult would be helpful to her.
Have a great time today. I think it's wonderful that you are doing things as a couple. The comedy club is also a really great idea. Nothing like laughter to ease a little tension.

Allgood - just wanted to add that LH is in England so her post was 5 hours ahead of us.

NoFun - It is so frustrating when our FWS's lash out at us when it is them who brought this on themselves. He really does seem to be making so many mistakes lately. It's too bad he can't find a better way to deal with his frustration than to lash out at you, the person whom he should be working so hard to R with.
My H had a similar episode but it was his partner of 15 years that he lashed out at after the partner called me up to tell me how long the A actually was going on (since my H lied about it being only months - not years). He was so violent in his attack (not physically but verbally) that his partner seriously thought of leaving the practice and began packing up his things. Instead they dissolved the practice and he went out on his own and to this day, has relatively nothing to do with my H. It was very sad for me to see since they had a wonderful partnership for so many years.
These FWS's compound their problems because they want to blame everyone else when they could so easily gain a lot of support if they just accepted responsibility and asked forgiveness from those they have betrayed.
(((NoFun))))

[This message edited by forgivenotforget at 12:57 PM, June 26th (Saturday)]


D-day - 12/23/05 LTA - 8 years.
"Love's a matter of trust and I just want to believe in us." M McBride

Posts: 1901 | Registered: Jun 2006 | From: A tunnel where I'm beginning to see the light
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Default  Posted: 1:19 PM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I am the boss, so I can't lighten my work load. I am so far behind right now it is giving me anxiety.

nofun, I simply delegated damn near everything to staff for quite a period of time. I am fortunate that 2 out of my 3 are very sharp and capable. FWW actually apologized to one of them, whom we also know socially, for creating the situation where they had to step up and cover work for me.

I can only imagine a nest of WSs all working together and covering and rationalizing for each other. Not a healthy environment. Some of FWW's coworkers/friends are OW or considering A's. She no longer helps them rationalize such activity, but cautions them. I am very pleased with this change in her.

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 5:26 PM, June 26th (Saturday)]


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 3:56 PM, June 26th (Saturday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

lh2: i wish she would go to ic, she refuses, she feels she is doing just fine on her own, i disagree, but this is not something i can force, she has to be a willing participant or it means nothing...i have offered, and will continue to do so and pray and hoipe that she changes her mind....pfm though feels i should force it, i think he cannot see beyond what he feels to understand that forcing it will do no good, he wants what he wants and he wants it for selfish reasons, which is what bothers me i think....

as for my fustrations with pfm i had an aha moment earlier in the week...my fustrations lie with me, with my inability to let it go, there is so much to let go...i need to step back and let him drown, and then i get fustrated because it defeats the purpose of me putting up with him...he continually asks for help and advice, he continually see what he does wrong after the fact and he continually still does it all his way...and my aha moment came because when my dad died my dad never did what pfm is supposedly trying to do...it would have meant so much to me if my own dad owned his shit, if my own dad came to me and told me that he realized what his actions have done to me...i want my daughter to have what i did not...my fustration is me seeeing the cycle continue and here i am her mom and i cannot prevent this, i cannot fix this and i don't want her to feel that torment and that feeling of having unresolved issues...

i am fine though, i am dealing....i have my moments as i have had since the getgo...but i do come back to center, thankfully...i think the only thing i can't seem to get a handle on is caring about the cleanliness of my house...i have zero motivation...its not filthy, but its not clean either...the dust is building, glass shelving looks like its frosted when indeed its not...and you could probably write messages in the furniture all through the house...and the worst part is i really don't care...i was never much for cleaning, always put it off til i had too, but now its worse then that....i am having this huge shinding on the 4th and i have no umph to to a blessed thing...which means i will probably wait to the last minute and clean like a chicken without a head...and cook and pack...we are leaving the day after for florida for a family vacation...whixh i have to admit i am so looking forward to, its all of us doing fun stuff and hopefully pfm will keep his mouth shut and just learn to go with the flow....and then i think it will be a great vacation actually...i will miss having si, if i get nuts i may sneak to the hotels computers to log in.. ...but i am hopin i don't feel the need....


allgood: i am very proud of you....you are steppin it up, i know you hate that you have to be the one to lead the way, and i agree that kind of sucks, but the reward is keeping your family intact and reconnecting with the man who is not only the dad to your kids, nut the man you love....so keep it up..


fun: i seriously would like to slap your husband upside the head....he is so busy saving face with other idiots he doesn't "SEE"...there is so much he needs to "see"....call his ic asap...and maybe also do one appt together to air out all this dirty laundry that doesn't even belong to either of you....he needs to have some boundaries put into place regarding this stuff, because he is starting to cross some lines...


lh2: it sounds as though your children have taken over the responsiblity of your angel baby's commemoration and i think that is awesome..


dip: i too was confused with the alligators...especially since i could have sworn you mentioned the keys (florida) and they have lots of real alligators ...us city folk don't know nothin bout those gators...at least not this city folk...hell i used to get excited to see a duck or a goose just in the neighborhood, after 10 years though i am now really used to them but at first, well i was like a kid...


ats: when i mentioned that you were back, i meant it figuratively...


m3: those mind movies: i have a couple of different kinds the most painful ones though were of me and pfm, having sex, where i am a "hole"...those are killer ones...mostly because i lived it, over and over....

gotta go, dd is finally home from prom, i need details...


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 12:30 AM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Miracle: Congrats on dd's prom. How exciting! As for IC for her, perhaps you can discuss what goes on in IC. My mother always wanted me to go when I was a teen after my father left, but I refused to go. I felt I had a handle on everything. I didn't fully understand what went on.
I strongly encouraged (almost forced) to go and it worked out well. The IC saw DS for a while, then me and then the both of us. DS and I were arguing over giving him permission to learn to surf before lifeguards were on duty and the IC "helped" us talk. When we got home, I talked with DS about how an IC is trained to help people talk with each other and not just scream and get mad....and to help people talk out their problems. He "got" it.
Perhaps your DD may want to go for a "try out"? She has a huge burden to bear. I doubt she would share this info with anyone and it's too much for her.

Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 12:38 AM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

hey honest:

we did the try out...dd closed up....like a clam, and she even liked the therapist...but she is headstrong...just like her mother..

if she were younger, i would be able to force the issue...she is too close to 18....not enough time for her to be forced where she might just open up eventually...i know she will heal herself from this, it will just take her alot longer and i wonder how many relationships she will go through before it happens...???? we try so hard to guide them, we try so hard to protect them....but we cannot...we can still be their soft place to fall when they do, we can still be ears when they need us to listen and we can still be the arms to wrap them in when they need that security blanket that tells them they are loved....this at least i know i can do...the rest, well i have to start letting go, and it just sucks that i cannot do more...

it is what it is...


how are you doing today honest??


i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 1:03 AM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I have the same problem as Nofun....I read posts and if I don't take notes (nofun, I have actually done this!)
I forget specifics that I would like to address.

I have to reread.
I do remember Nofun. Damn him for yelling at you like that!!! They have their "secret" club and God forbid anyone else gets involved with that.

I can imagine how you felt. When someone starts yelling at me or is angry at me for something so outrageous, I get speechless. It's like we can't even imagine that they are angry at US for such a thing, a thing that THEY are responsible for.
A few times that this has happened, I waited until I was calm and more collected and told WH very quietly and strongly that he was NEVER to speak to me like that again. I will NOT allow him to hurt me like that anymore. I have proved myself over the years to be a trustworthy, loyal, and good person and do NOT deserve to be treated like that and will not tolerate it in the future. I will walk away until he wants to talk calmly about it.

Tell your WH that, if not, write him a letter simply stating that, no details about what he said etc.

I'm so sorry.

Lost: I'm glad your family did something to commemorate your DS angel. Although my WH has been a bastard, he did have some saving graces, (that's why we still love them?). He said that he fully believes (or his culture/religion) that if parents have a baby that dies, that the parents get "extra credit" in heaven and that baby will be waiting for them at the gates of heaven.
I will also share this: when my daughter died and I was looking at her one last time in the coffin, I suddenly had a picture in my head of my dear departed grandmother (who was more like a mother to me) sitting in a rocking chair holding my DD up in heaven. I felt such a feeling of calmness from that. I truly believe it was a message from God.
Your DS is waiting for you.
{{{{{lost}}}}

I have to go back and reread everyone's posts. Allgood and Ats, I'm glad to hear your good news. Forgive, you always have such wonderful, supportive posts. Dip, we love you!! I alway knew the alligators were metaphorical I don't know what we Yankees would be wrestling up here!! Road rage hogs?

ETA: I've been spending the past 4 days crying on and off. I am really mourning. The fact that WH hasn't called since our last conversation really is putting a nail in the coffin. He knows how hurt and upset I am, and just chooses to ignore it. He had the gall to call up a few minutes after to ask if I saw some stupid item of his that he couldn't find.

There are so many triggers that are hitting me so strongly, I feel like I'm reeling. I have to take a deep breath, realize what it is and try to keep going.
I can't even look at decorator's magazines anymore. I had pored over them over and over to get ideas on how to design the house overseas...what tiles, flooring, etc. I designed the kitchen that OW was using when I wasn't there. I designed our master bedroom in the beach house that she slept in the same period I was there and is probably in that bed right at this moment.
It's not the same as when people get divorce and then the new wife uses the stuff....it was at the same time. The funny thing is I'm not really so mad at OW, but at WH. He gave it to her.

I better stop, or I'll start crying again. DS 34 keeps insisting that I should NOT let WH come back into my house. The wound is constantly being reopened and I'm not letting it heal. I know he's right for my emotions, BUT, as we have all discussed here, it's not that simple when you are dealing with a long marriage and kids. I have to keep reminding myself that I know from experience, that going through the actual divorce will be worse than it is now financially.

I want to 180 WH so bad and NOT talk to him at all, not for anything. But there's the kids. I'll try to do that this week, and not answer his phone calls. The hardest thing is that if WH can't get a hold of me, or I have tried not to answer his calls, he calls DS 15 and asks to speak to me, and I don't know what to say to DS. I have actually gone into the bathroom when I hear DS answer him so he can tell WH I can't come to the phone, but that's impossible if WH calls when we're in the car or at other inopportune times. <sigh>

Thanks for listening to my rant. I hope I'll feel better in a few days, or at least the roller coaster can get out of this dip.

{{{{Tribe}}}


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
Lost Heart2
♀ Member
Member # 21793
Default  Posted: 3:09 AM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest,
I cant imagine how difficult this must all be for you. Do you have any support IRL? How often do you see your IC?
You know, at some point soon you are going to have to tell your DS (15),prob with your older DS there with you? I doubt your H would take on this responsibility.

And If H calls for you and you dont want to talk (which I STRONGLY recommend as contact with you just feeds his f'ed up ego), just hang up. You need to be drawing up your firewalls around you, Honest.
Or at least get someone IRL to help with this. I would hate for that man to take any more advantage over you then he already has.
((((Honest)))))

***
Allgood,
Has any of the surveillance really helped, by that I mean, have you caught him in a lie, or is it to confirm that he is not lying?
You know its a false sense of security right? But you know what, in the first year, this is what we need. Any chance to build up some safety. I used to "stalk" my H on Skype.

***
Nofun,
So your H is upset that his work den of lies and iniquity is falling apart...boof'kinghoo!

Its actually kind of funny - all those WSs scrambling around wondering who is NoFun going to out next.

***
Miracle
FNF is correct in her linking my story to yours. My H ruled the Jackass WS camp for a long time here.
And it drove me insane.

I finally quit - MC, trying to save this M and be a good W and just backed off. I began focusing on me.

I hear what you are saying about not wanting your chn to repeat your history.
Thats what I wanted to. My F is one of the all time great Jackasses of the last 2 centuries.He was a mean, violent, cheating, selfish excuse for a human.Now he is just a selfish whiny old git (just the other day on Father's Day - he told me that he works so hard during the week, that all he looks forward to are quiet peaceful weekends, but then the grandkids come around and his heart sinks. Right. We hardly ever go over preferring to meet my mum over at our houses.So he hardly sees his grandkids. And still complains. ).

Anyhow I digress.
I wanted different for my chn.Which is prob why I (and you too?) when I realised early on that H was just never going to be a good F, that I took on that role as well. Which suited him fine.

Learning to let him 'go' to be a F was difficult. I watched closely from the sidelines esp at the beginning but not so much anymore. He had to take what I gave him and make of it what he will. I cant control him (even though he frequently says I do) but I will protect my babies when necessary.
I hope I am making sense here.

You are a wonderful mum and your chn will always have you. I totally understand your desire to want to protect them and we can but not in everything and not all the time.

***
Fnf,
The comedy club was hilarious! I laughed so hard, tears rolling down and sides hurting. V carthartic.H was wonderfully behaved. I saw some beautiful couples and usually that makes my heart sore, but last night I just felt wistful, KWIM?
There was this one couple (mddle aged)on the station platform. The man had his arms around her from behind and was crooning in her ear some love song and swaying with her, lost in their own world. So beautiful.
And then this much older couple walking hand in hand along the Thames,chatting away...

So how are you doing?


LTA BS

Dday#1 02.06.06
Dday#2 28.11.06


Mind what you love. Mind how you are loved.


Posts: 471 | Registered: Nov 2008 | From: London, UK
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 6:25 AM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Honest: I knew you were going to be having a rough time of it....

He knows how hurt and upset I am, and just chooses to ignore it.

As heart breaking as this is to you, Honest.... I think this is a good thing. If you told him it's over, then he's respecting that. (Unlikely, tho isn't it?)
If he did call, I think you might see it as a sign - or it would upset you - to be "throwing away" someone who has feelings for you. I could just be way off base, but I think you need to keep it business-like with him. The kids can communicate with him directly without your need to facilitate it. In fact, there's no reason for you to pick up his call, let him leave a voicemail if the kids don't answer 1st. Maybe you should make it clear to him, that unless it has to do with the business of your household or kid issues, you are not going to be talking to him.
Maybe you should limit your communication to email unless there's an emergency.
Just an idea - but I know you said he's charming & I don't want him to charm you right out of your 180...
Best of luck.

Lost Heart: OW lives & works within 7 miles of my H's place of employment & she still socializes frequently with his co-workers. The surveillance has helped to tip me off to events that she was planning on going to & I promptly made sure my H didn't go to them.
I saw that she left a couple of messages on facebook as to "How do I move on", which I took to mean she was grieving the loss of her relationship with my H - made me feel good for a minute til I realized that post was several months after the last contact was supposed to have been made. Also, she said something about her having the last say about the break up too, which really pissed me off. So, there's the danger of it - a lot of these messages are cryptic - I have no idea if she was talking about him or not. I couldn't go far back enough to the time of the last date of contact to see what she was posting then.
I think it's given me some insight as to who this person was & what the attraction was.
And, finally, now that I am "friends" with a number of their coworkers, I get a "heads up" as to all ongoing social events. The challenge, however, is in looking interested and/or surprised when my H advises me of an upcoming event that I've known about for months before he tells me.

Anyhoo - never had the heart to heart with the H - since I accused him 2x this week of something he didn't do - well, I have to say it was more of an inquiry, not my usual interrogation, just a simple question on both occasions, I decided I should just lay low for awhile. Plus - these heart to hearts tend to be 1 way conversations anyway. His IC is away & then we are away - so for 2 weeks he has no therapy so I think I will play IC with him next week. (Damn - that sounds a little kinky doesn't it? )

I was feeling a little low last night - just feeling like this is mission impossible. We have so many circumstances - the young kids, we don't have the same days off, we had drifted apart prior to the A to begin with and now this - that are going to make this difficult. And, even when the moon & stars align & we can spend some time together & there are no triggers, etc. I am not feeling "in love" with him.
Forgive: I am trying to remember that this takes time.

Fun: I COMPLETELY understand your situation. As are so rampant at my H's place of employment as well. My H's partner cheated on his wife while she was pregnant too. So many of his coworkers have cheated & cheated with each other it's ridiculous. I think over time, they really start to think it's normal, just like some other things that occur at work that you cannot convince my H it's wrong because it's been part of his daily life for so long. Besides the cheaters, most of the guys my H works with are young & single, and my H has never been one to shy away from a drink or a party - so I assume he feels like he's missing out on life. When my H's partner broke up with his W I wanted to call her to see how she was, but I asked my H first because I know how they are. No matter what, his response SUCKED!!!! F'n idiot. I know you know this, but it sucks to have him throw guilt on you. It just sounds to me like he's hit rock bottom, he's miserable & he's having just one big pity party/temper tantrum. F'n idiot.

Dip: I forgot to tell you that while I appreciate the sentiment, you can count me out in the foxhole. 1st off, if it drops below 70 degrees, I'm going to be doing A LOT of whining and if I can go AWOL I would do it in a heart beat.
Peace all.
EDITED BECAUSE I HAVE BECOME A MORON

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 6:32 AM, June 27th (Sunday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
iwantamiracle
♀ Member
Member # 22812
Default  Posted: 2:18 PM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

droppin in to give some hugs

((((tribe))))

and on the run...and will be running off and on for the next 2 weeks....will post when i can...thankfully its all happy stuff...although the happy stuff isnt what it used to be or should, kwim...but i have had the unhappy running too and i much prefer the happy stuff...



i am taking my life back, one step at a time!!!!!

Posts: 5994 | Registered: Feb 2009 | From: looking for my rainbow
atsenaotie
♂ Member
Member # 27650
Wink  Posted: 2:28 PM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

iwantamiracle, I am glad the prom went well for your DD and for you! DS had his senior prom a few weeks ago. As bad as everything can be, it is nice to be able to reflect on having raised some pretty good kids.


I know you are very concerned about pfm and your kids relationship. FWW was often upset about the decisions her xH made re: their kids. I would reminder her that for better or worse, he was a parent too, and entitled to his parenting style. So long as he did not physically or emotionally damage the kids, and some of the behavior came close, he could "father" them as he saw fit. On the positive side, I think it helped her girls to realize there are differences in people, and they learned to "manage" each of the parents differently. You can no more make pfm be the H you deserve than you can make him be the parent you believe your children deserve.

Lost Heart2, you are right about getting too caught up in the "things are good". It is tempting to enjoy they good and forgo the remaining work. Yesterday gave us just such an opportunity. I had a mild trigger that started me thinking about FWW, OM, and what they would or would not say when intimate together. Last night FWW mentioned she could tell I was thinking (she is so good at that). I told her I was having thoughts, but (and TrynHard will be proud of me) the answers did not matter, because it is in the past. After she promised on to answer I told her what I was thinking about and what the triggers had been. She shared the thoughts and triggers she had too yesterday, and we both felt better. I did not need or want the answers to what I was wondering about what she said to OM #1&2 because they would not make any difference to how WE feel today.

I will be out of the loop for a few days as we all go to DS18's college orientation. It is in the town where we lived for 11 years before moving where we are now, all pre-affair time.

--Ats


LTA BS 53
FWW 60
M 1990, dday 10-5-09
Reconciled

Posts: 3967 | Registered: Feb 2010 | From: FL
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 9:38 PM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Was there an SI picnic/beach party somewhere today & I was the only one wasn't invited?

Where is everyone today?!?


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
lostsuol
♀ Member
Member # 13706
Default  Posted: 10:47 PM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

I've been lurking. June has been a strange, full of triggers month... s-i-l's celebration of life, our 37th anniversary, a trip to the east coast, Father's Day, H's bday and the every day stuff. We are taking baby steps as far as R goes... as long as I don't bring the A subject into the light. It's in my thoughts daily but I keep quiet. Not the best path I'm sure but keeping calm seems to improve the atmosphere (not so much tension in the air).

I've read almost every day and prayed for all of the tribe but have no words of wisdom, only empathy... which I'd like to post but can't concentrate and keep things straight it seems.

{{{LTA}}}


Posts: 808 | Registered: Feb 2007 | From: Canada
honesttoafault
♀ Member
Member # 27105
Default  Posted: 11:54 PM, June 27th (Sunday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost: WH told both DS 11 and 15 last year that he had married someone else and that they have 2 sisters and a baby brother. DS 11 was confused, and DS 15 was upset and angry.

I don't want to put DS 15 on the spot if WH calls him asking for me and I'm sitting right there. I hate to have him lie saying I"m in the shower or whatever nor do I want to put him in the middle by having him tell his father if WH wants to contact me, he should email. <sigh>

Of course WH wants our DS's to meet the OC's. He even asked DS 11 if he had any toys he wanted to give his sisters.
DS 15 spent over $100 of his own money to buy a digital camera/video camera for WH for his birthday. What does WH take pictures of on it to show DS's? Videos of the OC's and WH didn't understand why I was upset. I should act like this is normal so all the kids would get to know each other...

Hugs to everyone. I wish I could give some advice and support to everyone, but I've been in a bad place.

ETA: I went to my cousin's graduation. We are a VERY small family. I am their ONLY cousin, but have not really been involved with them as much as I would like.

It was hard to sit there by myself and watch all the couples seem so happy together. They lived their lives together, planned things together. I don't think any of them even slept apart for all the time they were together.

I don't know why, but watching my only guy cousin who has been married for about 15 years to a very B****y, complaining, selfish, fat/obese wife and he's dedicated to her, drives me crazy. I think about how I NEVER even talked harshly to WH, always put him and his family first.

I am trying to reconnect to my family, but I feel so estranged.
I'm just feeling very lonely.

{{{Tribe}}}}


Posts: 1903 | Registered: Jan 2010
Allgoodnamesgone
♀ Member
Member # 26157
Default  Posted: 8:17 AM, June 28th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Lost: good to hear from you. You sound very busy. As long as your style of R is working for you that's great & I wish you well.

Honest: There is anything wrong with telling your WH that all non-emergency contact between the 2 of you is to be via email. This is what many divorced families do initially when emotions are still running high or 1 of the parents is just out of his/her mind. Once this is explained to WH you do not need to tell the kids to lie for you - you could just say Dad is calling someone pick up. If they don't want to pick it up then you let it go to the machine. If WH is on the phone with one of the kids & asks for you, pick it up & ask if there's an emergency. Do not allow anything but a yes or no answer. No long drawn out (let me suck you into my drama) story. If he even hestitates I would say - remember I told you all contact is by email - no further explanation & then hang up. You may feel wrong doing that - but please take my advice - you are extremely nice & your H needs to get it so you can move on.

As to the other couples - (sigh) I do that constantly. It's so sad. I've actually been doing A LOT of thinking lately about how I might just be happier finding someone new. I'm sure it's just a phase tho. Alternatively, I think about how I used to look like a happy couple/family while my H's A was going on as well & God knows people are not all that they seem. Makes me think the happy families maybe have secrets of their own. It's almost like I'm giving up on the good in people in general (exceprt for my SI buddies & my 2 girlfriends). And I miss my dog.

Peace all.

[This message edited by Allgoodnamesgone at 8:20 AM, June 28th (Monday)]


Me- BS
DDay- 8/26/09
Separated after failed R effort.

Posts: 2165 | Registered: Nov 2009
trynhard
♂ Member
Member # 22698
Default  Posted: 9:47 AM, June 28th (Monday), 2010View ProfileEdit MessagePrivate MessageHomepage

Just wanted to give everyone some words of encouragement today… Bit by bit, start to think and tell yourself you will be happy again. Make choices you can control that will get you there.

For some of us, that will mean…
- Plan to be financially independent as you move toward a new partner.
- Forgive, risk, and continue to stay married to the one that betrayed us… continue to work on desensitizing the trauma they caused… Try even harder to do nothing but desirables moving forward.. the desirables will make you a better partner… make it known to your spouse what you need and do it in a loving and clear way.

If for some reason you fall…just simply pick yourself back up and start over again.

Lostsuol… Yes, I too keep any comments of the A to myself… I keep anything A related away from my W… I do this intentionally. I do it because I want to do it. I do it because it makes me desirable for me not to say anything. I have control over this. Sometimes, I must bit my tongue not to say anything… lol… even harder to do it without a facial expression!!!! but it’s been working… my wife is loving me now. I don’t sweat the small stuff anymore… but any more big stuff that may come my way? Well then my W is just not good partner material... Do I still think about it everyday? Yes. Do I still cry about it? Yes. I cry because I hear a song about love, TV show or movie about what has happened to me… maybe a picture or thought during the day about infidelity and adultery… But in general, I am mostly happy. It’s because I’m starting to live life again… This weekend, ran a Half Marathon, wife cooked a great meal for me... Watched a couple of movies…some yard work, fed the birds… boated… went to a local festival… just do what makes you happy in life... it starting to work for me and my R.

Nofun… Of course your H was angry about all this…He is afraid! It puts him in a very stressful, taxing, nervous situation. One of his fellow co-worker may want to beat his face in for exposing. It’s scary because arguments are the # 1 reason for murder. Can you imagine being in a job where your life depends on someone that is pissed? I’m sorry you are in this position. Your H’s co-workers are abusing there spouses… It is cruel, ugly, horrible, sick and worst of all, a betrayal to God. As we all know, it carries home to make marriages not what they are suppose to be. I think everyone has an obligation as a good person to stop the abuse. It takes great courage by someone to say, it is your business. In your case... this is very very hard... Would your H stop an adult from sexually abusing a child? Would he allow a pyromaniac to continue to set fires? It is at risk of your own life to in these situations. Adultery is listed as a 10 commandment for a reason. People that cheat are abusers by making someone that loves them believe a false reality. Infidelity causes brain injury, PERIOD! Brain emotions are the most dangerous in many people. It needs to be exposed before it can truly be healed. The people being abused have a right to know what is going on. True, the healing may be for that abused person to find a new partner… or they can work toward a better M… the Awakening… But if not to expose, the abuse continues. My prayers are with you that you work through all your pain.... Just somehow keep moving forward.... maybe he can expose this and get transfered, move or retire? It's hard.. maybe I'm over thinking this... It all sucks.

Allgoodnamesgone.. I am telling you that you are very attractive... You have some great qualities that millions of men would want in a woman... in shape, smart, working girl... and shall I go on? Yes, you could leave your H and you will find good man. The next guy won’t be perfect, but next time read books on Q&A’s to ask when finding a mate, you’ll get a pretty good one.. lol… or.. you can also start today by doing a desirable… Positive “self talk”... Is your H loving you right now? If not, then make the choice to somehow let him know what he needs to do to love you.. but tell him kindly... in a way that makes him feel safe... As for us other families not exposing our secrets? I view it as me forgiving... I don't want my W to feel bad. If someone asked me, I won't ever lie... but I will say it in a way to make my W feel good about staying with me... Yes, many of us make mistakes in life... Today, I am happy with my marriage.

Iwant.. Don’t let the turkeys get you down… it’s my bird joke of the day..lol

anyway.. I wish peace to all this week.. make it so.

[This message edited by trynhard at 10:52 AM, June 28th (Monday)]


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